More COS Mojo Concerning Debbie Cook

Rene Descartes

Gold Meritorious Patron
Ahh, I see you be back for some more mojo, mon. And by mojo I mean that I'm a gonna be making da mojo outta you mon.


STATEMENTS MADE BY DEBBIE COOK BAUMGARTEN

Ms. Cook praised the Church and its leadership in statements made at the time or after the alleged incidents took place, a fact which should be made known to your viewers:

On June 2, 2007 she wrote that the Church's ecclesiastical leader's intentions for Scientology were:

“... to accomplish planetary clearing and remove the obstacles to accomplishing that. To do things right and set up organizations for the long haul with real production lines established. To restore the materials of Dianetics and Scientology to a pure LRH [L. Ron Hubbard] state so they can be assimilated and applied by others.”

Hey mon, looks to me like you be saying that she was fooling you then. And you couldn't foresee the hurricane on the horizon because she had been blinding your eyes with all this nice-nice talk about what was going on. No mon. BY now she still be thinking your mojo be da good mojo.

Suerly mon you must be able to see that she was suffering from Post Traumatic Stress Disorder due to the abuse that ye all had been given to her. Hey mon, don't you find it interesting that there is PTS in PTSD?



On September 8, 2007 Ms. Cook conducted a seminar to Church parishioners in Clearwater, Florida. She again echoed support for the Church:

“You have heard it said, there are days in history and there are days that make history. Well, that day was June 30th 2007 at the OT Summit here in Clearwater with the Chairman of the Board RTC's [Mr. Miscavige's] monumental announcement of the Golden Age of Knowledge for Eternity and release of the Basics [books and lectures of L. Ron Hubbard].”

So maybe you be thinking that she had not been totall yfreed from the mind rape that ye had been putting upon her, mon? Only 2 years had gone by. You be thinking that the Kool Aid still be very sweet for her and that the Kool Aid not be mixed in with any bad mojo, mon?


On May 29, 2009 in a letter to the Church she wrote:

“I have no doubt about the true source of the expansion actions at the Flag Land Base—COB RTC [Mr. Miscavige]. My support of COB RTC and his programs during this time was dedicated and unswerving.”


So mon, ye be thinking that she be so happy with the Leader of da Pack that she be happy to lick the bathroom floor for da master?

Perhaps mon by 2009, she not yet done hear about Amy Scobee and a few others and what the hell was that they been through. Perhaps she be lackin' the data at that time to be able to masterfully apply the great ones Data Series to. Mon, ye gotta be thinking that somewhere along the way Debbie Cook had to have gotten fed up with the stories she be hearing and put it all together.

Mon, ye were only able to hold your sway over her to some point. Mon, your lies and deciet and abuse could only go so far. Did ye honestly think mon, that Debbie Cook would not hear the stories of the others, stories that she herself could relate to due to her witnessing and being a victim of the abuse?

Gads, mon, What ye be thinking? Ye be thinking that da mojo you be having within you be the mojo of the gods? Mon, you need to learn that no matter how powerful da mojo be that you be having, the more powerful mojo that exist be the mojo of truth. And I ain't even be quoting about the mojo nonsense of the Lron Mojo.

Your main mojo man Lron, he be saying that lies be the persisting mojo but I got news for you, mon. Lies be the weakest mojo. Lies be getting slapped and kicked into the swamp to rot. Please learn about da mojo of da truth.

Da mojo of da truth be far greater than da mojo of da lies.

Da mojo of da truth be the element that cause da mojo of da lies to not persist.

There be too much convolution in da mojo of da lies mon! Too much!

Da mojo of da lies be imploding unto itself once da mojo reach da point where it cannot stand up to da mojo of da truth.

Bah, I'm finished with you for now, mon.

Your mojo, it be stinkin' like da poop.

Rd00
 
... Your main mojo man Lron, he be saying that lies be the persisting mojo but I got news for you, mon. Lies be the weakest mojo. Lies be getting slapped and kicked into the swamp to rot. Please learn about da mojo of da truth. ...

Not necessarily true, RD. Depends. :unsure:

Obvious lies, being easily spotted, are very weak just as you suggest. However, the more 'truthful' the statement the harder to perceive any untruth it may contain or suggest.

I've a long held personal theory about an individual's own serfacs that it is the degree to which the serfac may embody a truth for that person which makes it so difficult to spot as a serfac and therefore as possessing untruth. Since the person can see the obvious truth contained within the proposition, he is accordingly blinded to a degree to any untruth within it.

The idea that 'a lie causes persistence' is very much in keeping with this observation. It is only in spotting the lie that the lie loses the ability to deceive and accordingly vanishes.



... Da mojo of da truth be far greater than da mojo of da lies. ...

This is true, but it can entail having the ability to perceive some very fine distinctions in order to unravel.



Mark A. Baker
 

Petey C

Silver Meritorious Patron
My take on this is much more simple, and that is: A person can change her mind. In fact, if someone doesn't change her/his mind in the presence of new information, there's something wrong. Nothing wrong at all with changing one's mind.

