Mark A. Baker
Sponsor
Yes charge on "in/out" on the 2d is definitely a "hot" item. I know a lot of guys in particular all charged up about 2d out/int.
Mark A. Baker
Out-Int — Fact or Fiction?
- Thread starter Dulloldfart
- Start date
Yes charge on "in/out" on the 2d is definitely a "hot" item. I know a lot of guys in particular all charged up about 2d out/int.
Mark A. Baker
TR'SIN
Patron with Honors
You do have a sense of humor. That's pretty funny. AS IF (?) that might read . . .
Dulloldfart
Squirrel Extraordinaire
All right, you rotten lot, since no-one is going to tell me the "right" way to run Int by Dynamics and I am just starting on that section this very minute I'll invent the way to do it.
Since the dynamics are an arbitrary way of breaking down the whole of life it seems to me that one could possibly do an "Int by Know-to-Mystery-Scale Rundown" or "Int by Tone Scale Rundown" or "Int by _____ Rundown" too. We'll see if it proves to be valuable at all. It will be very little extra work to incorporate other options in like that.
I must say I enjoy not having to get AVC INT OK on this sort of stuff.
EDIT: Wowza. I'm running into a whole bunch of charge on this subject. There are *lots* of possibilities. Suggestions welcome.. The only thing really needed is that the items in a group span all possibilities for that group. One can do Int by Location; Int by Time; Int by Body Type; Int by . . . .
Paul
Since the dynamics are an arbitrary way of breaking down the whole of life it seems to me that one could possibly do an "Int by Know-to-Mystery-Scale Rundown" or "Int by Tone Scale Rundown" or "Int by _____ Rundown" too. We'll see if it proves to be valuable at all. It will be very little extra work to incorporate other options in like that.
I must say I enjoy not having to get AVC INT OK on this sort of stuff.
EDIT: Wowza. I'm running into a whole bunch of charge on this subject. There are *lots* of possibilities. Suggestions welcome.
. The only thing really needed is that the items in a group span all possibilities for that group. One can do Int by Location; Int by Time; Int by Body Type; Int by . . . .Paul
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Dulloldfart
Squirrel Extraordinaire
Just in case it's not clear how this "Int RD by Groups" would work I've listed it out here:
0. Complete or have completed a regular general Int RD of any kind first, along with any needed repair as best you can manage;
1. Decide whether to do the Recall Int RD (Assess Int buttons for hottest button, recalls, flatten hottest flow first, reassess Int buttons) or R3X Int RD (Assess Int buttons for hottest button, engrams, F1, F2, F3, F0, reassess Int buttons); [Note: Recall Int RD = End of Endless Int Repair RD; R3X Int RD = Int RD with engram running]
2. Assess the group of stuff (for example, the Dynamics) to find the hottest item in that group;
3. Assess the 12 Int buttons to find the hottest button with respect to that one item out of the group;
4. Flatten that Int button re that one item;
5. Repeat 3 and 4 until flat for that one group item;
6. Repeat 2 to find the hottest remaining item in the group (there may be none);
7. Do 3 and 4 on the new group item;
8. Repeat until all group items flat, or huge win and EP reached.
Ownership: Of course, ownership issues can be addressed if the user wishes, but only at the beginning. It would be a bit weird, I think, to chop and change in the middle of or throughout an Int RD by Groups.
Paul
0. Complete or have completed a regular general Int RD of any kind first, along with any needed repair as best you can manage;
1. Decide whether to do the Recall Int RD (Assess Int buttons for hottest button, recalls, flatten hottest flow first, reassess Int buttons) or R3X Int RD (Assess Int buttons for hottest button, engrams, F1, F2, F3, F0, reassess Int buttons); [Note: Recall Int RD = End of Endless Int Repair RD; R3X Int RD = Int RD with engram running]
2. Assess the group of stuff (for example, the Dynamics) to find the hottest item in that group;
3. Assess the 12 Int buttons to find the hottest button with respect to that one item out of the group;
4. Flatten that Int button re that one item;
5. Repeat 3 and 4 until flat for that one group item;
6. Repeat 2 to find the hottest remaining item in the group (there may be none);
7. Do 3 and 4 on the new group item;
8. Repeat until all group items flat, or huge win and EP reached.
Ownership: Of course, ownership issues can be addressed if the user wishes, but only at the beginning. It would be a bit weird, I think, to chop and change in the middle of or throughout an Int RD by Groups.
Paul
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RogerB
Crusader
Oh I love it that you have turned on charge in looking at this subject.
