Lulu Belle
Moonbat
Totally true.
Every RPF I/C I knew when I was in the SO inevitably wound up on the RPF himself.
Never failed.
Questions To Ask Mike Rinder
- Thread starter Alanzo
- Start date
Totally true.
Every RPF I/C I knew when I was in the SO inevitably wound up on the RPF himself.
Never failed.
B
bobo
Guest
Rinder and suis must be happy they have been put on RPF.
For sure they had lack of mass, so DM did the right thing.
B.
For sure they had lack of mass, so DM did the right thing.
B.
Bea Kiddo
Crusader
Huh? This post doesnt make sense... Please clarify.
B
bobo
Guest
B
bobo
Guest
Its exactly like what happened in WW2.
The big guys walk a way and the patsy boys get punished.
Discousting.
B.
The big guys walk a way and the patsy boys get punished.
Discousting.
B.
haiqu
Patron Meritorious
According to Geoff Filbert it was over by 1975, the year I started. I think it's a credit to anyone entering after that time that they managed to get any training or case gain at all under the circumstances. This, by the way, is to reassure you that I'm impressed with anyone who made OT VIII in there since you'd have to be pretty upstat and alert.
Looks like you didn't fall for their "implanter's triangle" of Status - Conformity - Control of Others.
haiqu
OHTEEATE
Silver Meritorious Patron
rinder and crew
Well, thanks for that. I think it had more to do with making a lot of money in 1983-85 than anything else. I had a solar company called AmericanSun in California, with two partners, Rick Bishop and Gloria Neumeyer, and we made millions and put big chunks on the Bridge, including L's, and then when the business folded( tax credits ended) we had our stuff paid for so I went flat out to OT 8. and then crashed! another story... but what occured to me, and maybe it's already been explored here, is that the "SP Hall" guys are being watched 24/7, and not let route out at all, as that would alert the public there is something very rotten in Denmark, and raise alarms. You see the "Rinder blows" rumor is all over the press, worldwide, you know? It's news. So, what if Ray Mithoff, Heber, Liz Ingber, Greg Hughes, all split at once? DM couldn't possibly cover that up. One of them would talk, maybe on TV, maybe in a big press release with a favorite reporter. I don't think Rinder would talk right away. I'll bet if he is out, he is negotiating to get his family out with him. He has stuff to negotiate with.
Well, thanks for that. I think it had more to do with making a lot of money in 1983-85 than anything else. I had a solar company called AmericanSun in California, with two partners, Rick Bishop and Gloria Neumeyer, and we made millions and put big chunks on the Bridge, including L's, and then when the business folded( tax credits ended) we had our stuff paid for so I went flat out to OT 8. and then crashed! another story... but what occured to me, and maybe it's already been explored here, is that the "SP Hall" guys are being watched 24/7, and not let route out at all, as that would alert the public there is something very rotten in Denmark, and raise alarms. You see the "Rinder blows" rumor is all over the press, worldwide, you know? It's news. So, what if Ray Mithoff, Heber, Liz Ingber, Greg Hughes, all split at once? DM couldn't possibly cover that up. One of them would talk, maybe on TV, maybe in a big press release with a favorite reporter. I don't think Rinder would talk right away. I'll bet if he is out, he is negotiating to get his family out with him. He has stuff to negotiate with.
Bea Kiddo
Crusader
No matter what he has done against us, no matter what, I think, and maybe I only speak for myself, but others may concur:
No matter how much happened in the past, Mike, we all pray for you and your family to be together. No matter what.
B
bobo
Guest
I dont have anything agains Mike Rinder, just wondered about the position he could be in right now and what other people think about him.
In fact, if he has left RTC and he continues to apply Scn tech, and I think he will, thats all automatism, he has to do a workout of the lower conditions and then at some moment when he might arrive at your door, hypothetically, he will have to ask you: Dear Bea, what is needed and wanted.
That would be fair.
B.
And further, I just try to create some TA.
B
bobo
Guest
But of course, I dont have to tell what Mike Rinder has to do. 
For sure he is a smart ass.
B.
For sure he is a smart ass.
B.
Terril park
Sponsor
I think Mike maybe is right about worldwide media. Wikipedia is
probably included.
Got sent this today, possibly Wiki's editor forums?
bb
Your continued donations keep Wikipedia running!
