Is the Scientology Personality Test Scientific?

Leon-2

Patron Meritorious
I think either you or I need to word clear the meaning of the word 'exist'.

If you can't measure it, you can't detect it. If you can't detect it, in what sense does it exist?

This does indeed go directly to the heart of the problem. How does one distinguish between - on the one hand, an entity which has no mass, no energy and no location in time or space, and on the other - nothing at all.

Well, the one has consciousness and awareness etc etc. The other does not.
 

Gizmo

Rabble Rouser
This does indeed go directly to the heart of the problem. How does one distinguish between - on the one hand, an entity which has no mass, no energy and no location in time or space, and on the other - nothing at all.

Well, the one has consciousness and awareness etc etc. The other does not.

" How does one distinguish between - on the one hand, an entity which has no mass, no energy and no location in time or space, and on the other - nothing at all ".

Ah, they are the same - that much you got right !

But, " Well, the one has consciousness and awareness etc etc. The other does not ". Is an honest to God, WTF .

As was once said, one is entitled to their own opinion however they are not entitled to their own facts.

And, surely, you are certainly entitled to your own opinion and when you post it as an opinion it might have merit ( with someone ).

When you step over into creating your own ' facts ' with nothing but your own opinion it tends to become a cropper with all people who have above a room temperature IQ ( real measured IQ - not that cult manipulated so-called IQ )
 

Anonycat

Crusader
You do not have a full understanding of the cult of scientology. A thetan weighs one and a half ounces. I've know this since I was a kid. Hubbard weighs a dying body, and the exiting thetan accounts for 1.5 ounces. Not sure how he got the chance to keep a dying person on a scale, but don't let that keep you from knowing that he figured this out decades ago. Science! On second thought, if a satan can take a doll body, why not just stay in a corpse? Keep the party going!

Could a mod move all this off-topic Leon Minus two stuff to a new thread? Leon's Babbling and Rambling?
 

strativarius

Inveterate gnashnab & snoutband
A thetan does not weigh one and a half ounce! What crap.

q2UuTqz.gif


Source

So what do you say now Leon?

Perhaps Veda or somebody could remind us of which book this came from. I have an idea it might have been 'The Phoenix Lectures', but I could be mistaken.
 

Ogsonofgroo

Crusader
This does indeed go directly to the heart of the problem. How does one distinguish between - on the one hand, an entity which has no mass, no energy and no location in time or space, and on the other - nothing at all.

Well, the one has consciousness and awareness etc etc. The other does not.

Hmmm, such an entity would simply not be much more than an idea in your head imho.

:confused2:
 

Leon-2

Patron Meritorious
q2UuTqz.gif


Source

So what do you say now Leon?

Perhaps Veda or somebody could remind us of which book this came from. I have an idea it might have been 'The Phoenix Lectures', but I could be mistaken.



Do you think I don't know this reference?

Do you really think I don't know this reference??

Do you really and truly think I don't know that Hubbard was talking crap????
 

George Layton

Silver Meritorious Patron
This does indeed go directly to the heart of the problem. How does one distinguish between - on the one hand, an entity which has no mass, no energy and no location in time or space, and on the other - nothing at all.

Well, the one has consciousness and awareness etc etc. The other does not.

You do realize that, " an entity which has no mass, no energy and no location in time or space", was hubbard's definition of the being of awareness that wears the physical form, right? How can you say that is what we are in true form? Because hubbard said so, or have you audited back to before time and space to experience and gain that understanding? If the latter is the case what was it you were aware of at a point of existence outside of time and space?
 

strativarius

Inveterate gnashnab & snoutband
Do you think I don't know this reference?

Do you really think I don't know this reference??

Do you really and truly think I don't know that Hubbard was talking crap????

I apologise unreservedly Leon. I forgot that you know far more about scientology than L. Ron Hubbard ever did.
 

Leon-2

Patron Meritorious
You do realize that, " an entity which has no mass, no energy and no location in time or space", was hubbard's definition of the being of awareness that wears the physical form, right? How can you say that is what we are in true form? Because hubbard said so, or have you audited back to before time and space to experience and gain that understanding? If the latter is the case what was it you were aware of at a point of existence outside of time and space?

The latter certainly plays the larger part in it, however, the matter is not open for discussion.
 

Dulloldfart

Squirrel Extraordinaire
A thetan does not weigh one and a half ounce! What crap.

