Pre bait and switch auditing. Worth saving?

Veda

Sponsor
Is the pre bait&switch part of auditing worth saving?

Also known as "layer one" of the Scientological Onion:

yellowonion.jpg


http://exscn.net/content/view/178/105/index.html

"Layer one," by itself, is no longer Scientology, any more than the wrapping paper for a package is the content of the package.

At Layer One, one is mainly asked. Later (after the switch) one is mainly told. There are also other sneaky changes.

What name should the better aspects of "layer one" be given?

Should it be mixed with other ideas and subjects?


__________​


It's interesting that even the seemingly enlightened, outside the CofS, 'Clearbird' does its own "bait and switch."

At 'Clear" one is free of "reactive bank":

Cleargirl.jpg


But soon, after becoming a Clear, the person is introduced to the OT levels:

solo2.gif


Notice the very unclear cloud hovering above.


__________​


One suggestion is that it simply be called pre-bait&switch auditing. This recognizes the inherent deviousness of Scientology doctrine, while attempting to salvage what is worthwhile in auditing.

PS: I just realized that this should probably be in the 'Human potential, and self discovery, outside and beyond Scientology' section.

No matter, I've a feeling it won't generate many replies.

However, I thought the question should be posed. :)
 

Caroline

Patron Meritorious
Is the pre bait&switch part of auditing worth saving?

Also known as "layer one" of the Scientological Onion:

yellowonion.jpg


http://exscn.net/content/view/178/105/index.html

"Layer one," by itself, is no longer Scientology, any more than the wrapping paper for a package is the content of the package.

What name should the better aspects of "layer one" be given?

Should it be mixed with other ideas and subjects?


[...]


One suggestion is that it simply be called pre-bait&switch auditing. This recognizes the inherent deviousness of Scientology doctrine, while attempting to salvage what is worthwhile in auditing.

PS: I just realized that this should probably be in the 'Human potential, and self discovery, outside and beyond Scientology' section.

No matter, I've a feeling it won't generate many replies.

However, I thought the question should be posed. :)


According to the article you cited to, the first layer is a "bait-on-the-hook" layer. Doesn't that answer it?

http://exscn.net/content/view/178/105/index.html said:
The first layer of the Scientological Onion is meant to be very visible...

Layer One includes Scientology's pampered clique of celebrities, and various public relations ploys. It reverberates with noble sounding sentiments about creating a better world. Scientology seeks to equate itself, and its founder, with anything broadly viewed as desirable or good. A little further along, this layer would include introductory courses with the stated aim of "knowing oneself" and "being free."

Here exist the potentially beneficial aspects of the many masked Scientology operation. The tragedy of Scientology is that the "positives" are used as "window dressing" and "bait on the hook," when they should have been the core and foundation. Thus the Scientology organization reeks of hypocrisy.

Also, at this much publicized layer, L. Ron Hubbard is presented as an engineer, war hero, nuclear physicist, and the "greatest humanitarian of all time," and the author of "22 best sellers with more to come."

The "first layer" is what Scientology wishes the outside world to know as Scientology. And it is essentially what new converts to the "movement" believe.

It includes most of what is good in the subject: The dream of peace on Earth, the desire to help, practical wisdom, civilized communication, and some potentially beneficial counseling procedures. The word freedom is used a great deal at this layer, and a heart felt desire for greater personal freedom, and freedom for all Mankind, is not unusual to new recruits to Scientology.

(Any inconsistencies or contradictions between the publicly stated aims of the movement, and actual practices or facts, become irrelevant as the individual becomes subject to the Dark Side of Scientology. And the deeper one descends into the "onion" the darker it gets.)
 

Veda

Sponsor
According to the article you cited to, the first layer is a "bait-on-the-hook" layer. Doesn't that answer it?

Yes, it is the bait, but if others are warned about the hook, is there anything in the bait that, in and of itself, has any value?

And, assuming that parts of it do have some limited value (mostly common sense stuff), wouldn't it be a good idea to alert others to it, precisely because it's used as a lead-in to Scientology, and its progressively darker inner regions?
 

Idle Morgue

Gold Meritorious Patron
The first layer - It is all about YOU! "We,the staff, love you, we care about you, we are dedicating our lives being on staff, working for nothing (can't mix money with religion LRH), we are working 16 hours a day so that you may achieve all your goals, have a strong "self determinism, have a family and a group that will support you 100% all of the time.

If you are not happy - it is the staff's fault and they failed at something.



The second layer
- It is about YOU yes, but it is also about this "GROUP" called Scientology - and it is slowly introduced in the first layer sparingly - and it turns into - "you are responsible for everything and it is all of your fault.

The third layer
- It is NOT about YOU - It is only about the group called Scientology - we will get you next lifetime slave- and this is the tipping point into insanity - about the time you have gone broke, disconnected from friends and family, are isolated and alone - and then it is "join staff or the Sea Org." (In order to control others...you have to be willing to be 100% controlled - LRH).

