Rathbun vs Scientology + Miscavige - February 4th, 2014 Hearing

TG1

Angelic Poster
JB, you are right and righteous!

In fact, the holes in the cult's arguments are growing so large that I wonder if the cult's lawyers no longer care what happens to their clients.

If so, this happens when lawyers find that their clients hamstring them at every turn.

And if so, which law firm will be the first to honor the Texas Bar Association ethics rules by resigning this engagement?

TG1
 

JBWriter

Happy Sapien
And if DM were female he would have texted the following

YL

YLCOHB

If DM were female, I'd consider leaving the gender altogether.
Who wants that on their team? Ick.
I'm already embarrassed on behalf of my species in that he exists, OneOne;
please don't add another woe, even if it's just a wee woe.

To never know real achievement, real success, or real life in all its breadth and wonders?
That sad, sad, wee little man.

JB
 

JBWriter

Happy Sapien
JB, you are right and righteous!

In fact, the holes in the cult's arguments are growing so large that I wonder if the cult's lawyers no longer care what happens to their clients.

If so, this happens when lawyers find that their clients hamstring them at every turn.

And if so, which law firm will be the first to honor the Texas Bar Association ethics rules by resigning this engagement?

TG1

I've no idea who or even if resignation(s) will ever come, but it's a fine, fine privilege to watch the process evolve and the players play.
Like everyone, I suppose, I'm rooting for lots of people - both in New Braunfels and out - to win a bit of justice and a bit of peace.

If enough people get their share of justice & peace, everyone wins. :cheerleader:

JB
 

Lulu Belle

Moonbat
Re: Rathbun vs Scientology + Miscavige - February 4th, 2014 Hearing - Trademark Issue

what do you mean "these three were busted off their posts" ? LOL

You sound like a COS spokesperson.

Who busted them off post?

Most likely DM, it's not like there was a comm ev or a group of people who decided they should be removed from post. Like DM is the "Chairman of the Board" of a group of people and they all gather in weekly meetings to discuss things. LOL

You know, the COS in their PR handlings to the public say Marty was dismissed or expelled from the "church". So the Judge or public THINK Marty did a bad job and certain things he did resulted in him being dismissed.

Scientologists THINK Marty committed overts and withholds and thus he "blew" from staff.

All of us normal people who have managed to remove hubbard's bullshit mind controlling techniques of overts & withholds technology from our thinking process, realize Marty ESCAPED from DM and his weirdness.

As did you and everybody else who gets it after some research and looking at the facts of Hubbards tech.


I'm not sure I understand what you are trying to say, or what you thought I was trying to say.

I never said anything about any post removals being fair, or who did them, or for what reason. I'm just saying these three were removed from these posts. RTC was re-orged and these posts ceased to exist.

It's just what happened.

You saying that I was implying it was because anyone did a bad job is an assumption on your part. As all ex-staff and ex-SO know, people got busted off of posts all day every day unfairly. I don't think any ex-staff would ever automatically assume that a bust from post means that the staff member did something wrong.
 

secretiveoldfag

Silver Meritorious Patron
Re: Rathbun vs Scientology + Miscavige - February 4th, 2014 Hearing - Trademark Issue

I'm not sure I understand what you are trying to say, or what you thought I was trying to say.

I never said anything about any post removals being fair, or who did them, or for what reason. I'm just saying these three were removed from these posts. RTC was re-orged and these posts ceased to exist.

It's just what happened.

You saying that I was implying it was because anyone did a bad job is an assumption on your part. As all ex-staff and ex-SO know, people got busted off of posts all day every day unfairly. I don't think any ex-staff would ever automatically assume that a bust from post means that the staff member did something wrong.

What I understood Gib to say was that the general public, including the judge and council would understand this busting off post to mean these individuals were sacked for bad behaviour.

Whereas in fact it was just DM having his fun. And anyone with any sense, like MR, would skedaddle at that point because he would know very well what was going on.

My 2 cents.
 

