Mentally Damaged Ex-Scientologists

Mojo

Silver Meritorious Patron
Usually, but Paul is an unusual person.

Some people are just peculiar. At the risk of being misunderstood by everyone, including Paul, permit me to suggest that Paul is one of those people who "have two brains and three eyes."

That actually means something, although I won't attempt to explain it at this time.

It's a good thing.

I will. Lol.

Paul has that rare human capacity to perceive from what's called the left and right brain, nearly simultaneously. Which is to say he can see from the heart, and as well, see from the mind. Or perhaps better stated: in terms of intellectual and emotional perception, Paul is not limping (or rarely limps).

The 'three-eyes' part of the statement is equally facinating. Both in theory and in fact. As Gurdjieff pointed out: there exist multiple meanings in any one given statement, I will be offering only one (or 2) of those possible meanings. Lol.

My instinctive take is the 3 eyes represent the 3 capacitites of human perception known as the first second and third person point of view, on any given subject, or experience of that subject. So to speak. Which capacity employed is like a breath of fresh air to a world struggling for oxygen. So to speak again.

My second take is: irrelevant given to my commitment to being loyal to the first. Lol! (no spiritual infidelity taken lightly here).

Mojo
 

Pixie

Crusader
OK, now I know. The thought of appearing in public to be stupid raised my ability to read the directions.



Say you want to multiquote two messages, like I just did. You click the multiquote icon on the first one and it glows red. Then you click the multiquote icon on the second one. It also turns red. If that's the last one you want to quote, you then click the normal quote button on that same post.

And Bob's your uncle. Now I'm off to bed.

Paul

Did that, it turned red, no, it's gone now, the multie quote. it's not here anymore, first one what, second one what?? This was not explained very well dull old fart.. I'm off to bed now too.. too tired for all this..
 

Alanzo

Bardo Tulpa
Flunk on this sentence of your post-but I liked the rest.

You cannot compare losing your money in a business or getting your leg blown off to insanity and perhaps losing your ability to 'live' and communicate with people and enjoy life. I still dont think you get the 'damage thing' as it relates to that minor thing -- a free uninhibited mind, free from conditioned responses that make you small and introverted as a result of mind control.

I totally get 'move on' and last I checked thats what we are all doing here as we erupt from the bowels of our mind here on exmb..

I have to disagree with you, BG.

That sentence was the main point of my post.

We ARE MEST objects that get kicked around as we go through life. Damage and wear-and-tear are not to be overcome by some spiritual magic wand, like we were sold by Scientology.

And that, I have learned since leaving the cult, is one of the most spiritual and redemptive lessons ever.
 

Mojo

Silver Meritorious Patron
Can you imagine that Mick and I, despite wildly divergent experiences arriving at the same conclusion might be revealing? It's something called 'parallax'

Zinj

Yes. I can also imagine Stalin and Hubbard in the same light. Or anti-light, experiencing the same parallax. Hint: the world is mine, humans are ants.

Mojo

P.S. If I need to explain this post to anyone I will have lost all faith in myself (temporarily).
 

Boldgirl

Patron Meritorious
Flunk on this sentence of your post-but I liked the rest.

You cannot compare losing your money in a business or getting your leg blown off to insanity and perhaps losing your ability to 'live' and communicate with people and enjoy life. I still dont think you get the 'damage thing' as it relates to that minor thing -- a free uninhibited mind, free from conditioned responses that make you small and introverted as a result of mind control.

I totally get 'move on' and last I checked thats what we are all doing here as we erupt from the bowels of our mind here on exmb..

I have to disagree with you, BG.

That sentence was the main point of my post.

We ARE MEST objects that get kicked around as we go through life. Damage and wear-and-tear are not to be overcome by some spiritual magic wand, like we were sold by Scientology.

And that, I have learned since leaving the cult, is one of the most spiritual and redemptive lessons ever.


Holy crap, I multiquoted!

OK, well that is a wow to me alanzo. I get now that you feel you are a body only and not a spirit...at least that is what I get from what you are saying here.

I believe that we have this body and we go on from here and come back for more fun over and over, but then again I have always believed that. So although my mest body has been kicked around in life, and certainly my spirit has too with scientology----the spiritual part is far worse. Although we know scn OT powers dont exist, there still is some serious validity to mind over matter at times as well as attitude affecting body sickness outcomes with certian people. This has been shown in the literature over and over by real clinicians in real research.

OK well, see ya.
 

gomorrhan

Gold Meritorious Patron
I have to disagree with you, BG.

That sentence was the main point of my post.

We ARE MEST objects that get kicked around as we go through life. Damage and wear-and-tear are not to be overcome by some spiritual magic wand, like we were sold by Scientology.

And that, I have learned since leaving the cult, is one of the most spiritual and redemptive lessons ever.