At this point, you have money on account, disconnected and alone, feel like a failure in life and have nothing to live for except become a slave and take 100% responsibility. From here on out - it will only be the group gets to survive at the expense of all of the slaves.

There are gradient level of slaves:
1. Public- they become financial slaves for the cult.
2. Staff - they become worker bee slaves - but have some perks - a rat hole apt., a car if they are willing to clean houses at night, poverty level conditions. They get no bridge - they just work work work. Of course, disconnected from anyone that is not a Scientologist. They answer to the elite slaves - the Sea Org slaves.
3. Sea Org - these beings are completely controlled. They cannot leave, they are tortured emotionally and psychically. They "appear" to be happy but are not. They are slaves to David Miscavige and they have placed their lives in his hands and he will use them up and spit them out when he is done. No bridge- only interrogations (sec checks). They live in poverty, dorms, shit food, 16 or longer work days. They have to pay to have their mandatory uniforms dry cleaned. It is a prison! They have a key in their pocket to get out - and many do. The one's that don't have been so beaten down, they can't. They are afraid of the world, have no skills or abilities and no money. They are covertly invalidated constantly. They have no life and they serve the Master - David Miscavige - who lives like a KING!

That is the layers of the Onion. It is not a big Onion - but it sure can make one cry when get near it.:bigcry:
 

Caroline

Patron Meritorious
Yes, it is the bait, but if others are warned about the hook, is there anything in the bait that, in and of itself, has any value?

And, assuming that parts of it do have some limited value (mostly common sense stuff), wouldn't it be a good idea to alert others to it, precisely because it's used as a lead-in to Scientology, and its progressively darker inner regions?

Pre-bait and switch auditing became impossible after Hubbard postulated the first bait.

My auditing was all after I knew about release, clear and OT. And that is all bait.

Hubbard was a master baiter, but a very bad one.
 

Tong Daddy

Patron
In my never to humble opinion, the majority of wins that are gained in the earliest parts of auditing are no different from seeing any sort of therapist, clergy, really close friend and talking out your problems.
 

Veda

Sponsor
The first layer - It is all about YOU! "We,the staff, love you, we care about you, we are dedicating our lives being on staff, working for nothing (can't mix money with religion LRH), we are working 16 hours a day so that you may achieve all your goals, have a strong "self determinism, have a family and a group that will support you 100% all of the time.

If you are not happy - it is the staff's fault and they failed at something.



The second layer
- It is about YOU yes, but it is also about this "GROUP" called Scientology - and it is slowly introduced in the first layer sparingly - and it turns into - "you are responsible for everything and it is all of your fault.

The third layer
- It is NOT about YOU - It is only about the group called Scientology - we will get you next lifetime slave- and this is the tipping point into insanity - about the time you have gone broke, disconnected from friends and family, are isolated and alone - and then it is "join staff or the Sea Org." (In order to control others...you have to be willing to be 100% controlled - LRH).

At this point, you have money on account, disconnected and alone, feel like a failure in life and have nothing to live for except become a slave and take 100% responsibility. From here on out - it will only be the group gets to survive at the expense of all of the slaves.

There are gradient level of slaves:
1. Public- they become financial slaves for the cult.
2. Staff - they become worker bee slaves - but have some perks - a rat hole apt., a car if they are willing to clean houses at night, poverty level conditions. They get no bridge - they just work work work. Of course, disconnected from anyone that is not a Scientologist. They answer to the elite slaves - the Sea Org slaves.
3. Sea Org - these beings are completely controlled. They cannot leave, they are tortured emotionally and psychically. They "appear" to be happy but are not. They are slaves to David Miscavige and they have placed their lives in his hands and he will use them up and spit them out when he is done. No bridge- only interrogations (sec checks). They live in poverty, dorms, shit food, 16 or longer work days. They have to pay to have their mandatory uniforms dry cleaned. It is a prison! They have a key in their pocket to get out - and many do. The one's that don't have been so beaten down, they can't. They are afraid of the world, have no skills or abilities and no money. They are covertly invalidated constantly. They have no life and they serve the Master - David Miscavige - who lives like a KING!

That is the layers of the Onion. It is not a big Onion - but it sure can make one cry when get near it.:bigcry:

:)

I guess that's the abbreviated version. Here's the original Scientological Onion as it appeared in the book, 'L. Ron Hubbard, Messiah or Madman?'

21M99HEXQ2L._SL500_AA300_.jpg


This is excerpted from the chapter titled, 'Destructive Cult Defined, and the Gradients of Deception: the Layers of the Scientological Onion'. Omitted is a one page introduction which is also worth reading.


Scientology could be described as a "layers of the onion" operation.