Talk:Mike Rinder
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Although I don't agree with User:Andrew eagles' use of revert warring tactics in regard to this article (and I've given him a 24 hour block for violating the 3RR), I think he was correct to delete these two sentences: "Rinder oversees all overt and covert activities of OSA and subordinate organizations. He has a particular hatred for former members of the Church of Scientology, refering to them as "apostates" and "wackos"." They lack sourcing and the second sentence in particular seems to me to be very biased. Please don't restore them as they are; find sources if you can, and try to make them accord with the NPOV policy. -- ChrisO 00:03, 1 April 2006 (UTC)
Oops, my bad. I saw that info was being deleted from AndroidCat and Fahrenheit451's edits and automatically assumed NPOV. I read the OSA article more thoroughly (and thus he would have broken the 3RR rule there anyway so I don't feel guilty for his block thankfully) but will take more care in future. Thanks Chris, ĢĿ€Ñ §τοĿĿ€ŖγŤč 00:31, 1 April 2006 (UTC)
Well, since you have effectively copied those two sentences to the talk page for discussion and for an attempt to find sources, I won't restore them. I will, however, restore what else Andrew deleted in a supposed attempt to "remov[e] incorrect & misleading data" -- namely, every single external link the article had except the official biography of Rinder on www.scientology.org .
One of the links is mislabelled; it isn't a USA Today interview with Mike Rinder (though I think it does count as sourcing for the statement that Rinder calls former Scientologists "wackos": "Both expressed their dissatisfaction with previous coverage of Scientology by major media outlets, and they warned against what they perceived to be the unreliability of the faith's critics -- "the wackos," as Rinder described them." "Rinder dismisses Christman as a "wacko" and says her allegations are "absolute bullshit."" [1]) We'll probably want to look and see if we can find the original USA Today interview with Rinder, though. -- Antaeus Feldspar 03:42, 1 April 2006 (UTC)
Mike Rinder was never a member of the Guardian's Office. I am sure you cannot find any citation to the contrary as it never happened. Elruhr 06:23, 16 January 2007 (UTC)
His biography page at www.scientology.org states that "his first involvement with the Church’s external affairs came in 1980"; this must have been with the GO, as it had not been replaced by OSA at that time. However, none of the references supports the statement about him holding the post at Flag Land Base, so I've fact tagged this. Also, the external ref to an article in the 'LA Times' is not an "interview with Mike Rinder" as labelled; it's a piece about Tom Cruise in which Rinder is just quoted in passing: would anyone object to me deleting it from the Mike Rinder page? DavidCooke 03:49, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Rumour
It has been reported in background Scientology circles that Mr. Rinder has left the Church of Scientology, probably after doing the UK radio program "Talk Sport" on May 20th 2007. As he is or was the Head of Office of Special Affairs this is of importance. Mr. Rinder managed all international legal affairs and knows therefore "all" confidential actions and agreements. If he speakes out (improbable) there will be an earthquake in Scientology.
I have no 100% prooven evidence of the fact at hand. whiteheaven —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Whiteheaven (talk • contribs) 12:19:01, August 19, 2007 (UTC).
Wikipedia doesn't need rumours and gossip. Got any sources for this "it has been reported" claim of yours? wikipediatrix 18:18, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
Anonymous rumor mongering at best. Possibly Mike Rinder kicked somebody's shin too hard. COFS 21:23, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
The sources are an anonymous post by an ex-member to an Internet forum 'confirmed' by another anonymous poster who added details. That's all so far, apart from Mr Rinder not having been seen by the media since the above date. Obviously if he has left his official Church biography will be removed, that has not happened yet. --Hartley Patterson 01:22, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
Obviously. COFS 04:39, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
Well, rumors are not prooven facts, I certainly agree. Therefore it is only discussed here. But if the Scientology Church / Religious Technology Center decides to keep Mr. Rinder's biography online - that is actually no proof he is still on post. In the past in numerous cases the fact was kept confidential for a long time that an important leading manager of the Church has been declared Suppressive Person (SP) or has been put in the Rehabilitation Project Force (RPF) for months and years or has left the Sea Org. Many of these persons are and have been kept in the Sea Org in the so called "Hall of SP" (to work hard for their rehabilitation), only sent on stage occasinally to present at important offical events to sock puppet Mr. Miscavige. Examples are Guillaume Lesevre, Heber Jentsch, Greg Wilhere and others. Whiteheaven 23:05, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Mike_Rinder"
Categories: Biography articles without listas parameter | Biography articles of living people | Stub-Class biography articles | Start-Class Scientology articles | High-importance Scientology articles
probably included.
