People of Colour ...

Enthetan

Master of Disaster
For the most part I have - I've multiple properties, new degrees, several hustles, a primary+secondary romantic partners (who know each other + are friends), etc. ... life is good!

However as someone who moved from SO to Social Scientist I can tell you that's not how trauma/triggers work.

Triggers are simultaneously specific + morphous - For example you're humming along, great day and then someone says something racist/homophobic similar to something in scientology policy or what someone said to you in scientology. Real life example you're visiting friends/family in {country X} and you hear someone call an Asian person a "Wog." Now all of a sudden you feel ill, angry ... did you hear that right? is that fucker a scilon following you? no they're some older woman being racist, then you feel angry because well you're part-Asian and wog is a horrible term to call someone. You tell her that wog is racist and the only people still regularly using it are members of the cult of scientology, she gives you the two-finger-salut and you move to another cabin. As the Millennials like to say - "It be like that sometimes" or us GenX'ers "shit happens." You feel shitty until 2 hours later you find a really good + cheap all you can eat Greek place by the wharf, but then you feel a different kind of shitty but that just needs a short loo trip and you're good again ;)

TBH, even your telling me to "just move on with your life" though well intentioned is a microagression, a very small one but one nonetheless. It belittles my pain because your pain or your perception if what was horrible about scientology is different than mine. Yes we were all fucked over by it but in different ways, and different shitty things felt more or less shitty to the people experiencing them based on their own previous experiences (good+bad) elsewhere. My pain being different doesn't in any way lessen your or other's pain at scientology or any other cults hands, or other types of racism or other types of sexism.

However we each have a right to look intersectionally + specifically how it {scientology alone or not} fucked us over. How different sub-groups got fucked over - it's part of how many of us heal. In the end people have to process this shit in their own way, at their own pace and sometime you have to re-process shit. Sometimes you find out years later something you thought you were good on triggers if {X} is in the environment, one is in essence constantly re-training and working one's peace of mind.

In essence this is also why scilon "auditing" does the opposite of what it claims (it creates/stimulates more triggers from real pain + false memories) and frankly I think that's what Hubbard actually wanted as the end product. Depressed people faking psycho-happy so he could work us to death for his fun+profit. But this isn't the thread for that. Frankly with the snark level here I don't think this is even the Forum for it.

https://patientsrising.org/what-is-spoonie/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microaggression - and I'm GenX but age isn't why it's going back to school to study various sciences where I heard it, and the concept was actually posited in 1973 by an MIT Ph.D as "micro-inequities" though it didn't reach colloquial penetration until Millennials made it popular in a Tumblr.

Also yes, I leave this Forum for months at a time - it's low priority since other forums/threads have less snark, more kindness and a willingness to look at others points of views/perspectives on scientology/cults. For example Leah+Mike's show, exscnkids, etc. Even the discussions on Twitter/IG seem to be a better outlet for me understanding others bad scn/cult experiences and/or other traumatic experiences as well as their good experiences post-cult. Plus work+otherwork+side hustle+two partners, occasional illness flareups, etc. Coming on here every few months 2-6 seems to be enough to answer PMs and skim the important things.
Cool. Glad you are getting on with life.

RE: micro aggression and the entire idea that someone considering himself in one or more intersectional categories means others are under obligation to avoid triggering their psychic minefields: I don't subscribe to that.
 

The_Fixer

Class Clown
His presentation is rather complicated and difficult to sort out.

For example,
1. has he ever done a simple presentation on why we have inner-city black crime in the U.S. ?
2. has he ever done a talk on the topic of "white flight" from residential areas?
Not that I know of. He's a grad student, so he's just starting off his journey.

Thomas Sowell would be a good source for information on that.
Exactly, Pirate!

Thomas Sowell and Larry Elder will tell you that the welfare caused almost all of this.

White Flight is the exodus from an area that has become welfare infected.

Be alert of your university teachings. Most will teach you leftist ideals.

Us tradies have a saying. You've done your apprenticeship now. Now it is time for you to go and learn your trade..

Which simply means you have to look beyond your teachings and learn more.
 
Cool. Glad you are getting on with life.

RE: micro aggression and the entire idea that someone considering himself in one or more intersectional categories means others are under obligation to avoid triggering their psychic minefields: I don't subscribe to that.
I do, in most circumstances - mainly because of evolutional theory. When we were in tribal cultures under most circumstances we did adhere to that level of sensitivity to others and frankly the brain hasn't changed much since then though the culture+technology has pulled us slowly apart. Only since the advent of the internet are we being pulled back together again. I think both are true, we should endeavor to have more control of our reactions and others should try harder to be sensitive to the viewpoints of others they live/work/interact with.