I assume Hubbard was referring to this paper from American Medicine, April, 1907, which he was careful not to cite, as was his wont.

Hypothesis Concerning Soul Substance Together
with Experimental Evidence of The Existence of Such Substance


by Duncan MacDougall, M.D. of Haverhill, Mass.

There's a copy of it here:

http://www.ghostweb.com/soul.html

-----

Leon: at times Hubbard differentiated between the thetan, and the static. Other times he defined them identically. The static was always no mass etc, the thetan only sometimes (defined) so.

Paul
 

lotus

stubborn rebel sheep!
Hmmm, such an entity would simply not be much more than an idea in your head imho.

:confused2:

What you said :yes:

Hubtub had no clue of what a spiritual being (thetan) is commonly known to not be...
It's not the mental, not the mind, not the brain not the self identity, not the personnality not the memory, not the genetics...

He was in total confusion about those aggregates and create a pseudo-religion and its teachings based on his own confusion of mind\body\spirit...Oh well, it must be convenient though for a sociopath narcissist to have [STRIKE]people[/STRIKE] (all men shall be my slaves) confuse their free spiritual component with mental that can be manipulated, hypnosed, indoctrined, traumatised....

LRH - a world wide acclaimed authority in spiritual matters...
 

Leon-2

Patron Meritorious
Hubtub had no clue of what a spiritual being (thetan) is commonly known to not be...
It's not the mental, not the mind, not the brain not the self identity, not the personnality not the memory, not the genetics...
.


I agree with your second sentence but please do tell what is a spiritual being "commonly known to be" ???????

As your second sentence implies - and it agrees with Hubbard mind you - the spirit cn only be defined by means of the via negativa, i.e. stating what it is not, since one cannot state what it is as it is not any thing that is describable.
 

Gizmo

Rabble Rouser
I agree with your second sentence but please do tell what is a spiritual being "commonly known to be" ???????

As your second sentence implies - and it agrees with Hubbard mind you - the spirit cn only be defined by means of the via negativa, i.e. stating what it is not, since one cannot state what it is as it is not any thing that is describable.

BULL SHIT !

The spiritual being is the immortal non physical aspect of a person.
 

Leon-2

Patron Meritorious
Yeah, sort of, but that is really skirting around the edges of a definition. It is like saying an apple is a fruit that grows on a tree. It doesn't home in in any way and define what an apple is.

But I'm glad for the part definition that you have made.:thumbsup:
 

strativarius

Inveterate gnashnab & snoutband
Yeah, sort of, but that is really skirting around the edges of a definition. It is like saying an apple is a fruit that grows on a tree. It doesn't home in in any way and define what an apple is.

But I'm glad for the part definition that you have made.:thumbsup:

Your arrogance and hubris is simply breathtaking Leon. This problem has exercised the finest minds on Earth over the last few thousand years and still nobody has solved it, and here you are acting as though you are an authority on the subject. You just make me laugh mate.
 

Leon-2

Patron Meritorious
That is actually a mild ad hom, but never mind.

Hubbard was not the first to describe Theta by way of it being not in space, not in time, not this, not that - the via negativa in other words. That goes back at least to the early Christian church fathers. They recognised it as God.
 

strativarius

Inveterate gnashnab & snoutband
That is actually a mild ad hom, but never mind.

Hubbard was not the first to describe Theta by way of it being not in space, not in time, not this, not that - the via negativa in other words. That goes back at least to the early Christian church fathers. They recognised it as God.

If the truth be told, I'm unwilling to take part in this conversation because I am completely out of my depth. What consciousness or awareness is, or how it is created by a bunch of organic molecules in the brain or the CNS, is totally beyond my comprehension.

What I am sure of though is that this 'entity' (or non-entity) you call the Thetan, which has the ability to travel to remote locations at superluminal speeds, has the ability to postulate and to perceive, send out tractor beams, blow up planets etc. etc. etc.. only exists in the minds of deluded individuals.

BTW, it will probably come as no great surprise to you to learn that I don't believe in 'god'.
 

Terril park

Sponsor
That is actually a mild ad hom, but never mind.

Hubbard was not the first to describe Theta by way of it being not in space, not in time, not this, not that - the via negativa in other words. That goes back at least to the early Christian church fathers. They recognised it as God.

Is earlier than Christianity.

 
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