The outermost layer of the "Scientological Onion" is not identifiable with Scientology at all, being composed of front groups that conceal their connection to -and control by - the Scientology organization. Front groups might be said to constitute Layer Zero: a place where the tentacles of Scientology can grope incognito.

The first layer of the Scientological Onion is meant to be very visible...

Layer One includes Scientology's pampered clique of celebrities, and various public relations ploys. It reverberates with noble sounding sentiments about creating a better world. Scientology seeks to equate itself, and its founder, with anything broadly viewed as desirable or good. A little further along, this layer would include introductory courses with the stated aim of "knowing oneself" and "being free."

Here exist the potentially beneficial aspects of the many masked Scientology operation. The tragedy of Scientology is that the "positives" are used as "window dressing" and "bait on the hook," when they should have been the core and foundation. Thus the Scientology organization reeks of hypocrisy.

Also, at this much publicized layer, L. Ron Hubbard is presented as an engineer, war hero, nuclear physicist, and the "greatest humanitarian of all time," and the author of "22 best sellers with more to come."

The "first layer" is what Scientology wishes the outside world to know as Scientology. And it is essentially what new converts to the "movement" believe.

It includes most of what is good in the subject: The dream of peace on Earth, the desire to help, practical wisdom, civilized communication, and some potentially beneficial counseling procedures. The word freedom is used a great deal at this layer, and a heart felt desire for greater personal freedom, and freedom for all Mankind, is not unusual to new recruits to Scientology.

(Any inconsistencies or contradictions between the publicly stated aims of the movement, and actual practices or facts, become irrelevant as the individual becomes subject to the Dark Side of Scientology. And the deeper one descends into the "onion" the darker it gets.)

Descending into the "onion" it is necessary to become a Scientologist. This means thinking like a Scientologist. This is the Second Layer where deception eases into "soft" forms of mind-manipulation. Love of Mankind is modified that the awareness that human beings are mere hapless "Wogs"... The desire to help becomes the desire to recruit. The ideal of practical wisdom, based on logic and science, is superseded by the belief in the unfathomable mystery of the "tech." Indeed one is expected to be in a state of awe regarding the "tech," much in the same manner that a peasant woman might regard piece of bone, said to have belonged to a Saint from centuries past.

The publicly promoted "policy" of honesty is modified by an awareness that deception is OK, as long as it serves to achieve the desired Scientological end. And the ideals of civility and democracy become a joke - just something that "panty-waists" and wimps fixate on.

One is slowly being "hatted" as a Scientologist.

(At this point an - unlucky - new Scientologist may be subjected to heavy handed "hard sell" tactics by a sales person or "registrar." Life savings have been lost, inheritances gobbled up, and lines of credit drained, all in a single arduous evening of "hard sell." This is really a premature taste of Layer Four.)

The Third Layer down is composed of never ending, expensive, highly advertised, but confidential "upper levels." These go on and on - and on. Scientology has been selling the promise of "Total Freedom" since before most of its current membership were born. It remains the ever elusive "dangling carrot."

Well known individuals who become involved in Scientology - becoming "Scientology celebrities" - do not go deeper into the Scientological Onion than this.

They are also spared the abuses that "less valuable" beings may suffer at the hands of Scientology sales people, "Sea Org" recruiters, or "ethics" officers...

At the upper fringes of the next layer down is local "Org staff," and at the bottom of Layer Four can be found "Sea Org" personnel. This layer employs more pervasive and cruder forms of "persuasion" or "mind control." Here is the "slave labor" supplying Rehabilitation Project Force, the Pavlovian "5 Card System," and the grim but repressed awareness that one is mainly a "post" and a "stat," (i.e. statistic.)

The Fifth layer down includes intimidation of the mass media, use of lawsuits purely for purposes of harassment, and applications of policies and programs, such as those discovered as a result of the FBI search warrants of July 1977. These materials were made available for public view by Federal court order in 1979 and consist of organized applications of the Fair game Law, and related confidential policies and "tech," designed to illegally gain access to private files, infiltrate, harass, lie about, "sue, trick, lie to, or destroy" anyone perceived as an enemy. At this layer also would be secret bank accounts and financial irregularities.

Other aspects of this layer would include "blackmail," including threats to publicize personal information obtained during "religious confessionals" (auditing sessions); and the inducement of duress of various kinds - including frivolous lawsuits - to obtain promises of "silence," and to obtain "signed retractions" of earlier statements.

Here also can be found the handful of individuals who constitute the "Scientology hierarchy": the board of directors of the Religious Technology Center, and its chairman David Miscavige or "DM."

Layer Number Six appears to be the core of the Onion. It is a very temperamental and secret place.