Well, I agree that we have bodies, and I think it's very likely that we emerge from those bodies. I think it's possible that there is encoded information which can be triggered by perception in our genes, and this feedsback with currently created memories, but I don't believe "we" or "I" lived before. I don't think I am a MEST object, but I think I'm encoded in a MEST object, and that if that object is destroyed or seriously disrupted, "I" cease to be present, and cannot return. However, I consider myself potentially extractable as non-local information, although I don't know the process to do that (I don't mean verbal or scientology form of process: I mean "uploading" to the akashic record, the ethernet, or whatever). I'm interested in working on this, one day, as the sciences which make it possible emerge (and until then, I have "faith" that they will). I suspect the research on replacing or amplifying brain "parts" will eventually yield insight into how we are encoded into the nervous system, and eventually make it possible for us to be free of the "wetware" from whence we seem to spring, in more enduring media.
 

Boldgirl

Patron Meritorious
Well, I agree that we have bodies, and I think it's very likely that we emerge from those bodies. I think it's possible that there is encoded information which can be triggered by perception in our genes, and this feedsback with currently created memories, but I don't believe "we" or "I" lived before. I don't think I am a MEST object, but I think I'm encoded in a MEST object, and that if that object is destroyed or seriously disrupted, "I" cease to be present, and cannot return. However, I consider myself potentially extractable as non-local information, although I don't know the process to do that (I don't mean verbal or scientology form of process: I mean "uploading" to the akashic record, the ethernet, or whatever). I'm interested in working on this, one day, as the sciences which make it possible emerge (and until then, I have "faith" that they will). I suspect the research on replacing or amplifying brain "parts" will eventually yield insight into how we are encoded into the nervous system, and eventually make it possible for us to be free of the "wetware" from whence we seem to spring, in more enduring media.



see red highlight---there was an X- files episode on this exactly.....it didnt end well for the person being uploaded.:bigcry:
 

Alan

Gold Meritorious Patron
Well, I agree that we have bodies, and I think it's very likely that we emerge from those bodies. I think it's possible that there is encoded information which can be triggered by perception in our genes, and this feedsback with currently created memories, but I don't believe "we" or "I" lived before. I don't think I am a MEST object, but I think I'm encoded in a MEST object, and that if that object is destroyed or seriously disrupted, "I" cease to be present, and cannot return. However, I consider myself potentially extractable as non-local information, although I don't know the process to do that (I don't mean verbal or scientology form of process: I mean "uploading" to the akashic record, the ethernet, or whatever). I'm interested in working on this, one day, as the sciences which make it possible emerge (and until then, I have "faith" that they will). I suspect the research on replacing or amplifying brain "parts" will eventually yield insight into how we are encoded into the nervous system, and eventually make it possible for us to be free of the "wetware" from whence we seem to spring, in more enduring media.

"Uploading" to the akashic record, the ethernet, or whatever is very easy to do.

It requires the ability to be able to create holographic imagery.......this accesses the data base......but unless you also have a fair bit of knowledge in holographic image form you will not be able to recieve or decipher the knowledge.

Edison, Ford and many others became masters in their fields and then tapped into those holographic records.

Alan
 

Andrew

Patron with Honors
"Uploading" to the akashic record, the ethernet, or whatever is very easy to do.

It requires the ability to be able to create holographic imagery.......this accesses the data base......but unless you also have a fair bit of knowledge in holographic image form you will not be able to recieve or decipher the knowledge.

Edison, Ford and many others became masters in their fields and then tapped into those holographic records.

Alan

Let's say that this is something someone wanted to do. Do you have any recommendations as to how a person would develop the ability to tap into these holographic records?
 

Neo

Silver Meritorious Patron
What "damage" can there possibly have been?


Well:

1) Take the large number of people who are afraid to post under their own names on these very boards? fearful of some un-named harassment from the "evil empire". People who have nightmares for years.

2) How about those who, post scientology, suffered breakdowns and even committed suicide?

3) How about those who have family they cannot talk to?

That's some real effing damage.

Mick

Agreed.

It's hard to move on from a damaging Cult, whilst that Cult is still in operation, continuing to do its thing.

However, rather than personally use the word 'damaged', I would say that I was 'severely affected' by my time in Scientology. Yes, life does go on. And yes, it is much better out here in the real world. However, I take exception to their continuing existence, particularly whilst they still perpetuate the crimes that lead to this 'damage' in the first place.
 

gomorrhan

Gold Meritorious Patron
see red highlight---there was an X- files episode on this exactly.....it didnt end well for the person being uploaded.:bigcry:

I loved the X-Files. I'm sure that many "uploads" won't go well, the first few times they are tried, but that's how we learn. I don't think it will be possible for a while, but I do think that it IS possible, and that in fact, it is inevitable, with the continuing convergence of networking, medicine, and processing (computer processing).

Alan, I see what you said as possible, but not as replicable in a reliable, repeatable manner. In order for that to occur, I think that there are medical realities that need to be created. Philip K. Dick touched on all of this sort of stuff decades ago, the Matrix touched on it (not necessarily the "bodies in pawn" theme, but the idea that our existence can occur with or without our bodies, in a virtual reality [perhaps that's all our brains are doing, is generating a virtual reality with an increasing degree of conformity to actuality]).
 

Alanzo

Bardo Tulpa
Holy crap, I multiquoted!

