My Ups and Downs

HappyGirl

Gold Meritorious Patron
I had a really hard time with people in the SO accepting my gains/wins. It seemed more like they wanted to smash me for them, so I couldn't understand why they were on a team that was supposed to be helping to get people up to OT if they couldn't even stand the idea of it really happening and would hate anyone who experienced anything in that direction.
Me too!! I can't believe I wasted 10 years of my life in a state of total anxiety over this exact situation. :duh:
Yeah, this was a good fix. :D :bong:
 

FoTi

Crusader
It's just a locational. The HCOB explaining it even says that. It's OK if it's done straight after attesting to Clear when one is all woo-woo about it. But if it's done a lot later, life has already run a locational on one and it's a waste of money. But they don't tell you all that, of course. Or let you skip it.

Paul

Thanks for the explanation.
 

FoTi

Crusader
FoTi, I did KTL at ITO in the early 90's - I would have loved you for a twin and I am a terrific M-9er! :yes: Where were you when we needed each other? :confused2: :bigcry:

Do you mean that you had to pay the "upper org fee" TWICE? :ohmy: Well...that sounds 'bout right from my experience :melodramatic: :grouch:

And "Dup ya perfectly" re the F'n "review auditin"! :angry:

Love and thanks for sharin' :thumbsup:

EP

Thanks for the response. :love2:

I guess I was in the wrong place at the wrong time. I wasn't on staff, so I wouldn't have done any training at ITO. It was my twin that went to ITO.

A course costs more at ASHO than it does at LA Org and the same course costs more at AOLA than it does at ASHO. The higher the org one goes to, to do the same course, the more it costs. When a person moves from a lower org to a higher org, they have to pay the difference in the cost between one org and the other, thus the upper org fee. Each time I moved to a higher classed org, I had to pay more.
 

FoTi

Crusader
Me too!! I can't believe I wasted 10 years of my life in a state of total anxiety over this exact situation. :duh:
Yeah, this was a good fix. :D :bong:

Sorry you had to experience this too. Kind of put a damper on the fun of it.

Good fix? A bong?
 

Zinjifar

Silver Meritorious Sponsor
Thanks for the response. :love2:

I guess I was in the wrong place at the wrong time. I wasn't on staff, so I wouldn't have done any training at ITO. It was my twin that went to ITO.

A course costs more at ASHO than it does at LA Org and the same course costs more at AOLA than it does at ASHO. The higher the org one goes to, to do the same course, the more it costs. When a person moves from a lower org to a higher org, they have to pay the difference in the cost between one org and the other, thus the upper org fee. Each time I moved to a higher classed org, I had to pay more.

Until you hit the EOWW (Exited Org World Wide) at which point the cost/benefit ratio reverses :)

Zinj
 

FoTi

Crusader
Continuation

Okay, so now I'm at AOLA on KTL with a new twin.

My new twin is in his 60's, OT V and kind of deaf and refuses to wear a hearing aid, so he can't hear me most of the time and I have to repeat myself, but we're getting along okay together making turtle progress. Neither one of us are fast students.

One thing that happened while we were twinning together was that the demo kits suddenly disappeared from the KTL courseroom. We were using the demo kits everyday and suddenly they were gone. Why? Well, we were told by the sup that because the materials that described how the course was to be delivered didn't include instructions to use demo kits, that we could no longer use them. :wtf: After all the years of demo kits being a standard part of study tech, we are no longer allowed to use them? :omg: I was upset. :hissyfit: What in the hell was going on here?

He and I both lived close to AOLA and neither one of us had a car, so when events came up we both rode the Scientology bus to the events. There was an event coming up and one day on course he asked me if I was going. I said yes and he said, do you want to go together. I said okay thinking he meant to ride the bus to the event together. When the time for the event came, we met at the bus and rode to the event together. Then when we got to the Shrine auditorium, since we were together, we sat together at the event. After the event when we were herded like cattle through the lobby and mooooved into the anex where the party was and the regging was going on, we went to the food table and got food and went and sat down at a table to eat. I wasn't paying much attention to him and I think I wandered off to see what was going on elsewhere.

The next day we came on course, he was livid. Apparently he thought we were on a date and I thought we were just riding on the bus to the Shrine together. I did not want to date him. He told me I was rude in that I didn't pay him enough attention at the event. :omg: I told him I did not want to date him. He was my twin on course and that's all I wanted of him.