In any case all of us non-white/NB+female/LGBT, marginalized etc. people are constantly trying to avoid pissing off or even just being misunderstood by the mainsteam (see codeswitching as an example) we're tired and it should be even. We are all part of the same human race and everyone should have to stetch their cultural brains too. It's selfish of the mainstream to put the majority of work on the marginalized and frankly increasing the ability to see things from other viewpoints is good for a brain anyways (increases plasticity = better chance at avoiding alzheimers/etc.). Really don't take it from me or a millennial Tumblr - read some scientists/historians who've studied these things - Dean Falk, Agustín Fuentes, Stephen Jay Gould, David Williams, Ijeoma Oluo, Paul Ekman and Oliver Sacks, plus texts/studies on things like sociology of racism, neuroscience on trauma, epigenetics of slavery, etc.

Anyways I'm tapping out of this tread because the rest of the people in here are just being snarky towards me in marginalizing ways and well I'm in startup mode so ain't got time for that
 
Exactly, Pirate!

Thomas Sowell and Larry Elder will tell you that the welfare caused almost all of this.
White Flight is the exodus from an area that has become welfare infected.
Be alert of your university teachings. Most will teach you leftist ideals.
Us tradies have a saying. You've done your apprenticeship now. Now it is time for you to go and learn your trade..
Which simply means you have to look beyond your teachings and learn more.

Well actually I had my first masters before scn, and went back after to study new and better things, particularly in the sciences. It's not that I'm "new" so much as re-calibrating post leaving the cult. I've numerous awards in my pre-scn fields and am merging my newer education with my older knowledge to create something new. However I'm not new to these things. I experienced many of these things first hand simply by growing up as a LGBT+WOC - survived growing up in a project housing, being shot at by gangmembers, being molested by my father, etc. scientology/SeaOrg is only a small part of the shit/trauma I've experienced. It's not merely academic to me, it's my life experience! I've not only looked beyond the intial teachings but circled back at an older age for more teachings (after dozens of years working + 3 in SeaOrg), whilst still critiquing those who are teaching me (in class even) often changing their minds. Even changed a well known scientific associations stances on certain things. It's like herding cats? I think it's easier to get WDC scn to approve a campaign than the Exec Board of a scientific association, and yet I've managed both. Sorry not sorry but 20+ PhD's are as stubborn a one McCabbage, but thankfully a ton more bright. Lucky for me getting stubborn people I work with to agree to trying new things is sort of my speciality, it's something no matter the field been doing since single digits. So to me each is a continuation not a "new" career.

In most concepts science leans what in America views is "left" but in other countries hold as plainly true. American conservatives in particular believe a lot of stuff which has been proven wrong by science but aren't willing to adapt their versions of conservatism like say Swiss or Singaporean conservatives are to new truths. Part of this is because we have a woefully scientifically under-educated/illiterate population. Either we'll all die out soon due to climate change or American conservatism will adapt like it's European+Asian counterparts or die to a growing Libertarianism. Or worst it will win and well end up in something akin to Handmaids Tale, but if it looks that way my primary partner and I will be moving to somewhere where even conservatives don't reject science.

Like I said, to the other guy, don't take it from me or the Tumblr - read the scientists & fields I mentioned. Read them and form your own opinions. read both sides, read all the studies not just Elder or others quoted by Fox News. Okay now I really do have to tap out - it's like 3am here.
 

I told you I was trouble

Suspended animation
Anyways I'm tapping out of this tread because the rest of the people in here are just being snarky towards me in marginalizing ways and well I'm in startup mode so ain't got time for that

Yeah ... you are so important that we're all sitting in rows jeering and attempting to 'marginalize' you ... for fun!

We are.

We really, really are.

Yawn.
 