OK, well that is a wow to me alanzo. I get now that you feel you are a body only and not a spirit...at least that is what I get from what you are saying here.

That's not at all what I said, BG.

We are definitely bodies. I can prove it to you.

Look down at your hands... are they on your keyboard or on your mouse?

Are your hands really totally separate from you?

There is such a thing as "dualism" and "nondualism" (these are hyperlinks!)

Take a look at "nondualism"

When you really get an idea of these, especially as they are taught in Buddhism, you get that Hubbard used DUALISM as one of his traps.

I believe that we have this body and we go on from here and come back for more fun over and over, but then again I have always believed that. So although my mest body has been kicked around in life, and certainly my spirit has too with scientology----the spiritual part is far worse. Although we know scn OT powers dont exist, there still is some serious validity to mind over matter at times as well as attitude affecting body sickness outcomes with certian people. This has been shown in the literature over and over by real clinicians in real research.

OK well, see ya.
Don't blow me off.

Read about these concepts - look at them through other eyes than Hubbard's.

MEST exists.

Spirit exists.

BOTH of them do.

There was a guy on ESMB named "Operating Lamda" once. That came from the Dianetics Axioms that Hubbard wrote in the early 1950's.

Don't dismiss this idea like Hubbard taught you to, as a knee jerk reaction against the "Materialists" or "Brain Theory Boys".

Look at it with new eyes, outside the cult.
 

Cat's Squirrel

Gold Meritorious Patron
That's not at all what I said, BG.

We are definitely bodies. I can prove it to you.

Look down at your hands... are they on your keyboard or on your mouse?

Are your hands really totally separate from you?

There is such a thing as "dualism" and "nondualism" (these are hyperlinks!)

Take a look at "nondualism"

When you really get an idea of these, especially as they are taught in Buddhism, you get that Hubbard used DUALISM as one of his traps.

Don't blow me off.

Read about these concepts - look at them through other eyes than Hubbard's.

MEST exists.

Spirit exists.

BOTH of them do.

There was a guy on ESMB named "Operating Lamda" once. That came from the Dianetics Axioms that Hubbard wrote in the early 1950's.

Don't dismiss this idea like Hubbard taught you to, as a knee jerk reaction against the "Materialists" or "Brain Theory Boys".

Look at it with new eyes, outside the cult.

But if you were unfortunate enough to lose your hands, would you diminish in any way? You are senior to your body.
 

Alanzo

Bardo Tulpa
But if you were unfortunate enough to lose your hands, would you diminish in any way? You are senior to your body.

If I was unfortunate enough to lose my hands, I would hold up my bloody stumps and scream, "MY HANDS!! MY GOD!! I'VE LOST MY HANDS!!!"

Did you read about nondualism?

Can you make a point about that?

Because that was the main point of my post.
 

Cat's Squirrel

Gold Meritorious Patron
If I was unfortunate enough to lose my hands, I would hold up my bloody stumps and scream, "MY HANDS!! MY GOD!! I'VE LOST MY HANDS!!!"

Of course you would, because it would be a / extremely painful and b / very disabling in terms of what you're able to do.

But you, yourself, would still be there.

Did you read about nondualism?

Can you make a point about that?

Because that was the main point of my post.

Sure, but you really need a spiritually awakened person to do it properly and the only ones I've known for certain to be that are now dead.
 

SchwimmelPuckel

Genuine Meatball
Bleh! - You guys won't get out of being a 'spirit' even if you are meatballs!

If indeed our brains are (wet)computers that has this amazing ability of self awareness and imagining everything.. Then that 'self' is you! A 'spirit' for all intents and purposes. - Only dependent on the brain running.

And such a 'self' will predictably protest death and non-existence. Those ideas are pretty daunting for an intelligent system. Logically daunting..

:yes:
 

nexus100

Gold Meritorious Patron
Bleh! - You guys won't get out of being a 'spirit' even if you are meatballs!

If indeed our brains are (wet)computers that has this amazing ability of self awareness and imagining everything.. Then that 'self' is you! A 'spirit' for all intents and purposes. - Only dependent on the brain running.

And such a 'self' will predictably protest death and non-existence. Those ideas are pretty daunting for an intelligent system. Logically daunting..

:yes:

"I have sampled this life and it is sufficient...Annihilation has no terrors for me because I have already tried it before I was born-a hundred million years-and I have suffered more in an hour, in this life, than I remember to have suffered in the whole hundred million years put together. There was a peace, a serenity, an absence of all sense of responsiblity, an absence of worry, an absence of care, grief, perplexity; and a presence of a deep content and unbroken satisfaction in that hundred million years of holiday which I look back upon with a tender longing and with a grateful desire to resume, when the opportunity comes."

Mark Twain
 

Voltaire's Child

Fool on the Hill
Re damage suffered--

It's different for different people. There are people who've had breakdowns. And there are people with ongoing emotional issues because of what CofS did to them. And there are people who don't have any issues but have diminished quality of life due to things like disconnection and other awful practices.

Not the same for everybody.
 
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