What's new

Marty critiques the Tone Scale and violates KSW in a new way

CommunicatorIC

@IndieScieNews on Twitter
Marty critiques the Tone Scale and violates KSW in a new way.

Marty has now crossed a new Rubicon. He has gone past the anti-KSW practice of refusing to apply aspects of the Tech he believes to be harmful or not workable to positively changing, altering and rewriting the Tech. It is one thing to omit. It is another step to rewrite and replace. Marty has gone from an editor who merely uses an eraser to an author who uses an eraser and a pen.

Marty is doing something else. He is asking people to think for themselves.

Marty - Emotions III: The Tone Scale
http://markrathbun.wordpress.com/2013/08/06/emotions-iii-the-tone-scale/

Excerpt:
Someone posted here once a lecture reference where L. Ron Hubbard pronounced that ‘action’ and ‘games’, were the places to aim for in terms of chronic emotion or state of consciousness (see Real Emotions for how Scientology tends to collapse the two ideas). The idea was that the top of the scale ‘serenity of beingness’ was far too boring for a being to stay with for very long. For those who made those ‘emotions’ their chronic targets, or their aspired to states of consciousness, here is something to think about. Games and Action are not emotions. They are activities. One could and does engage in ‘games’ and ‘action’ at every level of emotion. The next higher ‘emotion’ on the Scientology emotional tone scale, Postulates, too is not an emotion – and like ‘games’ and ‘action’ is engaged in during all manner of actual emotion. While ‘Serenity’ may well be an emotion, ‘serenity of beingness’ is probably something else entirely (more on that at another time). Perhaps the placement of activities on the emotional tone scale contributed to some of the confusion that occurs in Scientology with respect to the role and purpose and worth of emotion.

This begs the question, are there emotions higher than exhilaration (perhaps the highest Scientology tone scale position that is fairly sure to be an emotion)? I think it is a worthwhile exercise for people to work out for themselves how the emotional tone scale should or could or can be logically and intuitively seen to be. That is particularly so for those who have set their life goals around the achievement of the non-emotions placed at the top of the Scientology tone scale. It can be a liberating exercise. I have done a lot of work on it myself – by self-observation and observation of others. I share some of my notes on it below. This sharing is not for the purposes of indoctrinating or selling an idea. Instead it is provided in order to stimulate thought and conversation and input. The plain type items accompanied by numbers are from the original Hubbard Tone Scale In Full. The italicized typed items are tones on the existing scale that I question as being emotions in the first place (as noted above). The bold-faced, italicized entries are emotions I added by observation in their relative positions to the existing Tone Scale In Full.
 

In present time

Gold Meritorious Patron
oh my god...whut?
i need some clay, fast.

i will admit though, scientology appealed to me because i was always a huge bundle of emotions.
i really wanted/needed to get into a comfortable range.

and i did for a while. but i still always suspected that the "reactive mind" existed in my stomach, or what some would call the solar plexus.

my theory now is that, when you supress your emotions... they do move into the area around your head, and that creates what is called mass in scientology.

did anyone else ever experience that?

it's esoteric at best:/
 

Udarnik

Gold Meritorious Patron
Emotions are just chemical chain reactions in your head. They are especially connected with the autonomic motor system. If you don't let them out into the conscious areas of thought, the chemical messengers will continue to bounce around in the unconscious areas and eventally the stress will manifest itself in psychological or even physical ailments.

I suspect this is why there seems to be an increased incidence of cancer in $cientology circles.
 

kate8024

-deleted-
Marty critiques the Tone Scale and violates KSW in a new way.

Marty has now crossed a new Rubicon. He has gone past the anti-KSW practice of refusing to apply aspects of the Tech he believes to be harmful or not workable to positively changing, altering and rewriting the Tech. It is one thing to omit. It is another step to rewrite and replace. Marty has gone from an editor who merely uses an eraser to an author who uses an eraser and a pen.

Marty is doing something else. He is asking people to think for themselves.

Good! I think too many people doing Scientology stuff outside of the church are too scared to alter the tech. Coming up with better solutions than what LRH wrote is a very good thing in my book.

Having said that, I never really did get into the tone scale thing - to me it seems mostly useful for labeling other people as tone 1.1 or something like that to put them down but maybe I'm missing something there.
 

uniquemand

Unbeliever
Good! I think too many people doing Scientology stuff outside of the church are too scared to alter the tech. Coming up with better solutions than what LRH wrote is a very good thing in my book.

Having said that, I never really did get into the tone scale thing - to me it seems mostly useful for labeling other people as tone 1.1 or something like that to put them down but maybe I'm missing something there.

It's primary use as an auditor is to identify when the person is having improvement. Direction of improvement. Back in the fifties, it also determined how "heavy" a "process" to use with the person, a la "Science of Survival" chart in the back of the book. People who are low on the tone-scale are considered to run poorly on "heavy" processes like incident running, and should be run, instead, on "locks" or "pleasure moments".
 

Anonycat

Crusader
It's primary use as an auditor is to identify when the person is having improvement. Direction of improvement. Back in the fifties, it also determined how "heavy" a "process" to use with the person, a la "Science of Survival" chart in the back of the book. People who are low on the tone-scale are considered to run poorly on "heavy" processes like incident running, and should be run, instead, on "locks" or "pleasure moments".

