New and Looking for advice/help

dipshin

Patron
Hi - I am the mom of a 17 year old who has been in a relationship with a young public Scientologist for over a year now. I have been lurking for a year but never posted for fear of revealing too much of our identities.

This person that my child is in a relationship with, comes from a big "whale" family on one side and another heavily involved family on the other side. Both parents, were born into into it and the grandparents got involved as young adults. This young Scientologist has never experienced the horrors of the cult and is very sheltered from that experience. However, recently sea org recruiters barged into their house and were forcefully pushing this child to join. This kid was very agitated by them and complained to my child, who then commented that it seemed wrong for a religion to recruit with force. The reaction to my child's comment became defensive and angry.

I am interested in any advice that can begin to make a crack, even the tiniest, so that this child can start to reflect about all the things that are wrong. I have told my child to never say anything negative (based on all the books out there) and to only ask questions like, "How did that make you feel?" or "Did their tactics bother or scare you?"

Any advice would be greatly appreciated!
 

ThetanExterior

Gold Meritorious Patron
This kind of question pops up here quite often so you should be able to find information by searching this site.

The latest of these threads is here: http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?43827-Literally-what-to-do!

My quick answer is there is very little that can be done. When I was a scientologist I would ignore anything negative said about the subject and any attempts to get me to think in a certain way about it would not work. I would tell the person that they don't know what they're talking about and tell them to shut up about it. Scientologists are trained to not be "reasonable" and can be very rude if questioned about scientology.

The biggest problem you have is if your child wants to be in a permanent relationship with this other person. Then he/she would have to become a scientologist. That's the big elephant in the room.
 

guanoloco

As-Wased
If they're that young and there's no babies involved I'd say move on.

I think it's noble and all but let's explore what we're talking about. This is a mind control cult that is the best around. It's snagged Louis Farrakhan and the Nation of Islam which is a cult of it's own.

Let's say she gets him out and they get wed and start a family. Their kids are surrounded with wealthy in-laws and grandparents and aunts and uncles and cousins all sucked up into a soul crushing cult started by a devil worshipping hypnotist.

I'm thinking there's plenty of other fish in the sea so get some other fish to fry.
 
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dchoiceisalwaysrs

Gold Meritorious Patron
Hi - I am the mom of a 17 year old who has been in a relationship with a young public Scientologist for over a year now. I have been lurking for a year but never posted for fear of revealing too much of our identities.

This person that my child is in a relationship with, comes from a big "whale" family on one side and another heavily involved family on the other side. Both parents, were born into into it and the grandparents got involved as young adults. This young Scientologist has never experienced the horrors of the cult and is very sheltered from that experience. However, recently sea org recruiters barged into their house and were forcefully pushing this child to join. This kid was very agitated by them and complained to my child, who then commented that it seemed wrong for a religion to recruit with force. The reaction to my child's comment became defensive and angry.

I am interested in any advice that can begin to make a crack, even the tiniest, so that this child can start to reflect about all the things that are wrong. I have told my child to never say anything negative (based on all the books out there) and to only ask questions like, "How did that make you feel?" or "Did their tactics bother or scare you?"

Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

Edited to add ....welcome to the board.

I find it very difficult to say too much directly to this situation as more detail would be need to be known. However, I realize that your doing so is rather guarded to keep the cult out of the loop as much as possible.
So I will just state some ideas you might consider.

How involved is the relationship? Are they living together? Whose house and who lives in it did the Sea Org recruiters barge into? Was your child there when it happened? Did your child's companion bring up the objection to the Sea Org barging in or was it just mentioned to your child to then discussed it with you? Who's reaction to your child's comment to whom? Did you possibly over react? (very easy to do) Are the Sea Org members doing this repeatedly in any fashion?

Is your child a good student and fairly capable of doing a fair bit of reading?

I am not even suggesting you reply to these thoughts here online, but with those in mind you might want to educate yourself and your child on Martha Stouts's ' The sociopath next door' and the 12 or so characteristics of a cult, and Steven Hassan's books on mind control which include some details on cult control and how to free a person from such.

