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Quieting One's Mind - Getting Rid of Background Noise

lkwdblds

Crusader
And some people come somewhat to their senses and leave the official cult but still carry around in their thinking much of the cult like thinking processes.

There is "in" the cult and there is entirely "out" of the cult. There also seems to a vast "halfway" that many do have to work their way through.

Did black & white get replaced with color?

Very well stated. You damn well better believe it! If a person found anything of value while in the cult and it benefitted him/her, they would be wise to incorporate that into their life and still use and develop those skills!!!

For those who got nothing out of the cult, then they would leave behinde everything they were exposed to, all 100% of it. Both types of peopole are correct in their actions.

Both types exist and both have the right to come to their own conclusions as to whether they gained anything of value during the time they were in the cult. AS FAR AS I CAN SEE, BOTH ARE EQUALLY 100% OUT OF THE CULT. THEY NO LONGER SUPPORT IT, FINANCIALLY OR OTHERWISE, AND WHEN ASKED ABOUT THEIR EXPERIENCES, THEY VEHEMENTLY DISCOURAGE ANY NEW PEOPLE FROM GETTING INVOLVED AND THEY ALSO BOTH TELL THEIR RESPECTIVE STORIES OF THE TERRIBLE AND EVIL THINGS WHICH HAPPENED TO THEM WHILE THEY WERE IN THE CULT!

Persons who acknowledge and support the bold type passage in my previous paragraph are truly free of the cult. IMHO, those who insist that their opinion is the only possible correct option are still trapped in the cult. They are carrying on a cult policy by asserting "It's my way or the highway." That is a piece of the tech of virtually all cults! To be truly out of the cult and not using any portion of the old cult tech, one must be able to allow others to believe in and assert their own views.

A two valued system, "its all black or its all white", is not the way to approach life in this particular universe. Gradations of rightness are more the order of the day. Very seldom, if ever, can one say that something is 100% right. Take the statement, "Though shallt not kill", though usually right there are many possible instances when killing is the correct thing to do.
Lakey
 
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lkwdblds

Crusader
Defining delusion can be tricky. In general, I agree that "objective reality" (you know, the one we all sense but have different perceptions of) is the test medium. It's just that none of us know what "objective reality" really is. We know what our senses tell us and our minds determine, but if we really saw reality, we wouldn't need science to tell us what we were seeing. We'd just see it. Probably better to refer to it as "intersubjective reality".

Boy, you have hit the nail on the head!

For example, a person pounds his hand on the table and bellows, "This is solid oak!!" It's real, I can touch it, I have objective reality that it is real.

The actual state of affairs is far, far different from this person's objective reality. That table is almost empty space. The atomic particles are spread relatively thinly throughout the table top! What is more, those particles are not at rest, they are whizzing around at tremendous velocities.

We are conditioned to think "inside the box" of what our body senses tell us. This works pretty well for our macro world. For the micro world, it is a total bust.

I agree with your post and the conclusions which you have reached.
Lakey
 

lkwdblds

Crusader
Lakey, I not only appreciate you "got" what I was talking about - but that you expanded on it.

Thank you.

Toady

Thank you Toady!!! Your post is not what I expected. I had underestimated you. The fact that you acknowledged me and appreciate that I expanded on the topic means a lot to me. You made my day! Per my own definitions, you are truly 100% out of the cult! Well done to you and keep up your fine posting!
Lakey
 

uniquemand

Unbeliever
Not sure how you got my post was in reference TO Lakey rather than ABOUT a general point he made in his post ( that I quoted in full ).

Please go back and s l o w l y re-read his post.......hopefully you'll get what I'm talking about. If you don't.......skip it :)

I'll give you, you are dang good at jumping to conclusions from very thin air !

I'm also good at tennis. :)
 

lkwdblds

Crusader
I love to dance too. I find it very liberating.

You might like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OmiptO5nZrc



Wow, Smart One and Smila, your comments and the video on dance are very uplifting. That dance video is really aesthetic.

I have an opinion that both music and dance are somewhat unique in that they have to do with vibrations in the physical universe. In particular, when those vibrations match up with those of a individual, then the person is raised in tone up into the aesthetic band.