It proves you are truly human and one of us . . . . I was beginning to fear you might have been a little bit of a cold fish type . . . but nooo . . . warm, charged blood courses through those veins of yours!
But actually, that "6. Repeat 2 to find the hottest remaining item in the group (there may be none);" is key.
My experience is that we've got way more than "one, the only, greatest, all alone" int/ext button. That is one of the gross errors on the old tech; the think that you are hung up in/with only one "int" or "ext" button. What I've observed is that we've done this out-in-out-in . . . away from here-back to here trick many, many times.
What appears is the case that we might simply be mainly dramatizing one button/vector at this moment . . . that is, probably the last action on the subject. But the fact in my case was that they all got stirred up and made live, and my out-int did not get resolved till I recognized and handled that.
And picking up and handling the intentions involved, I found to be the key.
Rog
It proves you are truly human and one of us . . . . I was beginning to fear you might have been a little bit of a cold fish type . . . but nooo . . . warm, charged blood courses through those veins of yours!
But actually, that "6. Repeat 2 to find the hottest remaining item in the group (there may be none);" is key.
My experience is that we've got way more than "one, the only, greatest, all alone" int/ext button. That is one of the gross errors on the old tech; the think that you are hung up in/with only one "int" or "ext" button. What I've observed is that we've done this out-in-out-in . . . away from here-back to here trick many, many times.
What appears is the case that we might simply be mainly dramatizing one button/vector at this moment . . . that is, probably the last action on the subject. But the fact in my case was that they all got stirred up and made live, and my out-int did not get resolved till I recognized and handled that.
And picking up and handling the intentions involved, I found to be the key.
Rog
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Dulloldfart
Squirrel Extraordinaire
Thanks Rog. Actually, since this bit of this Int Module is somewhat experimental, I can add in your intention thingy easily enough now.
The way I have it set up right now, the client determines his hot group item. For example, if the group is The Dynamics, his hot item with regard to Interiorization this time around might be the 5th Dynamic.
At this point he gets to choose which RD to attack it with. I can just offer a third option, and he gets to choose one out of:
• Next is to assess the 12 Int buttons for hottest button and do Recall Int RD procedure
• Next is to assess the 12 Int buttons for hottest button and do R3X Int RD procedure
• Next is to assess the 12 Int buttons for hottest button and do Repeater Int RD procedure
Having selected which RD procedure to use, he would then assess down the list of Int buttons to find the hottest button right now, so it would go:
With respect to the 5th dynamic, Go in?
With respect to the 5th dynamic, Went in?
. . .
With respect to the 5th dynamic, Pushed in?
Let's say he ends up with the hottest button with respect to the 5th dynamic being "Kicked Out of Spaces."
(Note that logically one could first assess the Int buttons and *then* choose which of the three procedures to use, but logistically I can't set it up like that in PaulsRobot without making it horribly complicated.)
For the Repeater Int RD, maybe the instruction would then be something like, "What intention is connected with this?" and get this articulated (this isn't an L&N item as he can get another crack at the exact same item later if he needs to). And then "Repeat this aloud, and, as best you can, at the same time holographically recreate that exact same intention in present time."
I would suggest Rub & Yawn to help bleed off any charge that appears, but I guess the client could ignore that suggestion if they wish and have a better way of getting off any charge that comes to view.
This would be the alternative to the running of recalls or engrams in the other two approaches. Although quite honestly, there's nothing stopping one mixing and matching if one feels that stuff is being missed.
Once that particular re-creation has flattened, the client would then reassess the Int buttons, and for the hottest one spot what intention is connected with it, run repeater on that intention in the same way as above. And so on until there are no unflat buttons left *for that dynamic*.
Then reassess the dynamics (or whatever the group stuff is) and go through the same procedure, until everything is flat or a huge win makes it impossible to continue.
How does that sound? Guinea-pigging needed before finalization, of course.
Paul
The way I have it set up right now, the client determines his hot group item. For example, if the group is The Dynamics, his hot item with regard to Interiorization this time around might be the 5th Dynamic.
At this point he gets to choose which RD to attack it with. I can just offer a third option, and he gets to choose one out of:
• Next is to assess the 12 Int buttons for hottest button and do Recall Int RD procedure
• Next is to assess the 12 Int buttons for hottest button and do R3X Int RD procedure
• Next is to assess the 12 Int buttons for hottest button and do Repeater Int RD procedure
Having selected which RD procedure to use, he would then assess down the list of Int buttons to find the hottest button right now, so it would go:
With respect to the 5th dynamic, Go in?