And probably most important, what can you do to strengthen your relationship to your child so that they will stay connected to you? I say that because there is the potential that the Sea Org recruiters will be hunting and questioning and looking for any source of hestitancy that your childs partner might be showing.. That means they will be looking and asking as to who is putting up any objection to the recruit cycle.

And they will try to trace it to friends (such as your child's comments) or even then onto you. Then of course the Sea Org recruiters will do all that they can to remove what they call the "stop" "or Suppressive Person" or as I called it 'objections'. in doing so they are not the least bit concerned (sociopathic behaviour on their part) of what they can do and who it will hurt in order for them to get their recruiting done. They consider themselves above the law, and saving the world....and make zealots look like limp spaghetti.

I am glad you asked for help, and I don't mean to scare you...but you have every reason to be concerned and I am so proud that you are asking for help.

Read on...and I wish you all the luck and you have the support of thousands of people who will probably never even read this thread...but I assure you ...you are not alone and there is an army of concerned citizens doing what they can to end the ability of the cult to abuse and take over individuals lives.

PS. have you and your child watched Scientology the aftermath on A&E with Leah Remini?
 

Churchill

Gold Meritorious Patron
Given what you've written, I believe there's a very high likelihood that, over time, your son will be drawn into the orbit of Scientology.
He does not understand the seductive appeal and expert manipulation to which he will be subjected.
You, as his parent, need to treat his relationship with the girl and her family as the life threatening experience, which it certainly is.
Spend as much time on the internet as you possibly can. Read the plethora of books warning about this subject. Watch the documentaries, "Going Clear" and the many hours of Leah Renini's "Scientology and the Aftermath." Don't tiptoe around the subject.

Save your son before it's too late.
 

Enthetan

Master of Disaster
I am interested in any advice that can begin to make a crack, even the tiniest, so that this child can start to reflect about all the things that are wrong. I have told my child to never say anything negative (based on all the books out there) and to only ask questions like, "How did that make you feel?" or "Did their tactics bother or scare you?"

My biggest piece of advice would be to stop worrying about your child's friend, and start worrying very much about YOUR child. Treat the situation like you would if you suddenly discovered your child was involved with a drug addict or gang member.

These are teens here. Teens are not generally known for rationality and good judgement. They are more likely to respond to their emotions than to reason. If the friend joins the Sea Org, and tells your child that the only way they can stay together is if your child joins too, what might happen? Are they very emotionally involved?

The very FIRST step should be to have your child immunized. Watch Leah Rimini's series. Read some books. Maybe hang out here. Impress upon your child to NOT reveal the material to the friend, because that would result in immediate disconnection.

Now, most people in the Sea Org are good people. But in certain jobs, like recruiters, the only people who stay in those jobs are people who will "get their product", by whatever means necessary. The people who survive in that post, long term, are people who are prepared to be ruthless in dealing with obstacles.
 

Knows

Gold Meritorious Patron
There should be a black box warning in front of every Scientology church, on every Scientology book and anything written by L Ron Hubbard....

"Friends don't let friends DO Scientology"


While that sounds easy - it is the most difficult thing to do. It is impossible and will only make your life absolute hell to get involved with anyone who has family in Scientology.

I would say that anyone who gets involved with a Scientology is in danger. You are in danger of your life, you sanity, the life of your family and friends and your entire environment.

Scientology LIES, Scientology KILLS! And Scientology has no remorse. It bankrupts, financially ruins, destroys and shatters families, businesses and relationships.

The only person you can possibly help right now is YOUR KID.

I would take your kid - and sit down with him/her - and do the following program:

Watch "Going Clear".
Listen to audio book - "Inside Scientology" and WATCH every episode of Leah Remini
Do this TOGETHER!

Read: Blown For Good by Marc Headly, "My Billion Year Contract" by Nancy Many, "A Piece of Blu Sky" by John Attack", "Counterfeit Dreams" by Jefferson Hawkins FOR STARTERS....

Don't say anything to your kid - let him/her do all the "realizing about what Scientology is"...

Watch Debbie Cook's Deposition on You Tube. Watch "Squirrel Busters Marty Rathbun" on You Tube Watch "Debbie Cook signing gag order by Scientology attorney" on You Tube

After you are finished - get back to us and let us know your kids response.

