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Quick Question about "Fair Game" from Someone who Has Never Been a Scientologist...

Discussion in 'Fair Game and Disconnection Victims' started by never-a-member1, May 12, 2016.

  1. never-a-member1

    never-a-member1 New Member

    Hi,

    I have been lurking for a bit, and this is my first post. Thank you for sharing, and I hope that you are all healing well from your past experiences.

    I had the following quick questions about "Fair Game" particularly in the DC, NY, and London regions:

    1. Do Scientologists in those regions regularly "follow" and harass non-members (people who have never been members or involved in church activities) as part of "Fair Game"?

    2. What are the reasons for which they would do that if the non-member is not a journalist or someone with a "pulpit" for criticizing Scientology? How "easy" is it to be labeled an "SP" and "followed" for an extended period of time if you have never been a church member and are not a journalist/writer type? Is simply being "annoying" to a very high level official enough?

    3. Would Scientologists stalk a non-member just because they think (rationally or not) that that person would lead someone away from Scientology?

    As my screen name shows, I have never been in Scientology, but I am asking questions about "Fair Game" because I may be experiencing an issue with gang stalking which could be Scientology-related. I have had only one brief encounter in passing with a very famous Scientologist (at a non-Scientology event). This problem started to intensify in early 2015 if that rings a bell with anyone who might have left the church recently and knows of any major operations against non members and never members.

    Thanks!
     
  2. svonhatten

    svonhatten Patron with Honors

    Re: Quick Question about "Fair Game" from Someone who Has Never Been a Scientologist.

    Never-a-member,

    I can only share from my own personal experience. I haven't heard them harassing non-members unless that person was a former Scientologist (especially high-ranking) or a journalist of some kind, but maybe they've started targeting others too. I've been followed and some of my property was even damaged after I left the cult completely in 2010, so I have a reality on this at least.

    If I understand your post correctly, you are trying to lead a person away from Scientology? If so, it could be possible that they are trying to dig up dirt on you to present to whomever this friend is of yours that you are trying to lead away from Scientology since the "church" doesn't have a PC folder on you with all your dirty little secrets. However, if you aren't speaking critically about Scientology with any Scientologists and you don't post "anti-Scientology" information on the Internet, then it wouldn't make sense why they would be stalking you unless there's some other threat they might feel towards you...

    Meeting a Scientologist once at a non-Scientology event doesn't usually ignite the war machine...

    Maybe others can provide more detailed answers to your questions than me. In any case, I hope this helps.
     
  3. never-a-member1

    never-a-member1 New Member

    Re: Quick Question about "Fair Game" from Someone who Has Never Been a Scientologist.




    Thanks, svonhatten. That is helpful.

    I was not trying to lead anyone away from Scientology. I tend to stay out of peoples' religious choices actually (even if I might have a personal opinion about it). One of the explanations that I thought of for what I had been experiencing was that my behavior towards someone else (a possible Scientologist) might have been misconstrued in that way.

    If I made any critical statements or expressed any personal opinions about Scientology, they would have been with friends of mine who have not actually told me that they are Scientologists. The behavior that I'm seeing seems more like "intimidation" or "revenge" than "digging up dirt", though.
     
  4. Dulloldfart

    Dulloldfart Squirrel Extraordinaire

    Re: Quick Question about "Fair Game" from Someone who Has Never Been a Scientologist.

    1. Unlikely.

    2. Yeah. Why would they bother? There are only really two reasons to go to the trouble of labelling someone an SP, let alone interacting more with them. First, and this is supposed to be the only reason for it, is to protect Scientologists getting Scn services from losing their gains (if you're feeling all warm and fuzzy from a great session you just had you don't want to get into continual heavy pointless arguments with your aggressive neighbour over nothing). Secondly, where someone has discovered some unpleasant truths about Hubbard/Scn and insists on telling them to his Scientology friends/family in order to protect them one way or another: in this case the label of "SP" is designed to stop still-in Scientologists from learning about things that would take them and their money out of the bubble.

