Scared

Nicole

Silver Meritorious Patron
Hey Nicole,...wenn Scientology nicht waere, und die groBe Kartoffeln, haetten mir lautere kleine essen mueBen. Reuben

I don't undertand this... :hmm: May be you can write English. I understand English. :)




BTW I feel much better now. In the past I have gone through lots of shit... The strongest was to find help and people that believed me. People that don't say I am mad or still OSA. It was a very difficult time.

But know I am fine and me again. :happydance:
 

Royal Prince Xenu

Trust the Psi Corps.
:iagree:

Message arrived... Thanks! :) I only wanted to write the truth, before going forward.

I've kind of given up on friendship..Only when I get respect, will I then let the other person start earning mine. If that makes me an @$$hole, so be it. I've trusted and been betrayed by "friends" too often.
 

Nicole

Silver Meritorious Patron
I've kind of given up on friendship..Only when I get respect, will I then let the other person start earning mine. If that makes me an @$$hole, so be it. I've trusted and been betrayed by "friends" too often.

It is very difficult to find real friends. In the last year I have seen who they are. Real friends are rare, that was my lesson to learn. But that doesn't mean not to make new friends and to be nice to persons that dissapointed me in my "difficult" times.
A friendship must grow and both people have to tread the other person with respect. :yes:

Imo only so we can make the world more nicer.
 
Last edited:

Clarence Rockaway

Patron with Honors
I don't undertand this... :hmm: May be you can write English. I understand English. :)




BTW I feel much better now. In the past I have gone through lots of shit... The strongest was to find help and people that believed me. People that don't say I am mad or still OSA. It was a very difficult time.

But know I am fine and me again. :happydance:
Your Avatar says that you're from Germany. Well, anyway it doesn't make sense in English. It means..."if it weren't for Scientology and the big potatoes. We'd all have to eat little potatoes." See it isn't any good in English.
 

Nicole

Silver Meritorious Patron
Never mind!

Your Avatar says that you're from Germany. Well, anyway it doesn't make sense in English. It means..."if it weren't for Scientology and the big potatoes. We'd all have to eat little potatoes." See it isn't any good in English.


I am German, it doesn't make sence in German and in English...:unsure: It sounds like a poem that got translated from google:confused2:.
 

Ulduz

Patron with Honors
Hello Nicole,
I promised to deliver a criticizm of Dianetics by showing that the notion of engram is false, and I did. Please, see my new thread Nonexistent engrams -- fall of Dianetics.
 