You must let your kid decide for themselves about the relationship...BEFORE he does any "service" - that service is rigged with booby traps that will snare him/her into Scientology and you could lose them forever.

Scientology is an evil manipulative cult that uses fraud and deceit to trap people out of labor and money.

Here is a website that will explain HOW SCIENTOLOGY USES MANIPULATION, MIND CONTROL AND HYPNOSIS TO WORK...AND IT DOES WORK...THE CARNAGE IS ALL OVER THE INTERNET.

https://arnielerma.wordpress.com/2015/10/09/demonization-for-profit/
 
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Irayam

Patron with Honors
Bonjour dipshin,

When I was 18, my best friend tried scientology. Shortly after, I started also scientology.
When I was 21 and a proud scientologist, my best friend decided to work on staff, for the "Church".
When I was 22, I decided to join staff so I could work to save the planet with my best friend.

Now I'm 60 years old, I have spent more or less 13 years in scientology, mostly as a public, and I have left the cult since 27 years. I'm well, I'm fine, but I still think every day about scientology and my 13 years dealing with the cult.

So, my advice, as above, is quitte simple: avoid at any cost any kind of relationship with scientology.

Très Cordialement,
Irayam
 
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Enthetan

Master of Disaster
Thinking about it more, if the kid's parents are "big whales", then that may be the major motivation for them to so want the kid in the Sea Org : "If you ever leave, or stop contributing, then you will never have contact with your kid again".
 

George Layton

Silver Meritorious Patron
Hi - I am the mom of a 17 year old who has been in a relationship with a young public Scientologist for over a year now. I have been lurking for a year but never posted for fear of revealing too much of our identities.

This person that my child is in a relationship with, comes from a big "whale" family on one side and another heavily involved family on the other side. Both parents, were born into into it and the grandparents got involved as young adults. This young Scientologist has never experienced the horrors of the cult and is very sheltered from that experience. However, recently sea org recruiters barged into their house and were forcefully pushing this child to join. This kid was very agitated by them and complained to my child, who then commented that it seemed wrong for a religion to recruit with force. The reaction to my child's comment became defensive and angry.

I am interested in any advice that can begin to make a crack, even the tiniest, so that this child can start to reflect about all the things that are wrong. I have told my child to never say anything negative (based on all the books out there) and to only ask questions like, "How did that make you feel?" or "Did their tactics bother or scare you?"

Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

This is for the 17 year old. If you are not reading these responses You should be because this is about You. People that become involved in scientology are fed a plethora of "facts". These "facts" inform them about their minds, their lives, their thoughts, their problems, why those problems exist and everything else about themselves. The people that have learned these "facts" know others better then those others know themselves. The more scientology they learn the more they know about everything. The only thing they haven't learned is the "facts" were made up by hubbard or those people that followed his every lesson.

Question everything. Study the history of scientology. Question any "fact" you hear from any scientologist. Question any experience that any part of scientology might cause. Look for similar experiences outside of scientology. Same with the "facts" of scientology, look up those "facts" from outside sources that have nothing to do with scientology. Question the origin of those outside sources if referred by any scientologist. scientology will have answers to your questions and those answers, most of all, should be questioned independently of ANY from of scientology (COS, Freezone even those here on this form that say theirs is the safe, benign parts of scientology). Question all of it and read the stories of those here that have spent years of their lives on scientology.
 

dipshin

Patron
Thank you all for responses! I have been lurking for awhile so I know what a wonderful, helpful bunch you are!

When they started dating a year ago, I was the one who found out about the family and their involvement in the cult through a quick google search (Scientology connection came up right away probably because of "whale" side). My concern at the time was only my child. I wanted my kid to be armed with as much information possible and to know what needed to be dealt with, so that there were no surprises. So, we watched and read everything religiously (no pun intended). Initially, I thought this was young love and it would pass, so I focused on really getting ourselves prepared to deal with anyone trying to pull us in. My child was shocked at first and wanted to help the sig. other but I repeated what many of you had said re: the impossibility of making someone understand that they are in a cult. I have spoken to Karen DeLC directly as well.