He started hanging around me and following me down the stairs after course and was becoming a pain.

I finally went to the guy in Qual and talked to him about it and asked him to please do something with this guy. I didn't want any 2D with him. And per the study bulletin he wasn't supposed to get emotionally involved with me as his twin. The guy in Qual pulled him in and spoke with him, then pulled me in and spoke with me. The guy in Qual said...."I understand how he feels...he's in love with you....just humor him". :omg: :wtf: This was supposed to be a courseroom, not a lonely hearts club. This really pissed me off. What kind of Qual is this? Then the guy in Qual pulled us both in together and read off the Acceptable Student Behavior bulletin to him, and I told him I didn't want any 2D with him. We go back on course. He's still bugging me, so the guy in Qual tells him he isn't allowed to communicate with me off course and during course time he is to do the course. He still couldn't get it, so one day when I walked out the front door of AOLA and he was sitting on the bench outside the door, I walked up to him and told him I didn't want to have a 2D with him during or after this course, that I just wanted him to be my twin on course. He got mad and told me...."If you're not going to marry me, I'm not going to be your twin". :melodramatic: Geesh! This was crazy, so I went back upstairs to the course sup and told her what was going on and she wrote it up and said she would split us up and get us both new twins, which she did. She got him a twin and left me without one for about a week. So here I was twinless again. :grouch:

Then in walks my new twin. :) She was the LRH Comm at LA Org. Her ex husband had left the SO, and she had a child, so she had to live off the base. We got along okay and were turtling our way slowly through 6C getting lost in word chains, but getting each other through them very slowly. She told me she was going to go OT 8 on KTL. :roflmao: Okay. I was having some really nice wins on course and writing up 2 or 3 success stories everyday. I couldn't really put into words very well what I was experiencing so I don't think the sups could very well understand what my wins were, but I was loving this course. It was like candy to me. When I talked to other people on the course or who had also done KTL, I never found anyone who was having the kind of wins or degree of wins that I was having. I really loved KTL. I felt like I was getting something out of it that most other people weren't. I was also bound and determined to take my time and get everything out of it that I possibly could. I was there for my own gains, not the org's stats.

During this time I was also working with OSA on the Cult Awareness Network problem that the church seemed to be having. A bunch of us were flown back east to the CAN Convention and as a result of being there, there was a lawsuit filed against CAN and my name was on it and Scientology won the suit and CAN had to pay me and some other people money. Of course when the check came in, we had to endorse it over to the lawyers. I remember seeing this check flashed on a big screen, at an event at the Shrine, with my name on it. It really surprised me to see it there. I'm sorry to say that I didn't know any better or I would have never done that.

I remember one little guy from OSA who was there at the CAN convention back east who told me and several others that he had ridden up in the elevator and two goons from CAN had gotten in the elevator with him, one stood on each side of him and they were going to take him to the top floor and get rid of him. :omg: He said when the elevator stopped and the door opened, he punched one of them, ducked and ran out the door. That guy he hit took a swing at him and hit the other guy instead and the OSA guy ran and got away from them. True? I don't know. It was a good story. Convinced us how evil CAN was.

CAN never would let any of us into their convention, so that's why they got sued. It also didn't ever let any of us hear any of the other side, so the only story we had was the one from OSA.

One night at the hotel, the fire alarm went off and we were staying on the 8th floor. I barely heard this noise....if I'd been asleep, I never would have heard it...the rooms were very sound proof, which could have been dangerous in a real fire. The whole hotel emptied out down the stairwells in their pajamas and we all waited around in the lobby to find out what was going on. Someone had pulled the fire alarm. OSA was blaming CAN for doing it. Who did it? :confused2: We never did find out who or why.

About a week or so after we got back from this trip to the CAN Convention, the OSA gal who was the I/C of our group was in a meeting at PAC. She was tired and put her head down on the table and went to sleep. She never woke up. She died right there supposedly of an aneurysm. I wondered if someone had done something to her at the convention, but I was told that her family had a history of aneurysms. She was young. This really bothered me.

