REFUND! YIPPEE!

[Kutta]

I have been working on getting a refund of my money in my account at Saint Hill for a few months now. Written several letters, most recently also sent a Knowledge Report up lines as none of my letters had been answered. Also, the basics, 3 boxes of books and tapes, landed on my doorstep about the time I initially sent a request to Treasury for my refund.

This morning, finally, I had a phone call from Biggi, the DLC (LRH Communicator) at Saint Hill, and apparently everything is now being taken care of. I will receive a routing form in the mail. As long as it doesn't require me to visit any org that's fine with me. I will also be sent a waiver, also fine with me. Then the Claims Verification Board will review things, and I will get my dosh!!

I am over the moon. It has definitely made my day.

 

[EP - Ethics Particle]

Blows against the empire!

EP

 

[Wisened One]

 

[Dulloldfart]

That's great, Gail.

Paul

 

[Kathy (ImOut)]

Yippee and well done.

 

[Kutta]

I forgot to say that the Basics will be picked up by FedEx, paid for by St Hill, and the cost of them has already been refunded to my account!!!!!

 

[Kathy (ImOut)]

I forgot to say that the Basics will be picked up by FedEx, paid for by St Hill, and the cost of them has already been refunded to my account!!!!!

Even more better news.

 

[Axiom142]

I have been working on getting a refund of my money in my account at Saint Hill for a few months now. Written several letters, most recently also sent a Knowledge Report up lines as none of my letters had been answered. Also, the basics, 3 boxes of books and tapes, landed on my doorstep about the time I initially sent a request to Treasury for my refund.

This morning, finally, I had a phone call from Biggi, the DLC (LRH Communicator) at Saint Hill, and apparently everything is now being taken care of. I will receive a routing form in the mail. As long as it doesn't require me to visit any org that's fine with me. I will also be sent a waiver, also fine with me. Then the Claims Verification Board will review things, and I will get my dosh!!

I am over the moon. It has definitely made my day.

I am sorry to be a wet blanket Kutta, but I’m afraid you aren’t home and dry yet.

I had a terrible time getting a refund from St Hill. Getting the CVB routing form was the easy bit. I filled it in to their complete satisfaction, it was sent off and I was told that I would get my money back within a couple weeks, albeit with a deduction for ‘administration’. The LRH Comm saw me before I left the premises and told me that she would be ensuring that it all went smoothly and that she was my ‘terminal’ in this matter. Being very reassured, I relaxed and looked forward to my cheque arriving very soon.

After a couple of weeks, I hadn’t heard anything, so I tried to contact the LRH Comm. The two-faced lying b**ch refused to take my calls and wouldn’t respond to any messages. This attitude was repeated by every other staff member that I tried to contact.

Not surprisingly, I got very angry at this. Why go through all the motions of convincing me that they wanted to sort this out amicably and then just ignore me? Maybe this was part of their plan – get my hopes up, then dash them and refuse to communicate in order to cave me in so that I would just go away?

Well it didn’t work and in fact, resulted in a lot of trouble for them. Eventually, they caved in and gave me a cheque for the whole amount.

I still can’t understand their attitude. If they had trouble raising the money, why not just get in communication and offer to pay me in instalments? I would have settled for this and that would have been the end of the matter. But no, they just ignored me, or more likely couldn’t confront me.

It was this episode that convinced me that the CoS and their staff can never be trusted and that I should oppose them whenever I can. So well done, you lying two-faced scheming hypocrites – you created an enemy for yourselves.

I truly hope you don’t go through this Kutta, but you might want to start making some plans about what you do if they don’t cough up.

Axiom142

 

[pollywannacracker]

Kutta,

My hope is that you get a speedy repayment with no issues.

 

[AngeloV]

"The check is in the mail"

Don't count your money until it's in your hand.

Good luck.

 

[Ted]

I am sorry to be a wet blanket Kutta, but I’m afraid you aren’t home and dry yet.

I had a terrible time getting a refund from St Hill. Getting the CVB routing form was the easy bit. I filled it in to their complete satisfaction, it was sent off and I was told that I would get my money back within a couple weeks, albeit with a deduction for ‘administration’. The LRH Comm saw me before I left the premises and told me that she would be ensuring that it all went smoothly and that she was my ‘terminal’ in this matter. Being very reassured, I relaxed and looked forward to my cheque arriving very soon.

After a couple of weeks, I hadn’t heard anything, so I tried to contact the LRH Comm. The two-faced lying b**ch refused to take my calls and wouldn’t respond to any messages. This attitude was repeated by every other staff member that I tried to contact.

Not surprisingly, I got very angry at this. Why go through all the motions of convincing me that they wanted to sort this out amicably and then just ignore me? Maybe this was part of their plan – get my hopes up, then dash them and refuse to communicate in order to cave me in so that I would just go away?

Well it didn’t work and in fact, resulted in a lot of trouble for them. Eventually, they caved in and gave me a cheque for the whole amount.

I still can’t understand their attitude. If they had trouble raising the money, why not just get in communication and offer to pay me in instalments? I would have settled for this and that would have been the end of the matter. But no, they just ignored me, or more likely couldn’t confront me.

It was this episode that convinced me that the CoS and their staff can never be trusted and that I should oppose them whenever I can. So well done, you lying two-faced scheming hypocrites – you created an enemy for yourselves.

I truly hope you don’t go through this Kutta, but you might want to start making some plans about what you do if they don’t cough up.

Axiom142

I believe I can answer this and come close to the actual situation:

A refund or repayment request comes into the org. In the midst of the struggle to bring this week's GI in, a refund/repayment is a huge out-reality.