However, over the past year this person has been in my home on almost a daily basis. This is a wonderful, bright, engaging, polite person and both kids are hard working, talented, excellent students. So, I've made a connection as well. And recently, I met the parents who were very pleasant and told me how much they love my child, and that they would love to go out to dinner with us sometime. My thoughts are the parents are 2nd generation and are stuck in it, don't really like it, but don't know anything else, just go through the motions, but can never extricate themselves.What seems interesting is that both parents went to Scientology schools but chose to take their child out of one since middle school and now attends a public high school. And they have no problem with their child being in a relationship with a non-member. They never brought up the cult to my child or tried to recruit in anyway whatsoever. My child is not easily persuaded and will argue any philosophical topic to death! I can count on my kid coming to me with anything and I don't push myself onto my child with this topic. That said, my kid is constantly updating me on the situation and asking for advice.

My child was not there when the Sea org recruiters barged in...the story was recounted later.

Honestly, I really wouldn't care if this child was going to remain a public. I figured after high school, they would both go to college and the relationship would fizzle on its own. However, over the last few months this person is telling my child that they want to do Human rights work (probably CCHR) instead of college and now the Sea Org recruiters. I suppose I shouldn't care that much but after all I know now, it seems so hard to watch someone waste their life and education and get sucked in to this abusive, horrific, cult without doing anything. I feel like I am a witness to child abuse and just standing there doing nothing (that to me, is as much of a crime as the one abusing).

All the info on how to talk to a cult member about leaving are geared more to adults who have experienced some of the atrocities. I really couldn't find anything on dealing with a 3rd generation teen being recruited for the Sea org. This is why I reached out here.
Thanks again. I'm overwhelmed with all the responses!
 

Enthetan

Master of Disaster
Adding to what I said earlier, when I say "ruthless", I mean exactly that. If the recruiter sees your kid as an obstacle to their getting that kid, they will take measures to remove your kid from the scene.

Make sure your kid does not have any naked pics of the other kid (or any other kid ) on kid's phone (= arrest for child pornography). They might go as far as planting drugs, too. Be careful and vigilant at the point where Sea Org people see you as a threat to their plans.
 

EZ Linus

Cleared Tomato
Welcome. :) I think it's great that you are asking for help. Though, I highly recommend you help your child first -- like him putting on his own oxygen mask before helping his friend with his. He needs to be armed with information. He needs to be educated. I can't stress how important that is, otherwise, your child is in great danger to even know a Scientologist at all, ESPECIALLY AT 17! It would be best if he would just stop hanging out with this other person, but you probably can't control that. Hanging out less would be another option. Within all options, education is KEY. Knowing Lifton's Eight Criteria and really understanding it, would be a great start. I also recommend books by Dr. Margaret Singer. If you don't want to click on the link, I'll just paste a short version of Lifton's Criteria here:

Dr. Robert J. Lifton's Eight Criteria for Thought Reform



  1. [*=left]Milieu Control. This involves the control of information and communication both within the environment and, ultimately, within the individual, resulting in a significant degree of isolation from society at large.
    [*=left]Mystical Manipulation. There is manipulation of experiences that appear spontaneous but in fact were planned and orchestrated by the group or its leaders in order to demonstrate divine authority or spiritual advancement or some special gift or talent that will then allow the leader to reinterpret events, scripture, and experiences as he or she wishes.
    [*=left]Demand for Purity. The world is viewed as black and white and the members are constantly exhorted to conform to the ideology of the group and strive for perfection. The induction of guilt and/or shame is a powerful control device used here.
    [*=left]Confession. Sins, as defined by the group, are to be confessed either to a personal monitor or publicly to the group. There is no confidentiality; members' "sins," "attitudes," and "faults" are discussed and exploited by the leaders.
    [*=left]Sacred Science. The group's doctrine or ideology is considered to be the ultimate Truth, beyond all questioning or dispute. Truth is not to be found outside the group. The leader, as the spokesperson for God or for all humanity, is likewise above criticism.
    [*=left]Loading the Language. The group interprets or uses words and phrases in new ways so that often the outside world does not understand. This jargon consists of thought-terminating clich�s, which serve to alter members' thought processes to conform to the group's way of thinking.
    [*=left]Doctrine over person. Member's personal experiences are subordinated to the sacred science and any contrary experiences must be denied or reinterpreted to fit the ideology of the group.
    [*=left]Dispensing of existence. The group has the prerogative to decide who has the right to exist and who does not. This is usually not literal but means that those in the outside world are not saved, unenlightened, unconscious and they must be converted to the group's ideology. If they do not join the group or are critical of the group, then they must be rejected by the members. Thus, the outside world loses all credibility. In conjunction, should any member leave the group, he or she must be rejected also.