I hear passages of music where the vibration is so strong that I feel myself, as a being, matching the vibration This takes one up to a feeling of exhillaration or higher. Lyrics can be mixed in and when done in an artful manner, the lyrics can greatly enrich a musical composition. Things being sung in Italian or Latin can be very beautiful. German and French work well too. English doesn't work as well, at least for me, it is too nasal and banal in classical music. For rock, it is great. Shubert's "Ave Maria" would be one such example. Here is a link sung in German:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQVz6vuNq7s

In dance, this seems to be one instance where a person's body enhances the person. Dancing, as a pure spirit, seems tame to me. Has anyone experienced thrills from dancing without a body?

The body gives the dancer a chance to create rhythms with his or her moves and by doing so, they intrepret the music which is playing and add to its meaning and life. Again vibrations come heavily into play.

Lakey
 

Auditor's Toad

Clear as Mud
Thank you Toady!!! Your post is not what I expected. I had underestimated you. The fact that you acknowledged me and appreciate that I expanded on the topic means a lot to me. You made my day! Per my own definitions, you are truly 100% out of the cult! Well done to you and keep up your fine posting!
Lakey

Thank you. I have known for many years I'm well out of the cult - and they out of me. About '90 was it.

As for " belief systems " Christianity ( in its many varations and forms ) is so much better written ( and explained ) than poor old Hubturd was ever able to do with his volumes of mis-matched writings....wonder if that is why he seemed so against Christianity per se ? That'd make a nice thread.

( Oh, I just noticed in my kitchen is still a framed 8 x 10 of something ( in pretty colors ) by Hubbard about " Joy of Creation " ( or some such )... hope that doesn't count as a "hook" - ROFL !
 

uniquemand

Unbeliever
Thank you. I have known for many years I'm well out of the cult - and they out of me. About '90 was it.

As for " belief systems " Christianity ( in its many varations and forms ) is so much better written ( and explained ) than poor old Hubturd was ever able to do with his volumes of mis-matched writings....wonder if that is why he seemed so against Christianity per se ? That'd make a nice thread.

( Oh, I just noticed in my kitchen is still a framed 8 x 10 of something ( in pretty colors ) by Hubbard about " Joy of Creation " ( or some such )... hope that doesn't count as a "hook" - ROFL !

Christianity is well-written? I guess if you like parables and scary creation myths involving insanely jealous father-gods, that's true.

I wish all religions would just go away and let the rest of us get on with solving the real problems, here and now.
 

Auditor's Toad

Clear as Mud
Christianity is well-written? I guess if you like parables and scary creation myths involving insanely jealous father-gods, that's true.

I wish all religions would just go away and let the rest of us get on with solving the real problems, here and now.

In the context to Hubturds writings ( of which was the parameters of what was in the post ) why hell yes Christianity ( as in the bible ) is extremely well written !

It isn't that I "like" it, it is that in comparison to what Hubturd wrote it is infinitely better done.

Here is a little hint: compare populations. LOL !
 

FoTi

Crusader
Yep, I didn't know that Serge Gerbode had developed this field after leaving C of S. I need to modify what I said and add that I know of no metaphysically active person, except for a few that were exposed to Hubbard, who are conversant with the concept of obtaining a vanishment by seeing something as it is.

Thanks FoTi!
Lakey

There are others who have left CoS and followed Gerbode......several post on this board regularly. I took the basic TIR course, myself, which was recommended to me by a highly classed auditor who posts on this board. To me, it was a kind of slightly altered version of Book I along with a little Self Analysis and a bit of Prep Checking and a minor (much less effective in my opinion) form of ruds handling...no meters involved at that level of TIR. The woman who taught the course was a Class VI, but she did not let that be known to anyone else in the class because none of them had any contact with Scientology and the subject was never mentioned. It sometimes behooves an auditor to get certified in TIR so that they can advertise and work and make themselves known under a different modality that is more acceptable to the general public and doesn't have the bad reputation that Dianetics and Scientology has made for themselves and isn't connected to the name of LRH, other than the fact that if one reads Gerbode's book, he mentions that he did study Scientology, as part of his research. Having had some very good auditing from students on the BC at ASHO back in the 70's and having audited others on Book I with some dynamite results, I was not impressed with TIR....for me, it turned out to be kind of waste of money to take the course. But.... I have heard some rave results sort of second hand from others who have spoken to those who had received TIR from someone who had more advanced training in TIR who thought it was the cat's meow.....just no personal experience of my own.