The next CAN convention was in LA. This time we were allowed in some of their rooms for their convention, but not in others. I remember sitting there with another guy.....we were both Clear. A gal got up to speak who had been an auditor at CCLA, but had since left Scientology after finding out what was on OT III. She didn't have any hair because she had cancer and was on Chemo. I wondered if she had cancer because of her overts of leaving Scientology and speaking out against it or maybe from reading the OT III materials. I didn't notice that it didn't kill her to read those materials. When she started to talk about the OT III materials that she had read, both myself and this other guy put our hands over our ears so that we wouldn't hear something that might kill us. It's no wonder that a lot of Scientologists won't listen to critics.....those who haven't done the OT Levels are probably afraid they'll hear something that might kill them.

I remember Cynthia Kisser - she was one of the leaders in CAN and she was nasty like an evil witch. She also made me think that CAN was evil. She was awful.

I also remember one lady there who had done OT VII....Solo NOTS and I tried to talk to her to ask her why she quit Scientology or why she was doing this, but she wasn't willing to educate me on this. Nobody there was willing to talk to us.

One night at this convention they had a Shabbat service for the people there that were Jewish. They wouldn't let us in, so one of our guys was Jewish and he got himself an invite from one of the people who was at the CAN convention. I said I wanted to go too because I'd never been to a Shabbat service, so he took me and another lady who was with our group with him. The CAN people didn't like us being there , but I really enjoyed the service despite that. It was very nice.

One of the gals that was working with us at this convention was an OT 8 public. I remember she got sick at this convention and I wondered, since she had already done these levels, why was she getting sick and I wasn't? I also remember talking to her about my KTL. I was telling her about all my wins and what a wonderful time I was having on this course. She said that she did the KTL on the Freewinds and that she was pushed so hard and pressured to get through it quickly and she didn't get that much out of it. After listening to my wins, she said she was going to do it over again and take her time with it this time. It really makes me mad that the orgs are so into stats and making money instead of making an individual's gains the most important thing.

Okay, so back to my own KTL. Now that I have this new twin and things are going okay for me.....but my twin keeps having problems....can't get to course on time and all sorts of other stuff going on in her life. After a while, I went into the guy in Qual and I said....since she's having so many problems, is there any possibility that she didn't really EP her Clay Table Auditing? So, he went back and checked her folders and came back and put her back on Clay Table again and we did it over at LA Org, since that was her org and her C/S was over there.

When she was done with her Clay Table, and I looked at the EP, I got to thinking......I don't remember ever making that origination, so I asked the guy in Qual at AOLA, to check mine as well. That was kind of a dumb thing to do since I wasn't having any problems, myself except for having to continually go with my twin to ethics all the time while she got straightened out. The guy in Qual came back from looking over my folders and said he couldn't find that I'd made that origination, so he put me back on Clay Table as well.

This time, my clay replicas weren't real big. I did a few and then what started showing up in the clay were my problems and upsets with org terminals - ethics officers - in Scientology. I looked at this and decided that when I got done with KTL, maybe it would be a good idea to get the charge off of Scientology and all the crap I'd experienced in connection with Scientology. (A friend of mine did this recently when she got stuck on the Solo Course on study and said it helped her a lot to clean that stuff up.) Then the course sup called a break for lunch and we had to quit the session to go to lunch so they could lock up the courseroom over lunch time. I never could understand just stopping clay table in the middle of the session for lunch. :blink: One didn't stop other kinds of auditing sessions for lunch in the middle of the session....to be resumed for the rest of the session after lunch. :confused2:

Welll, my twin/auditor didn't show up for roll call after lunch. :waiting: She comes sauntering in about 10 minutes late. Where have you been? I was cleaning LRH's Office. Okay, I was pissed now. I'd had enough of her crap, so I wrote a note to the C/S explaining that I'd had enough of this person's nonsense and could I please have a twin that wanted to do this course and would come to course on time and be a twin because this lady was too distracted with being the LRH Comm and taking care of her kid, etc., etc. to pay attention to doing this course. I just wanted someone who would be there for me as an auditor and to be my twin on this course. I didn't think that this was too much to ask for, since I was there for my twin.

We were both pulled off course. My twin was sent to Athena Cramming where she spent the next few months and when I later saw her, she said she really needed that, that it helped her out a lot.

Meanwhile, I was told that they were going to FES my folders. :hmm: They have to FES my folders because my twin can't get her act together? Oh, well. So I sat in the hallway, awaiting my fate.


To be continued. :tobed:
 

Ted

Gold Meritorious Patron
The Absurdity of Twinning

We were both pulled off course. My twin was sent to Athena Cramming where she spent the next few months and when I later saw her, she said she really needed that, that it helped her out a lot.