 

HelluvaHoax!

Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on
..
(Sorry, in advance, as a rambling rant may well ensue after reading about these young innocent people's precarious plight with Scientology. I've seen this kind of dilemma up close more times than I care to mention and it never fails to stir my passions and utter contempt for Scientology. That's why I have posted to this message board over 21,000 times--to try to do my small part to shine some light on the vast minefield that awaits anyone who is in the proximity of that cult):

Shall we begin?

Here's a true story that can either give HOPE or HOPELESSNESS, depending on how it is viewed.

This happened at one of the top Scientology organizations in the world--therefore, it is not a "fluke" nor an anomaly. It is how Scientology thinks and works and how they treat a young couple exactly like your 17 year old and their love-interest.

This typical story involves the relationship of a beautiful couple in their early twenties.

--the Sea Org recruiters wanted them both for a billion year tour of duty.

--despite very intense recruitment sessions, party "A" did not want to join the Sea Og.

--party "B" did not give a definitive 'no' and this gave some impetus to the recruiters to keep "B" in many-hours long recruitment sessions over several days. multiple recruiters ganged up to bombard "B" with "ethics" and many other manipulative techniques.

--"A" and "B" naturally discussed this ongoing recruitment--because if "B" joined the Sea Org, that would be the immediate destruction and end of their loving/romantic relationship.

--"B" began to realize that they would lose the love of their life ("A") if they signed that billion year contract.

--"B" now began to evidence/voice their concerns and uncertainties about joining the Sea Org during the next gang-recruitment sessions. The recruiters were very, very, very unhappy that "B" was backsliding and not doing what they wanted.

--the recruiters (same age range as "A" and "B") then demanded that "A" report to the org's ethics officer and be told in very harsh terms that they "must stop enturbulating" "B".

--when "A" mildly questioned this bizarre "ethics matter", they were then ORDERED to stay away from "B" while the recruitment campaign was in progress. This means that "A" could not live with nor talk to their loved one, by ORDER of the recruiters.

--when "A" did not respond with enthusiastic agreement to the idea of having their entire life and relationship blown up destroyed (in order "to allow "B" to reach their own decision on their own determinism") the ethics officer(s) then THREATENED "A" with issuing a "Non Enturbulation Order". Therefore, "A" suddenly was powerless to speak to "B" under this very serious threat. In Scientology a "NON ENTURBULATION ORDER" carries grave and sinister penalties if the party "breaks it". If, for example, "A" went to visit "B" or called them on the phone to discuss the recruitment, "A" would be immediately "DECLARED A SUPPRESSIVE PERSON".

--if "A" was declared a "Suppressive Person" (by reason of "B" manifesting any "doubts or reservations about signing the billion year contract" then "A" would forever lose "B" by a "DISCONNECTION ORDER".

--"A" would also lose their entire family of parents, brothers, sisters and relatives, because "A" would be forever shunned and ignored by them. Yes, nobody would even see them or talk to them (for fear that they too would then be "declared a suppressive person" and disconnected.

"A" confidentially sought my advice and counsel because they were profoundly upset at these threats and insanity. I told them what I thought about the horrific mind-control, manipulation, bullying and treachery.

--Ultimately "A" and "B" remained together ("B" decided not to join) and they resumed living together. They have been together for YEARS since then, in a beautiful and committed relationship. They are both still deeply involved in Scn, as are their respective families.


WHAT CAN BE LEARNED FROM ALL THIS: First of all, that Scientology will stop at nothing to get what they want. Secondly, that Scn will trample people's lives, livelihood and families if they can't force them to do what the church wants. Third, that Scn will resort to gestapo-like tactics all in the name of "ethics", "justice" and "humanitarian" purposes.

