Not an ex-Scientologist Message Board

Xenu's Boyfriend

Silver Meritorious Patron
Yeah but perhaps as you toss it around in ya noggin trying to get your finger on it you will discover a little somehing that opens a whole next door - if not layers of the onion - for you.

For me, that has been the beauty of ESMB & keeps me coming back to read although I know I'm extremely close to the time for me to wave goodbye to this place & move on down my road.

In some ways, I have to ask myself if I'm a guest here, and what role I play. I've shared many times that I have no experience in the church and this is "an Ex-Scientologist message board", so I also need to ask myself, where my place is with the idea, information, knowledge, passion that I've got. I've always been annoyed with men who join feminist causes and try to out-feminist the women or white people who join anti-racist groups that are predominately black and talk so much the black people have to shut up. I know this isn't a good comparison in some ways, but I've complained about bullies here and I don't want to be one. Still, there are people like me, and more coming, who are very much connected to the anti-Scientology movement from what we are reading and we feel very upset about the chruch. So, excuse me if this is a bit messy, but it's part of the experience.
 

Free Being Me

Crusader
I think what's bugging you is the same thing that bugs me - the insincerity of a very few people who are here to try to play around with our heads, and save Scientology from us. And who are we to say that they don't have the right to try to play around with our heads? Lol.

Having said that it bugs me, it doesn't really anymore - it just makes me laugh :)

:goodposting:
 

Xenu's Boyfriend

Silver Meritorious Patron
I think what's bugging you is the same thing that bugs me - the insincerity of a very few people who are here to try to play around with our heads, and save Scientology from us. And who are we to say that they don't have the right to try to play around with our heads? Lol.

Having said that it bugs me, it doesn't really anymore - it just makes me laugh :)

Well, I will say one thing. Being here, even over this short period, has been a very intense experience. I've never had a relationship with a message board in my life like I've had with this one. Something powerful is going on.
 

Smilla

Ordinary Human
In some ways, I have to ask myself if I'm a guest here, and what role I play. I've shared many times that I have no experience in the church and this is "an Ex-Scientologist message board", so I also need to ask myself, where my place is with the idea, information, knowledge, passion that I've got. I've always been annoyed with men who join feminist causes and try to out-feminist the women or white people who join anti-racist groups that are predominately black and talk so much the black people have to shut up. I know this isn't a good comparison in some ways, but I've complained about bullies here and I don't want to be one. Still, there are people like me, and more coming, who are very much connected to the anti-Scientology movement from what we are reading and we feel very upset about the chruch. So, excuse me if this is a bit messy, but it's part of the experience.

It's really good to have you here - you've brought a lot to the table :yes:
 

ClearedSP

Patron with Honors
I think there's also an upside to the presence of those who aren't fully out.

I think that entropy is not the friend of cults. The moment you stop being surrounded by cultists, the clock starts ticking. Rather than having constant social reinforcement of cult beliefs, you just have reality, and reality tends to subvert those beliefs.

ESMB has a lot of concentrated reality. A lot of truth. People might come here looking for a co-auditor, or trolling for new PCs, or whatever, but if they start reading posts by people who knew Hubbard, and things like that, they're likely to learn way more than they bargained for. I'd rather have those people *reading* this site (whether they post or not), than hanging out at Marty's Revival Tent and Medicine Show.

I don't think it's a clear cut issue, but I do see the openness as a mostly positive thing. I think that truth wears away at lies a little bit better than lies wear away at truth. :)

[video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DBa746RVNHA[/video]
 

Smilla

Ordinary Human
I think there's also an upside to the presence of those who aren't fully out.

I think that entropy is not the friend of cults. The moment you stop being surrounded by cultists, the clock starts ticking. Rather than having constant social reinforcement of cult beliefs, you just have reality, and reality tends to subvert those beliefs.

ESMB has a lot of concentrated reality. A lot of truth. People might come here looking for a co-auditor, or trolling for new PCs, or whatever, but if they start reading posts by people who knew Hubbard, and things like that, they're likely to learn way more than they bargained for. I'd rather have those people *reading* this site (whether they post or not), than hanging out at Marty's Revival Tent and Medicine Show.