Got sent this today, possibly Wiki's editor forums?
bb
Your continued donations keep Wikipedia running!
Talk:Mike Rinder
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This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Mike Rinder article.
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* Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
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This article must adhere to the policy on biographies of living persons. Controversial material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately, especially if potentially libelous. If such material is repeatedly inserted or if there are other concerns relative to this policy, report it on the living persons biographies noticeboard.
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Start This article has been rated as Start-Class on the Project's quality scale.
(If you rated the article please give a short summary at comments to explain the ratings and/or to identify the strengths and weaknesses.)
Although I don't agree with User:Andrew eagles' use of revert warring tactics in regard to this article (and I've given him a 24 hour block for violating the 3RR), I think he was correct to delete these two sentences: "Rinder oversees all overt and covert activities of OSA and subordinate organizations. He has a particular hatred for former members of the Church of Scientology, refering to them as "apostates" and "wackos"." They lack sourcing and the second sentence in particular seems to me to be very biased. Please don't restore them as they are; find sources if you can, and try to make them accord with the NPOV policy. -- ChrisO 00:03, 1 April 2006 (UTC)
Oops, my bad. I saw that info was being deleted from AndroidCat and Fahrenheit451's edits and automatically assumed NPOV. I read the OSA article more thoroughly (and thus he would have broken the 3RR rule there anyway so I don't feel guilty for his block thankfully) but will take more care in future. Thanks Chris, ĢĿ€Ñ §τοĿĿ€ŖγŤč 00:31, 1 April 2006 (UTC)
Well, since you have effectively copied those two sentences to the talk page for discussion and for an attempt to find sources, I won't restore them. I will, however, restore what else Andrew deleted in a supposed attempt to "remov[e] incorrect & misleading data" -- namely, every single external link the article had except the official biography of Rinder on www.scientology.org .
One of the links is mislabelled; it isn't a USA Today interview with Mike Rinder (though I think it does count as sourcing for the statement that Rinder calls former Scientologists "wackos": "Both expressed their dissatisfaction with previous coverage of Scientology by major media outlets, and they warned against what they perceived to be the unreliability of the faith's critics -- "the wackos," as Rinder described them." "Rinder dismisses Christman as a "wacko" and says her allegations are "absolute bullshit."" [1]) We'll probably want to look and see if we can find the original USA Today interview with Rinder, though. -- Antaeus Feldspar 03:42, 1 April 2006 (UTC)
Mike Rinder was never a member of the Guardian's Office. I am sure you cannot find any citation to the contrary as it never happened. Elruhr 06:23, 16 January 2007 (UTC)
His biography page at www.scientology.org states that "his first involvement with the Church’s external affairs came in 1980"; this must have been with the GO, as it had not been replaced by OSA at that time. However, none of the references supports the statement about him holding the post at Flag Land Base, so I've fact tagged this. Also, the external ref to an article in the 'LA Times' is not an "interview with Mike Rinder" as labelled; it's a piece about Tom Cruise in which Rinder is just quoted in passing: would anyone object to me deleting it from the Mike Rinder page? DavidCooke 03:49, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Rumour
It has been reported in background Scientology circles that Mr. Rinder has left the Church of Scientology, probably after doing the UK radio program "Talk Sport" on May 20th 2007. As he is or was the Head of Office of Special Affairs this is of importance. Mr. Rinder managed all international legal affairs and knows therefore "all" confidential actions and agreements. If he speakes out (improbable) there will be an earthquake in Scientology.
I have no 100% prooven evidence of the fact at hand. whiteheaven —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Whiteheaven (talk • contribs) 12:19:01, August 19, 2007 (UTC).
