OT 3 and Incident 1 and 2 discussion

[alex]

Are there any tapes of L Ron Hubbard talking about Incident One? I've never actually heard/seen anything on it, just know it from the Intertubes

Incident 1 is not a specific event like 2, but the first contact with a "universe". So a person could have several such, and need to go earlier similar on it as there have been other "universes" prior to this one.

Some think 12-21-12 will be the end of this one....

Incident one is unique to each rather the the big party of 2.

 

[Veda]

"Incident 1" of "4 quadrillion years ago":

"Loud snap
Waves of light
Chariot comes out, turns right and left.
Cherub comes out.
Blows horn, comes close.
Shattering series of snaps.
Cherub fades back (retreats)
Blackness dumped on thetan"

Some background:

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=72944&postcount=3

Class 8 lectures, 1968:

http://forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=177122&postcount=41

Interview, 1968:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_w-YWwC1lI

 

[alex]

"The most common difficulty you get into with a BT that doesn’t blow is there was an earlier Incident 1, some have several earlier Incident I’s.......

...There were several universes earlier than this one. If “earlier incident l?” doesn’t work, then its “earlier universe?”

...(caution: There is an implant which miscounts the number of earlier universes, making it seem there were far more than there were ). "

HCOB 10 Dec 78 (fair use snippet)

 

[Björkist]

My question stands, anyone else heard about the screen that seals thetans onto planet earth? Any LRH refs?

No LRH refs that I know of, but Michael Tsarion mentions an artificial barrier surrounding Earth which keeps us here. He alleges that humans will die if we travel past the moon. (which is why we [?] haven't done so)

It's contained in one of his presentations to be found on Google Video. He has some very interesting data at times, but at others, he is clearly reaching.

 

[Dulloldfart]

Incident 1 is not a specific event like 2, but the first contact with a "universe". So a person could have several such, and need to go earlier similar on it as there have been other "universes" prior to this one.

Some think 12-21-12 will be the end of this one....

Incident one is unique to each rather the the big party of 2.

Try and reconcile that with the specific incident details Hubbard gives. I've forgotten the time span Hubbard gives, but it is something like 1 quadrillion years (i.e. 3.5 to 4.5 quadrillion years ago). He gives no incident details for his earlier universes.

On the Inc 1 platen Hubbard says this incident occurs at "start of track", obviously the thetan's own personal time track and not the same for everyone. Before this there was no time for the individual thetan, with regard to this universe anyway. Personally I don't have a problem with the concepts of "before time" and "after time" - it's hard to conceive of analytically but in session time-shifting real incidents up and down the track (not Hubbard tech!) can help to discharge them and pushing them before and after time too can get more charge out of them so as a concept it does have some workability even if Zinj might not like it much.

Anyway, so back at the ranch, we have a thetan not subject to time who by whatever mechanism enters this universe. Maybe like peeking through a hole in a fence to see what's beyond. Wham! The trumpet-blowing cherubs and chariot and the whole works assails him and the clock starts ticking. Must be a whole crew lurking beside that hole in the fence. Do you think it's a real chariot etc.? Or a real screen with images projected on it? Or a projector of some kind that just flashes the images at the thetan?

Silly stuff.

Paul

 

[Veda]

"Deadly serious" stuff too.

A Scientologist, on "OT 3," has read 'KSW' many times, and been subjected to months - probably years - of promo and hype about the "OT levels," especially "OT 3." With "OT 3," the doors are flung open to becoming a super being with an eternal future of freedom, power, and infinite pleasure, without "OT 3," the person is destined to become a "BT" in an eternity of stuckness, oblivion, and infinite pain.

"Incident 1" (and "Incident 2," also) is a significance, a significance told to the Scientologist through his "OT 3" materials. It's presented along with writings and actions - such as repair lists - that look familiar, and are part of ordinary auditing, so it seems somehow credible, even though incredible. Once the significance is accepted as an "incident," it can be "confirmed," as an "incident," to the person by his meter that "will tell" him, by reacting (reading) - and if it doesn't react (read) on a meter then he knows he's in really big trouble and in really bad shape.

Once it is regarded as an incident, then it can act as an incident, be fixated upon, and be a problem. It can also be dispensed with and resolved, much to the person's relief as he sees his needle float, which is confirmation that it all must be true, and that Scientology really is the way.

