ESMB has entered archive mode. All posts and threads that were available to the general public are still readable. The board is still searchable. 

Thank you all for your participation and readership over the last 12 years.

If you want to join in the conversation, please join the new ESMB Redux at

My new approach to mail (I think it worked!)

Discussion in 'Leaving Scientology' started by Steven, Dec 19, 2018.

  1. Steven

    Steven My name is Chris, and I was a Scientologist

    Interesting. So all the suppressive letters I sent to the $cn orgs (as described earlier in the thread), including Flag and the AOs wouldn't get me declared? There's also the fact that I've publically left the church right here in the forums. Sure, I haven't given you guys my last name, but it'd take a 2-minute call to Cincinnati to figure out who I am.

    If that's the case, I have more work to do!
  2. Mimsey Borogrove

    Mimsey Borogrove Crusader

    You can reach him at The Guarantee building on Hollywood blvd. The mailing address is actually on Ivar st., It's not too hard to find. He will never call you. You can write him for all the good it will do. If you search Tony Ortega's blog about the arbitration he ran in the Garcia's case, you can find how he treated them, get a sense of how he deals with "entheta" and what response your communications will get. He's a true believer. Good luck.

    Last edited: Jan 6, 2019
  3. Mimsey Borogrove

    Mimsey Borogrove Crusader

    I didn't read the whole thread, but there is policy on how to deal with entheta letters. You should google it. I think the green vols are on the net somewhere.

  4. Mimsey Borogrove

    Mimsey Borogrove Crusader

    Bill - how much continued consent did Lisa McPherson give? Granted, she signed the usual onerous unconscionable contracts which gave them the right to imprison her against her will in the name of spiritual healing, but practically speaking - her ceasing giving consent had nothing to do with her needless death. Nor was it a legal giving away of her rights.

    What Is an Unconscionable Contract? | LegalMatch Law Library
    Jun 25, 2018 - An unconscionable contract is one that is so one-sided that it is unfair to one party and therefore unenforceable under law. It is a type of contract that leaves one party with no real, meaningful choice, usually due to major differences in bargaining power between the parties.

    Last edited: Jan 6, 2019
  5. Steven

    Steven My name is Chris, and I was a Scientologist

    Thanks for pointing that out! I found it here, in case anyone else is interested:

    Interesting. So there's a good chance I wasn't declared because of my letters, although posting here plus the letters may have been enough. I guess it's time to write a KR to the RTC and ensure the deed is done.
  6. Bill

    Bill Gold Meritorious Patron

    My point was exactly that. The CoS had/has no legal right to perform their abuses minus informed, cognizant and active consent. One does not ever have to formally resign from the CoS for that to be true. Obviously Lisa McPherson was not of sound mind and could not have given a valid, legal consent.

    I see nothing wrong with some kind of formal resignation, but I believe the lack of such a document does not give the CoS the legal right to abuse people.

    I'm not a lawyer and I might be wrong but I can't imagine there is any valid "contract" that could or should give the CoS that kind of "get out of jail free" card.
    Enthetan likes this.
  7. Enthetan

    Enthetan Master of Disaster

    They don't have the right to abuse, but they do have the ability. The ability comes from the learned helplessness of Scientologists, plus the willingness of Scientologists to lie for the org, plus the org's superior legal resources.
    Bill likes this.
  8. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    Public disavowal of Scientology should do it.

    Suppressive Acts are defined as actions or omissions undertaken to knowingly suppress, reduce or impede Scientology or Scientologists.
    Such Suppressive Acts include public disavowal of Scientology or Scientologists in good standing with Scientology Organizations; public statements against Scientology or Scientologists...(snip)
  9. Steven

    Steven My name is Chris, and I was a Scientologist

    $cientology is shrinking and being attacked on hundreds of fronts. Any chance OSA hasn’t been on here to see my posts and identify me? I’ll make their job easy and send a KR with links to my threads.
    TheOriginalBigBlue likes this.
  10. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    It's just my own way of looking at it but I think of it like these people doing body hanging piercing. At what point can a legal assessment be made of a person's consent when they willingly participate in something that is obviously very potentially harmful and litigious? Let's see, I revoked consent after the 3rd hook, or I revoked consent after the 6th month of being locked in the basement. Scientologists have a lot of rationalizations for going down that path so far that the point of revoking consent can be very fuzzy. They stay locked up or in degrading situations like the RPF because they want to remain in good standing, they accept it as a kind of therapy, they have a spouse on staff who they don't want to divorce or leave behind, they are making amends, they want to prove they can tough it out, this is the only workable spiritual technology in the universe and if I lose this I lose my spiritual freedom and chance at super powers and total recall for eternity, etc. They sign waivers and agreements that say they volunteer. It's true that these documents Scientologists sign are extremely lacking in detail and disclosure of what exactly it entails but the longer they put up with it the more vague their revocation of approval becomes.