The_Fixer

Class Clown
Well actually I had my first masters before scn, and went back after to study new and better things, particularly in the sciences. It's not that I'm "new" so much as re-calibrating post leaving the cult. I've numerous awards in my pre-scn fields and am merging my newer education with my older knowledge to create something new. However I'm not new to these things. I experienced many of these things first hand simply by growing up as a LGBT+WOC - survived growing up in a project housing, being shot at by gangmembers, being molested by my father, etc. scientology/SeaOrg is only a small part of the shit/trauma I've experienced. It's not merely academic to me, it's my life experience! I've not only looked beyond the intial teachings but circled back at an older age for more teachings (after dozens of years working + 3 in SeaOrg), whilst still critiquing those who are teaching me (in class even) often changing their minds. Even changed a well known scientific associations stances on certain things. It's like herding cats? I think it's easier to get WDC scn to approve a campaign than the Exec Board of a scientific association, and yet I've managed both. Sorry not sorry but 20+ PhD's are as stubborn a one McCabbage, but thankfully a ton more bright. Lucky for me getting stubborn people I work with to agree to trying new things is sort of my speciality, it's something no matter the field been doing since single digits. So to me each is a continuation not a "new" career.

In most concepts science leans what in America views is "left" but in other countries hold as plainly true. American conservatives in particular believe a lot of stuff which has been proven wrong by science but aren't willing to adapt their versions of conservatism like say Swiss or Singaporean conservatives are to new truths. Part of this is because we have a woefully scientifically under-educated/illiterate population. Either we'll all die out soon due to climate change or American conservatism will adapt like it's European+Asian counterparts or die to a growing Libertarianism. Or worst it will win and well end up in something akin to Handmaids Tale, but if it looks that way my primary partner and I will be moving to somewhere where even conservatives don't reject science.

Like I said, to the other guy, don't take it from me or the Tumblr - read the scientists & fields I mentioned. Read them and form your own opinions. read both sides, read all the studies not just Elder or others quoted by Fox News. Okay now I really do have to tap out - it's like 3am here.
Hey, slow down! It's okay.

With all that, how the hell did you get tangled up with scientology? WOC= Women of Color? Oh, okay, I think I get it now. If you have a host of tertiary qualifications, you should certainly spot it.

I was a full blown leftie until recently. I now believe that lefties reject science and statistics, not the other way around. A lot of the activist groups and the rhetoric they spout should point at it.

Having said that. I'm not a full blown right winger either. Maybe it's a process, or it's the way I'm going to be. I dunno yet.

But from where I am, the lefties are completely fucking it up and hoodwinking us in the process. There's still a lot to go through, but I'm looking and working through it all. I see so much crap now and it's the lefties that are selling it.

All I can say is not to trust a word they are telling you and check every fact and statistic for yourself. In its entirety. And that includes the right wingers thinking. Remember that most activist's purpose is to mislead you. So check everything they say for yourself.

Lefties claim Che Guervara as their symbol of freedom. He had all gays executed and supressed any form of freedom of speech. Just for starters. Hero, much? But it is typical of the claims being offered by the left.

Like I hinted at before, have you learned your trade yet?
 

guanoloco

As-Wased
Not only another victim but one who's traded one cult for another.

Here's the best caveat:

More shocking still, to ask for evidence of this systemic and universal racism of white people is itself problematic. As the students of Evergreen shout at Bret, they don’t need evidence of racism because they live it every day—thus, a request for evidence denies the reality of their lived experience and is construed as further racism.
https://areomagazine.com/2019/03/15...ss-rage-and-entitlement-at-evergreen-college/

The only aggressions that exist today, micro or otherwise, are stacked up against culture from the quote - unquote marginalized people and the LGBQTIA putsch in particular.

There's such an overwhelming amount of evidence that absolutely shreds systemic racism, white privilege, marginalized groups w/o power that only someone who is blinded by their cultish indoctrination can't see it. The entire case surrounding Jussie Smollett and now Kim Foxx are perfect examples that shred the theories of power and rape culture and marginalized blacks and oppressed homosexuals and "woc".

What we really have isn't black vs white or man vs woman but progressive vs conservative in terms of privilege.

There are plenty of homosexual, lesbian, male, female, black and white conservatives who all agree that microaggressions and marginalizations and systemic racism and rape culture don't exist and haven't ever or for some time.

Scientology was a belief system that put zero emphasis or focus on the body despite anything Hubbard claimed in private. The bulk of the Hubbard examples given for racism most Scientologists never see or are aware of. A very brief time in and amongst auditors will quickly lay bare the stories of PCs being all sorts of races and sexes in past lives. Scientology, if anything, teaches one to view the body as a prison cell and a device to denigrate the thetan. To go OT is to escape the body. Male, female, black, white who cares? In a group trained to view the body as an impediment as such with interiorizations and trying to establish stable exteriorization the idea that black bodies and the thetans that operated them were somehow thought less of by the same group is laughable.

