Marty: An Open Letter to Tony Ortega

anonomog

Gold Meritorious Patron
Does anyone know what Rathbun means by "the take-down-Hubbard Cold War"?

Veda, I read it within this context:
Hubbard was demonized by the Cold War establishment perhaps more than any other civilian figure. One cummulative effect of it all was to to one degree or another de-humanize him in the public eye.

That the authorities, during the Cold War, started the demonisation and de-humanisation of Hubbard (that continues today).

:confused2:
But it is ambiguous.
 

Veda

Sponsor
Veda, I read it within this context:


That the authorities, during the Cold War, started the demonisation and de-humanisation of Hubbard (that continues today).

:confused2:
But it is ambiguous.

I just glanced at the opening paragraph of the article on Rathbun's Blog, and it may deserve a thread in MartyWorld.

Not the "love" part, but the "Hubbard-take-down Cold War" part.
 

elwood

Patron with Honors
There are people who have gotten out of scientology that attribute it to Anonymous - just a fact.

And it seems Anonymous had gotten some sea org members to blow.

Ratbun, hopefully, will stay in Texas where they are most famous for deep BS.

I stand corrected. However I take exception to your comment about Texan bullshit. A real Texan's bullshit at least has the ring of truth.
 

Auditor's Toad

Clear as Mud
I stand corrected. However I take exception to your comment about Texan bullshit. A real Texan's bullshit at least has the ring of truth.

I whole heartedly agree, all good BS has at least a ring of truth.

Is it still not BS?

Sort of like a little pregnant?
 

Petey C

Silver Meritorious Patron
Does anyone know what Rathbun means by "the take-down-Hubbard Cold War"?

I wondered whether it was referring to Hugh Urban's History of Scientology book recently released. Urban basically contextualises Scientology within the Cold War era and draws some parallels between Scn "doctrine" (aka crazy ideas) and the prevailing atmosphere of paranoia, control, the threat of nuclear annihilation, secrecy, fear of communism, aliens from outer space, etc.

Chapter 3 is entitled "A Cold War religion: Scientology, secrecy and security in the 1950s and 60s" and maintains that Scn was developed, grew and flourished between 1950s-1980s, almost exactly coincidental with the Cold War era.

Marty of course may have come up with the Cold War context all on his own but it's also likely he read the book.
 

Veda

Sponsor
I wondered whether it was referring to Hugh Urban's History of Scientology book recently released. Urban basically contextualises Scientology within the Cold War era and draws some parallels between Scn "doctrine" (aka crazy ideas) and the prevailing atmosphere of paranoia, control, the threat of nuclear annihilation, secrecy, fear of communism, aliens from outer space, etc.

Chapter 3 is entitled "A Cold War religion: Scientology, secrecy and security in the 1950s and 60s" and maintains that Scn was developed, grew and flourished between 1950s-1980s, almost exactly coincidental with the Cold War era.

Marty of course may have come up with the Cold War context all on his own but it's also likely he read the book.

Yes, Marty seems to taking a cue from "scholar" Hugh Urban.

Urban's analysis overlooked that Hubbard's original work, the 1938 "Excalibur', predates the Cold War, and also overlooks Hubbard's use of propaganda technique, which made any group, Communists, Nazis, Capitalists, terrorists, etc. the "enemy," if it served his ends.


"I can make Napoleon look like a punk," L. Ron Hubbard, 1938

"I can make Captain Bligh look like a Sunday School teacher, " L. Ron Hubbard, 1969


As an example of propaganda technique, at the height of the unpopular Vietnam War, when the "button" of "communist" was no longer effective, Hubbard switched from calling his enemies Communists to calling then Nazis.

In any event, for what it's worth, I started a thread on this.

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?24990-The-Take-Down-Hubbard-Cold-War
 

Jachs

Gold Meritorious Patron
Deleted. (Should have read more on the topic before posting).

I thinks its that too.

Marty is getting hit by Hubbards past continuously regurgitating, if hubbard didnt do it, and attempt to hide it, it wouldnt be a problem for marty and mike to apologize or refute.
 
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Beacon

Patron
New to this board. Was on lines in Boston in the 80's.

Marty can add all the context he wants around Hubbards toxic words, but the problem is that "Churchie" Scientologist take his toxic words out of context and as gospel, like:

1) MAKE MONEY, MORE MONEY etc. They are following that one with exceptional vigor.
2) A true SP can be lied to, tricked, destroyed. They sure are applying this one, though I'm pretty sure that Hubbard was talking about "REAL" SP's, not the ones unjustlly and off-policy declared by the church.

I could go on.

Beacon
 

Gadfly

Crusader
New to this board. Was on lines in Boston in the 80's.

Marty can add all the context he wants around Hubbards toxic words, but the problem is that "Churchie" Scientologist take his toxic words out of context and as gospel, like:

1) MAKE MONEY, MORE MONEY etc. They are following that one with exceptional vigor.
2) A true SP can be lied to, tricked, destroyed. They sure are applying this one, though I'm pretty sure that Hubbard was talking about "REAL" SP's, not the ones unjustlly and off-policy declared by the church.