    3. Unlikely. Scientologists tend not be vengeful. Scn tends to (or tended to years ago) attract people who were more to the more decent end of the scale. Avoid yes, stalk no. Just as you would tend to avoid someone who always wanted to discuss things you would rather not talk about.

    Paul
     
  5. never-a-member1

    never-a-member1 New Member

    Re: Quick Question about "Fair Game" from Someone who Has Never Been a Scientologist.


    Okay, thanks, Paul. That gives me a better idea of their behavior and the kinds of things that they will/will not get involved in. It leads me to believe that this may not be related...
     
  6. Hypatia

    Hypatia Pagan

    Re: Quick Question about "Fair Game" from Someone who Has Never Been a Scientologist.

    Scienos are not allowed to be around "suppressives" or talk to them. Yet harassment can and does happen-however, the harassment is carried out by cult operatives. Rank and filers take off like scared bunnies when they see an SP or anyone they've been told not to talk to even if the person was not formally declared.
     
  7. Terril park

    Terril park Sponsor

    Re: Quick Question about "Fair Game" from Someone who Has Never Been a Scientologist.

    I've been a critic and more importantly been promoting that
    one can do anything in Scn outside the CO$ for 16+ years. I
    have never had any problems from CO$ with regard to that
    although I expected I would. A few months ago I did get some
    group phone calls from OSAbots about an alleged website of mine.
    This is the website with phone numbers to call if one wants to leave
    the SO. Its not mine but my phone no is there for those in the UK.

    The only UK stalking activity I can recall is after Anon protests
    in London a handfull of people were followed to trace addresses
    and a few cease and desist letters sent from CO$ lawyers.
     
  8. Enthetan

    Enthetan Master of Disaster

    Re: Quick Question about "Fair Game" from Someone who Has Never Been a Scientologist.

    If you were simply rude or obnoxious to a Scientologist celebrity, I doubt Scientology would care.

    If you came across as somebody who was a threat (for example, had scandalous dirt on a celebrity and threatened either blackmail or exposure), then they would care very much, and you might get targeted.
     
  9. never-a-member1

    never-a-member1 New Member

    Re: Quick Question about "Fair Game" from Someone who Has Never Been a Scientologist.

    Thanks, Hypatia and Terril park.

    The kind of behavior that both of you are describing makes it sound like most often the Scientology harassment is on-going but not continuous throughout the day and that it tends to involve specific actions or incidents (phone calls or following someone in order to find an address). My problem is more of the "continuous" sort.

    Also, it sounds as if most of the "rank and file" couldn't be near me, then the harassment wouldn't be so "continuous". I'm starting to think it might be another group. My thought had been that it was Scientology because of the types of people who seemed to be involved.

    Thanks again.
     
  10. I told you I was trouble

    I told you I was trouble Suspended animation

    Re: Quick Question about "Fair Game" from Someone who Has Never Been a Scientologist.


    Hello and welcome to ESMB.

    Re the line above (emphasised by me) ... how annoying were you to whoever it was you were being annoying to? Without a bit more info it's hard to answer your question but it's certainly possible (if unlikely) that they are stalking and harassing you, that is what some of them are employed there to do, though in recent years they have no hope of keeping up with the amount of "annoying" people in existence.

    :biggrin:
     
  11. never-a-member1

    never-a-member1 New Member

    Re: Quick Question about "Fair Game" from Someone who Has Never Been a Scientologist.

    Thanks, Enthetan and "I told you I was trouble".

    As to the "annoying" issue, I took a picture with the celebrity without formally asking first (I was kind of waiting in line to take a picture). I thought it was okay, though. They seemed to be ready for the picture, and it was a public event. With the other "possible Scientologist" (not a celebrity), I might have flirted with them in an awkward way at one point, but I didn't think it was offensive.