I was very impressed with Scientology in my intro session at CCLA back in '73.....I experienced that peaceful calm at the end of the session....and I was sold....hooked from then on....I wanted more....and I got it. Later, after more auditing I experienced greater degrees of peaceful calm and quieting of mental stuff...or whatever it was that was bothering me, until finally one day I found myself in a heavenly sort of state of nothingness and not in contact with the physical universe. I really liked this....the only problem is that one can't live life on the physical plane if one is not in contact with it. I guess it would be more ideal if one could be either in or out of, or in contact or out of contact with the physical universe at will, and be able to experience that heavenly peaceful state whenever one desired to do so.
 

uniquemand

Unbeliever
There are others who have left CoS and followed Gerbode......several post on this board regularly.

You rang? I don't actually "follow" Gerbode, but I really appreciate the work he did cleaning up the parts of the subject worthy of retention and incorporating them into a model that properly referenced them and made them useful to people who spoke the language of psychology. Gerbode doesn't want any followers. In fact, he's retired, and has been for a while. Mostly, he plays medieval music and minds his own business. I don't think he takes clients anymore, and he only speaks at the request of the foundation he set up to promote metapsychology, during their Symposiums. Metapsychology is multi-authored, though Gerbode is rightly credited for the common terminology and approach shared by metapsychologists.

I took the basic TIR course, myself, which was recommended to me by a highly classed auditor who posts on this board. To me, it was a kind of slightly altered version of Book I along with a little Self Analysis and a bit of Prep Checking and a minor (much less effective in my opinion) form of ruds handling...no meters involved at that level of TIR.

The "ruds handling" techniques are de-emphasized, I would agree. There is less formality in a metapsychology session. Procedures are taken to their end points, and whatever is in the way is addressed flexibly. If a person cannot focus because of something that recently disturbed them, this would be taken up. I don't think there is any need for extremely formal "ruds". My standard question before a session is "is there anything currently holding your attention that we should address before we start?" That tends to do the trick.

The woman who taught the course was a Class VI, but she did not let that be known to anyone else in the class because none of them had any contact with Scientology and the subject was never mentioned.

I think I know her. :) Tell her I said hi if you see her. Many advanced Scientology auditors left Scientology and were looking for ways to continue to help people without being involved with the Church, and some see the wisdom in abandoning Hubbard's terminology and fixed thinking, as well. It would introduce too much complexity to explain how metapsychology differs from Scientology to someone who was unfamiliar with Scientology, and would likely only cause a negative reaction. I think any ex-scientologist would recognize the parallels to the lower grades in Metapsychology's curriculum, or the TIR similarities to Dianetics, but the difference in background theory and environment is so striking that they really are very different animals.

It sometimes behooves an auditor to get certified in TIR so that they can advertise and work and make themselves known under a different modality that is more acceptable to the general public and doesn't have the bad reputation that Dianetics and Scientology has made for themselves and isn't connected to the name of LRH, other than the fact that if one reads Gerbode's book, he mentions that he did study Scientology, as part of his research.

Bingo. Furthermore, there are many therapists who have never had anything to do with Scientology who study metapsychology and use it in their practice as their primary mode of delivery. When I took my TIR workshop, I did so with three other students. One was a social worker, one was a psychologist, and the third was a practicing hypnotist. That workshop sprung me into motion, and I started facilitating sessions immediately afterwards and have not stopped, since.

Having had some very good auditing from students on the BC at ASHO back in the 70's and having audited others on Book I with some dynamite results, I was not impressed with TIR....for me, it turned out to be kind of waste of money to take the course.