Meanwhile, I was told that they were going to FES my folders. :hmm: They have to FES my folders because my twin can't get her act together? Oh, well. So I sat in the hallway, awaiting my fate.


To be continued. :tobed:


Thanks for your story.

It seems that you never really had a twin, so I can't help but think what a screwed up tech/policy twinning has become. It looks like twinning is just another way to slow down a good, willing student.

Someone in charge needs to fully clear up the definition of "twin." Not the Scientology definition, but standard English.

Merriam-Webster:

Twin
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, from twin twofold
Date: 14th century
1 a: either of two offspring produced at a birth bplural capitalized : gemini
2: one of two persons or things closely related to or resembling each other
3: a compound crystal composed of two adjoining crystals or parts of crystals of the same kind that share a common plane of atoms


--
Ted
 

FoTi

Crusader
Continuation

It's been really hard for me to get back to continuing on this. It's very confusing and weird for me. Not sure of the sequence exactly, but I'll put the pieces here.

I remember sitting in the hallway outside the C/S's office waiting for this FES to be done. While sitting there, I remember the C/S came out into the hallway and she was angry....not at me, but just angry in general in the way she was speaking to people. This disturbed me. Then there was a public person standing in the hallway talking to someone else and telling them that she was helping out by doing some FESing. When I heard that, I suddenly felt fear.....that someone outside the SO was maybe FESing my folders and I didn't want that. I felt worried and panicky. The FES seemed to take forever, maybe a week or two while I waited.

I felt like I was red tagged because I was still stuck in the middle of this clay table session and nothing was being done about it to let me get on through it.

I was sent downstairs to the HGC for a session. When I went in session, the auditor asked if it was okay if she audited me. I said I didn't want a session, I just wanted to continue on the clay table session I was already in the middle of and I just wanted a stable twin for the course. So, the auditor didn't continue. I was sent back upstairs to Qual.

The guy in Qual gave me a piece of paper that the C/S had written up and told me I had to sign it. The C/S said that I had to sign this piece of paper telling me that I had to OBEY the C/S. This jacked up my TA big time. I thought, man this C/S is 1.5. No handling my originations. Just enforced reality....OBEY! :wtf: I was protesting big time, but silently. All I could see is that if I didn't sign it, I would never be able to continue, so I compromised my own integrity and didn't say anything, I just signed it. I was so pissed, but I couldn't do anything about it.

Then, I'm sent down to the HGC again. And I wait there. I didn't get in session. I'm told to go home and they will call me when they are ready. Three days later I'm still waiting and wondering, so I call the HGC to see what's happening. I'm told...."Oh, you have to go back to Qual". So I go back to Qual again and there I'm told ....."Oh, you have to go see the MAA".

So, I go see the MAA (Ethics Officer). She tells me......."You can no longer receive any auditing or training at AOLA because you are an illegal PC and no C/S here will have anything to do with you". :omg: :shock:

Why???? The MAA says....."You had a psychotic break and tried to commit suicide and were institutionalized". :omg: :shock: :wtf: When did this happen???? I don't know anything about this. The MAA looks at me and says...."Maybe you just don't remember." :omg: :shock: :wtf: The MAA was beginning to sound like some kind of shrink. It seemed like Scientology had suddenly switched over to psychiatry. All of a sudden this MAA who I had respected and had always been helpful had turned into something else. This was unreal. I was in shock. My future of going up the Bridge and going OT and going free was just suddenly wiped out. :omg: I was suddenly scared out of my wits at having the Bridge taken away from me.

I had to find out what was in my folders that made them think that I had tried to commit suicide and was institutionalized. The data that the MAA came up with was a time back in the 60's. My roommate had come down with the measles. I had an interview for a film and I didn't want to get sick and ruin it, so I went to a doctor and got a shot of gamma globulin (spelling?) which was supposed to make me immune to the measles. That night I was afraid to go to bed and go to sleep for fear that I wouldn't wake up in the morning. I got scared around midnight and called my parents. They came over and drove me to the emergency hospital. The doctor checked me over and said he couldn't find anything wrong with me and maybe it was just a reaction to the shot I'd had earlier that day. He gave me a shot of dramamine to help relax me and handed my mother 1 sleeping pill and told her to take me home and give me the pill to take and put me to bed to sleep it off. I woke up the next morning feeling fine. I went on the interview and aced it, still under the effect of what the doctor had given to me at the emergency hospital. Then I was called back for a second interview for this part in this film, only this time I was stone cold sober....not on any drug and I was a nervous wreck and blew it. Oh, well. How the C/S turned this into me having tried to commit suicide and being institutionalized, I'll never know, but this is what was being presented to me.