Most importantly, one can (hopefully) learn that Scientology WILL DO ANYTHING IT THINKS IT CAN GET AWAY WITH, no matter how many slimy tactics & sleazy lies they must engage in against innocent victims.

And Scientology will treat people like this FOR THEIR ENTIRE LIVES in order to steal their money or their time. It never stops. As a matter of fact, the pressure and coercive mind-control schemes will only become MORE FREQUENT and they will have GREATER INTENSITY.

And the more the Scientologist (or their associates) tries to pull away, the tighter the death-grip becomes. Think CHINESE FINGER TRAP.

The truth is that nobody in Scientology is allowed to live their own lives. They are considered to be part of Church "assets" and "property". The philosophy of Scientologists (beginning with Hubbard on down) is that SCIENTOLOGY OWNS EVERYTHING AND EVERYONE. If you dare to assert any control or ownership of anything (even your own money, your own kids, your own job, your own time, your own relatives, your own friends, et al) Scientology will unceremoniously attack you to re-gain control. either through love bombing, lies, threats, harassment, terror and/or other "Fair Game" sanctioned attacks.

So, could your young couple survive Scientology's onslaught? Perhaps.

But if they elect to be together, they will ALWAYS have to contend with Scientology the rest of their lives--as long as at least one of them is a "Scientologist" in good standing.

If one of them tries to be a Scientologist and not the other, EVENTUALLY IT WILL EXPLODE. Therefore, it's always better to flood them with truth (to whatever degree they are willing to read/listen to the dangerous nature and facts about Scientology) and let it blow up now, rather than later when it's far more complicated with kids, careers, family and lifelong friends become involved.

There are not happy endings to more than 98 percent of Scientologists' stories. That's why 98 percent blow (leave) the cult eventually.

Even at their young age (17) they are still subject to the laws of the universe and cannot defy basic common sense by joining a cult. That's true for naive young people who join ISIS and go to fight in the Middle East--and it's true for naive young people who are seduced into drug use. It's true as well for young people who join gangs. And it's true for any other disastrous CHOICES that they might make. The unalterable rule of life is that bad choices have bad consequences, no matter how old someone is.

Better, much better, to give them as much truth as possible. Better to coax them into discovering the SHOCKING LIES that Scientologists are feeding them.

The sooner, the better.

The human spirit is resilient and there is every possibility of avoiding tragedy--if they are willing to listen to and learn the truth.

The Church of Scientology will not be happy if one or both of them starts to explore the "forbidden" world of the internet and books exposing Scientology's criminal and despicable behavior. They will react against anyone who does that. They will try to finesse that person. They will lie to that person. They will show folders of "documents" that "prove" none of it's true. They will threaten. They will harass. They will intimidate. They will eventually ATTACK with every manipulative weapon they can muster. And they will eventually begin to "DECLARE" people to be SPs with all that entails. These are all actually GOOD things, because it means that Scientology is desperately losing their grip on the victim and is losing.

The Church going wild and attacking is even a good thing. Because that will further reveal their true nature and destructiveness to the young couple. And this will, in turn, further drive the young couple FURTHER AWAY from the chokehold that Scientology hopes to maintain.

There is only one way out of Scientology and that is to defy all their commands and orders and policies and threats, either directly or covertly.

NOTHING CAN BE LOST BY FLOODING TRUTH INTO THIS DANGEROUS SITUATION. If they refuse to look and learn then eventually they will learn the lessons the hard way. That's the same rules that everyone alive must eventually live by if they wish to avoid suffering in life, whether it is linked to Scientology or not.

Truth. Facts. That's all they need at this point. People on this thread are giving excellent advice, such as the "GOING CLEAR" documentary, the Leah Remini tv series, Louis Theroux's documentary, and many other shocking & entertaining exposes. They're all brilliant and enlightening. The more the better.

Wishing you and your child and the couple all the luck and success in carving out a life for themselves somewhere in this world that is not under the dark gravitational forces of Scientology and L. Ron Hubbard.
 
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TheOriginalBigBlue

Gold Meritorious Patron
Welcome!