Here lie the secrets of L. Ron Hubbard: his bad health, bad habits, undistinguished military service, flunked physics and mathematics classes. Here can be found the actual motivations behind, and sources of, Dianetics and Scientology. Here can be found Mary Sue Hubbard, languishing in prison for crimes committed under her husband's direction, while her husband, in hiding, passes the time writing Science Fiction. Here are all the things you shouldn't know about the founder of the "Science of Knowing How to Know."



__________​


Later, this strange little "mysterious" manual was spread across the grid of the Onion and examined in further detail.


Brainwashing-front.jpg


'Brainwashing Manual Parallels in Scientology', a.k.a. 'Revisiting the Textbook on Psycho-politics' http://www.xenu-directory.net/critics/ambry1.html

Contents

Examining the 'Brainwashing Manual' http://warrior.xenu.ca/Brainwashing-front.jpg with the purpose of better understanding Scientology 4

Introduction: A Brief Outline of Scientology Doctrine, Public and Confidential 6

"White Scientology" - The Battle Tactics Doctrine - Brainwashing Manual Tech - Scientology is Multi-layered - Exploiting the Positives: the Cheese in the Trap -

Background 9

Origin of the word "brainwashing." and of the "Russian Brainwashing Manual"
L. Ron Hubbard writing to Scientologists on the subject of the Brainwashing Manual
Departing briefly from the Manual: A look at private tactics later shared with insiders
A publicized statement
A private explanation
Hubbard vs. the "Asiatic Hordes"
Back to the Brainwashing Manual: Excerpts from Hubbard's third public statement on it
Kenneth Goff's 1956 version of the Manual
Scientology's "No-answer answers."

Excerpts from the Brainwashing Manual/Textbook on Psycho-politics 14

"Editorial Note": Hubbard. assuming the guise of the phantasmal "Charles Stickley"
"An Address by Beria": Hubbard, pretending to be Lavrenti Beria, chief of the Russian Secret Police
The Main Text of the Manual: Hubbard, masquerading as an arrogant Russain Brainwashing expert
"Pain-Drug-Hypnosis"

The Layers of The "Scientological Onion" http://exscn.net/content/view/178/105 17

Brainwashing Manual Parallels in Modern Scientology 19

Correspondences between the Brainwashing Manual and the Battle Tactics policy
On “Survival”
On Surviving the Atomic Bomb
On an individual Scientologist influencing leaders
Scientology is devious by design

Front Groups - Layer Zero of the “Scientological Onion” 20

“It is not necessary that the term ‘Communism’ [Scientology] be applied at first…”

Layer One - The publicized portion of Scientology 23

“White Scientology”
Scenario: (An application of “White Scientology”)
“By reason alone”
Auditing

Descending into Layer Two of the “Onion”: The “In-Organization” Strata 27

“…[Scientology] under the guise of [‘White Scientology’]…”
Exploitation of the process of abreaction
Playing one thing off another or “counter-playing”
“Loaded language”: the seemingly enlightened “counter-played” with the manipulative
Tone 4, “entheta,” “theta,” Suppressive Person
The Thought Limiting clichés of Scientology
Publicized, “In-organization” and Confidential Scientology “Ethics”
“…aligning the individual against the desire not to conform…”
Side effects of “critical thoughts”
Dominion over the loyalties of individuals

Layer Three of the “Onion”: The Confidential “Upper Levels” of the “Bridge to Total Freedom” 33

“…avoid the understanding of the layman…”
Highest of the “upper levels” must remain a mystery to the membership
Operating Thetan or O.T.
Aleister Crowley, Head of the O.T.O.
O.T. III, The “Wall of Fire” into which Hubbard “took the plunge” to save Mankind
Exploitation of the paranormal

Layer Four: “…a well trained individual who serves in complete obedience…”
The Sea Organization, the Rehabilitation Project Force, and the Five Card System 36


The Sea Organization: “Custodians of the O.T. Levels”
“…the only loyalty which should exist… is to the State [Scientology].”
Sea Org Ethics under Commodore Hubbard on the Flagship
“Refusal to let them sleep over many days…”
The Rehabilitation Project Force
“Filthy food, little sleep, nearly untenable quarters…”
“…the first loyalty [to himself]… is destroyed…”
“Degradation and conquest…”
The children’s and teenagers’ RPF
“A certain amount of fear…”
The RPF’s RPF
The Five Card “Team Share” System
“The technologies of psycho-politics…”

Layer Five: Confidential Scientology Policy and Tech for “handling” uncooperative outsiders 46