I told the MAA that I thought I had probably had an allergic reaction to the gamma globulin shot for the measles, but she was not paying any attention to anything that I said. I later read a medical article that addressed this very thing.....people who had an allergic reaction to the gamma globulin shot for measles and experiencing a similar kind of anxiety like I had.

So, I was told I'd have to contact this hospital and get my records from the hospital sent to the C/S at AOLA. Since this was almost 30 years prior and only a brief visit in the night and I didn't drive there, I didn't remember the name of the hospital. I got out the phone book and checked every hospital within driving distance of my apartment that night. I called all of them to see if they had any record of my visiting their ER that night. They all said that their records didn't go back that far. They weren't required to keep any records past a certain number of years. So, that was a dead end and I couldn't comply with AOLA's request for this data.

I had gone to a psychologist prior to Scientology....to group therapy mainly, but occasionally seeing him privately. So, now AOLA wanted me to get his records that he had on me. I had to go to the Shaw Clinic (doctors who were Scientologists) and have them request my records from this psychologist. Turned out he had been retired for some time and had not kept his records either. Another dead end. Still I could not comply with the C/S's wishes at AOLA.

I felt devistated. I can't remember if I went home and came back to the MAA or if she told me then.....but she said somewhere in here that I could try to petition the Sr C/S Int if I wanted to. So, I wandered out of her office and spent the next 3 days spinning :blink: :wacko: :dizzy: trying to figure out how to do that. I couldn't make sense out of any of this, but I finally found the bulletin on how to petition. The bulletin said something to the effect that I had to petition something specific, but I didn't have anything specific. I was so confused.

I went back to the MAA and said....You have to give me something specific to petition or else I can't do this petition. What the hell is in my folders? I asked her ....... "Is it drugs?" She says "yes". Okay, you have to tell me what drugs, so that I can do the petition. She goes and looks in the folder and then says....."No, it's not drugs." :blink: :wacko: Sheesh! Make up your mind!

She never would give me anything specific to petition. I then just wrote up what happened and requested that the Sr C/S Int go over my data and give me an answer as to whether I was an illegal PC or not and if so, specifically, why was I an illegal PC. I gave the write up to the MAA and she had my folders sitting in her office and said that she would send the write up with the folders to the Sr C/S Int. I asked her how long that would take. She said about two weeks.....to check back with her in two weeks. Two weeks later I went back to the MAA's office. I asked her if she'd heard anything back yet. No, the folders were still sitting in her office with the write up. She hadn't sent them off yet. :grouch: :angry: I went home and waited some more. After about 6 weeks she'd sent the folders to the Sr C/S Int office, but had heard nothing back. I'd had about enough of this.

While all of this was going on, the whole attitude of all the staff in the org that I knew had suddenly changed. Staff members that I knew for years, suddenly wouldn't look at me or speak to me. It was like I'd become a non-person. It also seemed like the org had gotten suddenly much more serious than I'd ever seen it. I couldn't figure out what had come over all these people. (This was 1994, by the way, in case anybody wonders.)

Also, while I was waiting around for the answer back from the office of the Sr C/S Int, I found this whole mess extremely introverting. Being accused of having a psychotic break and having tried to commit suicide and being institutionalized when no one will listen to it not being so, is awful and having one's Bridge being yanked out from under one on top of that is even worse. I remember being at home and thinking.....one is not even allowed to think about suicide, let alone try it in Scientology and how am I supposed to not think about it when it's being thrown at me like this? I got to thinking that maybe someone wanted me to try to commit suicide and maybe that's why they were doing this. They sure were sticking my attention on it. I really thought it was someone's intention in Scientology to try to get me to do this. It was so evil. I couldn't fathom why they were doing this. I was afraid of AOLA at this point. :nervous:

While I was going through this miserable mess, I heard that the KTL C/S had gone on an LOA because she was sick. I remember feeling a bit of satisfaction at hearing that she was ill and thinking .......she deserved to be sick after the way she treated me.

