Org income drop in 2012?

Freeminds

Bitter defrocked apostate
A key thing to remember, whether you're playing along at home or using the cash reserves of your manipulative Cold War era UFO cult... is that the returns you enjoy don't mean a thing... not a single thing... until the day when you stop playing, and cash out. Anybody can see a particular share double in value, and assume that it'll double again. If you stay 'in', you might stay just long enough to see a big fall... and if you cash out, you might do so just before a big rise. In other words, you'll always run the risk of being wrong.

Remember that a lot the stock market stories that people will tell you are like a lot of fishing stories. In reality, making money this way is hard work. In fact, making money is like misleading; you can only really win when somebody else is losing. Like energy, money can't really be created or destroyed; only changed. (When governments 'make' money, savers get poorer.) And there's always somebody with inside information, or more buying power than you, or simply a faster means of communication with their broker.

Avoid the hell out of big ticket commodities like gold: there are too many professionals who have subscriptions to much better information sources than you do. They'll let you play - welcome you with open arms - but only because there always have to be some losers, in order for others to be winners. See above.

Also, don't get into day trading. It will eat up your life and give you an ulcer. For professionals who want to burn out by 40, and whose work involves staring simultaneously at nine different monitors... good luck to them. But if you get into day trading the prices will always be at the back of your mind. You'll become a bad workmate and a bad family member who never does anything except sneak off to look at the latest market figures. And, incidentally, a crashing bore. Avoid. Choose a company that you care about or feel good about, and stay in for the long game... and only gamble with what you can afford to lose.

And don't trust anything you read on the Internet. Including this. But remember that your money is better being given a chance of working for you, than residing on account in some cult ledger, or handed over for a shelf full of the 5th edition of LRH's incoherent bullshit. Have fun with whatever you choose to do!
 

Helena Handbasket

Gold Meritorious Patron
Furthermore, inflation is a lot higher than the official pronouncements from Washington,
I've heard this from several places. Could someone give me some more detail, perhaps their personal experience, with this? Could the REAL inflation rate be as high as 2% per week?

Also, how are the government able to misstate the rate of inflation?

Helena
 

Lure Rob & Hyde

Patron with Honors
HH, what never got explained was how " RESERVES " of 1.5 Billion got to be completely in a " TRADING ACCOUNT ".

Perhaps you can chime in here and help me understand how the entire reserves got put into a trading account.

Nevermind the covered calls ( which he glossed over to mentioning much detail of that one either needs to own the stock or buy options to write against ).

Most professional traders do acknowledge that covered calls are a CONSERVATIVE method of profit but none claim anything like 50 % ROI on an annual basis.

Again, most professionals will tell you that a trading rate of over 70 % is considered genius level and one that the very hottest hedge fund managers aspire to achieve.

When someone tells you that all their trades over a longish period of time are positive do get to share some of what they are smoking - that is some very very good stuff !

I knew an options trader that showed me the slips of where he grossed $250,000 on a short term options trade - and where some went against him for that, too.

But, back to the question - does anybody know anybody that puts their entire net worth into a trading account managed by a professioanl or themself ? ( And nevermind that wou ld violate every common sense 101 rule of diversification ! )

Not evenmisscabbage is THAT stupid.


However the investments are tagged you need to factor in greed while sitting at the tables in the Wall St Casino.
JP Morgan's fiasco of 3 billion so far stated loss(it's way more by the way) was a supposed trade that couldn't go bad till another great white shark noticed how they could penetrate JPM's weakeness of the trade.
Ya think dwarfy boy didn't notice it and got the shivers?
Face it he would be a perfect candidate for a raid a position he was involved in atany given time? Maybe it already has happened .
 

Lulu Belle

Moonbat
What data is there that the reserves are in a trading account?

I have said before that the advices and data I have seen and heard about specifically say what the reserves are supposed to be kept in. Denise probably has better and mores specific info than I but the gist of it was - they are supposed to be portable and liquidatable. Gold, jewels and hard currency (swiss francs were the ones mentioned)


There was very little "trading". Money sent to reserves in KBL or BIS was, for the most part, converted. Hubbard was not - AFAIK (and I stand to be corrected on this part) - interested in investing. He was about acquisition and hedging. Hubbard was risk averse in the extreme.

Now DM has gone whole hog on this Ideal Org crap which is way out in left field and not at all something Hubbard would have embraced so undoubtedly there have been changes but I have not heard anything from anyone with knowledge about what changes have been made in the handling of reserves.


I just walked into this thread. I may be way off the rails here, and maybe this isn't exactly what you're talking about, but I know for sure that Stacy Young talked a lot about how Jim Isaacson was in charge of investing when he was at ASI. He would get creamed by DM when the stocks went down. I've seen posts by her about it and she also talked to me about it directly.