Ulduz

Patron with Honors
Hello again,
It appears that something is wrong with my threat -- it is empty.
I'm sending you a copy of it.
---------------
I have noticed that some ex-Scientologists still believe that PC auditing has some value. I hate to burst their bubble, but this auditing has only negative value. The purpose of this article is to show that engrams do not exist.
To start with, Hubbard did not invent the notion of engram, he borrowed it from Korzybski. Coridon wrote in his book that in early 1950 the Scientologist were instructed to study Korzybski’s works on engrams. Later, of course, LRH became the sole inventor of the idea of engram. Please, consider my post as a critique of Korzybski’s invention.
According to Korzybski, when an individual is rendered unconscious, his mind records everything that surrounds him correctly and in minute detail, including the speech of the people standing nearby. But then the mind incorrectly interprets the meaning of the phrases that it recorded during the moments when the person passed out (LRH calls such distortions “reactive mind”) Korzybski did not say that these distortions cause psycho-somatic illnesses, but LRH did. However, from the standpoint of this article, it is immaterial whether the psycho-somatic illnesses are the productions of the reactive mind or not.
Now I’m going to prove that engrams do not exist.
There are 6 possible scenarios that an unconscious individual can endure:
1. His mind does not record anything.
Obviously, in this case there are no engrams.
2. His mind records all events, but later cannot interpret the words and phrases that he heard.
Inability to interpret the words and phrases shows that there are no false interpretations and, therefore, no engrams.
3. His mind interprets the words and phrases correctly.
This is the best possible scenario, it does not matter whether he was unconscious or not -- he interprets everything correctly.
4. His mind interprets the words incorrectly but the phrases correctly.
Even if this is possible, as long as he interprets the phrases correctly he is in a great shape because the phrases are the final products of the speech.
5. His mind interprets the words correctly but the phrases incorrectly.
How plausible this scenario is? Basically, it detaches the meaning of a phrase from the meanings of words it is composed of. But this leads to creation of a new language where each phrase is a word. On the other hand, he is unable to communicate in that language with the auditor or any other person because he is the only one who understands it. So any bit of information he transmits in that language cannot be interpreted by anyone; it is impossible to tell whether he has an engram or not. The whole meaning of the word “engram” becomes null and void because of the lack of interpretation of that person’s experience during the time of unconsciousness.
6. His mind interprets both the phrases and the words incorrectly.
Indeed, a mental disorder leading to incorrect interpretation of words and phrases does exist. Its careers assign wrong meaning to the words and, subsequently, to the phrases. But it is impossible to communicate with these people because they cannot translate their own language into a normal language. Say, a PC during the auditing enters the reactive mind area, so to speak. It means that he forgets the normal language and begins communication in his language. He cannot translate his language into English (French, German, etc) because he forgets it. Unless its is possible for someone to remember the language and do not remember it at the same time, which is completely absurd, a PC cannot tell the auditor what is going through his head. END OF PROOF.
I did my share of Dianetics auditing. None of my PCs was wearing glasses; perhaps, they were using contact lenses. Because of that I thought my auditing was fine. I used to tell Clears who were wearing glasses that they were declared Clear by mistake. “Your auditor is poorly qualified”, I would say. They thought I was a weirdo and a bad Scientologist, they even wrote KRs on me. But that did not stop me from telling the “truth”. Now I know that I was an idiot. Dianetics does not work, period. Your PC might feel great after auditing. But he is bullshitting you and himself. He is predisposed to feel good by the virtue of self-suggestion (this is kind of a self-hypnotic suggestion). What is missing in the picture are measurable improvements in his health such 20/20 eye vision, properly functioning kidneys, normal heart rate, etc.
Dianetics, which is the foundation of Scientology, is rotten to the core; it is based on erroneous Korzybski’s ideas. This is not to say that Korzybski was always wrong; he made a substantial contribution to the science. But his notion of the engram is a dud.
When foundation is shaky, the whole building is bound to fall, which is what happened to Scientology.
 

MrNobody

Who needs merits?
I don't undertand this... :hmm: May be you can write English. I understand English. :)




BTW I feel much better now. In the past I have gone through lots of shit... The strongest was to find help and people that believed me. People that don't say I am mad or still OSA. It was a very difficult time.

But know I am fine and me again. :happydance:

OK, here it is in correct German:

"Hey Nicole,...wenn Scientology nicht wäre, und die groBen Kartoffeln, hätten wir lauter Kleine essen müssen."

Makes more sense if you see it for the analogy it is. :)
 

MrNobody

Who needs merits?
I've kind of given up on friendship..Only when I get respect, will I then let the other person start earning mine. If that makes me an @$$hole, so be it. I've trusted and been betrayed by "friends" too often.

Yeah, yeah, yeah... been there, done that, got the t-shirt, the mug, and a nice collection of bumper stickers to go with it - but the thing is: Respect needs to be earned, friendship needs to be given - and if friendship is betrayed, you have basically two ways you can go:

1: "You need to deserve my friendship, so you need to make yourself worthy first"
2: "Here's my friendship, please handle with care"

My best friend, during a very bad time I had, ratted me out to my worst enemy. Definitely not a nice experience, but so what? There were other friends who helped me outta there, so the bottom line was win for me. One false friend lost, a few true friends gained.

Thing is: Had I waited until those other friends had proven themselves to me, I would have been alone at that time. Option 2 always worked better for me, so I'll stick with that, although I might be disappointed occasionally.

Just make sure that you don't rely on your friends when it isn't necessary, rely on yourself, instead - and in times when you absolutely have to rely on a certain someone, you don't have a choice anyway, because otherwise you wouldn't have to rely on that person.
 

Nicole

Silver Meritorious Patron
OK, here it is in correct German:

"Hey Nicole,...wenn Scientology nicht wäre, und die groBen Kartoffeln, hätten wir lauter Kleine essen müssen."