    This is why Scientology is so effective as a cult. They have institutionalized this kind of consent into a business model and when things go completely sideways they just quietly settle. When they know how much training and auditing you have done that is a gauge of indoctrination and serves as a tacit agreement to accepting what they want to do and they are skilled at intuiting your level of tolerance and pushing it to the next level. I can easily see how they have avoided so much legal consequences when we signal our cooperation all along the way.

    Scientologists are gluttons for punishment.
    strativarius and Bill like this.
  11. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

  12. This is NOT OK !!!!

    This is NOT OK !!!! Gold Meritorious Patron

    They declared me. I was pleased. It cut down on the mail, but not completely. I had a "cutout" PO Box address and every once in a while I would go clean it out and into the trash.

    But they wouldn't take my cookie cutter web site down, even after many calls and letters and I threatened them that they didn't have the right to use my image to promote their cult.

    Finally I spoke out in the press and that first article didn't quite do the trick.

    So, finally, I appeared on Leah's TV show and THAT got the cookie cutter web site be replaced with a smear website of what a scumbag i supposedly am.

    But I've finally managed my on-line reputation. It's now obvious that I was in the cult, but now I'm out and have spoken out about it clearly.

    At last!:dance3::party::thewave:
    TheOriginalBigBlue likes this.
  13. phenomanon

    phenomanon Canyon

    In doing so you will be making a 'reach' toward them.
    It gives them the right to respond to your 'reach'.
    Best if you stay 'withdrawn' from them.
  14. Edwardo

    Edwardo Patron with Honors

    If you're nervous or in any way unsure of your position, that's a good plan.

    However if you are confident about dealing with org staff, then I suggest writing back to anyone who contacts you, explaining in a kind way your experiences in Scientology and what made you realize that things were terribly wrong. Maybe it was the beatings, the false stats at events, the imprisoned and disappeared execs - whatever you feel strongly about. For me, the final straw was the story of an exec I had admired and trusted, which was posted on Marty's blog (before Marty got nobbled).

    Include some links to your favorite articles that made you see the light.

    The advantage of this approach is that the person who reads your mail may check out the links and it may make a difference.

    I did this with the various people who contacted me, and after a couple of months I stopped receiving any magazines, calls, mail or email from any org anywhere.

    There aren't any Scientologists nowadays who can effectively handle entheta. Too much is known by the people outside, and too much is hidden from the people inside.

    I was just watching some of the Angry Gay Pope's videos. They are often very funny, and even though he can seem/be mean, he is (mainly) telling the Scientologists things they should really hear.

    Last edited: Jan 7, 2019
  15. Steven

    Steven My name is Chris, and I was a Scientologist

    Good suggestions! That's exactly what I've done. My early posts in this thread detail my letter-writing campaign. It's been a blast.

    I agree, and I'm 100% confident in my position, and it turns out that I'm a bit of a troll when it comes to $cientology.
    Edwardo likes this.
  16. tesseract

    tesseract Patron with Horrors

    Sounds fabulous. Maybe we could pool our ill gotten funds, drug money and government handouts and pay you 1 c per word (in a letter). :wink: Obviously, we would need dox from time to time. I think for now a declare on festive goldenrod paper would do... But then, I've heard they don't issue those anymore... :moon: :biggrin:
  17. TomKat

    TomKat Patron Meritorious

    No. Just print up a copy of that antichrist OT8 and send that to them :)
  18. cleared cannibal

    cleared cannibal Silver Meritorious Patron

    I sort of done the same thing and I know for sure I have been dead filed at my org but the letters from other places did not slow until I more or less done what you did. Still get some but a lot less. I didn't really put back a lot of entheata to them but indicated I wasn't going to do any more Scn. When ever they get someone new on staff someplace I usually get a letter from someone asking what I didn't like about Scn. I don't respond. Also get a few of the mass mailing now. I would say it has decreased 70-80% over the last 4 years and I have only been dead filed for a year at the org. I am not declared either. Still get a mass mailing from the org now and then. They must have several different mailing lists. They don't send your name uplines because they still want your name on the rolls to make it look like they have more membership than they actually do.

    I really don't think they will likely declare you unless you go public with things. The possible exception might be if they precieve you are holding back a family member or friend from dong Scn. With all the bad press about disconnection they are even treading lightly here now.
  19. phenomanon

    phenomanon Canyon

    The best thing you can do , for your own best interests, is to IGNORE them.
    Do not write letters to them.
    Write them here. Make no "reach" toward them at all.
  20. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    Yep, a CF file where the person hasn't responded to, but they have to spend money and time on for 30 or 40 years, is also a statement that isn't lost on staff.