degraded being
Sponsor
Degraded being deleted his own post because of a confusion about a quote.
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Not all the way "out" yet. My views and introduction
- Thread starter Nicki
- Start date
Vinaire
Sponsor
Nic, good on holding on to your viewpoint. Take your time to view other viewpoints. These viewpoints are there only because of the personal experience that lies behind them.
I left Sea Org in 1983 from Fort Harrison. I spent time on Apollo from 1972 till we came to Clearwater. I have held the posts of Course Admin, Word Clearer, Programs Chief, TRs Word Clearer, Admin Cramming Officer and CO India.
Like you I have always differentiated between the Scientology as I understood and applied, and the Scientology that I felt was misunderstood and misapplied. I have no grudges against Scientology as I understood and applied it. See "Vinaire's Story" (click on the link on my sig line). I had great wins right from the start.
I believed for some time that Scientology has been misunderstood and misapplied by those who are currently running the Church into the ground. In fact, I thought that the Church could be reformed, and I returned to Scientology as public in the late nineties. But I found that the rot had set in too deeply, and I left for good in 2005.
My background is Hinduism. That is the religion I grew up in. So, lot of the ideas in Scientology have been part of my very makeup. My favorite books are "Scientology 8-8008" and "The Phoenix Lectures." My favorite parts are "Scientology Axioms & Logics" and "The Factors." I could instinctively feel when Scientology veered off from its roots. I can see how it can be terribly confusing for those who do not have that familiarity with Scientology's background that I have.
It is only recently that I have come to realize that even the Scientology that I understood and applied can be improved upon. In fact that has been accomplished by old timers like John Galusha (IDENICS) and Alan Walters (KNOWLEDGISM), who worked with LRH in the fifties and sixties respectively. So far, I have only studied and applied IDENICS in detail and I am impressed by it. Only then I started to perceive Hubbard differently. He now appears to me as a person who was very possessive of what he had come up with. This tied any progress in Scientology to him and him alone. Thus, the subject lost its vitality after he passed away.
Anyway, this is just to let you know where I am coming from. You may also look at my web sites in my sig line. Until few weeks ago I had references to Scientology on "Vinaire's Page" which I have taken off now. These references were to the transcripts of three "Background of Scientology" lectures from the Phoenix Lectures. I really liked those. But, at the moment, I do not want to direct anybody toward the rotting carcass of Scientology, which remains in place of Scientology that I once felt proud of.
Hope you understand.
.
Dulloldfart
Squirrel Extraordinaire
The earlier reply should work. I've never tried uploading an avatar from a web link.
What I would do is:
1. Save the lower (not the upper as it is too big even though the thumbnails look the same size) of the two images to the desktop or a file, by right-clicking and "save image" or whatever your operating system uses
2. a few inches from the top of the screen are two lines of menu items on a darker background. the lower one is User CP - FAQ - Forum Rules etc. Click on User CP (control panel)
3. Under "settings and options" in the left-hand column click "edit avatar"
4. To the right of Option 2 click the "choose" button
5. Navigate to the file where you saved the "Spinning_Dancer_100px.gif" animated image
6. Click the "save changes" button underneath, and the deed should be done.
Paul
EP - Ethics Particle
Gold Meritorious Patron
Mistaken identity!
Hey IKTM - this is Nicki'sthread!
How is "Nicki" as a "nic" anti to Anonymous? :confused2:
And it was NA "Not Anonymous" who claimed to be in "turmoil"!
Whatever could be said about my good friend Nicki....well s/he is sure as hell not in turmoil.
Go Nicki! 
EP
Hey IKTM - this is Nicki'sthread!
How is "Nicki" as a "nic" anti to Anonymous? :confused2:
And it was NA "Not Anonymous" who claimed to be in "turmoil"!
Whatever could be said about my good friend Nicki....well s/he is sure as hell not in turmoil.
Go Nicki! EP
Iknowtoomuch
Gold Meritorious Patron
Hey IKTM - this is Nicki'sthread!
How is "Nicki" as a "nic" anti to Anonymous? :confused2:
And it was NA "Not Anonymous" who claimed to be in "turmoil"!
Whatever could be said about my good friend Nicki....well s/he is sure as hell not in turmoil.
EP
I think it's time for me to take a break from the computer.........
I'm sorry, I somehow got these posters mixed up.
Sorry Nicki, my last couple posts were based on this mix up.
Let's see...
Nicki picks and chooses whom to reply to. Nothing wrong with that, but it's revealing to see her choices.
Nicki discovers that many if not most posters to ESMB have 'upsets', are blinded by hatred or any of a whole bundle of 'low toned' traits which pretty much eliminate them as potential 'comm' partners.
Nicki *has* a life; implying that others do *not*, and, hense can spend their time 'attacking' the 'Church', the 'Tech' or the other wonders of Hubbardism with their upset hatred.
As far as Nicki's concerned, Scientology, Ron and the 'Church' are just peachy up to her own objection at GAT, but, she has no interest in discussing or hearing about outpoints pre-GAT or inherent to the 'Scientology Philosophy' because; well, just because.
Nothing new here; prettys standard down-tone-level-exercise, combined with 'divide and conquer', third partying, strawman false representation yadda yadda.
So, besides that Mrs. Lincoln, how did you enjoy the play?
Zinj
Nicki picks and chooses whom to reply to. Nothing wrong with that, but it's revealing to see her choices.