The Fair Game policy and “philosophy”
“…find or manufacture enough threat…”
“Direct the attention of the authorities…”
Scientology’s unscrupulous use of the legal system
“We will no longer put up with our religion being criticized…”
Discourage inquiry
Defamatory data on file; “Culling”: Searching “religious confessional” (auditing) files for embarrassing or intimidating items
Background: The Commodore’s Intelligence Network
The policy of covert attack and publicized PR “defense lines”
Scientology’s Multi-layered Public Relations tech
Scientology Intelligence tech
Data collecting, and Attack or “support” Intelligence
Creating incidents that reflect badly on others
“Data needed by Ops on each located who”
Attack or “support” Intelligence - The Covert Ops study course and checklist
“Persons in his vicinity to whom he is emotionally involved…”
Coerce them into signing prepared “retractions” or “confessions”
Plenty of bogus “documentation”
One justification for unscrupulous covert methods
Treatment of VIPs and celebrities
Goal of talking over “mental health” and “political guidance”
Full knowledge of Intelligence tech must be denied to the general membership
“Deception, chicanery, lying, manipulation and outright criminality”
“She over there, those pink legs sticking out, didn’t like me”
Scientologists believe in a planet-wide conspiracy against L. Ron Hubbard and Scientology
The Scientology Hierarchy

Layer Six: The Core of the “Scientological Onion” 69

“…virtually a pathological liar…egotism… lust for power, and vindictiveness…”
“We must be like the vine upon the tree…”
The elusive “1000 page” official L. Ron Hubbard biography
“It’s a trap not being able to prevaricate”
Conscience as an “impediment”
The L. Ron Hubbard Fan(atic) club

Epilogue 74

Freeing the Positives

Addendum 76

"Dr. Hubbard's" FBI letters written concurrent with the appearance of the Brainwashing Manual 77

L. Ron Hubbard assumes the identity of Dr. Hubbard Ph.D DD - Patriotic Concerned Citizen
Letter of 29 July 1955
From a letter dated 7 September

A further look at Scientology's Covert Intelligence Tech 79

"Categories of Data Needing Coding"
A glimpse at a covert operation, and of public strata "policy" used as a cover for applied covert policy
An example of public strata "policy" used as "cover" - this time used on Scientologists by Scientology
"Ops Planning"
What to "Vet" or delete from sensitive internal messages that may be scrutinized by outsiders

Bibliography 82

Notes 87
 

Techless

Patron Meritorious
"... wins that are gained in the earliest parts of auditing are no different from seeing any sort of therapist, clergy, really close friend and talking out your problems.[/QUOTE]"

Well...eh...I'm thinking there's definitely something different about them cause they can lead to definitely different things than: "seeing any sort of therapist, clergy, really close friend and talking out your problems"

Right?

Definitely something different about them ?!?!

Sorry, I'm too lazy to go into the differences that I could come up with now.
But just be very careful in saying that all the 'goodness' is the same...it's much more designed to get you into it, lock, stock, and barrel.

(my bad cowboy talk)
 
Yes, it is the bait, but if others are warned about the hook, is there anything in the bait that, in and of itself, has any value?

And, assuming that parts of it do have some limited value (mostly common sense stuff), wouldn't it be a good idea to alert others to it, precisely because it's used as a lead-in to Scientology, and its progressively darker inner regions?

That's an assumption I don't share...I say NO!

Why bother reinventing the wheel in finding useful ways of helping people with their problems?

Rather than alert people to the slight parts which may have some limited value, how about getting people in touch with what they really need, in terms of real effective practical help, counseling, medical help for brain problems, de-tox, rehab, special ed tutoring for folks with learning disorders or whatever is needed? As far as I am concerned, there is nothing there in "the early parts of auditing" that is original or especially unique, in terms of counseling techniques or methodologies which cannot be found elsewhere, more cleanly, safely, sanely and with more ease and less cost or stigma!

Cult programming is a tar baby. Cult speak and group think of Scientology is a tar baby!!!

Anything which you may deem "useful, common sense helpful stuff", can be found elsewhere. Often for free or low cost!!! No reason at all, except for people's sentimental attachments to their past experiences, to try and redeem anything from the Cult of Scientology.
 

Veda

Sponsor
That's an assumption I don't share...I say NO!

Why bother reinventing the wheel in finding useful ways of helping people with their problems?

Rather than alert people to the slight parts which may have some limited value, how about getting people in touch with what they really need, in terms of real effective practical help, counseling, medical help for brain problems, de-tox, rehab, special ed tutoring for folks with learning disorders or whatever is needed? As far as I am concerned, there is nothing there in "the early parts of auditing" that is original or especially unique, in terms of counseling techniques or methodologies which cannot be found elsewhere, more cleanly, safely, sanely and with more ease and less cost or stigma!

Cult programming is a tar baby. Cult speak and group think of Scientology is a tar baby!!!

Anything which you may deem "useful, common sense helpful stuff", can be found elsewhere. Often for free or low cost!!! No reason at all, except for people's sentimental attachments to their past experiences, to try and redeem anything from the Cult of Scientology.

Perhaps I didn't express myself clearly.

