My Time in Church and in the SO

FoTi

Crusader
Thanks for finishing up your story here.

I look forward to your next story on another thread. :yes:

You are a delightful writer. :thumbsup:
 

Operating DB

Truman Show Dropout
And then I realized that $cn IS RON. In order to truly doubt the church you have to truly doubt its founder. Until you can question the founder -- and break the link between him and the church --that very last mechanism will stay in place and keep you seeing things through only $cn eyes.
For me, the instant that I considered that Ron was source was the exact same instant that I became a $cn. That's the instant I stopped looking at anything else. And the early indoctrination in the church is doing everything it can to nurture that belief. That is the making (or breaking) of a $cientologist. And all that happened on this rundown was I simply changed Ron from "source" to "a possible source".

This could easily be the final step on the flee-dom bridge. And I think it becomes a personal thing from here.

And so the KR RD is the final step on The Bridge to Total Flee-dom:

LEVEL--- COST--- ABILITY GAINED

KR RD--- (free)--- knows who is, was, and always shall be SOURCE (hint: do you have a mirror?)

HAB

"LOOK! And ye shall know"

I just got done reading your postings and I really enjoyed it. Good insights and well written! You really said it for how I feel about the cult. For me the EP of becoming truly free from the cult was discovering that lrh is/was Source for everything evil or otherwise in the cult. Realizing this, truly sets one free from the cult and, at least for me, become truly CLEAR! And yes, you, the individual is Source! Isn't it great to do the doubt formula the correct way?

Thank you and have a nice day!
 

Supra

Patron
It tipped me too

Thanks everybody for the support, I'm nearly there...



This is where I first found the ESMB and looked at the forums.
......
.... "I know this person!" It was Carmel (Hi Carmel!) and I was totally amazed. As I read on I realised that I also knew this story!!! But the version i had heard was very abbreviated and had about 1% of the details that she had actually endured in her '9-levels-of-hell-inquisition'.

HAB

Yep HAB, I was closely involved with Carmel on the incident, but still had the wrong order of magnitude as to the extent that that RTC prick went to.
Reading Carmels story enraged me to the point of not only leaving the $oS, but to "publicly announce it".

Well done HAB, Well done Carmy, and well done Kevin.
 

Supra

Patron
Very Well Done

Okay, friends I think this about it,




I would like to truly thank everyone here and for all the support I've gotten from the people on this site, and especially to those who have made this site possible. It's been a blast sharing this -- writing a KR to the org just doesn't quite cut it.
......................
Last thing -- if you haven't read Carmel's story and Feral's story, read them now. They'll knock you for six. There are other stories that I'm finding now here and it is all confirming what I now know to be true.
......................................
Thanks again everybody!
Cheesburgers all round
HAB

"LOOK! And ye shall know"

Very Well Done HAB, I'm impressed. :)
 

Human Again

Silver Meritorious Patron
yay!! Cheeseburgers all 'round :D

If you're ever down my way, I'll happily shout you a cheeseburger and fries.
 

AnonyMary

Formerly Fooled - Finally Free
Happy Aberree

Hey everyone thanks very much and here is the next installment, everything here I write is my opinion bla bla maybe true or not or ham sandwhhiches

Cheers Mary, don't see why not -- do you have a site in mind?
HAB

Hi, sorry I missed your reply. This is a very informative story and it should be read by as many people as possible. I was thinking of putting it up on several sites. On usenet via alt.religion.scientology so that it gets spread more on on the internet and getting it up on lermanet.com with so many of the other important stories that are up there. It was just an idea. Let me know your thoughts.

Mary
 

Happy Aberree

Patron with Honors
Hi, sorry I missed your reply. This is a very informative story and it should be read by as many people as possible. I was thinking of putting it up on several sites. On usenet via alt.religion.scientology so that it gets spread more on on the internet and getting it up on lermanet.com with so many of the other important stories that are up there. It was just an idea. Let me know your thoughts.

Mary

Hi Mary,
that is fine with me as long as it is appropriate for those sites. If it gets read by more "doubters" and more newbies trying to get an informed angle on the c0$ I will be an even happier aberree.

Thanks also to everyone who read my story and for the feedback and support. It's really great.

HAB
 

HappyGirl

Gold Meritorious Patron
HAB - Your story is amazing! The way you see things made everything that happened much clearer for me. I knew it was all about money, but the way you broke it down into different phases and connected it up to what was going on then, got me to see Scn history more clearly. :thumbsup: And you had me laughing! My favorite. Thanks for writing this!
 