Sorry to hear that. What I got out of the Workshop was primarily an understanding of their nomenclature and experience running a session according to their protocols. It cut through my uncertainty about what to do when, and got me working. I've also stopped keeping session notes, other than what items were handled and what remains to be worked on, according to the viewer. Better for the viewer's privacy, and means less paperwork for me, as well as more capability of keeping my full attention on the session. I got more out of later workshops, because I was less familiar with those tools. I can see how a BC grad might not get that much out of the initial workshop. For advanced auditors, it might be like learning a new vocabulary. I think there can be a mistake in that, because the vocabulary represents changes in the fundamental model and approach.

But.... I have heard some rave results sort of second hand from others who have spoken to those who had received TIR from someone who had more advanced training in TIR who thought it was the cat's meow.....just no personal experience of my own.

I have some personal experience of my own, but I'm not all the way to the place you describe all the time, yet. It's much closer than it was when I started, though. My friends who have done more work (specifically on identities and influences and postulates) than I have don't rave at all, unless pressed for what they got out of it. They describe what sounds like serenity, to me. Quiet competence and receptive to others. No special powers. :)

I was very impressed with Scientology in my intro session at CCLA back in '73.....I experienced that peaceful calm at the end of the session....and I was sold....hooked from then on....I wanted more....and I got it. Later, after more auditing I experienced greater degrees of peaceful calm and quieting of mental stuff...or whatever it was that was bothering me, until finally one day I found myself in a heavenly sort of state of nothingness and not in contact with the physical universe. I really liked this....the only problem is that one can't live life on the physical plane if one is not in contact with it. I guess it would be more ideal if one could be either in or out of, or in contact or out of contact with the physical universe at will, and be able to experience that heavenly peaceful state whenever one desired to do so.

Gerbode describes this as a sort of polarity. At one pole he describes subjective experience, while the other pole is what is perceived by the individual (their "world"): his article about this on TIR website is "The Mind as the First Environment". Quieting down the subjective end of this doesn't mean you no longer have a world to interact with, or that you cannot be drawn into that world (probably why you keep it). Retaining that subjective clarity and lack of tension is not an easy thing, but is a skill to be mastered. Even masters sometimes lose it. :) I don't claim such mastery, but I am significantly more skilled at recognizing when I am triggered than I used to be, and MUCH better at destimulating whatever was triggered than prior to my training.

For me, it's been very, very positive: what I was looking for in Scientology but found only in connection with the constant disturbance from the Church and from people who were concerned about my involvement with the Church (and rightly so). Since I did most of my training and work, my "downward spiral" completely stopped and has reversed direction. I have no special powers, but I've stopped sabotaging myself, started empowering myself, ceased looking for damaging relationships and accepting honest, real love, reconnected with my children and started my own practice. I am rarely seriously disturbed by much, anymore. Part of this is my acceptance of my sphere of influence, part of it has been adoption of patience (learned in a coma).

Please don't read what I'm saying, here, as an endorsement of Scientology. I was looking for metapsychology when I was studying Scientology, I just didn't know it existed.
 
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Auditor's Toad

Clear as Mud
<snip>
Please don't read what I'm saying, here, as an endorsement of Scientology. I was looking for metapsychology when I was studying Scientology, I just didn't know it existed.
<snip>

It would appear what you say here covers much ground for many of us... we were all looking...just didn't really have defined down to a workable search for what it was we were looking for............yet.

Thanks for that post !
 

TG1

Angelic Poster
I don't want to derail this thread, because I'm enjoying the mediative / quieting / stillness theme to this one.

However, something else comes to mind related to getting rid of background noise ... exercise!

I haven't exercised regularly for years. But a month ago, I started doing so -- every day. And a month later, I feel better and my body hurts less than in years. It is almost magical!

There's a public service television ad on now in the U.S. that's aimed at helping people with arthritis (which I certainly have). The campaign is called "Moving Is the Best Medicine." I can say, given my recent experience, that that is absolutely correct.

Needless to say, my stress levels have gone down as well. I'm sleeping better, too.