With respect to the 5th dynamic, Went in?
. . .
With respect to the 5th dynamic, Pushed in?
Let's say he ends up with the hottest button with respect to the 5th dynamic being "Kicked Out of Spaces."
(Note that logically one could first assess the Int buttons and *then* choose which of the three procedures to use, but logistically I can't set it up like that in PaulsRobot without making it horribly complicated.)
For the Repeater Int RD, maybe the instruction would then be something like, "What intention is connected with this?" and get this articulated (this isn't an L&N item as he can get another crack at the exact same item later if he needs to). And then "Repeat this aloud, and, as best you can, at the same time holographically recreate that exact same intention in present time."
I would suggest Rub & Yawn to help bleed off any charge that appears, but I guess the client could ignore that suggestion if they wish and have a better way of getting off any charge that comes to view.
This would be the alternative to the running of recalls or engrams in the other two approaches. Although quite honestly, there's nothing stopping one mixing and matching if one feels that stuff is being missed.
Once that particular re-creation has flattened, the client would then reassess the Int buttons, and for the hottest one spot what intention is connected with it, run repeater on that intention in the same way as above. And so on until there are no unflat buttons left *for that dynamic*.
Then reassess the dynamics (or whatever the group stuff is) and go through the same procedure, until everything is flat or a huge win makes it impossible to continue.
How does that sound? Guinea-pigging needed before finalization, of course.
Paul
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TR'SIN
Patron with Honors
Hummm interesting enough that I keep coming back and reading all you have to offer D O F. and Roger keeps poking hishead up with equally relevent thoughts. Thanks for thinking it out guys.
It is rather pedestrian after you've discovered all the "ins" and "outs"
(just for fun).
But, I think you've hit on something quite germane to the issue Dulloldfart - the expansiveness of this charged area has been limited by using just the IN-EXT RD as a cureall/endall. And you've develed rather deeply. Thanks Paul you can be fun at times.
It is rather pedestrian after you've discovered all the "ins" and "outs"
(just for fun). But, I think you've hit on something quite germane to the issue Dulloldfart - the expansiveness of this charged area has been limited by using just the IN-EXT RD as a cureall/endall. And you've develed rather deeply. Thanks Paul you can be fun at times.
Panda Termint
Cabal Of One
I'm not sure exactly how it's supposed to be run, Paul.
I'd assume that the "Standard Tech" way would be to do an Assessment by TA; get the pc to discuss each Dynamic in his/her own words and take up the one which produced the most Tone Arm action. (Watch for and note reading items during the assessment.)
(How you would do this without a meter is a different problem but one possible solution is probably just to get the person to consider each Dynamic by reading definitions of same and observing which one which one grabs the immediate interest.)
Find the hottest Dynamic and from there it's open slather, as you've proposed.
I may well be wrong but, IMO, Int By Dynamics is an unusual solution mostly applicable to certain people with specific fixations, it's not a one-size-fits all thing.
I'd assume that the "Standard Tech" way would be to do an Assessment by TA; get the pc to discuss each Dynamic in his/her own words and take up the one which produced the most Tone Arm action. (Watch for and note reading items during the assessment.)
(How you would do this without a meter is a different problem but one possible solution is probably just to get the person to consider each Dynamic by reading definitions of same and observing which one which one grabs the immediate interest.)
Find the hottest Dynamic and from there it's open slather, as you've proposed.
I may well be wrong but, IMO, Int By Dynamics is an unusual solution mostly applicable to certain people with specific fixations, it's not a one-size-fits all thing.
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Dulloldfart
Squirrel Extraordinaire
I think you're right about that. When I have it online I am not going to describe it as applicable to everyone, simply available if anyone wants to give it a whack.
Paul
Panda Termint
Cabal Of One
Great, let me know when it's up.
BTW, I added a sentence to my post above after you posted your response.
BTW, I added a sentence to my post above after you posted your response.
Dulloldfart
Squirrel Extraordinaire
Oh I will, don't worry.
Thanks for pointing it out as I would have missed it. It's a very interesting subject, actually — how to assess a subject for charge.
In regular Scn there are basically two meter methods: assessment by instant read, and slow assessment by TA (or whatever its proper name is). Coupled with that is pc interest as a deciding factor. In PaulsRobot there is no meter used, so how to do it?
Personally, if I am researching something and checking it for charge, I give it a whack with Rub & Yawn. I put my full attention on it, mock it up holographically, manipulate that imagery in various ways, and talk aloud about it (to the wall or whatever), all while rubbing vigorously. If a topic can survive a minute of that onslaught with no discharge at all then I *know* there is no charge anywhere near the area that is available at that time.