What usually sticks a person to Scientology is finding one thing that is "good." It can be almost anything. Once the person is exposed to that tiny bit of "good" in Scientology - dangling like a twinkling ornament on a carnivorous Christmas tree - the person, inevitably, eventually, encounters the view that Scientology is all bad, and that there is no good in Scientology whatsoever.

That Scientology - and Hubbard's so called "philosophy" - is rotten at the core, but uses twinkling ornaments dangling on the fringes to lure in the unsuspecting, and that some of these twinkling ornaments may sometimes be "good," is not conveyed.

The "good" includes well meaning, but naive, persons (dupes as Hubbard called them) that actually have good intentions and sincerely want to help.

It also includes mostly common sense ideas.

This is why, for example, I appreciate Lawrence Wright describing this aspect of Scientology during many of his interviews. It alerts people to the bait that lures. :)

4153808015_6c526dbef1_z.jpg
 
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I understand what you are saying Veda, but I disagree...

I don't think it's finding something good or useful at first, "the initial wins" one might have, that get people stuck in a Cult. Those kinds of experiences may be an initial attractant, that coupled with curiosity or rebelliousness, might get people to look into Scientology or initially explore it, but not get trapped in it. Those twinkling ornaments are an insufficient attractive force to get one "stuck" in a Cult which has always had it's Critics and a bad reputation! Not sufficient motivation to spend decades of one's life pursuing the Bridge, go broke, abandon their family, ruin their health and drive themselves crazy.

Because life is full of twinkling ornaments and attractions. People play with them all the time, and then turn around, put them down and leave, and go on with their lives, go on to some other interests, without getting "stuck".

People get wins from all kinds of things, like a good talk with a friend, a good self help book or lecture, a support group, a good insightful or thought provoking movie even! Those small pleasure moments or small initial wins are not what "stick" people to Scientology, in my opinion.

The Cult manipulation is what "sticks" people to it. The purposeful lies and misdirection stick people to it! Lovebombing, finding one's ruin, pushing the "help" (or self importance) button that most people have, the mystery sandwich, feeling special and in the know and part of a select group, being separated or estranged from former family and friends, monetary rewards for getting other people into the Cult, etc. etc. All that. You know!

It's not special. It's no different in that way from the Moonies or The People's Temple or any number of other similar high control Cults, which implant by a trance induced form of repetitions and "drill" for teaching, a severe us vs. them mentality, you're either with us or against us, subsume individuality for the good of the group mentality in their new recruits, and actively work to separate them from reality and the real world. That's the stuff that gets people stuck. It's only true if it's true for you is tar. The personality test is tar. Doing the TR's is tar. Learning to be controlled and control others is tar. The greatest good for the greatest number is tar. The Auditor's Code is tar. The grades chart and tone scale are tar. Looking up to someone with "altitude" is tar. Gaining certainty is tar. The promise of "going clear" or gaining OT powers is tar. Auditing on an e-meter which stimulates the endorphins in your brain is tar!

That's the stuff that tar babies are made of.

Show me one good element in Scientology auditing or training that's effective and worthy of being disseminated into the world that can't already be found elsewhere! WITHOUT all the Cult tar on it!

Go ahead, name ONE!
 

HelluvaHoax!

Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on
--snipped--
It's not special. It's no different in that way from the Moonies or The People's Temple or any number of other similar high control Cults, which implant by a trance induced form of repetitions and "drill" for teaching, a severe us vs. them mentality, you're either with us or against us, subsume individuality for the good of the group mentality in their new recruits, and actively work to separate them from reality and the real world. That's the stuff that gets people stuck. It's only true if it's true for you is tar. The personality test is tar. Doing the TR's is tar. Learning to be controlled and control others is tar. The greatest good for the greatest number is tar. The Auditor's Code is tar. The grades chart and tone scale are tar. Looking up to someone with "altitude" is tar. The promise of "going clear" or gaining OT powers is tar. Auditing on an e-meter which stimulates the endorphins in your brain is tar!

That's the stuff that tar babies are made of.

Show me one good element in Scientology auditing or training that's effective and worthy of being disseminated into the world that can't already be found elsewhere! WITHOUT all the Cult tar on it!

Go ahead, name ONE!


Ummmm, Clear tar?

It's special. You can't see it so you don't know you've been tarred.

I learned that while doing TRs (Tar Routines).
 

HelluvaHoax!

Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on
Yes, it is the bait, but if others are warned about the hook, is there anything in the bait that, in and of itself, has any value?

There could be something valuable in the bait. It's like cheese. It's valuable to a mouse, but not in a mousetrap.

Scientology cheese is permanently attached to the "slam bar" that comes down when you take a bite.

And Scientology cheese is laced with addictive chemicals too, like sugar in soft drinks and caffeine in coffee. Thus the good part ends up bad and takes it's toll eventually as well.

Best advice to anyone near a Scientologist who offers cheese: Just say: "No thanks, I'm full."
 