    The only other ways that I think I could have been "annoying" is if one of my school friends to whom I mentioned an opinion on Scientology's attitude towards psychiatry (since I was a psychology major) is actually a Scientologist and never told me about it.
     
  12. I told you I was trouble

    I told you I was trouble Suspended animation

    Re: Quick Question about "Fair Game" from Someone who Has Never Been a Scientologist.


    Ah, OK thanks ... I very much doubt if it is the cofs in that case, I was being serious in my previous post when I said they can no longer keep up with people who are in opposition to them and what you did (or may have done) is minor in comparison.

    :)
     
  13. never-a-member1

    never-a-member1 New Member

    Re: Quick Question about "Fair Game" from Someone who Has Never Been a Scientologist.


    Okay, that makes sense. I wasn't sure since it sounds like they hit back pretty hard at the people who are perceived to cross them in some way, but I wasn't sure how high the threshold was for getting on their nerves.
     
  14. Karen#1

    Karen#1 Gold Meritorious Patron

    Re: Quick Question about "Fair Game" from Someone who Has Never Been a Scientologist.

    I disagree with almost all posters here, speaking from 40 years inside and a YouTube Channel that creates an Email box that deluges me with Email Globally so I get to hear what is happening here there and everywhere.

    You must first understand the nature of the beast.

    There is an old Arab saying "He who steals your cow, will also steal your wife."
    What does that mean ? It means a thief is a thief is a thief.

    The nature of the beast of the cult is vicious retaliation and intimidation.
    It is an equal opportunity employer.

    When you have done or said anything to make the Cult deem you an *Enemy* the steamroller truck of the CULT is relentless and
    could care less what counselling or involvement you have had or not had.

    I have had *NEVER-INs* report FAIR GAME because that is the nature of what Scientology does to its enemies.

    Karen.
    I have a series on a playlist of what Office of Special Affairs does.
    150 of them in Los Angeles alone and FAIR GAME is their turf.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FWw7jpp9SQ8
     
  15. HelluvaHoax!

    HelluvaHoax! Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on

    Re: Quick Question about "Fair Game" from Someone who Has Never Been a Scientologist.

    Agreed.

    It takes a while for a Scientologist of any denomination (e.g. COS, Indie, FZ, Ron's Org, et al) to realize that FAIR GAME still remains in force, and is per policy. Observably this is true--despite the deceitful little rhetorical flourish called the "Fair Game is canceled" policy that Hubbard typed out in 30 seconds to absolve himself of 30 years of human rights atrocities.

    However, when a Scientologist finally "cognites" that the FAIR GAME thuggery is very much alive (typically because the cult has targeted them or a loved one) they are often left with the mistaken conclusion that the practice of FAIR GAME is triggered by and standardly adheres to Hubbard's sociopathic policies. That couldn't be further from the truth.

    REASON: Because in Scientology there are no "policies" that are routinely followed. Scientology "policy" is a cruel hoax on the gullible and the naive--because a person can be FAIR GAMED for any reason whatsoever. It doesn't have to be related to "policy" in the slightest. If a senior Scientology executive doesn't like someone for purely personal reasons, or wants to rip them off, FAIR GAME is a diabolical tool they can use. Because they will have the full support of the cult and nobody will dare question them. Example: When L. Ron Hubbard decided he wanted all the money in the Scn. Mission network. So he went Gestapo and declared "upstats" on the spot. The same folks Hubbard had previously issued Kha-Khan statuses to (i.e. A Kha-Khan is a person whose stats are so high that they can be forgiven the death penalty 10 times). But, in reality, no Scientologist has ANY ethics protection, let alone 10 reprieves, if the cult guru wants to steal their shit. The fastest way to lose one's Kha-Khan status, by the way, is to even slightly interfere with the cult's senior policy, known as Kha-Ching.

    Likewise for non-Scientologists. Nobody who crosses the cult's path is immune from irrational attacks.

    Because the cult is quite insane and their actions are neither predictable nor even slightly sensible the majority of the time.

