OZ Minor Party Statement re Inquiry

Cherished

Silver Meritorious Patron
Friday, November 27, 2009

Thank you for your email regarding Senator Nick Xenophon and his Adjournment speech about Scientology.

The Coalition vigorously supports religious freedom and the due process of law, as well as freedom of speech.

Senate committees are an important part of the process of law-making but should not try to act as de facto law enforcers.

Whilst the Parliament is an appropriate forum to air issues of concern, an issue such as Senator Xenophon’s allegations require great care in respect of stereotyping members of an organisation or indeed the organisation itself.

At the same time, individuals who feel aggrieved by this or any other organisation also have the right to state their case and be heard, as do spokespersons and members who wish to mount a defence against accusations.

The Coalition unequivocably supports the thorough investigation of any alleged criminal activity and the right of our citizens to conduct their lives in peace in accord with the law and their personal choices.

My view is that the allegations of illegalilty should be referred to the appropriate authority for investigation, and if appropriate for prosecution. It would be unwise to have a Senate Inquiry before the appropriate authority had the opportunity to deal with the allegations.

Thank you for your concern and taking the trouble to make contact. If I can help in any other way, please let me know.

Yours sincerely

Eric Abetz

Deputy Leader of the Opposition in the Senate

Shadow Minister for Innovation, Industry,

Science and Research

Liberal Senator for Tasmania
. Posted at http://forums.whyweprotest.net/318-...gy/oz-minor-party-statement-re-inquiry-57396/
 

Cherished

Silver Meritorious Patron
I think there's more to it than he's saying. I think this is a convenient excuse. Because not all of the issues can be resolved by the criminal justice system. Even without the complexity that we're talking about an organisation that willingly suborns perjury and destroys evidence, making criminal prosecution very, very difficult, some of the issues involved are just not police matters.

I have an idea why he and the Libs might not want an inquiry. I don't want to say what that is. They may just need some hand-holding.
 

anon2487

Patron with Honors
Thanks.

I can't comment on most of what you've said, because I've got no meaningful understanding of the Aus political landscape.

...Because not all of the issues can be resolved by the criminal justice system...
This for me, is the reason that a Senate Inquiry is essential.

Hopefully in the intervening period, we can get this aspect across more powerfully.
 

Carmel

Crusader
Well, the coalition will probably have a new leader by Monday, so let's see what goes, and then act accordingly to point out the difference between a police invest and an Inquiry (hmm - like they don't know the difference already)
 

scooter

Gold Meritorious Patron
I think all the Coalition MPs and senators are being extremely careful right now - they're usually like that just before a bloodletting.:D

Once the bodies have been removed and the victors announced, all will be fine and they'll again start thinking about the people they're supposed to represent.:thumbsup:

Then we'll have more of their attention methinks. :yes:
 

Carmel

Crusader
I think all the Coalition MPs and senators are being extremely careful right now - they're usually like that just before a bloodletting.:D

Once the bodies have been removed and the victors announced, all will be fine and they'll again start thinking about the people they're supposed to represent.:thumbsup:

Then we'll have more of their attention methinks. :yes:
Exactly Scoots. Xen was wise to defer the vote.
 

Pooks

MERCHANT OF CHAOS
Isn't Wendy Honnor from Tasmania?

She may have some personal pull with this guy.
 

scooter

Gold Meritorious Patron
Nic's from South Australia and I seriously doubt that Wendy has personal pull with anybody outside the cult.

PR "Tech" just doesn't cut it with media-savvy politicians nor their advisors these days.
 

Carmel

Crusader
A bunch of us have had the same letter back from Senator Eric Abetz now.

His argument for not having a Senate Inquiry is full of holes, and he would know that. A senate Inquiry is different to a police investigastigation, and BOTH are needed.

Yes, a police invest is needed......it has started already, but the Senator would be well aware of the fact that a Senate Inquiry has different perameters, and that the two would go hand in hand.....each with their different purposes and functions.

Don't be fobbed off. It's political PR crap. Google the two (if you need to), and you'll see the difference between an Inquiry and a police investigation.

Can those who have received this response, please respond.

Thanks,
C

PS: I haven't responded to him yet. I'm just gonna chill a little first, then gather everything and anything I can, related to his "argument", in an effort to blow it apart.
 

scientrollogy

Patron with Honors
here's my effort - did i miss anything?
Dear Senator Abetz

Firstly, I know that I'm not one of your constituents, however any final
decision over Scientology in Austalia does heve ramifications in the UK,
since they use their tax free status gained there to avoid taxes over
here. So I beseech you to at least read on.

I read one of your email responses on our forum, and I write to point
out there is a world of difference between a few identified individuals
being brought to book in your court system, and a decision regarding the
whole of the business that is Scientology, including it's many
fraudulent front groups.

Hidden within their buildings is a mass of orders, advices and opinions
written by the late L Ron Hubbard, which are divided into three distinct
catagories.

"Public", the least offensive of all, merely being mind control and
financial fraud. They run couses such as TR-L - "How to Lie Effectivly"

"Sea-Organisation" - (SO) -Once defrauded and deprived of all property,
a "Public" victim is often recruited into the Sea-Organisation, which is
totally under the control of the CMO. During membership of this Sea Org,
a person lives at a Sea-Org building, eats Sea-Org food, and lives the
Sea-Org life, which is a pretty miserable affair. This is where the
forced abortions, imprisonment and all that Sen Xenophon spoke about
takes place, often under direct orders from a CMO person. There are Sea
Org units in Australia.

"Commodores Messenger Organisation" (CMO) - this is the top controlling
group within the cult, who have access to all those highly offensive
orders, which are obeyed as if they were in fact the Law - many of these
directly contravene many Laws in any part of the civilized world -
including Australia.