Some stress, in the body and "space" of the person, naturally exists. Add a significance to that already existing stress that adds even more (envisioned "endless agonized") stress, then do various things to that stress; the stress usually, eventually, dissipates, and the needle eventually floats: happy "pre-OT," ("Infinite Pleasure") who finally attests to "OT 3," and has a huge win knowing that "his future" (next "endless trillions") "is assured" (and will not be "agonized" like those who haven't followed the carefully "taped path" etc.

One heck of an "aberrative pleasure moment," and a nasty trick by L. Ron, the glue-you Guru.

Note: For the glue to be effective, the lacquer/solvent ratio must be just right.

 

[Mark A. Baker]

Personally I don't have a problem with the concepts of "before time" and "after time" - it's hard to conceive of analytically but in session time-shifting real incidents up and down the track (not Hubbard tech!) can help to discharge them and pushing them before and after time too can get more charge out of them so as a concept it does have some workability even if Zinj might not like it much.

Not sure it mightn't be seen to qualify as "hubbard tech". It could fit in under creative processing. "Moving" things in time & space is a legitimate auditing tool under creative processing. Nothing "non-standard" about that.


Mark A. Baker

 

[Dulloldfart]

Not sure it mightn't be seen to qualify as "hubbard tech". It could fit in under creative processing. "Moving" things in time & space is a legitimate auditing tool under creative processing. Nothing "non-standard" about that.

Mark A. Baker

Fit it wherever you want.

I'm aware of Hubbard's creative processing idea of putting mockups into yesterday or next week, but I don't recall him ever taking known charged incidents or groups of incidents (as opposed to uncharged mockups) and alternately moving them backwards and forwards in time, a bit more each "swing" (they will go a bit further each time, it seems, as long as they are pretty much discharged by now), and finally moving them before and after time. That's what I found works best with time-shifting.

Paul

 

[Been Done Had]

No LRH refs that I know of, but Michael Tsarion mentions an artificial barrier surrounding Earth which keeps us here. He alleges that humans will die if we travel past the moon. (which is why we [?] haven't done so)

It's contained in one of his presentations to be found on Google Video. He has some very interesting data at times, but at others, he is clearly reaching.

Thanks for the ref! I originally read about the screen in L. Kin's Pied Pipers of Heaven (Google it.) I consider it OTIII fan fiction.

An interesting idea on Kin's is that implanting machinery and other devices that create effects on thetans are actually made of thetans. That makes sense, although it's rather grim to contemplate.

 

[Zinjifar]

It's not particularly new. Old theme in SF, although, the best version I can think of is C.S. Lewis' 'Perelandra Trilogy'. By the way, the third book of the trilogy is 'That Hideous Strength', which is one of the best analyses of Scn in a fictional setting that I can think of.

Zinj

 

[Zinjifar]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/That_Hideous_Strength

Zinj

 

[Leo J]

Emporers clothes

Scientology is the religion of xenu. That is the belief. Not provable fact, belief. Secret belief. You die if you find out! Oh my. Many people belonged to scientology and now say they dont, but from an outside observers position it looks as if you still think just the same way.

If someone comes along and says things that dont fit in your box, bannishment! This board still supports the beliefs that are scientology and cuts out the people who try to wake you up. Xenu is alive and well with you at his feet. You just dont know it.

Search the members list and see who was here the first day. Mil Femma of course, and?

xenus pal.

Wake up people. really. wake up.

You are still xenu slaves.

I think it would be a very good idea if we viewed the whole of the
"OT Levels" in PT. And viewed them from the idea that Amos or Ralph
or Joe Shmoe had discovered them.

!. They are not OT Levels.

2. They are engramic incidents. (I think being transported to a
volcano, having a H-Bomb exploded on top of you qualifies as an engram.)

3. They are late on the chain engramic incidents.......worse they are
"end of game" engramic incidents......as such they have earlier
beginnings and later endings.

4. End of Game and loss of Game are the basis of
depression......Gameless, Goaless and Souless.

5. R6-EW, CC, OT I, II, III. are 3rd and 4th dynamic engramic
incidents - the odds are very few people have enough charge off their
cases to run the actual incidents.

6. In picking up another entities case to run on the
material......you would have exactly the same phenomena on that
entity as you had during your beginning auditing.

7. You now have multiple time tracks and beings in restimulation as
well as your own.

8. The odds of getting these incidents and implants are remote.

9. The logistic are utterly improbable and impossible.

10. The cost would have been astronomical...........DC 8's with
propellers would not have been viable transportation to transport 40
billion bodies to any of the many locations.