Makes more sense if you see it for the analogy it is. :)

:unsure: I am slow on the uptake. :wink2: You mean this analogy?

"Die dümmsten Bauern haben die dicksten Kartoffeln und wenn wir keine kleinen Kartoffeln hätten, müssten wir andauernd die Großen essen."
 

MrNobody

Who needs merits?
:unsure: I am slow on the uptake. :wink2: You mean this analogy?

"Die dümmsten Bauern haben die dicksten Kartoffeln und wenn wir keine kleinen Kartoffeln hätten, müssten wir andauernd die Großen essen."

Yeah, well, if you want to see it like that.... :)

I interpret it like this: If we have no big potatoes, we have to eat the small ones, and $cn is insignificant either way. :coolwink:
 

Nicole

Silver Meritorious Patron
Yeah, well, if you want to see it like that.... :)

I interpret it like this: If we have no big potatoes, we have to eat the small ones, and $cn is insignificant either way. :coolwink:

:biggrin:

Yes, this meaning is possible too. What for a little sentence... :)
 

Ackerland

Patron with Honors
Hello Nicole,

I needed at this time an anchor. A person that holds me away from Cof$. I thought you could it be. But I had the feeling that you let me fall. You wrote me, so doesn't work Anon etc. So I searched for a new anchor and that was OSA. First they seemed to be a friend again. That what I missed and my anon hate got bigger and bigger... and my husband also started to get angry about some Anons because you let me fall.

I never banned you from WhyWeProtest. But I told you that place is not good for you and you should leave. You did not against my better advice, as you had to experience for yourself later. Then, you promised to stay away but you came back to post about several things, like here: http://forums.whyweprotest.net/threads/scientology-in-köln.89506/#post-1775257

You were told by several people to drop the subject of Scientology, including myself.
You continue to immerse yourself on several forums (like this one: http://www.anonberlin.de/forum/showthread.php?tid=340&pid=1417#pid1417)
I hear you're active on Facebook in several groups related to Scientology.

You're grasping at anchor points and feel each time you think you've found one, they're slipping away. Look for them in real life, not on the internet! You won't find them here. Not even spending 24/7 on all things related to Scientology on the Internet will fix that.

and my husband also started to get angry about some Anons because you let me fall.

You do realize that this assertion alone says a hundred times more than you think it does?
Besides... it's not Rheinländer's, or anyone's task to babysit in on you and make sure you keep your hands off the cult drug. Get other interests.
 
Last edited:

Nicole

Silver Meritorious Patron
Hello Nicole,



I never banned you from WhyWeProtest. But I told you that place is not good for you and you should leave. You did not against my better advice, as you had to experience for yourself later. Then, you promised to stay away but you came back to post about several things, like here: http://forums.whyweprotest.net/threads/scientology-in-köln.89506/#post-1775257

You were told by several people to drop the subject of Scientology, including myself.
You continue to immerse yourself on several forums (like this one: http://www.anonberlin.de/forum/showthread.php?tid=340&pid=1417#pid1417)
I hear you're active on Facebook in several groups related to Scientology.

I will tell you where I post. I post at Anon Berlin Forum and at "Gegen das System Scientolog" (FB) and ESMB. On no more places... What the hell is your problem with it. Bann me from WWP that is your right.... But the rest is mine.

You're grasping at anchor points and feel each time you think you've found one, they're slipping away.
No, they didn't slipp all away...

Look for them in real life, not on the internet!
I do...

You won't find them here. Not even spending 24/7 on all things related to Scientology on the Internet will fix that.
What do you know about me and what I am doing the whole day. Which way I am going at the moment. You know nothing private about me.



You do realize that this assertion alone says a hundred times more than you think it does? Besides... it's not Rheinländer's, or anyone's task to babysit in on you and make sure you keep your hands off the cult drug.
No, it is my personal thing. Only I can do this.

What the hell do you think, I am doing. You don't know what I think and what my life is. I have to sort some things out and that did I. Even Rheinländer was a part of this.

You are having a wrong opinion about me in your mind. Thats it!!!
 

ClamSource

Patron with Honors
That person recorded everything I said, every call, every meeting, every chat etc. and wrote and sent it to other persons. He lied about me everywhere.
He blackmailed me with my OSA past in the last week. I am sure this is the reason.