Wikipedia doesn't need rumours and gossip. Got any sources for this "it has been reported" claim of yours? wikipediatrix 18:18, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
Anonymous rumor mongering at best. Possibly Mike Rinder kicked somebody's shin too hard. COFS 21:23, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
The sources are an anonymous post by an ex-member to an Internet forum 'confirmed' by another anonymous poster who added details. That's all so far, apart from Mr Rinder not having been seen by the media since the above date. Obviously if he has left his official Church biography will be removed, that has not happened yet. --Hartley Patterson 01:22, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
Obviously. COFS 04:39, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
Well, rumors are not prooven facts, I certainly agree. Therefore it is only discussed here. But if the Scientology Church / Religious Technology Center decides to keep Mr. Rinder's biography online - that is actually no proof he is still on post. In the past in numerous cases the fact was kept confidential for a long time that an important leading manager of the Church has been declared Suppressive Person (SP) or has been put in the Rehabilitation Project Force (RPF) for months and years or has left the Sea Org. Many of these persons are and have been kept in the Sea Org in the so called "Hall of SP" (to work hard for their rehabilitation), only sent on stage occasinally to present at important offical events to sock puppet Mr. Miscavige. Examples are Guillaume Lesevre, Heber Jentsch, Greg Wilhere and others. Whiteheaven 23:05, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Mike_Rinder"
Categories: Biography articles without listas parameter | Biography articles of living people | Stub-Class biography articles | Start-Class Scientology articles | High-importance Scientology articles
Kookaburra
Gold Meritorious Patron
I dont have anything agains Mike Rinder, just wondered about the position he could be in right now and what other people think about him.
In fact, if he has left RTC and he continues to apply Scn tech, and I think he will, thats all automatism, he has to do a workout of the lower conditions and then at some moment when he might arrive at your door, hypothetically, he will have to ask you: Dear Bea, what is needed and wanted.
That would be fair.
B.
And further, I just try to create some TA.
Well, it appears to me that he has just done doubt, so his next step would be to strike a blow to the enemies of the group he has joined. And make up damage done. I certainly hope he does this. He is in a position of strength, even if he does not realize it now. He has the goods on DM, and can send the little rat to jail where he belongs, and free the 39 other Int execs, including his wife, that are wrongfully imprisoned.
Hopefully he is reading this thread. Unlike many SO members, he knows what goes on on the internet.
DM, I hope you are worried. You should be. Your karma is about to hit you in the face.
So Mike Rinder won't be knocking on Bea's door asking what's needed and wanted. He will be asking for her signature.
Regards,
Kookaburra
Little Bear Victor
Silver Meritorious Patron
Yes, except that you gain the incredible state of Freedom from Conditions when you leave Scientology. No longer is your life "determined" by whether your stats are up this week or not. My "stats" of living life and enjoying it are definitely uptrending but I ain't going to graph that.
Freedom from constant application of "lower conditions" is an important step in the direction of living, if you want my opinion on the matter. I even have some "dynamics" now that they are no longer regulated by a "papal decree" of "No dynamics for you, bud, until we have a cleared planet!"
I wouldn't sign a thing if Mike showed up at my doorstep. I'd throw away the paper and would say "Well done! You should be proud that you realized where this vicious trend was inevitably going to lead you and the rest of the planet, decided to no longer support the insanity and managed to leave the place against all odds! Now go live your life!"
Victor
Bea Kiddo
Crusader
Yeah, well. Though we have crossed paths, he doesn't know me from a hole in the wall. I do wish him well all the same.
Kookaburra
Gold Meritorious Patron
You do have a good point, there. I don't apply weekly conditions either, lower or otherwise. It is a good thing to be free of.
On the other hand, I do try and take some responsibility for the effects I create. This is really all that it's about, whether you put a label on it or not. And it's really all that is being asked of Mike. He can do that or not, but it is his own life that will be most affected by his choices. I hope that he does something to help the people he left behind in the SP room. And maybe makes a few public statements about what he knows. Then he'll be truly free to enjoy the rest of his life.
Little Bear Victor
Silver Meritorious Patron
That's right -- first things first.
Lulu Belle
Moonbat
Cathy.
Or one of his kids.
I'm sure that will be what is attempted.
Not sure if it will work or not, because I don't know where they stand.
Little Bear Victor
Silver Meritorious Patron
Cathy.
Or one of his kids.
I'm sure that will be what is attempted.
Not sure if it will work or not, because I don't know where they stand.
Not a chance. DM knows Mike would talk them into leaving. Wouldn't happen.
If he's really made up his mind, nothing will make him go back. And he will get his family out sooner or later. I have no doubt about that. The question is how long will it take.
Mike has, by the by, been under security watch a few times, even several years before he went into the Hall, for having doubts about the SO. So this is not totally new. I just don't know that he's ever blown before.
V
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