I agree with all the prior responses. I was a recruiter for a while and you should know that they are under a tremendous amount of stress and supervision, moment to moment. Nothing happens by chance. They are operating off of a program with targets specifically written to land this child. They don't get a stat until the recruit routes onto the EPF. Just signing the contract doesn't count. Recruiters can't be honest about representing the actual conditions in the Sea Org so they must lie, deflect and obfuscate. As mentioned, only the most ruthless people are successful and stay recruiters for any length of time and if this family has a high level of status within Scientology then the recruiters may have been hand picked for the purpose. They will study all associations with the family in order to neutralize any opposition. The recruit will be forced to pick sides. If they resist without being diplomatic or ask the wrong questions then they risk putting the whole family's standing in jeopardy.

These recruiters, it should be assumed, were telegraphed a willingness and acceptance of their being permitted to come to the home or they would have been more restrained. This tells you a lot about the family. They are either supportive of this kind of thing or so submissive that they can't do anything about it.

Your child's friend is being tested. How fortunate it is to get to see where a partner's loyalties begin and end so early in a relationship. I was summarily dumped once after coming out as a Scientologist after going together for a year. It hurt but in retrospect I now have a tremendous amount of respect for her decision at the time. This was before the internet and even though I still respected LRH and the Tech I knew enough to not come out for a year. If probing questions can't be asked now then what would it be like after marriage or with children? There are threads here where a non-Scientologist is asking for help during or after a divorce where children are involved. I highly recommend that your child read these. It is difficult enough having the Church as a third party pulling strings in the background but Scientology has profound effects on a person's psychology, especially since so many people get into it during the earlier formative part of their lives. It can take many years, or even a lifetime for an ex-Scientologist to sort these effects out themselves, let alone their partners.
 

phenomanon

Canyon
..
Wishing you and your child and the couple all the luck and success in carving out a life for themselves somewhere in this world that is not under the dark gravitational forces of Scientology and L. Ron Hubbard.

Who will he believe? His parents? His Girlfriend?
I'll give you 3 guesses.
The videos will be dismissed by her as lies told by people who are world class experts at telling lies ( they actually drill it ).
Sorry. You can't compete.
You are the Adult.
You have already allowed your child to become embroiled
in a relationship", at his 17 yrs of age. Now, you will have to ride it out.
Don't appear to object.
Show interest and ask meaningful "innocent" questions.
If he becomes a member for even a short time, he will be led to believe that his role as a scn'ist is the most important thing he can do with his life.
If you seem to hold him back from that, he will disconnect, and you will likely lose him to this wretched organization.

Sorry this is happening to your family.
 

HelluvaHoax!

Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on
Who will he believe? His parents? His Girlfriend?
I'll give you 3 guesses.
The videos will be dismissed by her as lies told by people who are world class experts at telling lies ( they actually drill it ).
Sorry. You can't compete.
You are the Adult.
You have already allowed your child to become embroiled
in a relationship", at his 17 yrs of age. Now, you will have to ride it out.
Don't appear to object.
Show interest and ask meaningful "innocent" questions.
If he becomes a member for even a short time, he will be led to believe that his role as a scn'ist is the most important thing he can do with his life.
If you seem to hold him back from that, he will disconnect, and you will likely lose him to this wretched organization.

Sorry this is happening to your family.


Lovely advice!

Ultimately, it is my belief that all tactics and longer-term strategies will eventually end up in exactly the same place. With the person BLOWN from the cult. The challenge is to avoid decades of deceit and degradation before having the blow-cog.

There doesn't appear to be any perfect solution to how to stop lying fanatics from lying and doing fanatical things to control marks.

The most dangerous thing to the cult is INFORMATION & FACTS. That's what really drives them insane and to extremes of obviously irrational behavior. That's, therefore, their weakest link. But, before the chains of slavery is broken, Scientology roars, threatens and creates a full "skunk" effect that they believe will back off anyone foolish enough to try to challenge their lies.

But, is it foolish? Not really, that's pretty much how everyone who ever escaped the cult (the 98%) was able to do so.

If people learn facts and truth, they will leave. And, Scientology is quite powerless to stop it.