11. Running the OT levels violates the Auditors Code.......Do not
evaluate for the pc.

On the plus side.

1. Providing it is real and you have interest. - Run as an "end of
civilization" engram - with earlier beginning and later
endings.......you blow a tremendous amount of charge, also you get
the sequence of how Civilizations are formed and grown.

2. You can make some nifty friends with your entities.....and often
you can build a powerful spiritual team of entities.

3. You can have weird conversations with your friends.

4. You end up on very strange lists, e-mailing very strange messages,
to very strange people. :-D

Alan

 

[EP - Ethics Particle]

Not even rice and beans...

 

[Veda]

Scientology is the religion of xenu. That is the belief. Not provable fact, belief. Secret belief. You die if you find out! Oh my. Many people belonged to scientology and now say they dont, but from an outside observers position it looks as if you still think just the same way.

If someone comes along and says things that dont fit in your box, bannishment! This board still supports the beliefs that are scientology and cuts out the people who try to wake you up. Xenu is alive and well with you at his feet. You just dont know it.

Search the members list and see who was here the first day. Mil Femma of course, and?

xenus pal.

Wake up people. really. wake up.

You are still xenu slaves.

I'm not sure if I understand your post completely, but I think you're becoming irritated at the wrong people. Alan appears to have been thinking out loud - while sorting through these issues. Neither he, nor his associate, Dart, recommend "OT 3."

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=77423&postcount=9

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=72944&postcount=3

 

[Mark A. Baker]

I'm not sure if I understand your post completely, but I think you're becoming irritated at the wrong people. Alan appears to have been thinking out loud - while sorting through these issues. Neither he, nor his associate, Dart, recommend "OT 3."

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=77423&postcount=9

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=72944&postcount=3

He's BACK.

Leo J -> Joel

aka Wanker.

Mark A. Baker

 

[Hatshepsut]

I was redirected from the Aspectics sight to a book by L. Kin. It is called The Pied Pipers of Heaven. There is a WHOLE background story of Xenu as learned working and auditing under Captain Bill Robertson. It spans universes. I did not get that any background data was ever given on the level. If you google it you will find it under the second link. Read the entire manuscript or search for an interesting chapter in Scribd. Worth while. The major spin is from a very mystic Eastern philosphy point of view weaving The Factors in and 'Games Playing". It takes the 'effect' angle away a bit regarding Xenu's engineering.

 

[Dulloldfart]

There is a WHOLE background story of Xenu as learned working and auditing under Captain Bill Robertson. It spans universes. I did not get that any background data was ever given on the level.)

"Channeled" from Hubbard by CBR, Hubbard wearing his galactic commander hat. Hubbard as Hubbard gave a bit of background on the Class VIII course, tape 10, which is available online. He briefed SO members on the ship too, so I don't know how much of that story comes from Hubbard's personal briefings, how much via CBR's "channeling" and how much was added by Ulrich.

I would suggest ignoring all of it.

Paul

 

[Hatshepsut]

"Channeled" from Hubbard by CBR, Hubbard wearing his galactic commander hat. Hubbard as Hubbard gave a bit of background on the Class VIII course, tape 10, which is available online. He briefed SO members on the ship too, so I don't know how much of that story comes from Hubbard's personal briefings, how much via CBR's "channeling" and how much was added by Ulrich.

I would suggest ignoring all of it.

Paul

Oh my goodness! Are you saying that the author, L. Kin is actually Ulrich Kramer. Shit. I was directed to the 'Mindwalking' site by another poster here on ESMB. I guess she thought I'd pick up on the fact that the two were the same. It did not seem like the owner of the site wrote in the same meter as L. Kin.
Captain Bill does not write like that either. The Pied Pipers book was actually easy to digest and a bit intersting. Damn every time I think I've linked into some bit of light on the matter I get someone else's delusion.

 

[Zinjifar]

Damn every time I think I've linked into some bit of light on the matter I get someone else's delusion.

It's cheaper than custom made

Zinj

 

[Hatshepsut]

It's cheaper than custom made

Zinj

Uh huh..my delusions are free. They don't cost me a dime.
Yeah...and I'm such an epicurean here. I devour viewpoints. A real valence HOG. Will the effect of synthesizing all of it make me well rounded or multi-faceted or just bristley. I once just wanted to be a simple being again.. but I see by my leanings that I really appreciate a smorgasboard of complex things.

Oh, and by the way Zinj, I finally located a copy of That Awesome Strength by C.S. Lewis. Haven't read it yet though.