But for someone who is not such a devotee of Rub & Yawn? I would suggest just talking aloud about the item for ten seconds or so, like one would with an assessment by TA, is sufficient to see if it is charged. If it is heavily charged, one's voice will catch, emotion will well up, etc., but even if it is less charged I think one would notice within 20 seconds.
Paul
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Dulloldfart
Squirrel Extraordinaire
duplicate
RogerB
Crusader
Thanks Rog. Actually, since this bit of this Int Module is somewhat experimental, I can add in your intention thingy easily enough now.
The way I have it set up right now, the client determines his hot group item. For example, if the group is The Dynamics, his hot item with regard to Interiorization this time around might be the 5th Dynamic.
Yes, Panda's note and your response as to "how to assess" without a meter is good. It would have to be done by "interest" and client perception of "feelings."
Also, "out/int" would likely be an unknown concept to folks who've never been in Scn . . . so I suspect an explanation of the phenomena and its related consequences would be very beneficial. It'd also help them "feel" the forces and charge that can manifest.
Bottom line in my view is that "ext" and "int" is not really an in or out of body issue. Though that can be a PT expression, or a trigger of, the more basic spiritual phenomena of being present "here" or "in" fixedly or being "elsewhere" or "out of here" fixedly.
Dulloldfart said:
I don't recall all of the 12 Int buttons (you got them handy? to save me trying to find them?) I suspect there may be benefit in adding some further items that will be more specific to the spiritual phenomena.
Dulloldfart said:
I would prefer a question worded as: "Connected to . . . . ?"
And if we add some questions to actually get the intentions, the "int buttons" would form a question as this:
"Connected to . . . . are you going in?"
"Connected to . . . . are you trying to get in?"
"Connected to . . . . are you going out or getting out?"
"Connected to . . . . trying to get out or get away?"
Though I must say an out/int R/D by Dynamics doesn't "resonate" with me . . . maybe because I'm sort of out of that kind of case level/scenario.
Dulloldfart said:
I would use/ask the question this way: "Connected to (area) what intention or intentions are you carrying out (or implementing . . . your choice
) ?" I used the plural as well s the singular so as to avoid the trap of trying to find the "only one right answer." This way they client can get the answer or all of the answers.Dulloldfart said:
Not done "Rub and Yawn" . . . too busy with my other stuff . . . so I defer to you on that one
But I suspect that for your average non-Scn public rub and yawn will be the preferred and more effective way to reduce the charge than any recall or R3X or R3R type action.
Rog
Div6
Crusader
I count 30 Int buttons from the Solo Nots materials.
I haven't seen the latest 53, but there were 9 buttons on it at one point:
Went in
Go in
Can't get in
Want to get out
Want out
Kicked out of Spaces
In too solidly
Totally identified with
Can't leave
Int is a REMEDY. Until a person can confront the Whole Track and determine correct ownership, it is best to just cool off the hot restim and let them get on with it....
I haven't seen the latest 53, but there were 9 buttons on it at one point:
Went in
Go in
Can't get in
Want to get out
Want out
Kicked out of Spaces
In too solidly
Totally identified with
Can't leave
Int is a REMEDY. Until a person can confront the Whole Track and determine correct ownership, it is best to just cool off the hot restim and let them get on with it....
RogerB
Crusader
As Div6 wrote: "Int is a REMEDY. Until a person can confront the Whole Track and determine correct ownership, it is best to just cool off the hot restim and let them get on with it....
I'd say there is merit in that.
Any who are brave enough, and aware enough as cases to handle the "real deal" can go for gold, otherwise it will be a repair and/or de-accessing, de-restim action for most.
R
Dulloldfart
Squirrel Extraordinaire
I'm aiming at a Scn crowd with this one and the other Scn modules (Exp ARC S/W, Exp Grade 0 etc.). I wouldn't expect non-Scios to be particularly interested and I don't think I would deliberately steer them in the direction of purely Scn material anyway.
What I am currently saying there is:
• It is not obvious what is meant by Interiorization and Exteriorization with regard to a spiritual being and his/her body. The simplistic view that a being pops in and out of the body like a golf ball dropping into the cup and being picked out of it is not accurate.
• What *is* true is that many people have had various pains and pressures and difficulties with auditing relieved by addressing and handling the subject of "Int."
• It is probably true to say that:
• • Exteriorization is the action of the being changing his condition with regard to the body to a status more outside the body than before; and
• • Interiorization is the action of the being changing his status with regard to the body to one more inside the body than before.