But to question that and ask for examples is...get this...racist.

That's a nice caveat...sort of like having an "open mind" in Scientology or asking for demonstrations of OT ability. That's a parlor trick...a microaggression.

Here's something I've witnessed in Scientology.

It's true that you get what you validate. I've seen people who were perfectly fine and OK soon display physical malady upon being informed that they were Red Tagged.

If you're so racist that you view everything through the race lens then all things will be racist. To ask for examples of racism then become racism.

This is so bad that now women can levy severe claims against men that have severe penalties attached but when society asks for evidence it's like "being raped all over again". We're supposed to just believe the accuser.

"triggers", "microaggressions", "oppressors", "oppressed", "marginalized", "power", "sytemic", "institutionalized", "intersectionality" are all going to be as valid and have as much influence as you, personally, believe. Exactly like the "red tag" phenomenon.

Telling people to be stoic and handle their own issues or that they're responsible for their own condition means that the teller is now racist.

That's Scientology.

WOC have more power than anyone in today's world and it's very true that power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. The more WOC that open their mouths and push their weight the more corruption takes place. True justice would correct corruption.

You cannot correct a wrong with another wrong. I thoroughly enjoyed that Coleman Hughes video as posted by PirateandBum. He nails it. The humanist view is, itself, under attack by the anti racist view. To be color blind is now to "erase" poc, woc and all that meatbody focus bullshit.

All the various posts that numerous posters have put out here I know actually very little about them and only on occasion am able to ferret out some knowledge as to whether they're male or female or single or married or what-have-you because, I suspect right or wrong, they're ex Scientologists and are no longer "being" their bodies or identities or brains or personalities or opinions or beliefs. These are all things that they have.

I've barely read anything from ScienceNotScientology and I know that she's black and a lesbian. That's because that's what she's being.

We aren't our possessions. Our possessions aren't our identity. We have sexual orientations. We aren't sexual orientations.

This is what is at the heart of identity politics and the progressives' ideology.

One's genitals, the color of one's genitals and how one uses one's genitals.

What a cesspool of "knowledge".
 
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guanoloco

As-Wased
Just to follow up about 70,000 years ago the human race barely shaved through an extinction event. It got reduced to something like 40 breeding pairs.

This means that genetically human bodies are virtual carbon copies of each other. The genetic difference is so minuscule as to be negligible in some estimations when looking at the big picture. Some have inferred that societal things are constructs.

Well, like I've said, the red tag construct and the Scientology cult construct have tremendous influence. This is the power influence behind concepts of microaggressions, rape culture, systemic institutionalized racism and marginalization of women and minorities and the LGBQTIA groups.

Scientology as abusive as it is is especially abusive towards its own adherents. The same for any cult and the PC progressive cult is no different.

You get what you focus attention on. That's why you don't audit out "bad legs", you audit out "good legs".
 

tesseract

Patron with Horrors
Regarding triggers: if one seeks to avoid "triggers" in their entirety, one will get more and more anxious. Been there, done that - in a non-political way, as part of a beginning severe depression many years ago I got a generalized anxiety issue for some months.
 

tesseract

Patron with Horrors
Scientific American said:
Are Trigger Warnings Actually Helpful?
[...]
From a psychological perspective, one could make a case either way. On the one hand, it may be the case that trigger warnings prompt people to better regulate their emotions. It's true that being able to anticipate a response can make you more proactive in regulating your stress if you have such skills. On the other hand, the same research also suggests that anticipating a particular response can also cause one to exaggerate the anticipated response.
[....]
 

Voodoo

Free Your Mind And Your Ass Will Follow
How many of us who are here aren't white? or at least non-Hispanic Caucasian?
One of the things that really struck me in the Sea Org was the casual, un-examined racism that people had that they didn't even know they had. Particularly annoying was when people would use policy as an excuse/justification. Which isn't to say that Hubbard himself wasn't also racist (he was quite racist) and they are certainly related but I'd like to hear others stories to see if they are similar to mine and what their thoughts are on them?
Warm Wishes!
SnS
(raises hand)

Yeah, I was one of those rare, melanin enriched Scientologists, but I experienced a lot less overt/covert racism inside the bubble, than I did on the outside.

In fact, the 'color blindness' of the group was one of the initial attractions for me. People on the scene seemingly had little to no attention on race or ethnicity, which was refreshing, and in tune with the mores and attitudes of the youth at that time.