I could go on.

Beacon

There are no "real SPs". The entire Suppressive Persons "construct" or "model" is a delusion of Hubbard's. But, what you said is a good start! :thumbsup:

Also, yes, there is no doubt that the Church of Scientology has always abused the SP/justice data to get rid of ANYBODY who disagreed or rocked the boat. The justice policies have always been a "political tool" for Hubbard and the Church of Scientology.

Welcome to ESMB where the unraveling from the Scientology mindfuck continues along nicely.
 

Free to shine

Shiny & Free
New to this board. Was on lines in Boston in the 80's.

Marty can add all the context he wants around Hubbards toxic words, but the problem is that "Churchie" Scientologist take his toxic words out of context and as gospel, like:

1) MAKE MONEY, MORE MONEY etc. They are following that one with exceptional vigor.
2) A true SP can be lied to, tricked, destroyed. They sure are applying this one, though I'm pretty sure that Hubbard was talking about "REAL" SP's, not the ones unjustlly and off-policy declared by the church.

I could go on.

Beacon

Please do go on.... :) :welcome:
 

Pooks

MERCHANT OF CHAOS
Personal opinion alert:I consider Marty to be an arrogant asshole and drama queen who plays fast and loose with the facts, is absolutely intolerant of any criticism and was apparently taught to write by Scientologists. What he does with the English language is criminal. He is, however, very entertaining and is accomplishing something Anonymous can't; he's getting people out of the church. I also wish he would go back to California.

^^^ What he said.
 

Pooks

MERCHANT OF CHAOS
New to this board. Was on lines in Boston in the 80's.

Marty can add all the context he wants around Hubbards toxic words, but the problem is that "Churchie" Scientologist take his toxic words out of context and as gospel, like:

1) MAKE MONEY, MORE MONEY etc. They are following that one with exceptional vigor.
2) A true SP can be lied to, tricked, destroyed. They sure are applying this one, though I'm pretty sure that Hubbard was talking about "REAL" SP's, not the ones unjustlly and off-policy declared by the church.

I could go on.

Beacon



Welcome Beacon! I was at the Boston Org in the 80's as well. There's a Boston thread here.

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?7231-Boston&highlight=boston

Glad to have another Bostonian on the board.
 

Infinite

Troublesome Internet Fringe Dweller
. . . Personal opinion alert:I consider Marty to be an arrogant asshole and drama queen who plays fast and loose with the facts, is absolutely intolerant of any criticism and was apparently taught to write by Scientologists. What he does with the English language is criminal. He is, however, very entertaining and is accomplishing something Anonymous can't; he's getting people out of the church. I also wish he would go back to California.

Upon what information do you base this opinion?
 

SchwimmelPuckel

Genuine Meatball
<snip> he's (Mr.Rathbun is..) getting people out of the church. I also wish he would go back to California.
Upon what information do you base this opinion?
Hmm.. I'm sure Elwood can answer for himself.. I just felt like opinionating on this:

Mr.Rathbun is getting people out of Scientology by heading a revolution.. This 'works' because most scientologists have been wishing for a Revolution for decades. They have never been allowed to say that out loud of course, but the wish have been there.

Many of the scientologists are still 'loyal' to Hubbard and 'the group'. They think the fault is with Supressive Persons, the Governmant and the evil psychs ruining the church for them. They're not about to abandon 'scientology'.. But they're ready for a revolution!

Mr.Rathbun delivers!

So it's not like these scintologists are getting out of Scientology by joining Mr.Rathbun's revolution. Rather they are SAVING Scientology.. From the obvious SP David Miscavige.

But when they're with Mr.Rathbun's crowd, it's not 'dangerous' to think anymore. Most of the official cult's grip on their minds are loosened. Suddenly it's OK to be critical. You won't have to guard your thoughts in preparation for a metered security check anymore.

That's halfway out of Scientology!

Note: I still believe Mr.Rathbun is the PR front for the official PR and Intel caper to salvage the Sinister Scam Cult of Scientology.. Miscavige probably had a mental breakdown and caved in about the time when Rathbun started 'working' his revoloution. Some cabal of high ranking Scilons are orchestrating this 'revolution', with Miscavige sitting wimpering in the corner..

The reason that the 'handling' for Scientology's PR problem must be a 'revolution' is that it's the only action that has any chance in hell of working... If sucessful however, the Revolution will resurrect Scientology cleansed of it's own bad history and peopled with the heroes of the Revolution. All the past sins and crimes were all done by the evil regime that is now a thing of the past.

If this pet conspiracy theory of mine is true.. Then I must say that Mr.Rathbun is a much more efficient and skilled PR man than he ever was when he was being slapped around by Miscavige..

:yes:
 
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