In my experience, it was just a sales tool. They'd point at the chart and say: Look! Once you go Clear, you'll never be down below that - ever again! A prop.
 

uniquemand

Unbeliever
In my experience, it was just a sales tool. They'd point at the chart and say: Look! Once you go Clear, you'll never be down below that - ever again! A prop.

That's certainly how it could be used in "dissemination". It's not how auditors or case supervisors use it. A clear, BTW, isn't supposed to be ALWAYS enthusiastic. Instead, they are supposed to have control over their emotions and express the ones that seem most appropriate to them, rather than ones that are "triggered"/"restimulated".
 

Anonycat

Crusader
That's certainly how it could be used in "dissemination". It's not how auditors or case supervisors use it. A clear, BTW, isn't supposed to be ALWAYS enthusiastic. Instead, they are supposed to have control over their emotions and express the ones that seem most appropriate to them, rather than ones that are "triggered"/"restimulated".

When I got the pitch in '74, that was the deal. Lots of amazing promises. I was part of the "throw away your glasses" and "knock a man's hat off" scene ... as an observer, not a continuing client. I did see that stuff though.
 

clamicide

Gold Meritorious Patron
Is it wrong that I'm worried about Marty? Anyone who happens to remember what I post knows that I'm not a fan of either of the MRs, but this stuff... he needs a therapist, but is convinced that psychs are evil. You can only spin yourself so far into trying to work out the tech before a cog gets loose...
 

Udarnik

Gold Meritorious Patron
Is it wrong that I'm worried about Marty? Anyone who happens to remember what I post knows that I'm not a fan of either of the MRs, but this stuff... he needs a therapist, but is convinced that psychs are evil. You can only spin yourself so far into trying to work out the tech before a cog gets loose...

...because someone with more than a few cogs loose put the "tech" together in the first place! :screwy:
 

Anonycat

Crusader
Is it wrong that I'm worried about Marty? Anyone who happens to remember what I post knows that I'm not a fan of either of the MRs, but this stuff... he needs a therapist, but is convinced that psychs are evil. You can only spin yourself so far into trying to work out the tech before a cog gets loose...

I consider Marty one of the people with the roughest of roads out. He went deep into it.
 

CommunicatorIC

@IndieScieNews on Twitter
Is it wrong that I'm worried about Marty? Anyone who happens to remember what I post knows that I'm not a fan of either of the MRs, but this stuff... he needs a therapist, but is convinced that psychs are evil. You can only spin yourself so far into trying to work out the tech before a cog gets loose...
Why do you say Marty "is convinced that psychs are evil" when he repeatedly recommends a book by a psychiatrist (Man’s Search for Meaning, by Viktor Frankl), repeatedly recommends a book by psychologist (The Sociopath Next Door, by Martha Stout), and recently and disparagingly wrote, "For those Scientologist still sufficiently brainwashed to refuse to consider the words of a psychiatrist...."?
 

Gib

Crusader
Good! I think too many people doing Scientology stuff outside of the church are too scared to alter the tech. Coming up with better solutions than what LRH wrote is a very good thing in my book.

Having said that, I never really did get into the tone scale thing - to me it seems mostly useful for labeling other people as tone 1.1 or something like that to put them down but maybe I'm missing something there.

Hubbard was into scales. It all had to align with his sub human (wogs) to "clear" to "OT" bullshit.

He had to make it sound "science" like, like wow man.

See, you was once a "god", got implanted, then fell to grace (earth the prison planet),

and now hubbardski got you climb the ladder back to godlike status. Like wow man. :laugh:

Don't forget, money is all part of this, every step of the way, and the till increases as one gets above "clear".

.
 

kate8024

-deleted-
Hubbard was into scales. It all had to align with his sub human (wogs) to "clear" to "OT" bullshit.

He had to make it sound "science" like, like wow man.

Yeah I have a copy of Scientology 0-80, he went _way_ overboard with scales. The tone scale is probably the one I dislike the most though. Some of them I find totally bizarre like the "know to sex scale". I can understand observing and cataloging something like phases people go though while transitioning between emotions but I'm pretty sure he just made up the vast majority (or rather all) of his scales then tried to shoe-horn people into them.
 

lost

Patron with Honors
Yeah I have a copy of Scientology 0-80, he went _way_ overboard with scales. The tone scale is probably the one I dislike the most though. Some of them I find totally bizarre like the "know to sex scale". I can understand observing and cataloging something like phases people go though while transitioning between emotions but I'm pretty sure he just made up the vast majority (or rather all) of his scales then tried to shoe-horn people into them.
You took the words right out of my mouth?
 

Outethicsofficer

Silver Meritorious Patron
I consider Marty one of the people with the roughest of roads out. He went deep into it.

I now think I went south through some sort of crazy and ended up in the cult as a solution, finding no solution there really I exited the cult eventually, I may have hit crazy again coming north from it...or I am about to! Unsure on this point.

Anyway, getting out of it is just the first part and that may have been achieved easily for some and not so for others, either way; out is just like saying you opened the front door and stepped through it to find yourself on the porch there is yet a road in front of you. IMO one may hit 'crazy' on that road. Perhaps Marty is now at this point.
 
Top