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Veda

Sponsor
-snip-

Go ahead, name ONE!

You're still misunderstanding what I'm saying.

The first Scientologists I ever encountered were the Incredible String Band, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4_8u3ZNR4Y
and then I met a few other Scientologists, all of whom impressed me with their goodness. They, now, as do I, recognize that they were well-meaning dupes.

Scientology uses disguises. It's sneaky. The ultimate disguise is goodness.
 

secretiveoldfag

Silver Meritorious Patron
I believe this was not the first stage.

From Hubbard's admissions and his oldest son's various articles, it appears that auditing grew out of Hubbard's more or less successful attempts to brain-rape his children, his second wife, his third wife, and various other people he lured in. Nibs called it soul-cracking. Hubbard was pretty good at it.

I would put all his manuals in a box, lock the box, throw away the key, and dump the locked box in a live volcano.
 

secretiveoldfag

Silver Meritorious Patron
You're still misunderstanding what I'm saying.

The first Scientologists I ever encountered were the Incredible String Band, and then I met a few other Scientologists, all of whom impressed me with their goodness. They, now, as do I, recognize that they were well-meaning dupes.

Scientology uses disguises. It's sneaky. The ultimate disguise is goodness.

From the Wikipedia article:
Joe Boyd, in his book White Bicycles – Making Music in the 1960s and elsewhere, describes how he was inadvertently responsible for their "conversion" when he introduced the band to Simons who, having become a Scientologist, persuaded them to enrol in his absence. The band's support for Scientology over the next few years was controversial among some fans, and seemed to coincide with what many saw as the beginning of a decline in the quality of their work. In an interview with Oz magazine in 1969 the band spoke enthusiastically of their involvement with it, although the question of its effect on their later albums has provoked much discussion ever since.
 
I'm not the only one who sees this! :rubeyes:
From:http://angrygaypope.com/docs/robert_levine_headley_case_brainwashing.pdf

(Partial) DECLARATION OF ROBERT V. LEVINE, PH.D., IN SUPPORT OF PLAINTIFFS’ OPPOSITION TO DEFENDANTS’ MOTIONS FOR SUMMARY JUDGMENT

MARC HEADLEY,
Plaintiffs,
vs.
CHURCH OF SCIENTOLOGY INTERNATIONAL, a corporate entity,
Defendants.
_______________________________
CLAIRE HEADLEY,
Plaintiff,
vs.
CHURCH OF SCIENTOLOGY INTERNATIONAL, a corporate entity, RELIGIOUS TECHNOLOGY CENTER, a corporate entity AND DOES 1-20,
Defendants.
_______________________________

snip~

In addition to my general qualifications in the field of psychology, I also have particular qualifications regarding the psychology of persuasion and mind control, issues that directly relate to this case. I have been specializing in the psychology of persuasion and mind control since 1984. I have taught a self-designed course on this topic for more than twenty years. I have published a book, peer-reviewed research and invited chapters and book reviews in professional journals, and presented research on this topic at professional conferences.

My most extensive publication regarding this subject is a book: Levine, R., The Power of Persuasion: How We’re Bought and Sold (2003) (updated paperback version published 2006). Hoboken, NJ: John Wiley & Sons. This book has been translated into seven languages. It details the psychology of persuasion that is often used to manipulate consumers into making decisions that are sometimes not in their best interest. It includes material on the psychological manipulations that have been used in common situations such as sales and advertising as well as the manipulations used in extreme groups such as cults. It includes a chapter on Jonestown and analyses of cults, including the Moonies and Hare Krishnas, and a very brief discussion of Scientology.

I have also published a chapter on cults in an encyclopedia: Levine, R., “Cults,” in E. Hickey (Ed.), Encyclopedia of Murder and Violent Crime. Thousand Oaks, Ca.: Sage (2003). This invited chapter was written as an introduction to the social psychology of cults. It summarizes research concerning what constitutes a cult, the type of individuals who join cults, the typical structure of cults and the social psychological dynamics that exert such a powerful influence on cult members.

My other relevant publications on the topic include: Levine, R., “The evil that men do: Review of The Lucifer Effect by Philip Zimbardo,” American Scientist 95:440-442 (2007); Levine, R., Fast, N., & Zimbardo, P., “The power of persuasion: A field exercise,” Teaching of Psychology 31:136-138 (2004); Levine, R., Milgram’s progress: Review of The Man Who Shocked the World by Thomas Blass,” American Scientist 93:368-370 (2004); Levine, R., “Beware the illusion of vulnerability,” Net and Books 1:24-27 (2001).

snip~ The essential questions that I will address in this declaration are whether an average person (without clear psychological pathologies) would have been able to make clear and independent rational decisions given the physical, social and psychological environment created by Scientology and, hence, whether the Headleys were deprived of free will in making such decisions.