Mike Laws

Patron Meritorious
Re: Rathbun vs Scientology + Miscavige - February 4th, 2014 Hearing - Trademark Issue

She was arguing that they did not try to enforce their marks, but she was arguing from an assumption that there are marks to enforce. The reason companies like McDonald's go after small restaurants with that name is not only to be a bully (though that happens, too), it's that the law says if you know someone is violating your marks and you don't go after them, you can't go after someone else hammer and tongs at a later date. You either enforce them always, or never.

It might be a very interesting addition to their case to note how many marks have expired due to RTC negligence.

This is absolutely correct, and a much more concise description of what I was trying to say. That, together with the Headly case, has left them unable to defend their marks legally or prevent others from practicing the tech legally.
 

Udarnik

Gold Meritorious Patron
Re: Rathbun vs Scientology + Miscavige - February 4th, 2014 Hearing - Trademark Issue

This is absolutely correct, and a much more concise description of what I was trying to say. That, together with the Headly case, has left them unable to defend their marks legally or prevent others from practicing the tech legally.

I've been involved in a few trademark disputes and in a few planning meetings on such subjects as how to construct logos so as to avoid infringement on things as simple as color scheme. I've also done competitive and linguistic analyses for potential trade names.

Trademark law is one of the very, very few areas of the law where I even have a passing acquaintance.

The whole RTC thing just boggles my mind, because with a minimum of competence, they could have kept their stranglehold on the materials.

I saw this once at a company I used to work for. Management was enamored of "process". The business process had to be just right. There were checklists and process improvement committees and all kinds of horse shit. I was, fortunately, working on a team that ignored all that, because our VP was kinda Kha Khan from a previous success. There was another team developing something that was slightly ahead of our timeline. We offered them some space at our trade show booth about a year before they were supposed to launch their product - we were almost 2 years out, but prepping the market. They refused our offer - they had no materials for the public developed at that time. We had our logos, product description, description of the technical issues, all ready to go. I was flabbergasted. This team was held up as a positive example of meeting all the process hurdles again and again, and here they had done nothing but that - being totally internally, politically focused, they dropped the ball on what mattered - the customer.

I think it's the same with the Co$. Always a Hill 10, always a fire drill, always hitting that Thursday at 2 PM, only looking at the stats DM gives a shit about, and not at the ones the wog world cares to measure. Maybe they would have fared better if the trademark renewal date had fallen on a Thursday?

I'm reminded of that old caution about only using a limited set of metrics to evaluate performance - you get what you measure.
 

Mike Laws

Patron Meritorious
Re: Rathbun vs Scientology + Miscavige - February 4th, 2014 Hearing - Trademark Issue

Re: Statute of Limitations
Great point, Mike, and I think it's perfectly logical, too. :thumbsup:
Except...
...do you think the Co$ attorneys would refrain from advancing an argument simply because facts get in the way? :)
I didn't and don't think they'd WIN using their 'let's-advance-another-specious-argument' tek. I merely think they consistently employ that pre-trial litigation tactic.

As for how long Mr. Rathbun publicly made known his thought/beliefs/practices relative to scientology WITHOUT an action filed against him by Co$? You're 100% correct -- they knew, they failed to take appropriate steps, and they should be estopped from ever saying the phrase "trademark enforcement" ever again. But, they will say it anyway, because they (apparently) can't/won't stop themselves.
Personally, I very much want to hear Ray Jeffrey ask, in open court, with Mike Bennitt's video camera rolling, "Who at CSI and/or RTC authorized Monique Yingling to write a letter to Marty Rathbun's blog?"
Know why? Because it tells Lottie-Dottie-and-every-body that Co$ upper mgmt KNEW the blog was up, KNEW what the blog was about, and their lawyer wrote a letter TO THE BLOG. Such knowledge + action back then, severely limits any 2014 claims of, "duh, we didn't know".

My other hoped-for moment is the day when Ray Jeffrey asks, in open court or in a filing we can all see/read, why it is that the attorneys for RTC&DM object to having the 'pope of scientology' deposed in 2014...when Captain David Miscavige has previously been deposed.