I don't think it's a clear cut issue, but I do see the openness as a mostly positive thing. I think that truth wears away at lies a little bit better than lies wear away at truth. :)

[video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DBa746RVNHA[/video]

Awesomely Awesome Post! :yes:
 

Free Being Me

Crusader
Well, I will say one thing. Being here, even over this short period, has been a very intense experience. I've never had a relationship with a message board in my life like I've had with this one. Something powerful is going on.

There is a huge variety of people here, from all backgrounds that have experienced hubbard personally and his scientology. What I find fascinating is that after having been in hubbard's mind cult, the members here dissect those experiences bluntly and honestly, as stepping stones to help themselves and others looking for information, answers, help and speak out. I think ESMB is rather unique in it's member dedication to this end. Could that be the phenomena you're putting your finger on?
 

Andtheyalllived

Patron with Honors
As somebody who's so new I'm dripping in placenta:

I actually enjoy the hell out of the stuff that bugs you the most! I see a post or comment that makes me insane, because of it's hypocrisy, self-absorption, or downright bad intentions.... For a few minutes I consider composing some scathing reply, and then I remind myself to wait a little while: someone's going to nail this person to the wall with more class, history and intellect than me.

I guess I'm talking more about the real ideological battles rather than than the look-at-me stupidity... That IS annoying. But I don't mind annoying... And I love watching the smart people bury the bad guys using only their brains.
 

tetloj

Silver Meritorious Patron
Great discussion starter XB. I am also a never in, and am 100s of miles from any Scientology whatsoever. My now husband was persuaded to take a personality test while a uni student a quarter of a decade ago, thought it was bullshit - that' my closest personal association with the subject.

There have been some fairly disturbing discussions over the last month and I put that down to the post-Debbie Cook, post-Tomkat divorce post-The Master [insert other big 2012 stories] hangover. I am feeling it too; the big hits were intoxicating.

Yes some of the discourse is painful to read, even with no experience of the mindfuck. What it does for me however is reveal the mindfuck.

While I have no Sci experience I do have experience with mindfuck in other areas (I am in a very toxic workplace at the moment, a number of narcissistic, manipulative and incompetent people in leadership positions) and I am finding ESMB a great education. Thanks in part to observations by people like you who can identify and point out the behaviour. Discussions like this are part of my mindfuck immunisation programme.

Attracted by the woo-woo celebrity factor, stayed for the lulz, got an invaluable education in the process.

And where else do you get this kind of education except through a long term immersion in discourse, facilitated by insightful and humorous correspondents.

Some of the heavier posts send me to google, wikipedia and youtube - Sci watching generally (and ESMB in particular) are my very own liberal arts curriculum.

Thank you for the courage of your convictions.

:thumbsup:
 

TG1

Angelic Poster
Ah well, I do not think posters are writing to one another but readers of the thread who, hopefully, are plenty of lurkers.

It is like politics, no one is going to switch from far right conversation to far left liberal because of " a " post. maybe a slight shift or some food for thought.

When we come to the cult it is an onion each has to peel at their own pace.
I know when I walked out the door my feeling for Ron as they were when I was in.
Nowadays, I think the old bastard was bat shit crazy.

But, bottom line, as I have the right to believe I should help destroy the cult the next person has the same right to believe the cult is the salvation of mankind. I do not agree with the Kool Aid drinkers but I do deeply believe I must defend their right to be allowed their say.

Also, as much as it chaps my ass to see these pro-cult posts & apologists spout what I consider untruths it is more bothersome to me that some threads are DESIGNED to take attention off the cult & onto things that have no bearing on any stated purpose of this board ! Makes me want to tear my hair out !

Ah, if we all agreed & got together to sing kum-bye-ya as we held hands in love, peace & harmony it would flat out kill the board.

Why ? Controversy fuels interest.

So, folks, welcome the ass chapping deeply pissing off opposing views - it is what turns the wheels of the board !

...............or vice versa :duh:

QFT!
 

Auditor's Toad

Clear as Mud
One of the things it may take the newer members awhile to see is that in this mix of posters is some who spent time close to LRH, lots of auditors even all the way up to Class 12, some CS's, some people who were highly admin trained & held very high posts in the SO, Fully hatted EO's, reges, some who have done the whole bridge ---and many with decades of experience in the cult.

Ain't no way to know much about our fellow posters.

Enjoy 'em all !
 

afaceinthecrowd

Gold Meritorious Patron
One of the things it may take the newer members awhile to see is that in this mix of posters is some who spent time close to LRH, lots of auditors even all the way up to Class 12, some CS's, some people who were highly admin trained & held very high posts in the SO, Fully hatted EO's, reges, some who have done the whole bridge ---and many with decades of experience in the cult.

Ain't no way to know much about our fellow posters.

Enjoy 'em all !

Yep!:thumbsup::yes::clap:
 
Xenu's Boyfriend, you have some good points. Yes, you're relatively new, and therefore you've probably not seen enough cycles in the exchanges on the Board. We have good (interesting, volatile) months and bad (boring, indie-ful) months. I agree that over the last little time there seem to be more and more indies/freezoners around who want to argue Scientology's good points. I get tired of reading them too. You can use the blocking facility in ESMB if you like; I don't because I like to see who's posting (though I don't read posts from people whose POV I already know I disagree with on the subject of Scientology).

But consider this. It's friction that makes the pearl. Sometimes it takes a poster who's somewhat pro-scientology (as opposed to CoS) to get me to the point where I can clarify what my objection to scientology is. While I generally exist in a wash of general irritation with, contempt of and opposition to the whole of scientology and Hubbard, sometimes a specific pro-scn comment or viewpoint (or a milder acceptance of something) will stimulate me to think a bit harder and articulate my opposition or disagreement a bit more clearly. For me, it's all good as it adds to my general store of specific disagreements and objections.

You've been a breath of fresh air for tired old folks like me on the Board. So keep ranting and airing your opposition; you never know when one of your ideas will actually set off a chain reaction in someone else.

Yes I like Xenu's Boyfriend's posts too. Please don't infer that yours are not great too though, because they are, no matter how tired or old you are. :)
 

HelluvaHoax!

Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on
...


HELPFUL TIP FROM COMMANDER EX

JPGGreetingsFromCEXcopy.jpg


Scientology attracts 3 kinds of people.
Truth seekers.
The deluded.
Liars.
When presented with enough truth. . .
The Truth Seekers blow.
The deluded get confused but some recover.
The liars continue lying.
Welcome to ESMB.
 

Mini Me

Retiree
The thing is, you could go and join another message board that only allows one viewpoint, and they do exist. They are out there. But nobody posts there because they are boring.

The conversations go like this:

"Hubbard was an asshole"
"Yeah Hubbard was an asshole"
"Oh Yeah Hubbard really was an asshole"
"And the tech sucks"
Yeah the tech really sucks"
"There is nothing good in Scientology"
"Yeah nothing!"
"Oh and Hubbard was an asshole"
"the tech sucks"
"yeah the tech really sucks"
"The tech sucks because Hubbard was an asshole"

What's left to talk about?
 

Mick Wenlock

Admin Emeritus (retired)
Your premise is flawed I think.

There is no defined 'persona' for an "ex".

Its a process of self-identification and what is an "ex" for me is not the same as an "ex" for someone else.

But here is the point that fries the true believers - the difference does not matter. What matters is that this a place where people can disagree with each other about Scientology - and still be in touch.

The best answer to scientology is free, open opinion and communication that respects the other view.
 
G

Gottabrain

Guest
Your premise is flawed I think.

There is no defined 'persona' for an "ex".

Its a process of self-identification and what is an "ex" for me is not the same as an "ex" for someone else.

But here is the point that fries the true believers - the difference does not matter. What matters is that this a place where people can disagree with each other about Scientology - and still be in touch.

The best answer to scientology is free, open opinion and communication that respects the other view.

Nice. :thumbsup: Thanks, Mick.

(oh and you were right and I was wrong about the gold, but I still disagree with you on OSA Reserves v SO reserves. :coolwink: Love ya. :heartflower:)
 

freethinker

Sponsor
Most of the people here were seeking truth when they got caught up in the never-never land called Scientology. Those people are still seeking truth, that is what is going on here.

Just my thoughts.
Well, I will say one thing. Being here, even over this short period, has been a very intense experience. I've never had a relationship with a message board in my life like I've had with this one. Something powerful is going on.
 

TG1

Angelic Poster
But here is the point that fries the true believers - the difference does not matter. What matters is that this a place where people can disagree with each other about Scientology - and still be in touch.

The best answer to scientology is free, open opinion and communication that respects the other view.

Amen! :hattip:

TG1
 
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