Preliminarily, I wish to explain that “brainwashing” is a term that has been over-used and is quite misleading. Totalistic commitments, such as those which the Headleys undertook, are often described as the result of brainwashing.

The sort of torture that is commonly associated with the term brainwashing does not appear to have been usual in the Headleys’ history in Scientology. What I believe did occur, however, was a more subtle, more potent form of control that transformed their reality and thinking in a manner that left them unable to make rational decisions. They were subject to social and psychological pressures that subverted control of their thinking, behavior, emotions, and decisions. Although this type of control can and did lead to pathological behavior and thinking, it is usually for the most part an extension of normal psychology – the common tactics of persuasion and influence that occur in non-pathological, everyday life settings.

The differences between everyday persuasion and extreme control concern intensity and intent: In instances of totalistic control, such as the case of the Headleys, the psychological techniques are taken to extremes. The techniques are, also, often “manipulative” -- a term that, in a psychological context, refers to persuading or influencing people in such a way that the manipulator tries to get what he or she wants, or makes a person believe something in a calculating, indirect and somewhat dishonest way. The end product of the control to be described is pathological. However, the normalcy of the techniques, when applied with skill and subtlety, make it difficult for the victim to recognize just how pathological the coercive forces are until they are removed from the situation. This, I believe, was the case in the experience of the Headleys under Scientology.

In this document, I offer my analysis of how the Headleys were manipulated and socialized by Scientology to a point where they lost their ability to make clear, independent decisions. Whether or not the Headleys sincerely believed in the tenets of Scientology, the pressures upon them made it extremely difficult to express their grievances and even more difficult for them to leave the organization. Again, this is not to say it was impossible for them to leave. Psychologists understand that, even under the most intense pressures, individuals react on a normal curve, meaning there are always outliers who defy the pressures. Given the intensity of the coercion in this case, however, I conclude with confidence that a normal person – which I define here as an average person – would not have been capable of walking away; and, I am convinced by these depositions, very few individuals experiencing this series of pressures would have been capable of clearly weighing the issues, costs and benefits that would enable them to make rational decisions.

In the cases of most organizations, the most difficult step in recruitment, as it is in any persuasion campaign, is to elicit an initial commitment, no matter how small. It might be a willingness to attend a lecture, or a free dinner, or to accept a free book, or a free flower, or even to just stop and listen to what the recruiter has to say. This initial step is known in sales lingo as getting a foot-in-the-door.

snip~ As will be described below when discussing the psychological and social pressures on the Headleys, social norms are extremely powerful. See, e.g., Kahan, D.M., “Gentle nuges vs. hard shoves: Solving the sticky norms problem,” Univ. Chicago Law Rev. 67:607-645 (2000). They, rather than formal rules, guide most of our behavior. We often think of legal authorities – the police, the courts, prisons – as the most formidable enforcers of our society’s rules. Rules and laws, however, simply threaten with formal penalties. They work through fear of external threats. Once the enforcers are gone, the individual can escape. Kahan, D. M., “Gentle nudges vs. hard shoves: Solving the sticky norms problem,” Univ. Of Chicago Law Rev. 67:607-645 (2000).

With social disapproval, however, the punishment persists inside the transgressor. Shame and guilt are, in a sense, like having control agents living in your mind; as a result, they are always present. They dictate one’s moral code of behavior. In the case of the Headleys, their inner voices dictated codes of behavior that were often not consistent with those of the surrounding world: The beliefs that may have been considered normal, correct behavior in another context were understood to be deviant from the norm in the culture of Scientology. Many of the precepts of Scientology, which outsiders might consider strange, were the accepted norm. To not sign required documents, even when unreasonable, was not only understood to create problems for oneself, but was understood to be a deviant act. To stand up for what one believed was deviant, inappropriate behavior. It not only led to discipline toward oneself but created problems for those close to you. An outsider might wonder why any normal person would remain in Scientology under many of the conditions described by the Headleys. To the Headleys, however, to leave Scientology required a rebellious or deviant act and they had been socialized to believe that rebelliousness and deviance – when targeted at Scientology – were immoral ways of thinking.

Layered upon their history of socialization in Scientology was totalistic control--behavior, information and thought control--of their day-to-day lives. Hassan, S., Releasing the Bonds (Somerville, MA: Freedom of Mind Press, 2000)."

Read the whole report, it's fascinating!
 

Idle Morgue

Gold Meritorious Patron
Pre-bait and switch auditing became impossible after Hubbard postulated the first bait.

My auditing was all after I knew about release, clear and OT. And that is all bait.

Hubbard was a master baiter, but a very bad one.


"Hubbard was a master baiter" and Caroline - no pun intended, right? According to Hubbard's affirmations - he most certainly was both! Seemed he had quite the problem with "masterbating" and we know he was also a "master baiter"! :dieslaughing:
 
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