Nicole,
This isn't normal behaviour. Outside of cults, people generally are good people. (I don't mean people inside cults are bad people, cults just bring out the worst in them).

People when they leave cults are always very fragile, perhaps as fragile as they'll ever be in their lives. Put this one nasty experience behind you as best you can and move forward. Recovery takes time. There's all the pain of leaving the cult to deal with, and then there's the very real culture shock of returning to the real world.

Plenty of other people have been down this path. It will get better, as many many people can tell you.
 

Ulduz

Patron with Honors
Hello Nicole,



I never banned you from WhyWeProtest. But I told you that place is not good for you and you should leave. You did not against my better advice, as you had to experience for yourself later. Then, you promised to stay away but you came back to post about several things, like here: http://forums.whyweprotest.net/threads/scientology-in-köln.89506/#post-1775257

You were told by several people to drop the subject of Scientology, including myself.
You continue to immerse yourself on several forums (like this one: http://www.anonberlin.de/forum/showthread.php?tid=340&pid=1417#pid1417)
I hear you're active on Facebook in several groups related to Scientology.

You're grasping at anchor points and feel each time you think you've found one, they're slipping away. Look for them in real life, not on the internet! You won't find them here. Not even spending 24/7 on all things related to Scientology on the Internet will fix that.



You do realize that this assertion alone says a hundred times more than you think it does?
Besides... it's not Rheinländer's, or anyone's task to babysit in on you and make sure you keep your hands off the cult drug. Get other interests.
This is not the way to talk to someone who is trying to do her best to get away from a cult. Your judgment is too harsh, and it does not do any good. People who left the cults after a long stay are fragile, and you should treat them with utmost respect.
Try to talk to me like that and you’ll see what will happen. I am not vulnerable at all, my story of involvement with Scientology is far different than Nicole‘s. As far as I understand from hers and yours posts, she tried to be your friend and was looking for your support. But you ditched her.
 

morizo

Patron
This is not the way to talk to someone who is trying to do her best to get away from a cult. Your judgment is too harsh, and it does not do any good. People who left the cults after a long stay are fragile, and you should treat them with utmost respect.
Try to talk to me like that and you’ll see what will happen. I am not vulnerable at all, my story of involvement with Scientology is far different than Nicole‘s. As far as I understand from hers and yours posts, she tried to be your friend and was looking for your support. But you ditched her.

Ackerland is a helpful and patient person with people hurt by the cult.
 

Nicole

Silver Meritorious Patron
Lost in Translation, so much is being lost in translation . . .

Tell me please what you don't understand. I will try to explain.

I do very well understand, what you all wrote, but maybe you don't understand what happen.
At the moment I want to close the book, of the things that happen in the last ca. two years (Gaslighting, contact to Anons, contact to OSA...) and I want to move on.


But always when I think, now it is closed, it isn't closed.

I am not scared anymore, it was only because of this one stupid man... It was a very evil thing to hear that a person everything recorded and may be he did much more.

The fear is gone eg I called MrNobody and we had a very nice and long telephone call.

I don't have the feeling to go back to the Cult. I am over this point. I am lucky to be free and to learn lots of things.

At the moment I am doing lots of things that I never made...(thanks for this advice "Free to Shine") and I enjoy time with my family. It's a great world. ...eg today I had a great day with my family. I also enjoy time with my friends. I often help my grandmother, she is demented. It's nice to listen to her stories. I hope she is able to tell them very long.

I am not alone and I am having contacts. But sometimes I have the feeling they don't understand me in some things.
The members on ESMB do understand me and I can read and learn to find my way.

But I also want to fight against this evil cult. It doesn't exists lots of places where I can do this in German. I can't discuss very good in English. That is the reason why I post at the German Anti Scientology pages. ...and I do there nothing wrong. ..and it is my right to that. I do that what I want. I don't let me forbid this.

I wrote in the begining, I want to close the book of the things that happen in the last 2 years, but I want to get along with my childhood in Cof$ and what happen because of this childhood. I am the result of Hubbards evil education advices.

I get more and more me. I know more and more what I want. I get more and more self trust.
 
Top