I'm not doing all that much, just exercising about half an hour a day, 15 minutes twice a day. Mostly, I'm walking on the treadmill with a lot of incline. I'm breathing hard, for sure, but still in the aerobic range.

Love it, love it, love it!

It's so simple.

TG1
 

Smilla

Ordinary Human
I don't want to derail this thread, because I'm enjoying the mediative / quieting / stillness theme to this one.

However, something else comes to mind related to getting rid of background noise ... exercise!

I haven't exercised regularly for years. But a month ago, I started doing so -- every day. And a month later, I feel better and my body hurts less than in years. It is almost magical!

There's a public service television ad on now in the U.S. that's aimed at helping people with arthritis (which I certainly have). The campaign is called "Moving Is the Best Medicine." I can say, given my recent experience, that that is absolutely correct.

Needless to say, my stress levels have gone down as well. I'm sleeping better, too.

I'm not doing all that much, just exercising about half an hour a day, 15 minutes twice a day. Mostly, I'm walking on the treadmill with a lot of incline. I'm breathing hard, for sure, but still in the aerobic range.

Love it, love it, love it!

It's so simple.

TG1

It's not a derail. Glad you're getting a good result from your exercise - I have noticed the same thing.
 

uniquemand

Unbeliever
I don't want to derail this thread, because I'm enjoying the mediative / quieting / stillness theme to this one.

However, something else comes to mind related to getting rid of background noise ... exercise!

I haven't exercised regularly for years. But a month ago, I started doing so -- every day. And a month later, I feel better and my body hurts less than in years. It is almost magical!

There's a public service television ad on now in the U.S. that's aimed at helping people with arthritis (which I certainly have). The campaign is called "Moving Is the Best Medicine." I can say, given my recent experience, that that is absolutely correct.

Needless to say, my stress levels have gone down as well. I'm sleeping better, too.

I'm not doing all that much, just exercising about half an hour a day, 15 minutes twice a day. Mostly, I'm walking on the treadmill with a lot of incline. I'm breathing hard, for sure, but still in the aerobic range.

Love it, love it, love it!

It's so simple.

TG1

Doing repetitive exercise and focusing on it has a similar effect to doing repetitive auditing commands. The mind stops chattering while you do just one thing. There's a reason people get such a high from yoga, tennis, or any other highly focused repetitive activity.
 

RogerB

Crusader
TG1,

The good news about exercise, being somewhat experienced on the subject myself :biggrin: is that it puts you at knowing cause over what you are doing.

My personal favorites are alpine skiing and surfing as they are challenges in respect to the environment . . . and you'd better pay avid attention to what you are doing or otherwise you can get yourself into strife.

I've actually had some of my biggest ascension experiences and episodes of heightened awareness while engages in these two sports.

But any activity that sets you up to direct your attention on what you are doing has a beneficial outcome . . . .

Exercise has the advantage of being good for the body and its biochemical processes and responses. It keeps "things working."

I had to get back into an exercise regimen after I left off "going to work" and carting my heavy briefcase through the commute to work and the usual up and down the stairs at the office and such.

Living the life of luxury, now I'm fully retired, means no "natural" daily exercise, but a requirement to specifically engage in it.

I had a wake-up call recently. One of our friends on ESMB had to have an operation on the back due to stenosis and calcification that had the individual bent over, unable to stand straight without legs going numb.

I have been having back issues due to old sports injuries(in two locations). (I had earlier nicely handled stenosis in the neck to the surprise of my doctor).

But recently in the press and various med publication I get, I saw material on "handling backs" . . . . and one of the key things is to maintain a correct and good posture so distortions do not set in.

Well the distortion thing was setting in on me . . . sitting all day at the computer tended to have me "hunched" and with a bent spine . . . and since this has been the case in the 3+ years I've been a man of leisure the back pain and problems had increased.

Well, my ESMB friend gave me a wake-up call concurrent with the med literature I received.

I changed my exercise specifics . . . but most important of all I markedly changed my posture and sitting position.

In a month, WOW! what a difference and improvement.

So TG1 . . . you are very right. Exercise is a good thing from many perspectives.

Rog
 
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