But they can certainly use the "Oz Tech" of pulling levers and making their amplified voice boom in threatening volumes--as the smoke and flames explode around their intimidating five-story projected image. . .


BEFORE READING THE INTERNET

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AFTER READING THE INTERNET


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wizard-of-oz-behind-the-curtain-youtube-screenshot-warnerbrosonline.jpg


 

Hypatia

Pagan
Hi - I am the mom of a 17 year old who has been in a relationship with a young public Scientologist for over a year now. I have been lurking for a year but never posted for fear of revealing too much of our identities.

This person that my child is in a relationship with, comes from a big "whale" family on one side and another heavily involved family on the other side. Both parents, were born into into it and the grandparents got involved as young adults. This young Scientologist has never experienced the horrors of the cult and is very sheltered from that experience. However, recently sea org recruiters barged into their house and were forcefully pushing this child to join. This kid was very agitated by them and complained to my child, who then commented that it seemed wrong for a religion to recruit with force. The reaction to my child's comment became defensive and angry.

I am interested in any advice that can begin to make a crack, even the tiniest, so that this child can start to reflect about all the things that are wrong. I have told my child to never say anything negative (based on all the books out there) and to only ask questions like, "How did that make you feel?" or "Did their tactics bother or scare you?"

Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

Leave books by Jenna Hill, Nancy Many, Marc Headley and others around your house. Be seen reading them.
 

dipshin

Patron
Thank you all for responses! I have been lurking for awhile so I know what a wonderful, helpful bunch you are!

When they started dating a year ago, I was the one who found out about the family and their involvement in the cult through a quick google search (Scientology connection came up right away probably because of "whale" side). My concern at the time was only my child. I wanted my kid to be armed with as much information possible and to know what needed to be dealt with, so that there were no surprises. So, we watched and read everything religiously (no pun intended). Initially, I thought this was young love and it would pass, so I focused on really getting ourselves prepared to deal with anyone trying to pull us in. My child was shocked at first and wanted to help the sig. other but I repeated what many of you had said re: the impossibility of making someone understand that they are in a cult. I have spoken to Karen DeLC directly as well.

However, over the past year this person has been in my home on almost a daily basis. This is a wonderful, bright, engaging, polite person and both kids are hard working, talented, excellent students. So, I've made a connection as well. And recently, I met the parents who were very pleasant and told me how much they love my child, and that they would love to go out to dinner with us sometime. My thoughts are the parents are 2nd generation and are stuck in it, don't really like it, but don't know anything else, just go through the motions, but can never extricate themselves.What seems interesting is that both parents went to Scientology schools but chose to take their child out of one since middle school and now attends a public high school. And they have no problem with their child being in a relationship with a non-member. They never brought up the cult to my child or tried to recruit in anyway whatsoever. My child is not easily persuaded and will argue any philosophical topic to death! I can count on my kid coming to me with anything and I don't push myself onto my child with this topic. That said, my kid is constantly updating me on the situation and asking for advice.

My child was not there when the Sea org recruiters barged in...the story was recounted later.

Honestly, I really wouldn't care if this child was going to remain a public. I figured after high school, they would both go to college and the relationship would fizzle on its own. However, over the last few months this person is telling my child that they want to do Human rights work (probably CCHR) instead of college and now the Sea Org recruiters. I suppose I shouldn't care that much but after all I know now, it seems so hard to watch someone waste their life and education and get sucked in to this abusive, horrific, cult without doing anything. I feel like I am a witness to child abuse and just standing there doing nothing (that to me, is as much of a crime as the one abusing).

All the info on how to talk to a cult member about leaving are geared more to adults who have experienced some of the atrocities. I really couldn't find anything on dealing with a 3rd generation teen being recruited for the Sea org. This is why I reached out here.
Thanks again. I'm overwhelmed with all the responses!
 

TheOriginalBigBlue

Gold Meritorious Patron
You have probably already seen this:

http://exscientologykids.com/eskforums/viewforum.php?f=7

The problem with these kinds of relationships is there is always the potential for the Church to override an individual or partnership's priorities. It's kind of like a Sword of Damocles.

If all good public Scientologists could shadow a day in the life of a Sea Org member and especially the RPF - the cult would disappear overnight.
 
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