JB

JB, Wow, dude or dudette, you are really paying attention!!!

Graham Berry has an awesome story about deposing DM, where after prolonged brutal fighting to keep DM out of being deposed, judge orders DM to sit for 6 hours and be deposed. Understanding that the COS attorneys would try and burn the time, he apparently instructed Graham to have a stop watch, and time all distractions or deviations and add that to the 6 hours.

COS Mantra ... never let the truth get in the way of the story you want to tell.

Next time Ray comes to the house, will have to relay your hoped for moments.

The other thing that is not widely recognized but has a massive impact on the future was HOW the COS got the Headley case dismissed. The Scilon empire submitted Marc's book in as evidence, a materially accurate record of what happened, then sought protection under the first amendment, this was all religious practice. Though IANAL, my understanding is that how they did this resulted in essentially Scientology saying the courts can't be involved in any aspect of doctrine because of the first amendment, even if it wasn't following hubbards policies. Indies and freezone and all of them are executing their first amendment rights.
 

Terril park

Sponsor
Re: Rathbun vs Scientology + Miscavige - February 4th, 2014 Hearing - Trademark Issue

I'm reminded of that old caution about only using a limited set of metrics to evaluate performance - you get what you measure.

I've not heard of that caution, but its one of the major reasons for the decline of CO$.

If they had as there prime stat delivery of Well done Auditing hours WDAH all else would be well. It may not be the best main stat, but it would require getting new people, training them to deliver auditing even valid charity work in hospitals, and thus good PR. However at events we get square feet of new tiles etc.

The stats Mike Rinder has posted from the various OT committees show abject failure.

http://www.mikerindersblog.org/disastrous-eus-ot-committee-report/

"I have highlighted a few of the most interesting things in red. Not a single one of these reports gives the impression of a flourishing org. In fact, for the most part they are pathetically sad. Their reports covering the activities for an entire quarter focus in many cases on a single individual who got onto services, or people who were “revitalized and planning on starting” or “pledges” for the ideal orgs.

Perhaps the most noticeable thing is that there is more information contained in these reports about WISE, WTH, Criminon, Youth For Human Rights and other “4d campaigns” than there is about selling books or getting people onto services in an org. The “OT Committees” are avoiding the orgs themsleves or “clearing the planet.”

"Frankly, I think this report is the most telling indictment of the state of Corporate Scientology that has ever been published. The overall picture is gloom and doom glossed over with attempted hype and “uptoneness” which fails miserably. This is a snapshot of abject failure."
 

TG1

Angelic Poster
Mike Laws,

You are right, JBWriter rocks.

She's a she.

And I think she's from Texas.

TG1
 

Mike Laws

Patron Meritorious
Mike Laws,

You are right, JBWriter rocks.

She's a she.

And I think she's from Texas.

TG1

TG1, lol, I was pretty sure JB was a man, as an after thought hedged my bets. Former military, and from Texas ... explains my misguided man crush. Love ex military, many of the key folks in my real life are ex military. I am trying to put together a semi formal training for ex military, giving them potential carreers in envioronmental and disaster response.

Is JB also an escapee from the Scilon empire?
 

JBWriter

Happy Sapien
I just checked the online court docket and see it's been updated with...

multiple entries for "OBJECTIONS",
one "Motion", (<---I think from Defendant CSI)
one "Motion to Dismiss", (<----I think from Defendant Sloat)
one "Order", (<----Dying to know!)
but I didn't see Jethro Tull listed. :coolwink:

Still, it's probably a good idea to let the thread sleep. :)

Derail portion here...
JB <-----Texan-by-blood (Mom insists this is biologically transmitted, "per God's grace an' the ghost of ol' Sam Houston".)
JB <-----Yankee by choice (Mom insists this is worse than enlisting @ 18 and atheism combined.)
JB <-----3 MOS total. (2 AIT, 1 OJT all MI Branch)(<----ASVAB measures aptitude, not intellect. My aptitude chromosome RULZ! Tks, Dad!)

/derail.

JB
 
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