Next, once the reality is accepted, and this could take a while, the org doesn't have the money sitting around as ready cash, so they can't pay even if they want to.

They go on hoping: 1) that the requester will come to their senses and/or will disappear, or 2) that the next week's GI will cover it, giving huge preference to #1.

They cannot offer installment payments because that is not how to pay bills per LRH policy. When bills are paid piecemeal a creditor can't write the bill off in full. Never mind that you aren't a creditor, the LRH policy will be applied.

And, to pay in pieces signals your cash flow is poor. This, too, is out-policy. Heaven forbid anyone should find out the org is struggling.

Finally, there is no actual money on account. Yes, I know that's what people think, that is what staff tell you, but there is no actual money on account. The money is divided up to pay bills at the org and a goodly portion goes up lines never to be seen again as soon as the stat week ends.

And that's why it is so damned difficult to get your money back.

 

[AngeloV]

I believe I can answer this and come close to the actual situation:

A refund or repayment request comes into the org. In the midst of the struggle to bring this week's GI in, a refund/repayment is a huge out-reality.

Next, once the reality is accepted, and this could take a while, the org doesn't have the money sitting around as ready cash, so they can't pay even if they want to.

They go on hoping: 1) that the requester will come to their senses and/or will disappear, or 2) that the next week's GI will cover it, giving huge preference to #1.

They cannot offer installment payments because that is not how to pay bills per LRH policy. When bills are paid piecemeal a creditor can't write the bill off in full. Never mind that you aren't a creditor, the LRH policy will be applied.

And, to pay in pieces signals your cash flow is poor. This, too, is out-policy. Heaven forbid anyone should find out the org is struggling.

Finally, there is no actual money on account. Yes, I know that's what people think, that is what staff tell you, but there is no actual money on account. The money is divided up to pay bills at the org and a goodly portion goes up lines never to be seen again as soon as the stat week ends.

And that's why it is so damned difficult to get your money back.

A clear description of how scio handles refunds.
Thanks, Ted.

 

[Kutta]

Thanks for warning Axiom and AngeloV. I am of course aware that until I have the money it is not a done deal. Please tell me what actions you took that eventually resulted in getting your money, Axiom. In the meantime I am going to remain optimistic.

 

[Feral]

We did not do their routing form, we refused to cooperate utterly.

It is not a legal requirement and got over $100k back from our account, it is, after all your unspent money.

Use your consumer rights.

 

[Alanzo]

We did not do their routing form, we refused to cooperate utterly.

It is not a legal requirement and got over $100k back from our account, it is, after all your unspent money.

Use your consumer rights.

I agree with Kevin.

Often a Scientologist on their way out tends to not realize that they are a citizen - with rights - of the country they are in, and that the Church of Scientology is subject to laws and consumer protection regulations.

THOSE are the rules which ACTUALLY apply to this situation, not the Church's attempt at intimidation, coercion and manipulation in the guise of a "routing form".

Go straight to public institutions and the law and the relevant regulations and follow them. Forget their "policy".

Believe it or not, you are still being "fair" by following the law. Although the Church will do everything to get you to think otherwise.

Don't fall for it.

 

[Mick Wenlock]

We did not do their routing form, we refused to cooperate utterly.

It is not a legal requirement and got over $100k back from our account, it is, after all your unspent money.

Use your consumer rights.

Kev is right. If you are requesting your money that is on account - it is YOUR money. It does not belong to Scientology.Just start writing letters to whatever Consumer Rights bureau exists in the country - be sure to send copies to St Hill. demand your money immediately, there is no reason why you should have to wait.

Do not WAIT. Just keep pressuring, do not accept anything other than the certified check, dont accept "next week" or "we need you to ..." just keep up the refrain of "give me the money".

 

[byte301]

When has a shop or any other retailer told you to do a routing form before you could get your refund?

It's just bullshit.

If you (and I assume that you do) have receipts proving you have money on account then they don't have a leg to stand on.

If you got a lawyer to write a letter stating you want your money and don't intend on doing a routing form or sign any waivers I bet they'd get the ball rolling pretty quickly.

 

[FlunkedForLaughing]

I believe the routing form is intended to get you to give in (stop asking for the refund), or else they try to cave you in (wrong indications, invalidation, reverse processing, stuff like that). Don't do the routing form.

By law, it's not required for you complete the routing form to get your refund. If you demand your money on account to be paid back, you'll get it, but you have to really demand it hard, with threats of legal action. Be nasty and they will listen. Be nice and cooperative and they will drag it out for a billion years.

Do a search for something like "refund letter" in search box that appears when you click "Search" up near your username on ESMB. You'll find some good advice on a bunch of threads. This one is really good for you to read:

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?t=12527

I'm about to start this process myself. I'll let you all know how it goes.

Cheers,
FFL

 

[Mystic]

It ain't over until the fat lady sings.

 

[Daedle]

Hi Kutta,

Congrats on the refund!

To make it a bit better,

Also, the basics, 3 boxes of books and tapes, landed on my doorstep about the time I initially sent a request to Treasury for my refund.

is very, very illegal. If they dumped the boxes on your doorstep and took the money, or implied that are somehow responsible for paying for those books then they have broken trading standards. You don't owe them for the books - if they dumped them on your doorstep without having a payment agreement with you, then those books are your property. If they want the books back then they need to pay YOU for the books.

Give consumer direct a bell on 08454 04 05 06 and you may well get more than a refund - and there will be a criminal investigation into their trading practises!

If you've been subjected to any of their sales pitches since may last year where they lied then also bring that up - again a breach of trading standards and a criminal offense!

As everyone else said, the routing form is not enforceable in court and you should refuse to sign it. If they refuse to give you your money back then get in touch with consumer direct.