Unlike a lot of minorities who joined up in those days, I'd been raised in a racially mixed environment, so being a 'black sheep' didn't bother me at all. That is, unless someone chose to make an issue of it, which never happened to me inside the church proper. It did happen a few times outside the confines of the orgs.

Actually, there was one exception to that I can recall, which was David Miscavige. I think he disliked me on first sight, but it was hard to tell if that was because of my race or some other personal attribute. The guy was really hard to read, so who knows?

The point is, I rarely perceived any hint of racist attitudes on the part of staff and public during my decades in the bubble. Matter of fact, there were many occasions when Scientologists seemed to grant me a kind of enhanced admiration for being brown. That used to tickle me :p

Anyway, there were probably fewer than 1:100 of us swarthy types in Scientology when I first got in. The ratio got better as the years went by. In time, I began to see people from more and more non-white, non-mainstream ethnic groups.
 

Voodoo

Free Your Mind And Your Ass Will Follow
That's not definitively racist as it is more directed at an aboriginal culture.

If I recall correctly Hubbard did speak well of some distinctly dark skinned spiritual understanding in Fundamentals of thought.

For my own part, several of my most valuable teacher/mentors have African-American
Agree with everything you said, except the hyphenated-American part. I despise such divisive labels.
 

Voodoo

Free Your Mind And Your Ass Will Follow
I'm the one without the spoons (energy level is low due to illness) and am asking for others experiences NOT for others to ask me about mine! WHY are people who didn't have similar experiences even commenting on this thread? Ya'all are making ZERO sense ... If your experiences runs counter then idk find another thread about your experiences or about something in scn you know about.

Maybe once I'm feeling better I'll be willing to share, if people are willing to share their's first or at least not be an ass towards me just because my experience was different - which in itself is also a microaggression.
Pretty thin gruel there, my friend. If you were honestly discriminated against in the Sea Org, then spill it. What happened?

If it's too painful too talk about, perhaps this is something you would be better off discussing with a therapist. Otherwise, this all comes off sounding like natter.
 

Voodoo

Free Your Mind And Your Ass Will Follow
Here's an infographic that shows a sliding scale of white supremacy. The bottom levels are so subtle that you wouldn't even recognize (or you might even deny) the racism. But people of color notice.

pyramid of white supremacy
I'm a person of color. The top half of that chart rings true to me, but the bottom half does not. All people and all ethnicities are guilty of those things - not just whites.

Victimology is a worse trap than Scientology, in my opinion.
 

Voodoo

Free Your Mind And Your Ass Will Follow
I would believe very few American blacks whose bloodlines would still be pure as it was from Africa.
To me it seems that we are headed for a single race on Earth with our global movements and liaisons.
My mom used to tell us kids the same thing during the civil rights era. She called such a future race, café a'lait.
 

The_Fixer

Class Clown
Just to follow up about 70,000 years ago the human race barely shaved through an extinction event. It got reduced to something like 40 breeding pairs.

This means that genetically human bodies are virtual carbon copies of each other. The genetic difference is so minuscule as to be negligible in some estimations when looking at the big picture. Some have inferred that societal things are constructs.

Well, like I've said, the red tag construct and the Scientology cult construct have tremendous influence. This is the power influence behind concepts of microaggressions, rape culture, systemic institutionalized racism and marginalization of women and minorities and the LGBQTIA groups.

Scientology as abusive as it is is especially abusive towards its own adherents. The same for any cult and the PC progressive cult is no different.

You get what you focus attention on. That's why you don't audit out "bad legs", you audit out "good legs".
What was that "extinction event" thing you referred to, if I may ask?
 

Voodoo

Free Your Mind And Your Ass Will Follow
What was that "extinction event" thing you referred to, if I may ask?
Here's an excerpt from a Gizmodo article on the subject:

"There is one near-extinction event that is fairly well-known, although it remains controversial. Roughly 70,000 years ago, give or take a few thousand years, an enormous eruption occurred in what is now Sumatra, leaving behind Lake Toba (the crater lake pictured above). The eruption coincides with a population bottleneck that is often cited as the reason for the relatively low genetic diversity across Homo sapiens sapiens. Research suggests as few as 2,000 humans were left alive by the eruption and its after-effects."

https://io9.gizmodo.com/extinction-events-that-almost-wiped-out-humans-5501565
 
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