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New SP Declares in LA

Discussion in 'North America' started by Chris Shelton, Dec 16, 2013.

  1. dchoiceisalwaysrs

    dchoiceisalwaysrs Gold Meritorious Patron

    Well it is a very good thing that the Scientology organization has fully SAFE POINTED itself with the L.A. Police. The possible ramifications of this are huge. Who would be the overseer of the legality of these actions on US soil? What is next? The Cherch of scientology re-writes the US constitution and having already SAFE POINTED the state and federal Attorney Generals David Miscavige declares an amnesty to all previous POTS?

    I can't find it right now, but it was either Gabe Cazares or the Clearwater police chief of that time who on video explained that the crown prosecutors I think it was, were concerned if they would be harrased/fair gamed. I could use some help with locating that video.

    Ahhhh I guess it is all in the OSA tech who are guided by the OT Orgs policy date of which I forget. So on source...paraphrased...'all men will be my slaves' so Freedom of establishment of religion to practise overthrowing the life, and liberty... must be what the founders wanted for the USA. :pullhair::banghead:

    For those who think I am completely off the mark, with my literary hyperbole near the end of my first paragraph I recommend re-reading Janet Reitmans Inside Scientology, in particular Chapter 12, a peek into the small scale FAIT ACCOMPLI of the State of Florida at the city, county and state levels. All using taxpayers money. Smells of CultoCRAZY to me.

    temporary end of rant :soapbox::tiptoe:


     
  2. dchoiceisalwaysrs

    dchoiceisalwaysrs Gold Meritorious Patron

    From what little I know of these things, 'Phillip' did NOT leave the establishment and therefore is detained and fought for ..what? just my thought.

     
  3. Mimsey Borogrove

    Mimsey Borogrove Crusader

    What I am wondering about is this - can the SP declares be considered slander or libel? The last time I was at flag they had them posted up on a board in the MAA's office - and the same thing at ASHO - they were posted next to the elevator door on the same floor as the MAA's office. I have the same question about the DA packs. (Dead Agent - meaning the pack is full of your "crimes" and it is shown people they want to denigrate you to.) I know I have one, because people I know have told me they read it.

    It is a nasty operation, the whole DA pack and showing of declares, used to disgrace you in the eyes of your friends and people who barely know of you. I would think it is illegal, it is at least on a par with the infamous Hollywood Blacklist era. Like, where does freedom of speech end and slander and libel begin?

    Mimsey
     
  4. Out-Ethics

    Out-Ethics Patron Meritorious

    These might sound like dumb questions. Is there recourse for not receiving a golden rod outside the church because we all know there is no such thing as recourse within the church? Is an organization responsible for showing the affected person in writing that they are no longer a member of the group?
     
  5. SchwimmelPuckel

    SchwimmelPuckel Genuine Meatball

    A 'Goldenrod', Supressive Person Declare issued by Scientology.. Is a provable and documentable conspiracy by this large group of religious fanatics to injure, steal and destroy the person they issud the 'Declare' on.. (Look up 'Penalties for Lower Conditions'. That's the official Policy as regards to this!)

    That is bloody illegal! - It is if I do it anyway.. But even when Scientology threathens me with an SP Declare. I can't threathen them with cheating, injury and destruction! - It is illegal, and the cowardly cult WILL sue my arse for it. Example from real life: Keith Henson indeed was sued by the Sinister Scam Cult of Scientology and convicted for threatening to send 'Tom Cruise Missiles' at Gold Base in Hemet. A joke posted on the NewsGroup Alt.Religion.Scientology.

    Yet, we have to put up with crap like SP declares from this bunch of religious nutters!?

    So.. With all that in mind. 'Phillip' was securing evidence that this group of unrepenting criminals was threathening him with theft and bodily harm. In that light it's perfectly 'understandable' that the hoodlums didn't want him to have it.

    :yes:
     
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2013
  6. dchoiceisalwaysrs

    dchoiceisalwaysrs Gold Meritorious Patron

    44. Defamation is effected by either of the following:
    (a) Libel.
    (b) Slander.



    45. Libel is a false and unprivileged publication by writing,
    printing, picture, effigy, or other fixed representation to the eye,
    which exposes any person to hatred, contempt, ridicule, or obloquy,
    or which causes him to be shunned or avoided, or which has a tendency
    to injure him in his occupation.



    45a. A libel which is defamatory of the plaintiff without the
    necessity of explanatory matter, such as an inducement, innuendo or
    other extrinsic fact, is said to be a libel on its face. Defamatory
    language not libelous on its face is not actionable unless the
    plaintiff alleges and proves that he has suffered special damage as a
    proximate result thereof. Special damage is defined in Section 48a
    of this code.

    http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/displaycode?section=civ&group=00001-01000&file=43-53

    44. Defamation is effected by either of the following:
    (a) Libel.
    (b) Slander.



    45. Libel is a false and unprivileged publication by writing,
    printing, picture, effigy, or other fixed representation to the eye,
    which exposes any person to hatred, contempt, ridicule, or obloquy,
    or which causes him to be shunned or avoided, or which has a tendency
    to injure him in his occupation.