Didn't the Special Edition overpriced leatherbounds etc. from ASI come about because DM lost a bunch of LRH's money with bad investments?

My impression was always that DM liked to gamble. Wasn't there a lot written about how he and Pat Broeker would go out gambling? And that Gene Denk was taken gambling (I think by Broeker and DM) during LRH's last days?
 

Auditor's Toad

Clear as Mud
<snip>
Realistically, if any major fund manager could achieve anything over 10% annually for clients in various market conditions they would be Hall of Fame. If any could routinely achieve 20% they would be legendary.
<snip>

And, if the SO reserves were a billion ( skip the other alleged half a billion ! ) when DM stole the joint in 1986 ...uh, at 50 % ROI a year wouldn't the net worth by 2000 of the reserves be a mere 225 Billion ? ( Sorry, got bored adding 50 % a year for another dozen years but it'd be - roughly - over 11,332 Billion).

I'd agree they are wealthy, but could I get a show of hands of those that really do believe there is, on hand, a mere 11,332 Billions ?
 

HelluvaHoax!

Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on
What data is there that the reserves are in a trading account?

None that I have seen. That's why I said I treat all such info as "anecdotal" or "speculative".

I was just responding to some of the even more speculative talk about Return On Investments.

Here is an interesting thing about the billions of real estate, cash, assets and reserves that is under the control of one person, David Miscavich. If any of the parishioners were 0.0001% as responsible as they pretend to be (e.g. Clearing the Planet, Salvaging this Sector of the Universe....) they would be able to answer this simple question about their church.

WHAT HAPPENS TO THE BILLIONS IF DAVID MISCAVICH SUDDENLY LEAVES, IS INCAPACITATED OR DIES?

The fact that Scientologists cannot answer this question reveals how profoundly naive & irresponsible they are. It's the same way they blindly accept the idea that Hubbard has figured out everything in the universe and it's all gonna be just fine because "ETHICAL OT'S ARE HANDLING IT!"

And why can't a Scientologist ask their own church what the succession plan is for using the billions to save the planet, if their leader suddenly "sheds their encumbrance"? The answer is pretty devastating, actually.

Because they are too scared to ask. And it's not an "outpoint" that all these mighty planet-clearing OTs are at 1.0 on the tone scale. It's by design and a "plus point".

But if one lone OT did summon the courage to ask (and assuming that they were not Declared or routed to Ethics immediately for re-indoctrination) here is what would happen:


OT VIII
...so yeah, I was kinda wondering like who would run the
church and handle the billions if COB, ummmm...well, if
COB were to ummmm....well, if he was errr...promoted
to Target II. You know, because he is so upstat and junk.

INT EXEC
Yes, that is an excellent question. I can assure you that
everything is being done standardly per standard policy.
Of course for security reasons, it is better that you don't
know the specifics.

OT VIII
Oh, it's better that I don't know? But wouldn't it
increase my KRC if had knowledge about --

INT EXEC (interrupting)
It's for your own safety and your own eternity.
Like if Psychs kidnapped and tortured you and
made you tell them where the money was, then
we wouldn't have the money and you would lose
your eternity.

OT VIII
Oh wow. That indicates. Thanks for answering
my question, I always wondered about that and
now I can end cycle and focus on getting up the Bridge.​
 

HelluvaHoax!

Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on
And, if the SO reserves were a billion ( skip the other alleged half a billion ! ) when DM stole the joint in 1986 ...uh, at 50 % ROI a year wouldn't the net worth by 2000 of the reserves be a mere 225 Billion ? ( Sorry, got bored adding 50 % a year for another dozen years but it'd be - roughly - over 11,332 Billion).

I'd agree they are wealthy, but could I get a show of hands of those that really do believe there is, on hand, a mere 11,332 Billions ?



Please stop saying 50% ROI! :hysterical::hysterical::hysterical::hysterical:

Only OT's with OT powers can make 50% ROI.
 

RolandRB

Rest in Peace
I've heard this from several places. Could someone give me some more detail, perhaps their personal experience, with this? Could the REAL inflation rate be as high as 2% per week?

Also, how are the government able to misstate the rate of inflation?

Helena

I think that if you howl at the moon loud anough and long enough then all will become clear.
 

NoName

A Girl Has No Name
But David Miscavige, alcoholic, paranoiac and violent micro-manager, playing the stock market? I can't see that happening. If he tried it would overwhelm him, but I can't see him trusting somebody else with the job.

Honestly, that probably worked in his favor. In 08, seriously rich people had been royally fucked over by their fund managers, what with all the hedge funds and mortgage backed securities. And look at what happened with Elie Wiesel's foundation that had been managed by Madoff - and all the people who committed suicide when that turned out to be a fraud.