I went over to the Flag Office and told them what I'd been experiencing at AOLA. They suggested that I move to Clearwater and continue my services there since I kept going there for services anyway. But what about this illegal PC thing? I was told, just move there. If nothing else you can do your training there even if you are an illegal PC. I said.....Are you sure? Please look in my folder and see if there is any reason that I wouldn't be allowed to train at Flag. One of the Flag auditors went and looked in my folder and said he didn't see any reason why I couldn't train at Flag.

I went home to think about it. Then a friend from back east called me and said that she and her husband wanted me to do something for them business wise in Clearwater. I said I'd think about it. Then one night, shortly after this phone call, I was laying in bed at 2am and I could hear the gangs fighting in the alley behind the apartment building where I lived....yelling "I'm going to kill you." :omg: My bed was quivering from the seismic activity in LA....(I'm real sensitive to earthquakes and it makes me nervous) At about 5am, the neighbors came home.....several drunk Mexican guys who sang songs very loudly until noon and with all the other crap that I had to live with in that area, I'd had enough of LA as well as AOLA. I called my friend back and said....I accept your offer. She said that they weren't quite ready for me but to go ahead and come on back to their home (they didn't live in Florida) and when they were ready which would probably be right after the first of the year, then I could move to Clearwater to help them out, which meant that I would have a job and a place to live and I could go ahead and train at Flag.

So I proceeded to make my plans to go to Clearwater to continue with my Bridge there. I sold most everything or gave it away, packed what I needed and shipped it off to my friend's house, bought my plane ticket and was just about ready to leave. The night before I was scheduled to get on a plane for back east, I'm sitting on the floor in my empty apartment. I get a call from the HGC at AOLA. "The Sr C/S wants you to come in for a session." :grouch: :angry: I told them....sorry, you're a little late, I'm leaving town tomorrow. I closed up the empty apartment, gave the keys to a friend to give to the manager after I left, and went to sleep on a friend's sofa for the night.

The next morning the shuttle arrived around dawn to take me to the airport. I got on the plane and flew out of LA, still stuck in the middle of a clay table session on KTL.

Leaving LA wouldn't have been so bad, because I didn't like living there anyway and the only reason I was living there was because of Scientology, but .... I left behind a friend that I was very much in love with (although he didn't know that). Nobody in my whole life ever made me laugh as much as he did. I cried all the way across country on the flight because I knew that I would never see him again and I really enjoyed his company immensely. It's been over 14 years and I still miss him. :bigcry:


More later. :sleepy:



I
 
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FoTi

Crusader
Continuation

When I arrived back east, my friend and her husband picked me up. I stayed at their house for about 6 weeks. Disaster struck and she broke her foot one night stepping off the stairs in the middle of the night .... not realizing that she was one step higher than she thought. Now she was in a wheelchair until her foot healed up so that left me with having to take care of a very large home and do the cooking, etc. She gradually started talking to me like I was a servant or some kind of slave to her, which I didn't care for and then got nasty with me.

Then when they went to do their taxes, right after New Years, their accountant told them not to do the business venture in Clearwater, so I didn't have a job with them after all.

I shipped my stuff down to Clearwater to another friend there, bought a ticket to Clearwater and she and her husband drove me to the airport. She wasn't speaking to me.... end of that friendship. I never heard from her ever again. I often wondered if she ever continued on up the Bridge.

I flew to Clearwater where my other friend and her husband picked me up and took me to a place they had found where I could stay until I got myself settled there.

I felt like a fish out of water ever since I'd been told I was an illegal PC. My life was in a jumble. No home, no job, bouncing from place to place.

After I got to Clearwater, my friend's brother in law helped me to find a car to buy. Then I got AAA roadside service and decided to go to work for them....so I now had a job selling auto club memberships. Next, I was in the One Stop Shoppe (a business owned by a Scientologist near Flag) and I asked the girl behind the counter if she knew of anyone that had a place to rent so I could find a place to live. It turned out she had a room for rent so I rented her room and moved my stuff in there. Things were slowly coming together. It turned out that she wasn't a Scientologist....she just worked for a Scientologist, but she had nothing against it and was open to learning about it, so we never had any problems in regard to it. She just had absolutely no money to pursue it and wanted to go back to school at a late time in life and pursue art, which she did. She was a really nice person and we are still friends to this day, even though we live in different states now. I'm glad I had the chance to meet her. We can talk to each other about anything.....such a pleasure, compared to any Scientologist that I knew or still know that I had to be so careful about whatever I had to say.