The difference between most of us and Debbie Cook and a few others is that some have a high profile and their assertions and sayings are more public and wider spread. For someone like me, it's mainly the spouse and dog who hear my bold statements.

We've all been there -- made assertions that we (half) believed in at the time, then regretted it. If I had to stick by every single opinion and claim I'd ever made in my life, I'd be a morass of contradictions. (Hell, I'm already that.)
 

Lulu Belle

Moonbat
My take on this is much more simple, and that is: A person can change her mind. In fact, if someone doesn't change her/his mind in the presence of new information, there's something wrong. Nothing wrong at all with changing one's mind.

The difference between most of us and Debbie Cook and a few others is that some have a high profile and their assertions and sayings are more public and wider spread. For someone like me, it's mainly the spouse and dog who hear my bold statements.

We've all been there -- made assertions that we (half) believed in at the time, then regretted it. If I had to stick by every single opinion and claim I'd ever made in my life, I'd be a morass of contradictions. (Hell, I'm already that.)

Oh I know. My worst nightmare is to have everything that comes out of my mouth be on video. :nervous:

It would convince everyone I know - especially me - that I was a total bipolar lunatic.
 

HelluvaHoax!

Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on
..

Whoa!

I wonder how many of those kind of sound bytes the CoS has collected in preparation of a trial, where Debbie is praising the cult and COB?

"No, no, no, my [STRIKE]guru[/STRIKE] husband never ever beat me. I sleep with myself and know every square inch of my body and I would know. And those black and blue marks, swelling and stitches on my face are not physical abuse--they are somatics that turned on in my auditing and i just need to continue until it flattens."

I believe what we are looking at (in Debbie's adulation of her tormentor) is Post Traumatic Stress Syndrome from the time she was stuck in the hole.

[STRIKE]Stockholm[/STRIKE] Stuckhole Syndrome.
 

Jquepublic

Silver Meritorious Patron
..

Whoa!

I wonder how many of those kind of sound bytes the CoS has collected in preparation of a trial, where Debbie is praising the cult and COB?

"No, no, no, my [STRIKE]guru[/STRIKE] husband never ever beat me. I sleep with myself and know every square inch of my body and I would know. And those black and blue marks, swelling and stitches on my face are not physical abuse--they are somatics that turned on in my auditing and i just need to continue until it flattens."

I believe what we are looking at (in Debbie's adulation of her tormentor) is Post Traumatic Stress Syndrome from the time she was stuck in the hole.

Absolutely. I have no doubt.

Anything she wrote prior to leaving the church may have been her attempts to PR her way out of the situation she was in. I don't know about anyone else but as I was leaving, I had to do some heavy duty PRing to keep the situation somewhat under my control. I had to play along or I was going to be ordered to a Sea Org base to do my routing form and I knew what that meant. I even lied about a suicide attempt early on to avoid being yanked down to Flag.

You say what you have to say to get out.

One other thing. Does the church have a single staff member on post these days above the age of 12?! The older I get, the more juvenile their tactics seem. Really? Do they really think that anyone would buy their lame "evidence" as proof of wrongdoing NOW with Debbie?

Please.
 

Rene Descartes

Gold Meritorious Patron
The idea that 'a lie causes persistence' is very much in keeping with this observation. It is only in spotting the lie that the lie loses the ability to deceive and accordingly vanishes.


Mark A. Baker

I would be totally buying into this statement of yours except there is one thing holding me back from buying into it.

The fact that someome in the Church is lieing and someone in the Church knows that they are obviously lieing however the lie in their eyes is not doing a very good job of vanishing as you state it will "accordingly".

This is why I like my theory better.

That the lie gets overly convoluted and gets to a point where it cannot sustain itself and cannot stand up to truth so it implodes, you know kind of like when Columbo shows the criminal the final piece of evidence that nails his ass to the wall the final piece of evidence he deduced from listening to all the lies that he was previously told.

Imagine that, he was able to figure out the truth by being given a bunch of lies.

When the Church throws in half-truths and half-baked truths and half-assed truths it only makes it more convoluted.

And while we are on this, the statements by the Church contradict their attorney's argument that Debbie Cook had the intentions from the start to violate the NDA.

It only adds stupidity to the whole situation. I hope they consulted him first to determine that this was a good move legally.

Spencer probably would not be too happy to know that the Church did a lame brain thing like this especially since his grilling of Debbie Cook had that in there. He will probably never be able to bring that three dollar bill out to the crap shoot ever again.

Rd00
 

RogerB

Crusader
Well . . . we all change with the passage of time and the acquisition of more knowledge, facts, and truth . . . .

Watching Debbie, I can't help feeling she has been on a learning curve . . . and while she still sees/believes in the absolute workability of "the tech," it seems she has come to the truth that the current scene of the $cn enterprise is wrong and criminal.

We should allow her the win of her progress . . .

We should help her screw the current goings-on in the cult and help her free those in "the hole" . . . these are all things we ought want and support.

Her recognition that $cn is a deceitful fraud can come later . . .

RogerB

PS: RD, you mojo piece was a hoot! Way clever and funny!
 
I would be totally buying into this statement of yours except there is one thing holding me back from buying into it.