• So this PaulsRobot Int section is very short of theory, but it does contain the regular Scn procedures, as far as they can be done in the Robot paradigm.
-----
I should probably amend that a bit as I wrote it before getting into all the Int RD by Groups stuff. I need to up my reality on having Int problems with bodies and other items in order to write something properly that is within my reality and understanding. For now I might just change the words "with regard to the body" to "with regard to the body or something else" and leave it vague like that, although I am always open to suggestion.
Without getting inventive in the least, I am using the standard 12:
GO IN
WENT IN
PUT IN
INTERIORIZED INTO SOMETHING
WANT TO GO IN
CAN'T GET IN
KICKED OUT OF SPACES
CAN'T GO IN
BEING TRAPPED
FORCED IN
PULLED IN
PUSHED IN
As I said, I have been trying to follow the regular Scn procedures as much as possible with this, at least for the Recall Int RD (End of Endless Int Repair RD) and R3X Int RD (Int RD with Engram Running). On that last, it is impossible to have an engram-running module at PaulsRobot that works without using R3X because of the anaten factor and the severe limitations of regular R3R sending the pc down the track hunting for earlier similar incidents instead of waiting for one (if it exists) to come up into PT for him as the topic discharges.
I'm getting a bit more lax with Int RD by Groups, including Int by Dynamics, as the RD is not well known at all anyway and will be a novelty to most. And while I'm at it, I'll throw in your (Rog's) Repeater Int RD for good measure, and since that one will be completely new anyway I don't see why I can't add more buttons to that one, but not the first two (Recall Int RD and R3X Int RD).
OK, but remember I'm not going for an instant-read type response here, more of a slow-assessment-by-TA type response. I think the latter is needed to get the client to chew over the meaning of it more than posing the simple question and nothing else, especially in the responses a long list being read at the individual's own pace from the screen would elicit.
Yeah. But this isn't a one-size-fits-all rundown that you have to do in order to get into Heaven. It's totally optional. If it looks interesting to the client, give it a whack, and if not, don't. It's not a big deal. I've got 25+ other modules to play around with. It's not like it costs $500 an hour and needs OK from Snr C/S Int first.
I would use/ask the question this way: "Connected to (area) what intention or intentions are you carrying out (or implementing . . . your choice
OK, thanks.
Not done "Rub and Yawn" . . . too busy with my other stuff . . . so I defer to you on that one
But I suspect that for your average non-Scn public rub and yawn will be the preferred and more effective way to reduce the charge than any recall or R3X or R3R type action.
I agree, but as I said, the Scn modules are aimed at a Scn public. The explanations are deliberately written in Scn lingo, although they would still be intelligible to a non-Scio should he stray into one by mistake.
Thanks for all the help Rog.
Paul
Dulloldfart
Squirrel Extraordinaire
What's the difference between CAN'T GET IN and CAN'T GO IN? They seem synonymous to me.
Any offers?
Paul
Any offers?
Paul
RogerB
Crusader
I think you're right, Mate. It's probably just a bloody Hubbardism thing
Though, it may be that the different wordings register with some and not with others.R
RogerB
Crusader
This is shaping up nicely, Paul.
On the wording in red above, that you're doing a think on ("with regard to the body or something else") I would suggest the following, based on the point that one of the factors involved in the "out/int" problem phenomena is that the thetan is compulsively trying to orient itself . . . either in or out
See if this wording works, even if wordy: "with regard to the body or something else you are orienting yourself to."
As to any assessment by an experienced ex-Scn off the meter, they will certainly feel the "intentions" when they hit the live ones as they do contain force. And what is perceived is the charged ridge or turbulence caused by the intention's force colliding with the whatever is stopping the intention from being fulfilled.
The other out/int buttons, being more in the vein of significance or labels may not give as much sensation or pain.
When I am coaching my clients, they are off the meter. But we are discussing case, either by going over their solo session worksheets or in general terms. And in these 2-way comm scenarios, I can assure you they do feel these items . . . interestingly enough, the items that are most easily missed by them are the "thought" type, significance type items. Intentions and moods and charge are tremendously real to them, and they often will tell me so in no uncertain terms.
The "thought" type items, as I said, they often miss them as they are so familiar with them and they appear so usual that the client sails on past them. I usually handle this by close observation in client indicators (they change, color, body demeanor etc.) and simply ask "Is (statement/thought expressed) an item you need to address?"
And it often turns out, that when their attention is directed to it by the question . . . . Oh yes, it is something they get gains from by addressing it.
R