It took me a couple of months to get oriented and settled in Clearwater, which wasn't as easy as I thought it would be, (I found it hard to get oriented to a brand new area where I didn't know anybody or where anything was or what the laws were.). I decided it was time to try to get on lines at Flag and get the mess cleaned up that got started in LA and get on with my KTL.

I went to the training building where the KTL was on the corner of Cleveland and Fort Harrison. I had all of my folders shipped from AOLA to Flag. When my folders came in, I was routed to Qual. The guy in Qual said..."You can't do KTL here....you're an illegal PC." :grouch: So, I explained the whole situation to him. He routed me to Haviva, an MAA at the Sandcastle.

Haviva worked with me and we got all the data written up and she sent it all up to the C/S at the Sandcastle and the C/S said for me to go over to the FH and get a sec check. Okay, fine with me. My folder was sent over to the HGC at the FH. I followed it over there. Next a D of P interview. The D of P opens my folder. No data. All the work that Haviva did with me, that took days....the writeups, info from the C/S, etc...gone....all missing from the folder. :omg: :wtf: Where did it go? It was hand routed by one person from the MAA's office at the Sandcastle to the HGC at the FH. How could it possibly have gotten lost between the Sandcastle and the FH?

Then I get routed to the MAA at the FH to do this cycle all over again. Only this time it's different than with Haviva. The MAA that I see at the FH is a guy with a kind of German accent. He starts asking me all kinds of introvertive questions....hey, what's this? Is this guy trying to do a sec check without a meter or an auditor or a session? Eeeegad. I answer his questions because I feel like I have to or else I will never get back on KTL. But I leave there feeling horrible. That was a kind of nightmare. He reminded me of the gistapo. Eeeeww. He said he'd send the data to the C/S and told me to go home and he'd get back to me. I go home hoping I don't ever have another experience like that again. I sort of felt like someone squashed my head. Was this Scientology?

Several nights later, I get home from work about 9pm, wiped out from a very long day. I get a call from the MAA's office telling me I have to get right over to the MAA's office right now and to be there by 9:30pm because I have to complete this cycle tonight!!!! I jump in the car and drive over to the FH, run into the MAA's office....I'm there by 9:30pm and then I sit in a chair and wait in the waiting area until 10pm. Then the MAA comes out of his office and looks at me like....what are you doing here? I told him I was told to come to see him. He says...."I don't have time to see you....I have a meeting to go to." :grouch: :angry: I went home totally pissed off. What kind of nonsense was this? I didn't like getting jerked around like this.

Shortly after this, I was driving to the FH to try to get through this cycle with the MAA so that I could get in to get the Sec Check to sort everything out and so that I could get back on KTL again. The closer I got to the FH, the worse I felt. When I arrived at the FH I felt so awful that I just kept driving right past the FH and kept right on driving. I never went back to complete that cycle with that MAA. I never wanted to see that guy again as long as I lived. I never heard from the MAA's office or Flag again to come in and finish it. It just died right there.

About 2 years later, I was talking to another Scientologist about this and I was really upset because I was still off the KTL. He suggested that I go back and see Haviva again, so I did. She got my folder and looked in it and sure enough, all the prior work she had done was not there, so she went through the whole proceedure again, just like before.....it wasn't introvertive like the MAA at the FH. Again it all went up to the C/S at the Sandcastle and again it came back that I was to go to the FH for a Sec Check. This time the folder page walked both me and the folder over to the HGC at the FH. The folder page let me know that getting the Sec Check would be no problem because I already had 24 hrs of unused auditing paid for in my folder from the time that I was at Flag to do my CCRD. Hey, that was good to know.

The folder page dropped me and the folder off at the HGC at the FH and I went and sat and waited in the waiting area to be called. After a while I was called to the window and was told that I had to go see the Reg.