    And finally, one has to wonder: WHAT DO SCIENTOLOGISTS GAIN EXACTLY FROM ALL THEIR FURIOUS SOCIOPATHIC BLACK OPS AND FAIR GAME ATTACKS?

    ANSWER: Nothing. Absolutely nothing. Except for a momentary feeling that they helped save the planet. That transient sensation lasts until they too are blown and targeted by the cult's next HE&R campaign (Hate, Entropy* & Revenge).





    [SUP]* [/SUP] Entropy - noun: (def 2) lack of order or predictability; gradual degeneration, degradation, decline and collapse into chaos.

     
  16. Lord Xenu

    Lord Xenu Patron Meritorious

    Re: Quick Question about "Fair Game" from Someone who Has Never Been a Scientologist.

    I will suggest another possible scenario; anyone who is deemed to be a threat in anyway to a 'big being' or management level scifag could be targeted by that person using their cult (and not necessarily OSA) connections.
    I hope to be able to elaborate at some point in the future. :hourglass:
     
  17. svonhatten

    svonhatten Patron with Honors

    Re: Quick Question about "Fair Game" from Someone who Has Never Been a Scientologist.

    Hmm... I admit that Fair Game policy is around and practiced by CoS, but I think the main issue is about whether "Never-in" is the target of a Fair Game campaign.

    The possibility certainly exists, but I certainly hope s/he isn't a target. Based on what they've said, I highly doubt CoS would be running some kind of Fair Game campaign - although an awkward flirtation with a celebrity Scientologist does sound a bit like a possible motive if she/he's high enough in the church and was offended in some capacity. After that, it's a KR and your party's over.

    This is, after all, the same church that went shopping for a wife for Tom Cruise, so... who knows what would set them off? In general, though, I just doubt it. But if they are conducting a Fair Game campaign, it wouldn't surprise me. Most of the "sane Scios" have left. The ones that remain are either willfully ignorant, crazy, or just downright evil... :nervous:
     
  18. HelluvaHoax!

    HelluvaHoax! Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on

    Re: Quick Question about "Fair Game" from Someone who Has Never Been a Scientologist.


    Yes, all true.

    There is no algorithm that predicts Scientology's use of the FAIR GAME doctrine.

    Perhaps it can be said that the only pattern-recognition metric that can be observed is that: THOSE WHO INTERACT WITH SCIENTOLOGISTS ARE MORE LIKELY TO BE VICTIMIZED AND/OR FAIR GAMED BY SCIENTOLOGY. That's why less non-scientologists get fair gamed. It is analogous to hitting tennis balls near a raging bonfire. The closer you are to the fire the more likely and frequently the ball goes in and burns up.

    Just a parting thought. WHAT EXACTLY IS SCIENTOLOGY HOPING TO ACCOMPLISH BY FAIR GAMING PEOPLE?

    ANSWER: Agreement. That is all that Scientology was ever about from its very inception. The cult's insatiable obsession with money stats is simply an indicator of how much agreement they have gotten. The goal isn't money--it's Total Slavery. Once that is attained, the money automatically comes with it.
     
  19. HelluvaHoax!

    HelluvaHoax! Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on

    Re: Quick Question about "Fair Game" from Someone who Has Never Been a Scientologist.

    ..

    CORRECTION:

    Scientific research reveals that there actually is an algorithm that predicts the likelihood that one will encounter the Scientology thuggery known as "Fair Game".


    [​IMG]


    DVF = (PF)(CIL + CFP)[SUP]2[/SUP]


    DVF = Degree of Victimization by Fairgame
    P= Proximity (to Scientologists)
    F= Frequency of contact (with Scientologists)
    CIL = Cult's Income Lines
    CFP = Celebrity's FSMing Potential
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2016
  20. Terril park

    Terril park Sponsor

    Re: Quick Question about "Fair Game" from Someone who Has Never Been a Scientologist.

    I second that.