    45a. A libel which is defamatory of the plaintiff without the
    necessity of explanatory matter, such as an inducement, innuendo or
    other extrinsic fact, is said to be a libel on its face. Defamatory
    language not libelous on its face is not actionable unless the
    plaintiff alleges and proves that he has suffered special damage as a
    proximate result thereof. Special damage is defined in Section 48a
    of this code.

    ..........


    52.1. (a) If a person or persons, whether or not acting under color
    of law, interferes by threats, intimidation, or coercion, or
    attempts to interfere by threats, intimidation, or coercion, with the
    exercise or enjoyment by any individual or individuals of rights
    secured by the Constitution or laws of the United States, or of the
    rights secured by the Constitution or laws of this state, the
    Attorney General, or any district attorney or city attorney may bring
    a civil action for injunctive and other appropriate equitable relief
    in the name of the people of the State of California, in order to
    protect the peaceable exercise or enjoyment of the right or rights
    secured. An action brought by the Attorney General, any district
    attorney, or any city attorney may also seek a civil penalty of
    twenty-five thousand dollars ($25,000). If this civil penalty is
    requested, it shall be assessed individually against each person who
    is determined to have violated this section and the penalty shall be
    awarded to each individual whose rights under this section are
    determined to have been violated.
    (b) Any individual whose exercise or enjoyment of rights secured
    by the Constitution or laws of the United States, or of rights
    secured by the Constitution or laws of this state, has been
    interfered with, or attempted to be interfered with, as described in
    subdivision (a), may institute and prosecute in his or her own name
    and on his or her own behalf a civil action for damages, including,
    but not limited to, damages under Section 52, injunctive relief, and
    other appropriate equitable relief to protect the peaceable exercise

    http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/displaycode?section=civ&group=00001-01000&file=43-53
    or enjoyment of the right or rights secured.
     
  7. Smurf

    Smurf Gold Meritorious SP

    It would be a waste of time if he didn't immediately filed a police report. "Phillip" would need to show that the assault occurred. I suspect the cult would simply say it never happened.
     
  8. Smurf

    Smurf Gold Meritorious SP

    Crown prosecutors? Clearwater, FL is not in the UK. :) I can't find the video that you speak of, but the police chief you speak of was Sid Klein who tried to remain objective when conflicts brewed between Scientology & it's critics, EXCEPT when it came to making money.

    The cult leadership learned they could gain favor from Sid by providing it's police officers with well-paid moonlighting jobs. I also remember the protests at the Fort Harrison in 1998 & 1999 where OSA Director Mike Rinder stood next to Chief Klein & was real cozy with him. Here's a video where critic Jeff Jacobsen complained about it in 2001..

    [video=youtube;fd78vId2Uns]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fd78vId2Uns[/video]
     
  9. dchoiceisalwaysrs

    dchoiceisalwaysrs Gold Meritorious Patron

    Thanks Smurf...which reminds me..the video I was looking for was either posted here or linked here on ESMB. It was either a direct interview with Gabe or a news item/documentary type video. Best I can remember is I watched it around the time I watched for the first time, the interview with Gabe(who was retired at the time of the interview)
     
  10. Smurf

    Smurf Gold Meritorious SP

    This one?

    [video=youtube;eQtH8TLwm30]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQtH8TLwm30[/video]
     
  11. Anonycat

    Anonycat Crusader

    I know something of the laws regarding Security Guards, but it sounds like they were not licensed guards, but just Sea Org. The person known as Phillip may sue these individuals, their place of business, etc. It sounds no different than walking into a Christian bookstore and getting beaten by a Minister for trying to take a sheet of paper.

    The laws are very strict regarding Security Guards, but that's a different story.
     
  12. RogerB

    RogerB Crusader

    Mick . . .

    It's a simple proposition:

    He is obviously a member of the IAS . . . that membership confers with it the obligation, both ways, of adherence to Cof$ Policy. That's the contract . . . and the consideration given by the member is his dollars and the consideration given by the Cof$ is the promise of availability of services and treatment in accordance with Cof$ doctrine and policy.

    Those are the constituent parts of the agreement that forms this contract.

    Policy states the member must be given a copy of all reports on the member . . . and based on that policy and understanding it is reasonable and proper that the member would seek to keep the copy given him . . .

    And, apart of the bullshit you are going on about regarding him being on "private property" there is the question that he obviously was improperly declared SP . . . that is, declared in violation of the policy covering Cof$ Jurisprudence . . . again a breech of contract. Thus, there are grounds for him bringing further suit that he is in fact still in good standing till proper procedure, per policy and the contract of membership, has been fulfilled.