I went to the Reg. He told me that I had to come up with $10,000 for 25 hrs more than I already had in my folders. He said that the C/S said that I had to have 50 hrs to get this Sec Check. I told the Reg.....this is just to find out if I'm an illegal PC or not.....I don't see how it can take 50 hrs to do that. The Reg agreed that it seemed a little strange, so he called the C/S to query it. The C/S told him....yes I had to have 50 hrs before they would start the Sec Check. I'd been milked twice before to pay for unnecessary services at Flag and I wasn't willing to do it again. I had the hours in my folder already and they weren't willing to deliver me the service, so I wasn't willing to give them another dime. I told the Reg that I didn't have the money to pay for it, which I didn't. But I experienced something new.....I no longer had the incentive to go get the money for any more services at Flag. My willingness was gone. Something seemed not right in Scientology. It was supposed to be a self correcting system with KSW, right? My KTL could wait until someday when things got better in Scientology. The Reg was very nice. He didn't try to pressure me into getting the money to pay for it. I'd made up my mind....I wasn't going to pay for this no how, no way. :no: I wasn't willing to pay $10,000 to a church to prove my innocence of something that they had falsely accused me of in the first place. I just got up and walked out.


More later...:tobed:
 

Free to shine

Shiny & Free
Wow FoTi, what a story! It's sort of like a super expanded version of stuff I experienced, and the theme that I noticed with mine - and yours - is how arbitrarily some person can say "this is so" and stop you dead in your tracks. That's something that is not place specific, it happened in every org I was in. And no care factor unless you represented a stat.

It seems that once you had been arbitrarily assigned the label of 'illegal pc' that meant you were not an immediate stat prospect, and therefore really low on the totem pole. The idiocy is that no-one took the time to really use the most basic tool in life - communication - to find out the facts and follow it through. So sad, and so distressing and so unnecessary.
 

sallydannce

Gold Meritorious Patron
Thank you so much for writing your story FoTi.

Like Free to Shine mentions, there is a theme in the way scientology treats its members. Some of what you have written I could have written - details different for sure, but conceptually the same.

Sharing your story like you are is very valuable. It helps others like me who have been mired in "what the f*** happened"? to connect some dots, see those patterns and find some reality/peace.

Thanks again. I'll look forward to your next post(s).
 

Woggin' out

Patron with Honors
Thank you so much for writing your story FoTi.

Like Free to Shine mentions, there is a theme in the way scientology treats its members. Some of what you have written I could have written - details different for sure, but conceptually the same.

Sharing your story like you are is very valuable. It helps others like me who have been mired in "what the f*** happened"? to connect some dots, see those patterns and find some reality/peace.

Thanks again. I'll look forward to your next post(s).

I'm w/ Sally Dance and FTS on this one. A similar experience happened to me when I arrived at Flag. I was treated like crap by the MAA and told that I wasn't allowed to be at Flag and was escorted by 2 little SO girls to gather my things.(After all I was sooo dangerous and psychotic lol). :omg: As I was at the front desk, the LRH Host came and got me and said you're not going anywhere! She said I had friends in high places. It seems my minor celeb status had saved me.

All this because my mother had committed suicide and someone got confused and thought I had tried to commit suicide!!
Ahh Flag. the friendliest place on Earth,,,ya right. :angry: I was never really comfortable there after this!

Thanks for your story Foti, I'm sorry you went through all this. Your story really shows all that is so wrong with this "organization".

Hey the Freewinds takes it all another step further if you can imagine that. That "OT distraction free" environment was INSANE!! :duh:

Did you ever get any money back Foti?
 

FoTi

Crusader
Wow FoTi, what a story! It's sort of like a super expanded version of stuff I experienced, and the theme that I noticed with mine - and yours - is how arbitrarily some person can say "this is so" and stop you dead in your tracks. That's something that is not place specific, it happened in every org I was in. And no care factor unless you represented a stat.

It seems that once you had been arbitrarily assigned the label of 'illegal pc' that meant you were not an immediate stat prospect, and therefore really low on the totem pole. The idiocy is that no-one took the time to really use the most basic tool in life - communication - to find out the facts and follow it through. So sad, and so distressing and so unnecessary.

Yeh. What really bugged me was that they were lying to me, directly to my face about my life. It seemed like they were trying to make me think something had happened in my life that never happened. It felt like they were trying to tell me I was crazy or trying to make me crazy. This kind of thing is extremely disturbing, especially when they were accusing me of trying to commit suicide. I just wonder how many people they did this to and if they did this to some of those people that did commit suicide. I just couldn't understand how people who understood the tech could even do such an evil thing. I thought it was just something going on at AOLA and that it would get straightened out at Flag, like Flag straightened out the prior mess from AOLA. But, no, this kind of crap was at Flag, also, when I got there.
 
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