Scientology is like MacDonalds in the respect, being as identical as
possible the whole world over. They run a deliberate policy of moving
Sea Org members to any country other than thier own, in order that a
person is more isolated and cut off from support or escape.

So if this sounds like a picture of a "Church" to yourself, carry on
opposing an inquiry, if however you think that the above sounds like an
organisation Australia could do without, please, let's have the
skeletons out of the cupboard, what harm can it do?

Yours sincerely

David Ceptimous
xxxxx xxxxxxxx
xxxxxx
xxx
xxxxxx

Downloadable reports
http://scientologyinfo.freehostia.com
 

Royal Prince Xenu

Trust the Psi Corps.
A bunch of us have had the same letter back from Senator Eric Abetz now.

His argument for not having a Senate Inquiry is full of holes, and he would know that. A senate Inquiry is different to a police investigastigation, and BOTH are needed.

Yes, a police invest is needed......it has started already, but the Senator would be well aware of the fact that a Senate Inquiry has different perameters, and that the two would go hand in hand.....each with their different purposes and functions.

Don't be fobbed off. It's political PR crap. Google the two (if you need to), and you'll see the difference between an Inquiry and a police investigation.

Can those who have received this response, please respond.

Thanks,
C

PS: I haven't responded to him yet. I'm just gonna chill a little first, then gather everything and anything I can, related to his "argument", in an effort to blow it apart.

I have not received this reply yet, although I have received a personal reply from Sen. Brown (pro-inquiry), and Mr Xenophon.

Nick Minchin has just resigned from the coalition over the carbon-emissions legislation so, as Carmel says, the Coalition line-up on Monday could be completely different.

I eagerly await a reply as quoted above. As a piece of writing it's about as sharp as a chemistry teacher's cardigan--and it has bigger holes than said cardigan having been knitted on broom handles.

Carmel, you will run rings around him. May you be so swift and light, that said rings look like a halo.
 

Cherished

Silver Meritorious Patron
Nic's from South Australia and I seriously doubt that Wendy has personal pull with anybody outside the cult.

PR "Tech" just doesn't cut it with media-savvy politicians nor their advisors these days.

I think Pooks means maybe Wendy has some "pull" with Eric Abetz. I don't know, but I bet he received her "oh, no there's going to be a holocaust-like situation if you allow an inquiry" letter, and a lot more besides.

His sentence about not stereotyping persons or any organisation smells to me as if he's been listening to that kind of representation.

I'm very interested to know if any of you exes ever wrote such letters - and do you think that the Oz scientologists are genuinely scared that they are being targeted by a "hate" campaign? Or do you think many of them are using it as a cynical manipulative strategy?
 

Royal Prince Xenu

Trust the Psi Corps.
I think Pooks means maybe Wendy has some "pull" with Eric Abetz. I don't know, but I bet he received her "oh, no there's going to be a holocaust-like situation if you allow an inquiry" letter, and a lot more besides.

His sentence about not stereotyping persons or any organisation smells to me as if he's been listening to that kind of representation.

I'm very interested to know if any of you exes ever wrote such letters - and do you think that the Oz scientologists are genuinely scared that they are being targeted by a "hate" campaign? Or do you think many of them are using it as a cynical manipulative strategy?

Yes, Cherished. We all wrote letter like this, and we all took any attack as a personal affront to freedom of "speech and religion". That is OSA's main strategy--the "Church" is but one entity, but if you break it down into individuals and throw in a few fictitious ones as well, you make that "Church" entity look bigger.

It's perfectly OK that $cn pokes fun at Christian beliefs but when someone pokes fun at $cn, it's war!
 
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Carmel

Crusader
<snip>

I'm very interested to know if any of you exes ever wrote such letters - and do you think that the Oz scientologists are genuinely scared that they are being targeted by a "hate" campaign? Or do you think many of them are using it as a cynical manipulative strategy?
I didn't write such letters, but I do know that many Oz scientologists think that they are being targeted by a "hate campaign".

With some fence sitters but mostly scientologists, I am getting "Why have you gone public on this? There are other ways". They don't get it. They see the outpoints, but don't want to see what they have found favourable or perceivable as positive with Scn, go down the drain and be lost. They want change, but not at the cost of losing all they have supported and dreamed of for a long time now. They don't understand that what we are objecting to is not their beliefs or hopes and dreams, or purposes....but rather something insidious, which at this time they are oblivious to. :bigcry:

I get where they are coming from. A year and a half ago I wanted reform. I didn't want to see Scientology lost or gone. The thought of it scared the shit out of me back then, and I would have had the same reaction as some of my old mates are having now. :sad:

By the same token though, even back then, I wouldn't have lied or bullshitted as Wendy has in her letter, to protect the church.
 

moarxenu

Patron with Honors
Well, the coalition will probably have a new leader by Monday, so let's see what goes, and then act accordingly to point out the difference between a police invest and an Inquiry (hmm - like they don't know the difference already)

Actually, I only have a general idea of the difference between a police investigation and a Parliamentary Inquiry.

It would be extremely useful for you and others to specify exactly what the difference is so we have talking points to write about after the expected change in the Coalition next week.

Thanks!
 

hartley

Patron with Honors
With some fence sitters but mostly scientologists, I am getting "Why have you gone public on this? There are other ways".
The answer to that is "so what are you doing about it"? It's there in big bold instructions in the Church, if you find outpoints you MUST act at once or you yourself are at fault. Sitting on your ass waiting for someone else to do something is not an option.

But that leads into what they really don't want to think about - that they are culties trapped in a minature '1984' who can't think straight.
 
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