The fact that someome in the Church is lieing and someone in the Church knows that they are obviously lieing however the lie in their eyes is not doing a very good job of vanishing as you state it will "accordingly". ...

It sounds like you have some interpretation worked out where the lie has some sort of an 'objective existence', at least until it vanishes. That is not the case. Lies are ideas and as ideas exist only in a mind. Spotting the truth of a lie causes the lie to vanish within the mind, not as some object or particle within the physical universe. That is why one person may 'vanish' a lie, yet another person will still be the effect of it.

The liar has a completely different experience from that of the person to whom a lie has been told. The liar knows from the beginning that the lie is a lie. It is something he has 'mocked up' and as long as he retains the knowledge of his own creation & responsibility the lie has no ability to mislead him. The lie holds no element of truth for him.

The acknowledgement of his own culpability in creating the lie, i.e. knowing the truth or source of the lie, defeats any effect which the lie might have to persuade him of its truth. The liar can only come to believe his own lie should he forget his own culpability in having created the lie in the first place. That is the epitome of self-delusion. That can only be overcome by 'spotting the source'. i.e. that it's his own lie.

That represents a very different perspective to that of a person who, not knowing the truth, has come to believe a lie. It is only from the perspective of a person who is ignorant of a truth and the subsequent experience of learning the truth that the 'vanishing of a lie' can be said to occur.

For each person as he spots his own truths the lies vanish. That is the very mechanism of cognition and that is from which arises the sense of lightness & brightness which is often experienced during a cognition.


Mark A. Baker
 
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Terril park

Sponsor
Her recognition that $cn is a deceitful fraud can come later . . .

RogerB

So you deny the benefits of TRs, the comm cycle, objectives
the grades and correction lists and other matters!

Where would you be without the above?

Try getting honest on whose shoulders you stand on!

Also try sueing CO$. Just for fun.
 

Rene Descartes

Gold Meritorious Patron
Mr Bqaker,

I am only goign to cover one part of your post. It follows below...

"...as long as he retains the knowledge of his own creation & responsibility the lie has no ability to mislead him."

Are you referring to a fib?

Or are you referring to telling a childabout Santa Claus?

Did you ever see the Star Trek Voager episode where they ended up breifly within a society where fiction stories were forbidden because they were considered to be lies? If so is this what you are referring to?

I'm thinking this is what you are referring to because when you state that "the lie has no ability to mislead him" I am thinking that this is the only kind of lie that might not be able to lislead him.

There is no convoluton in that "lie".

There is not even any "vaishing".

Let's talk about real honest to goodness lies. The kinds that not only does one have to lie and continue to lie but they have to throw in certain truths in order to make the lies appear to betruths and they have to throw in even more lies to make their lies appear to be truths.

That convolution isn't going to stand up to time. It is going to eventually implode unless everything else iaround t disappears before it gets a chance to implode.

Kind of like Spencer and the CoS. The will mutually self destruct each other, forgive me for the oxymoron.

The woof and warp of their convolution is going to collapse.

Rd00
 

GreyWolf

Gold Meritorious Patron
Thanks M.A.B.

The liar can only come to believe his own lie should he forget his own culpability in having created the lie in the first place. That is the epitome of self-delusion.

This describes L.R.H. perfectly.
 

GreyWolf

Gold Meritorious Patron
So you deny the benefits of TRs, the comm cycle, objectives
the grades and correction lists and other matters!

Where would you be without the above?

Try getting honest on whose shoulders you stand on!

Also try sueing CO$. Just for fun.

:angry: And you would deny people their right to their anger and pain that they had been victims of the Charlatan, L.R.H. There is too much evidence out now that the abuses visited upon Staff, S.O. and Public were not started by DM, but by the Cloven Hoofed God of Scientology, Mr. L. Ron Hubbard.
 

Rene Descartes

Gold Meritorious Patron
It's going to vanish as individuals spot the lie for what it is. That is correct.


Mark A. Baker

I did not say the lie is going to vanish as individuals spot the lie.

But if we take the Rathbun OT3 portion of his interview, I do say there was a lot of implosion there and no vanishing of that lie(s).

Rd00
 

Rene Descartes

Gold Meritorious Patron
Quite possibly. Or perhaps not. Hard to say since he was clearly complex, messed up, and manipulative.


Mark A. Baker

Mr Baker,

Are you calling him a liar?

Wait let me vary the question.

Are you saying he told lies?

Are you saying he told fibs?

Are you saying he told acceptable truths?

Are you saying he withheld truth that was pertinent to statements that he made?

Are you saying thast he lied to protect others?

Are you saying that he lied to protect himself?

Are you saying that he lied but did not realize he was lieing?

Let me know what kind of reads came up.

Rd00
 

Hatshepsut

Crusader

Rene Descartes? Born 13 yrs before John Dee 007 died...hmmmm....was he a 00 too?
http://www.sirbacon.org/links/dblohseven.html
Descartes too was a brilliant mathematician called to work in a court of a queen

johndee007.png
johndeetwo.png


I was just wondering why you placed the 00 after Rd in your signature
 
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