Nicki discovers that many if not most posters to ESMB have 'upsets', are blinded by hatred or any of a whole bundle of 'low toned' traits which pretty much eliminate them as potential 'comm' partners.
Nicki *has* a life; implying that others do *not*, and, hense can spend their time 'attacking' the 'Church', the 'Tech' or the other wonders of Hubbardism with their upset hatred.
As far as Nicki's concerned, Scientology, Ron and the 'Church' are just peachy up to her own objection at GAT, but, she has no interest in discussing or hearing about outpoints pre-GAT or inherent to the 'Scientology Philosophy' because; well, just because.
Nothing new here; prettys standard down-tone-level-exercise, combined with 'divide and conquer', third partying, strawman false representation yadda yadda.
So, besides that Mrs. Lincoln, how did you enjoy the play?
Zinj
I think it's time for me to take a break from the computer.........
I'm sorry, I somehow got these posters mixed up.
Sorry Nicki, my last couple posts were based on this mix up.
I noticed your confusion too, but, hey, don't leave; the fun may be just starting
Zinj
Dulloldfart
Squirrel Extraordinaire
Oh, for God's sake.
She's getting attacked like flies on shit. Maybe not a good analogy. I'm amazed at how many people she's responded to. I think she's holding her position well, all things considered.
Paul
Vinaire
Sponsor
Iknowtoomuch
Gold Meritorious Patron
I can see why you might think that but consider the fact that Nicki is not so willing to explain things to people that want to know what she's thinking. Then says she's being attacked and hated on.
When in reality members just want to know why she thinks what she thinks of Scientology. Then she rejects answering those questions one way or another.
That's her prerogative but then can we really call it an attack?
I'm still asking myself why is Nicki here? I do see Nicki is willing to read what links we post which is a great thing. Is that really it?
Tim Skog
Silver Meritorious Patron
As an atheist I find all religion inane. But I sure get a kick out of Nic. She seems have to have stirred up the shit pot here.
Not everybody is always going to agree to debate. I hope Nic keeps posting on this board. It appears Nic is leaving the Church and going into the freezone. I am interested in what may come of that.
Not everybody is always going to agree to debate. I hope Nic keeps posting on this board. It appears Nic is leaving the Church and going into the freezone. I am interested in what may come of that.
Zinj,
Now you can add "Nicki" to the top of the list of things to beef about:
Let's see ..there's:
Scientology
CofS
L. Ron Hubbard
Let's add:
"analyzing everything Nicki says" or we could call it
"the problem with Nicki"
Or
"things that make me go "snarl"
Basicaly, I'm responding in like kind, and not really taking it personally...you shouldn't either.
Nic
Now you can add "Nicki" to the top of the list of things to beef about:
Let's see ..there's:
Scientology
CofS
L. Ron Hubbard
Let's add:
"analyzing everything Nicki says" or we could call it
"the problem with Nicki"
Or
"things that make me go "snarl"
Basicaly, I'm responding in like kind, and not really taking it personally...you shouldn't either.
Nic
Nothing 'personal' about it Nicki. There's no rule against being manipulative on ESMB, but, also no rule that one has to allow oneself to *be* manipulated.
You're welcome here
Zinj
The Anabaptist Jacques
Crusader
Yeah, and we really don't know if she is actually reading any of the links. Somehow, not being smitten with someone has been redefined as attacking them. I may be singing the same old song, but I think she is playing some people here llike a virtuoso.
The Anabaptist Jacques
Megalomaniac
Silver Meritorious Patron
Uh, yeah.
Hi.Wow, even the trolls get a warmer welcome than this. What happened to that "face value" stuff?
Nicki, here
, let me loan you my umbrella. 
uncle sam
Silver Meritorious Patron
Tiger Lily
Gold Meritorious Patron
AJ, She may be. . .(playing some of us like a virtuoso), or . . .maybe she's not. We don't know that she isn't reading the links either.
All I know is that I went through a period of extreme upset when I first found out that there was actual validity to arguments against Scientology -- that exes weren't all SP's etc. It was a really hard transition in world view. And I was not always completely rational about it either. If someone else is in that situation (going through some change in reality about Scientology) I really want to be a support to them. I know how much I needed support.
If I'm wrong, I'm wrong -- it's happened before. But I'd rather think the best in someone until I have solid knowledge they don't deserve my support. I'm not handing out my social security number or anything, just encouraging her to communicate and explore for herself, is all. Maybe I can learn something from her too. . . I have already learned lots from listening to all of you here on ESMB. . . another voice is welcome.
As far as not answering everything. She's here for herself, not us. Maybe she doesn't want to take the time, or maybe she knows that it'll just cause more argument, and she'd rather spend her time doing something else.
I'm not criticizing those of you who are suspicious. Many of you have been burned badly and you have a right to be wary. And I'm new here, maybe I'm naive. I'm willing to have that too. But it's how I feel today that I'd rather go with "innocent until proven guilty" with reasonable caution, of course.
-TL
The Anabaptist Jacques
Crusader
I understand that leaving the Church is an evolutionary process. But when you were starting to ask questions of others when you were first leaving were you as smug as she? It is her attitude that I am wary of, not her questions. People calling her courageous and people praising her for holding her position is a bit too much. She was in the GO don't forget. She is not as innocent and naive as she leads people to believe.
The Anabaptist Jacques
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Vinaire
Sponsor
What are you afraid of? Being manipulted again?
It is ok if you let yourself be manipulated, if you are letting it happen knowingly.
.