    Thus they are actually in violation of his civil rights as well as in offence under tort and contract law.

    R
     
  13. dchoiceisalwaysrs

    dchoiceisalwaysrs Gold Meritorious Patron

    Thanks Smurf.. on target but not sure a bullseye yet. YOU did get the Gabe interview that I was looking for. :thumbsup: Watching to see if it contains the Chief's statement or the statement I wanted to quote...
     
  14. Smurf

    Smurf Gold Meritorious SP

    He could sue, but I doubt he'd win if he didn't file a police report immediately after it happened or went to the hospital to tend to his injuries. Documentation is everything when it comes to litigation.

    Plus, if he sued the cult & he lost it or the case was dismissed, "Phil" would be held liable for paying the legal fees & court costs in the lawsuit. What proof does "Phil" have that we was manhandled by cult staff? Who are his witnesses?
     
  15. Karen#1

    Karen#1 Gold Meritorious Patron

    I am posting my good friend Dave Soroka's recent declare with his permission. Canadian declare, not Los Angeles,

    BUT

    the content of it is 90% cookie cutter of "Phillip"s" SP declare.
    The emphasis of why declared "SUPPRESSIVE" is on connection to squirrels and speaking your mind..
    The Scientology Inc definition of suppressive is based on how you thing and what you say and who you friend..​


    [​IMG]
     
  16. Bea Kiddo

    Bea Kiddo Crusader

    If nothing else, LRH has got it down on how to develop a foolproof dictatorship complete with blindness from members who follow him.

    It's sad, really.
     
  17. Anonycat

    Anonycat Crusader

    Right, I only say what I did knowing nothing about the scuffle and what exactly was involved. I had also guessed there was no police report, so knowing what little I do from the post, I wouldn't recommend suing unless he was punched to the ground or something. If it were me, I would make a police report, though, and document any bruises or untreated injury. It sounds like it was assault, it just depends on what he wants to do about it.
     
  18. dchoiceisalwaysrs

    dchoiceisalwaysrs Gold Meritorious Patron

    I correct myself that he was actually a comissioner at the time of the interview

    Following are a few notes I evily transcriped of the Video you found Smurf.

    These transcribed parts complement very well what Janet Reitman writes about in chapter 12 of her Inside Scientology.

    @ 8:46 Gabe states .."what has happened here is the for the first time in the over 200 years that our nation has existed an American city has been taken over , has been occupied. This is a virtual occupation, a military type occupation, by a para-military terrorist type organization....project Normandy.....dossiers on top officials....
    @ 11:50 they had aims to take over the whole world, international aims.......what groups B1 will need to penetrate...they have more dossiers and more intelligence on top leaders.....their(scientology's) entire top leadership....... have gone to jail for conspiracy against the US government.

    Florida constitution says... section 3: Religious freedom shall not justify practises inconsistent with public morals, peace or safety.....

    Enemy lines....areas to penetrate are.......the Florida attorney General, the Florida State Attorney General....love DICK...


    ...with our money we can buy cities and even countries..

    ..the scientologist got the clue then, ok as soon as the people say something bad about us, let's sue them and it's normaly enough to intimidate people to harrass them, to scare them, no one likes depositions or interrogatories...and usually it is enough to break a person.....this is psychological terrorism....where the Law is used to scare people...

    A 5th column...stealth..surreptitiously ..occupy.."

    ---------

    So I believe the exact quote I was looking for was in the video with (Sid Klein) speaking. Edit..I just google Sid Klein and I don't believe it was him that I am referring to...perhaps the person I am referring to was only an officer/detective of the Clearwater police...the name Ray is coming to mind now..he was a much more robust person...

    ahhh I found Ray Emmons Lt. (retired) in this video..looks like it is going to be the one..and the reference starts around 1:50

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XW8eTe_Ank8
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2013
  19. degraded being

    degraded being Sponsor

    .
    .
    So why is the COS so security conscious about SP declares now? It seems they have gotten more and more determined NOT to let people get their hands on them.

    Is it about the fact that it might get put up on the internet, or is it because of some legal technicality? A legal technicality on the SP Declare itself or an associated legal technicality, such as the fact that it reminds people of Fair Game and all the illegality done under that "non-existent" policy.

    Have they copyrighted SP declares?. Would they go to court on copyright if some bitter apostate were to send THEM SP Declares on golden rod?
     
  20. Reasonable

    Reasonable Silver Meritorious Patron

    It would have been great if he called the police whether or not he won the case. Just getting a police report would be great, then post the police report on line to Tony Ortega and who ever else is interested.

    Phillip would say that he was hit and the Seo Org would say they they were hit and everyone is now hauled off to court or jail or whatever.

    You don't have to win, just the accusation of physical violence could be good enough to do real PR damage.


    A police report is in writing and therefore true:wink2: