Rathbun's views on the Debbie Cook trial.

Infinite

Troublesome Internet Fringe Dweller
..

What's one new, substantial thing that Marty Rathbun has told the world about Scientology that wasn't known prior to his emerging on the scene?
 

xseaorguk

Patron Meritorious
wasn't Marty Rathburn the one who "retrieved" Debbie when she first left?
Took her back into imprisonment?
Or did I get that wrong?
 
Based on what Marty is saying here, currently, I am more repulsed with Greg and Debbie Hughes and Angie Blankenship. Screw these people. Jesus. What is with these fucking people covering up crimes and being paid off with blood money. Sometimes I just want to scream at the top if my lungs.


If Marty needs more time, they might too. And they may be teddy bearish too.
 

Dulloldfart

Squirrel Extraordinaire
Sometimes I just want to scream at the top if my lungs.

So scream. :)

Get a baseball ball or something and smack hell out of the sofa or a mattress and scream and yell and cry and punch and kick until it's all drained away. It's very cathartic.

Shut the windows first or warn the neighbours so they don't call the police (not kidding).

Paul
 

Vittorio

Patron Meritorious
The Temporary Restraining Order(TRO)/Preliminary Injunction (PI) procedure is relatively standard in most states in America. Since 1981 Mike and I had helped Scientology Inc capitalize on it to crush, punish and silence many people. Generally, one can get the TRO with no notice to the defendant, and then the defendant has but ten days to put together a complete defense in a hearing for a PI. That means scrambling together for bread and trying to hire someone competent to enter a thoroughly unremunerative and unrewarding battle field and get him prepared for the unpreparable. Very few that Mike and I could recall had ever been able to get it together in that time frame. So, dozens of times we had used the weapon successfully to muzzle a defendant from the outset and for the remaining two to five year period the case would take to get to ultimate trial. It was like shackling the defendant to the whipping post, then using the two to five years of litigation process to bury, punish, and bankrupt him or her with harassing discovery and motion work. And while ultimately the defendant might prevail at trial (e.g. Gerry Armstrong, Joe Yanny), in many ways the person was ruined and enervated by that time.

He say's this without the faintest remorse. He is the same person, playing the same game, just on another team. It's like a Nazi joining the allies when he knows that the Nazi's are losing the war. He is still a Nazi at heart. The OSA video's of Marty not only show OSA to be borish malicious time wasters, it also shows Marty to be the irrational, violent, thug that he is now and was in the C of S. Miscavige's physical abuse of staff is decades old. Marty Rathbun left corporate Scientology in 2004 and would probably still be there had he not been submitted to 'The Hole'. I don't believe for a moment that he has anything to offer spiritually and has been so knee deep in so much despisable behaviour for so long and shown so little remorse for it, that it is hard for me to support him or his friends in their endeavours. At the end of the day it will be the perpertrator's of the worst abuse in Scientology that will take Scientology down, as we are now seeing as they battle it out in court.

They are not even late cogniter's, they have yet to cognite. Debbie still believes that only such abuse happened at Int. Where has she been for the last 30-40 years? It's happening down in the Org's as well. Terril now feels that Debbie's testimony is proof that it's all down to "one man". Terril, get your head out of the sand. Do you think Hitler stayed in power without support and willing and knowing acomplices? We've been here before with all the court cases in the early to mid 80's and even earlier with that with people who were dismayed at Hubbard's introduction of heavy ethics.

Aside from Marty's statement which I have quoted where he talks about "utterly ruining people", he was also responsible for destroying evidence in the Lisa McPherson case, knew about the bad tech at Flag, as evidenced by Nancy Many (and ironically verified by a post of his), he lovingly introduced the e-meter to ethics cycle's, admits to drawing up legal strategies to destroy people, physically hit people, he brought Annie back to her imprisonment, emotionally caved people in with his "ethics" interviews (Michael Pattinson, is just one example) and someone (allegedly) managed to hold on to his inheritance the whole time whilst the rest of us were expected to hand voer everything and more! Now Debbie, is not as knee deep into the crimes as the axis of evil Rinder-Rathbun-Miscavige, but she knows stuff and that stuff could be damaging to Marty as well, very damaging. No suprise that he turns up on the scene as a hero, but in my eyes is the biggest 'handler' of them all or 'containment agent' acting to protect himself and his hidden goals and agenda's. He control's the income for her legal defense, he arranged the attorney and this will no-doubt influence how things are played out in court and how she present's things.

Marty and Mike have no right to criticise Tommy Davis, who they groomed to be the way he is now and who is doing the job they once did and has far cleaner hands than they could ever hope to have. They're also in no position to criticise people for the gagging order's considering they harrassed people to do the same.

Marty only tells the truth when it suits his regime. There was more than one person (Miscavige) and behind that Ron, responsible for all that has gone wrong. I remember many people in Scientology who did not hurt and abuse people or get on ego trips and even a few who spoke out against the injustice at a great loss to themselves. He has very cleverly avoided jail and is hiding behind the support and naivety of the people he would have onced destroyed, should it have been called for, to give himself an air of innocence and credibility.
 

Veda

Sponsor
I'm very much in favor of the intra-Hubbardite war continuing. It can't help but shake some things loose.

However, I am mindful that the warring parties have a mutual hero...

l-ron-hubbard1.jpg


And mindful also of the effectiveness of this bit of instruction from their mutual hero:

"The objective is to be identified as attackers of popularly considered evils. This declassifies us from former labels..." That bit of Hubbard instruction has been used, by Scientology, with limited success, as the proper "button" had never been found. Yet, now, finally, a truly despised "popularly considered evil" has become available, and it is Scientology itself, in the person of one David Miscavige, its leader.

How Elronic, but, when you think about it, a perfect example of "Pan Determinism," providing Hubbardite camp#2 with a perfect foil - someone who will make them look good in comparison, while forwarding the same fundamental Hubbard agenda.

So let the shaking continue! :happydance: but be mindful....
 

LA SCN

NOT drinking the kool-aid
Petey, I could not bring myself to read the whole thing, it was too long and kind of boring. Can someone please post the highlights of the contents of the dissertation? Perhaps it was all lost in translation...or I don't know...

This was Martys' way of co-opting the spotlight of the Debbie Cook court appearance and making it all about himself...he was the wise c/s etc. etc., couldn't have happened without his help and brilliant intervention...gag. Once again he blithely mentions his contributions to the harm and destruction of many with no sign of remorse. Further, acting as if his past actions constitute a resume to establish his credentials as the leader in bringing down the church. As I stated in a post on another thread, thank god he didn't get to testify. The self aggrandizing would have been more than I could bear.
 

LA SCN

NOT drinking the kool-aid
Based on what Marty is saying here, currently, I am more repulsed with Greg and Debbie Hughes and Angie Blankenship. Screw these people. Jesus. What is with these fucking people covering up crimes and being paid off with blood money. Sometimes I just want to scream at the top if my lungs.

AMEN!!

How do these people - and I include Spin and Marty - live with themselves?

They KNOW the suffering they caused and they KNOW that it still goes on.

Do they think they can just walk away from it and pretend it didn't happen, while those they wronged still suffer?

And go on with their lives without remorse or sense of responsibility or accountability?

These people are not heroes. They are the dregs of the anti-social and need to expend every effort make right and bring to light the wrongs they participated in to deserve to live free lives among honest men and women.
 

LA SCN

NOT drinking the kool-aid
I agree. Still, a huggable thug is nonetheless a thug. The fact is Rathbun remains a thug, and an utterly unrepentant thug at that. He's apparently still in the same business. He just changed gang affiliation.

Not a man to be believed or credited.

I'd like to see him change his life for the better, but there is no sign of that happening yet.


Mark A. Baker

Right on, Mark. :thumbsup: I agree 100%. :yes:
 

LA SCN

NOT drinking the kool-aid
I am going to stick up for Marty and his blog and I will tell you why.

I was in Scientology for 40 years. Twenty of those years included being in the SO or on staff at an org. I am no longer a Scientologist independent or otherwise. Some of my favorite posters here are people like "helluvahoax", "gotta brain", "AnonyMary", "Alanzo" and many others with that type of attitude.

A little over two years ago I began reading about Scientology on the internet and ran into all of the wonderful interviews and reports done by the St. Petersburg Times. That was the first time I had ever heard of Marty Rathbun. It was also the first time I had heard of a lot of the other whistle blowers.

I began reading Marty's blog every night along with many other blogs and message boards and all of them were helpful. Marty was instrumental in exposing much of what Miscavige was doing and while Marty has not disclosed everything by a long shot, he did enlighten me and a lot of other people so I have got to give him grace on that.

To have someone who has been in Scientology for any length of time read a completely anti-Scientology website such as Arnie Lerma's page might turn many people off. While I feel that what is written on these extremely critical websites is most often true, it is a bit overwhelming at first and can be rejected by someone who is just leaving the cult.

Marty's website takes a more gradient approach and allows the reader to reject some of the goings on in Scientology without rejecting all of it. As some of these things that have been going on are exposed one becomes more able to think for themselves.

Then, as one reads more and looks at some of the other websites that are critical of Hubbard and Scientology, more layers of the onion are peeled away. Eventually you get a fuller understanding and will become free and regain your critical thinking.

Because of this I love Marty just as I love all of you.

None of this would have been possible without the internet and I am so thankful for everyone who has contributed to the exposure of the Church of Scientology no matter how large or how small. The truth shall set you free.

Good stuff - Honesty is the best policy; Different strokes for different folks; The truth will out - conventional wisdom supports you and freedom of speech is the soup de jour on ESMB :thumbsup:
 

LA SCN

NOT drinking the kool-aid
So scream. :)

Get a baseball ball or something and smack hell out of the sofa or a mattress and scream and yell and cry and punch and kick until it's all drained away. It's very cathartic.

Shut the windows first or warn the neighbours so they don't call the police (not kidding).

Paul

So true! Sometimes after being ingrained to think dianetics or some therapy is needed to reduce some emotion, it is often easier and cheaper to just get it out of your system by letting yourself experience it. Its just a form of energy to be released.
 

LA SCN

NOT drinking the kool-aid
Yes. More establishing of the indispensability of Marty Rathbun.

Although it would be churlish not to acknowledge his (and his network's) contribution to Debbie's victory in court.

Paul

I would prefer to hear the facts of it from Debbie herself, though, as a sidecheck. This is Debbies' game here; I'll gladly support Marty if he should ever display similar balls.
 
So true! Sometimes after being ingrained to think dianetics or some therapy is needed to reduce some emotion, it is often easier and cheaper to just get it out of your system by letting yourself experience it. Its just a form of energy to be released.

Eh-Hem! Can I just say that this is the aim of most conventional types of counseling and therapy?

Some people have suppressed their feelings so much (usually in order to survive some very challenging or threatening situation or circumstance) that they need to get physical (Paul's idea with the bat) and hit something (non-living) and scream, pound a pillow, etc...to be able to access their emotions more fully.

Most of us can access our hurts, grief, anger and upsets more directly and easily. But I agree...feel your feelings, express your emotions, (in any way and through any means that doesn't harm yourself or any other living thing) and don't stuff or repress them and hold on to them. :thumbsup: No gunnysacking! :biggrin:

Your methods may very. Some people have great success by watching very sad movies or listening to evocative music. Whatever works for you, "so it harms none". :thumbsup:
 

Boomima

Patron with Honors
This seems as good a place to ask this as any. Wasn't there/Isn't there an RPF at Flag? That's where Nancy Many says she was held in the garage while pregnant.

Was Debbie Cook Captain FSO while Nancy Many was in the garage at the Ft. Harrison?


The top officials who leave seem to be surprised (not that there is an RPF) but that they could end up serving on it.
 

La La Lou Lou

Crusader
I cannot believe that a gagging order to not tell of a crime has any validity.

If it had then the guys would be forced to sign one, accept the cash, and be allowed to leave the hold. That is not the case, they are held there, cars confiscated, barbed wire, ill fed, reverse audited and spirits broken.

If everyone that was a witness spoke out despite gagging orders DM would be mincemeat. Lets face it he must be pretty tired reading all our crap.

Actually I wonder if Fybromyalgia is the EP of the hold. Abuse them so that they are so traumatised they cannot function and will be no threat.
 
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