I don't believe that Slappy got 50%. In fact, he probably lost his shirt buying up Idle Morgue properties between 2003-2008 real estate bubble. Maybe, just maybe, he's gotten a bit ahead with any real estate he's purchased since 09.

And he's too paranoid to let anyone manage liquid assets (something that, unfortunately, would have worked in his favor these last 15 or so years).

He'd be lucky to break even between any high-yield money market accounts and real estate losses, imo.
 

NoName

A Girl Has No Name
And, if the SO reserves were a billion ( skip the other alleged half a billion ! ) when DM stole the joint in 1986 ...uh, at 50 % ROI a year wouldn't the net worth by 2000 of the reserves be a mere 225 Billion ? ( Sorry, got bored adding 50 % a year for another dozen years but it'd be - roughly - over 11,332 Billion).

I'd agree they are wealthy, but could I get a show of hands of those that really do believe there is, on hand, a mere 11,332 Billions ?

But I would say that you don't even need to do that. I've done well in life, and learned to be paranoid about people wanting to exploit me (partly why I ran quickly away from the Co$).

What I can tell you based on my experience is that a person can live EXTREMELY well by parking a large some of money into some high yield money markets, CD's, and annuities, and living off the interest. And by leaving a maximum of $250K in each bank (when the banks started failing in late 2008, I started doing business with **several** banks). Assuming a 2% ROI on his 1 billion, Slappy has 20 mil a year to buy Tom Cruise his private jets, pay his PI's, and buy helmet cameras for Squirrelbusters. I think that he probably lives a little TOO opulently for 20 mil, what with all those fraud settlements that the Co$ has to pay. But still, that's a lot of money, and 2% is admittedly VERY conservative considering the amount we're talking about.

But I don't even give Slappy this much credit. I am told that LRH took large amounts of cash every week to Creston, and that no one really knew what happened to it. So, the question is whether Slappy followed his mentor and has buried large amounts of cash in the super secret vaults, or stuffed it in his mattresses, or whatever. If some of the IAS refund stories are to be believed, there are large numbers of offshore accounts. Thieves like to do business with thieves, so I can only assume that this type of "diversification" will bite Slappy in the ass in the long run.

Finally, there is the issue of Idle Morgues. I'm sure he lost something with the property values, but I can't for the life of me understand a couple of things. Why is the New Haven building being allowed to go into foreclosure? And the fines on that building in Clearwater? I get that it's standard dreck to not pay bills on time, but to allow a building to be seized and auctioned off is an unfathomable level of stupidity, particularly when you supposedly have a bil in reserve. So I have to wonder why that's being allowed to happen? It simply doesn't make sense. On this point, I refuse to take the, "It's Scientology, it doesn't make sense!" That's true for the Tech, for the abuse, for the Xenu story, etc. But I can't understand why this particular thing with the properties would happen because it will NEVER EVER EVER pay for itself in the long run (unlike consistently paying bills exactly 10 minutes before the late fee kicks in).
 

Terril park

Sponsor
But I would say that you don't even need to do that. I've done well in life, and learned to be paranoid about people wanting to exploit me (partly why I ran quickly away from the Co$).

What I can tell you based on my experience is that a person can live EXTREMELY well by parking a large some of money into some high yield money markets, CD's, and annuities, and living off the interest. And by leaving a maximum of $250K in each bank (when the banks started failing in late 2008, I started doing business with **several** banks). Assuming a 2% ROI on his 1 billion, Slappy has 20 mil a year to buy Tom Cruise his private jets, pay his PI's, and buy helmet cameras for Squirrelbusters. I think that he probably lives a little TOO opulently for 20 mil, what with all those fraud settlements that the Co$ has to pay. But still, that's a lot of money, and 2% is admittedly VERY conservative considering the amount we're talking about.

But I don't even give Slappy this much credit. I am told that LRH took large amounts of cash every week to Creston, and that no one really knew what happened to it. So, the question is whether Slappy followed his mentor and has buried large amounts of cash in the super secret vaults, or stuffed it in his mattresses, or whatever. If some of the IAS refund stories are to be believed, there are large numbers of offshore accounts. Thieves like to do business with thieves, so I can only assume that this type of "diversification" will bite Slappy in the ass in the long run.