Your story is similar to others but you tell it in such a brilliant way, relating the de-programming to the original programming. A very nicely organised example of how the hypnotised can un-hypnotize themselves step by step. (Alanzo would no doubt be highly impressed:) )

One bit that "jumped out" at me near the end was this:

-snip- KR RD--- (free)--- knows who is, was, and always shall be SOURCE (hint: do you have a mirror?).

Without wanting to interfere with your creativity, it got me thinking that the "grade chart to Fleedom" could have on it somewhere; "Knows who he was and knows he never wants to be anyfuckingwhere near there again" as one of the "EP's :p :p
 

Happy Aberree

Patron with Honors
HAB - Thanks for writing this!

Cheers Happy Girl, writing it all down actually lifted a load off my shoulders that I didn't realise was even there.

One bit that "jumped out" at me near the end was this:

-snip- KR RD--- (free)--- knows who is, was, and always shall be SOURCE (hint: do you have a mirror?).

Without wanting to interfere with your creativity, it got me thinking that the "grade chart to Fleedom" could have on it somewhere; "Knows who he was and knows he never wants to be anyfuckingwhere near there again" as one of the "EP's :p :p

Cheers DB. I think that EP you mentioned is a very close second EP of the KR rundown but because the rundown is available to anybody (including little chilluns) it is not stated on the Flee-dom Bridge due to the profanity-content (though I will check with the publisher as I don't think "anyfuckingwhere" is officially a swear-word). lol

HAB
 

uncle sam

Silver Meritorious Patron
To HAPPY!

Uncle Sam fully endorses any and all of your Rundowns and in my appreciation of your endeavors on behalf of all people everywhere and at anytime - I award you the state of California.
 
Thank you Panda, can't really stop myself now (it was only supposed to be about 4 paragraphs originally) :whistling:

Okay... back into it!

--Everything I write here on this site is totally my own opinion and thus could be true, false or neither (or chocolate biscuits).

That whole ideal org pgm thing was just a global 'why' (which is an impossibility) that has been forced on orgs planet-wide. One of the main problems I saw with upper management is that they would continually come up with these massive 'whys' (if you are not policy-savvy, a 'why' is the greatest departure from the ideal scene, in other words its the thing that will sort out the situation e.g. staff aren't trained, or no salesman on post, not enough promo, manager is serial killer, etc).

They would come up with these and then order their compliance planet wide; so whether you were Milan or Canberra you had to comply. But what it says is that the solution for Milan org is the same as the solution for Canberra org, and that's just rubbish. Anyone who has actually done a 'why find' in an org or department will know that it is very specific to that situation. There could be a Day and Fdn org in the same building and they could easily have two different whys respectively. And to order 6 staff to be sent up-lines for training on a GAT evolution from an org like Canberra (which often didn't even have 6 staff!) is just blind stupidity.

Anyway, I was now doubting upper management and had completed the DUM RD (Doubt Upper Management Rundown). I had taken my next step on the Bridge to Total Flee-dom.

After making such gains I couldn't believe that the next step would present itself so soon, but of course, it did. The BASICS; and it's a big one.

Now from what I remember of the event, there were gross errors that existed on the part of the publishers in the form of grammatical, formatting, missing chapters/sections, included chapters/sections, incorrect type-sizes (or something like that). And these errors had now finally been rectified through 9 gazillion hours of work.

Now I have to willfully control myself here so as to not just start spewing forth profanities willy-nilly. :grouch:

So, calmly now, I am expected to believe that Ron wrote these basics over the course of a 10-15 year period and then 35 or so years after writing book one, he died. And these basics (the books anyway) are said to comprise the entire technology of $cn. I remember reading a policy that said that if you really understood the basic books and had full certainty on them, you could work the rest out yourself; they were that powerful (more verbal tech).

Okay.

Now these books contained GROSS errors that actually changed their meaning or the resultant understanding of them. And in all that time, Ron didn't notice that? Even if he was continually going from org to org non-stop working on expanding each area (not saying that he was), wouldn't it be more important to correct errors in the basic books of $cn? And if he was in the orgs and the basic books were so far out, you would expect major tech problems in those orgs -- which he would have surely seen.

Another thing I noticed at the event was that all this blame (there was about a ton of it) got put onto the old publishing companies or old staff who were distributing the books in the 60s. Which meant that very fortunately (funny that), absolutely no blame got put on current management. This is a habitual thing it seems:

1. Make a product and sell it; 2. Revise the product and re-sell it; 3. Improve the product and re-sell it.

Now this in itself is not foreign as a business concept or strategy. And it's hardly objectionable, as long as their is NO MONOPOLY ON THE PRODUCT. You have a product that you buy and a few years later, a better one comes out. If you want the better one, you get it.

Also if you're not happy you can always get a different product from a competitor. But within $cn it's more accurately this:

1. Make a product that is perfect; 1a. Sell it as the perfect product; 2. Discover imperfections; 2a. Make the product really perfect; 3. Sell it as the Really Perfect product; 4. Repeat ad infinitum.

And there is actually no competitor to buy from. The competitors are all SPs! Take a look: you want a different angle on mental health? Too bad because psychiatry is suppressive. What about another angle on the truth? Well that's out too because the media is suppressive. Different perspective on sorting out my illness? Maybe, but all drugs and drug companies are suppressive so not a good idea (and maybe the medical profession is suppressive too unless the doctor is a $cn). Surely I can get another opinion on management? You could if government wasn't so suppressive.

The real-world authorities (which are the ones who might question things within their spheres) are all viewed as enemies -- and you don't communicate to enemies. And you definitely don't believe what enemies tell you.

--which means you never find out that your group could be the enemy...

I was noticing some 'glaring out-points' and things were heating up. I was finally about to be 'fleed'.

--more soon
HAB

I haven't finished your whole thread but just have to comment that I was saying the same thing about those "Basics". I was so freaking pissed off.

I was in major doubt of Scientology at this time anyway as I just didn't see the upper Bridge producing what it was "supposed" to.

I had it out with many, many SO members about these "Basics". I told them this:

You want me to believe that LRH would have these books out all these years and not fix them? You can't tell me he wouldn't have found out about it as what is in those books is what he was trying to teach us. No, instead he comes up with MU tech, etc.... GOD, I was so freaking pissed.

I eventually told that I had more faith in LRH than David M. and until someone gives me a better understanding of why LRH would have books on the shelf for 35 years that were wrong and not fix them, I wasn't reading them.

yea, this from someone who was running WISE Training Courses in Businesses, who supervised for the Org on occasion. A long term Scnist, Supervisor and EX ED of an Org and an Honor Roll Member.

I had to dropped all my course rooms and start looking for a way to make a leaving. in other words, I was fucked.

Needless to say, no one has given an acceptable understanding of why those books were wrong for so so long.
 

Dulloldfart

Squirrel Extraordinaire
Needless to say, no one has given an acceptable understanding of why those books were wrong for so so long.

I think the actual answer is that he didn't give a rat's ass. It took me many years to come to that conclusion - it isn't a casual one. See my thread http://forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?t=2678 comparing in detail the current book Scientology 8-8008 to the prior edition and my reasoning on why I think the current one is a more accurate rendition of LRH's original (for better or worse).

Paul
 

lkwdblds

Crusader
The ideal org push is a flag that something is wrong

There are several huge "red flags" that C of S management has "gone off the rails" and the "ideal org campaign" is one of the most obvious. If you read the LRH policy on ideal orgs the intent was to establish many totally on policy, vibrant orgs wherein if any one entered, they would see that an island of sanity was being formed in a turbulent world. Then by creating more and more of these islands of santiy, Scientology would permeate the society as these islands linked up. There is a whole list of what would constitute an ideal org and the physcial building and the furnishings being upstat are mentioned, almost as an after thought. C of S has corrupted this so that a palatial. posh, upstat building furnished with Vegas like glitz is sufficient to determine an ideal Org. Well done to you for spotting this! I can't believe how seemingly intelligent staff and public unquestioningly buy into this madness,

A closely related topic having to do with real estate is the Super Power building. C of S has collected and spent tens of millions of dollars on this building and then suddenly stopped construction without any explanation and lets the unfinished building sit idle year after year without any explanation to the investors in the building, the staff, the Scientology public or the general public. C of S is a corporation and in a normal corporation the board of directors would be held responsible for this and have to divulge why the project was shut down to the investors satisfaction. The fact that nothing is ever mentioned about this and the staff and publics take it in stride shows how naive the staffs and publics are. It reveals a system with no accountability to anyone which is a dictatorship. The fact that management is still sending out requests for further donations is absolutely incredible! The fact that no one questions this is even more incredible!
lkwdblds
 

Alanzo

Bardo Tulpa
There are several huge "red flags" that C of S management has "gone off the rails" and the "ideal org campaign" is one of the most obvious. If you read the LRH policy on ideal orgs the intent was to establish many totally on policy, vibrant orgs wherein if any one entered, they would see that an island of sanity was being formed in a turbulent world. Then by creating more and more of these islands of santiy, Scientology would permeate the society as these islands linked up. There is a whole list of what would constitute an ideal org and the physcial building and the furnishings being upstat are mentioned, almost as an after thought. C of S has corrupted this so that a palatial. posh, upstat building furnished with Vegas like glitz is sufficient to determine an ideal Org. Well done to you for spotting this! I can't believe how seemingly intelligent staff and public unquestioningly buy into this madness,

A closely related topic having to do with real estate is the Super Power building. C of S has collected and spent tens of millions of dollars on this building and then suddenly stopped construction without any explanation and lets the unfinished building sit idle year after year without any explanation to the investors in the building, the staff, the Scientology public or the general public. C of S is a corporation and in a normal corporation the board of directors would be held responsible for this and have to divulge why the project was shut down to the investors satisfaction. The fact that nothing is ever mentioned about this and the staff and publics take it in stride shows how naive the staffs and publics are. It reveals a system with no accountability to anyone which is a dictatorship. The fact that management is still sending out requests for further donations is absolutely incredible! The fact that no one questions this is even more incredible!
lkwdblds

This is an extremely clear-minded statement.

Another interesting thing about the Church of Scientology is the International Association of Scientologists: the only association I have ever heard of who keeps the number of their membership secret.
 

Zinjifar

Silver Meritorious Sponsor
If Scientology Management Works, as it should, since it's part of the 'Tech', why is Scientology Management there?

Zinj
 

lkwdblds

Crusader
Great Story - The Ron portion makes one think.

I loved your story and your format is extremely cute and fast paced but also very logical. I bought into the LRH mystique 100%. I had big wins in Scn, it gave me a purpose, a whole new life, many new friends, and some valuable skills. It was fun to be a Scientologist in the early 70's. I thought that no mere Earthling could uncover all these secrets and develop all this tech. I bought into Ron being extra terrarestrial and that had no case.

One incident in 1973, which I tell in my story, revealed that he was not perfect. He insisted that I had embezzed funds from CCLA treasury. I knew he was wrong on that point so I realized he could be wrong.

I did not know much else until I started reading the internet, 32 years later.
The only other thing I did not like was his letting Mary Sue take the rap for him in the "Snow White" caper. Also, I did not like the fact Sea Org members lived in hovels, worked for a pittance and had no medical or retirment benefits even when the Church became wealthier and was investing in palatial type buildings. Everything else I learned on the internet.

What does it matter if LRH had a case! What if it could be restimulated and he would do irrational things or write bad policies that hurt people. I did'nt care that much about that, I even admired him more for overcoming his case and getting out good products. What drove me away from him was the dishonesty that he and his creation, C of S used. The whole LRH story and the C of S story are both built on lies and then further lies have to be created to cover those lies, on and on in an unending cycle. There is always a phoney "shore story" for every activity they are engaged in and scientologists have to become chronic liars to support this deception.

I DO NOT THINK LRH EVER CONCEIVED THAT SOMETHING LIKE THE INTERNET WOULD COME ALONG AND EXPOSE ALL THE LIES.

What's wrong with telling the truth. LRH was an Eagle Scout at an early age, he went to George Washington University and after 2 years, he dropped out to seek his fortune as a writer. Why does he have to be the youngest ever Eagle Scout or a nuclear scientist? Why did he have to be the first person wounded in WWII and why did he have to cure himself from blindness with Dianetics. If people were winning and being successful using his books and technologies they would not care if he was an Eagle Scout at an early age instead of the youngest Eagle Scout, etc.

If his life had been described truthfully and the true origins and motives of Dianetics and Scientology had been told to the public and if good staff had been nurtured and treated with respect, there was enought good tech there that actually helped people that I think there is an excellent possibility that by now, 59 years after Book 1 they might actually have 8 to 10 million adherents world wide as they claim rather than the 55k or so they actually have.

Your great story captures the essence of what I say above but I just wanted to acknowledge you and add a couple of related points.
lkwdblds
 
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