Finally, there is the issue of Idle Morgues. I'm sure he lost something with the property values, but I can't for the life of me understand a couple of things. Why is the New Haven building being allowed to go into foreclosure? And the fines on that building in Clearwater? I get that it's standard dreck to not pay bills on time, but to allow a building to be seized and auctioned off is an unfathomable level of stupidity, particularly when you supposedly have a bil in reserve. So I have to wonder why that's being allowed to happen? It simply doesn't make sense. On this point, I refuse to take the, "It's Scientology, it doesn't make sense!" That's true for the Tech, for the abuse, for the Xenu story, etc. But I can't understand why this particular thing with the properties would happen because it will NEVER EVER EVER pay for itself in the long run (unlike consistently paying bills exactly 10 minutes before the late fee kicks in).

Mike Rinder has said that the whole idle morgues deal is that DM can give some nice stats and wins at events. This probably makes it easier for the IAS to fleece those attending. However this must be getting more difficult as time goes on.
 

Auditor's Toad

Clear as Mud
Mike Rinder has said that the whole idle morgues deal is that DM can give some nice stats and wins at events. This probably makes it easier for the IAS to fleece those attending. However this must be getting more difficult as time goes on.

As long as there are people left to fleece - and reges left to fleece 'em - spending more money on the imagined stats of the dog & pony show is easy.

Many aren't looking at what that dog & pony show leaves behind -a trail of what ?
 

NoName

A Girl Has No Name
Mike Rinder has said that the whole idle morgues deal is that DM can give some nice stats and wins at events. This probably makes it easier for the IAS to fleece those attending. However this must be getting more difficult as time goes on.

Terril, when you said that first, ny reaction was that it makes absolute sense. But then the more I thought about it, I realized that it makes abbsolutely perfect sense in a successful businessperson sort of way. When has DM/Co$ ever been honest with those stats graphs? And why would they start now?

Hell, I remember the Dear Leader's broadcasts when I was a kid - "the 5 year plan is being met by 225%" and there wasnt a damn thing to buy in the stores. I was wearing too big boy clothes that had been washed to rags, because none of us saw ANY evidence to support it. But we didn't dare question it out loud.

DM was never anny different than the Dear Leader with his so called upstats graphs. Why would he start now?

Mike Rinder's logic has some superficial appeal, but that's honestly about all it has for me.

Oh and btw, happy Staturday. I noticed we had 3 delurks this week. A REAL upstat with actual proof.
 

Auditor's Toad

Clear as Mud
<snip>When has DM/Co$ ever been honest with those stats graphs? And why would they start now?
<snip>
DM was never anny different than the Dear Leader with his so called upstats graphs. Why would he start now?

Mike Rinder's logic has some superficial appeal, but that's honestly about all it has for me.
<snip>

I get tickled at people who put any stock in Mike Rinder... he spent how much of his life doing what?

And he is still glued to Marty Ratbum who spent the majority of his adult life doing what?

Given both these guys are now running on whatever agenda they are running on and are still managing to get some people out of the cult - good for 'em. Does that make either one of 'em a " relaible source " for anything other than the time of day ? ( which one can quickly verify of their own Timex ).

scn is a house cards built on lies.
Some say the old boy had millions in cash on hand - where did it go? Some say he had jewels - where did they go?
Who lives at Creston now?
Who lives at the 'backup ranch' now?
Where did the guns go?
Where did the camera collection go ? :omg:

Is there honor among " OT " thieves? :duh:
 

GoNuclear

Gold Meritorious Patron
I'm surprised that none of the pension funds have latched onto this.

What they make and what they show YOU as a return may or may not be the same.

You could probably make 50% per year with investment art if you knew what you were doing and had the money. Opportunities abound for those who have capital and liquidity. Furthermore, when things get really shitty, cash becomes king, and real gems of investments are available at fire-sale prices. That is true now in real-ewaste, but, they aren't going to give ham and eggers a break. What they will do is bundle bank REO assets into packages, available to those who can plunk down a billion or more dollars at a whack.

Pete
 

Terril park

Sponsor
Terril, when you said that first, ny reaction was that it makes absolute sense. But then the more I thought about it, I realized that it makes abbsolutely perfect sense in a successful businessperson sort of way. When has DM/Co$ ever been honest with those stats graphs? And why would they start now?

Hell, I remember the Dear Leader's broadcasts when I was a kid - "the 5 year plan is being met by 225%" and there wasnt a damn thing to buy in the stores. I was wearing too big boy clothes that had been washed to rags, because none of us saw ANY evidence to support it. But we didn't dare question it out loud.

DM was never anny different than the Dear Leader with his so called upstats graphs. Why would he start now?

Mike Rinder's logic has some superficial appeal, but that's honestly about all it has for me.

Oh and btw, happy Staturday. I noticed we had 3 delurks this week. A REAL upstat with actual proof.

One of the interesting comments the data chief made is that she was the one who had to find the good stats for DM to trumpet at events, and this became harder and harder. And she left years ago
 
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