Scientology and Money

XGO

Patron
Scientology and Money

Everyone in the world knows we are in the middle of the worst financial crisis since the Great Depression of the 30s. Scientology is not going to make these
problems disappear, and I posit that they are at great risk, just like the rest of us.

Please see: http://money.cnn.com/galleries/2008...rket_gurus.fortune/index.html?ref=patrick.net

Some of the more notable statements:

- "We are in the middle of a very severe recession that's going to continue through all of 2009 - the worst U.S. recession in the past 50 years"

- "Things are going to be awful for everyday people. U.S. GDP growth is going to be negative through the end of 2009. And the recovery in 2010 and 2011,
if there is one, is going to be so weak - with a growth rate of 1% to 1.5% - that it's going to feel like a recession. I see the unemployment rate
peaking at around 9% by 2010."

- "The value of homes has already fallen 25%. In my view, home prices are going to fall by another 15% before bottoming
out in 2010."

- "It was a year in which every major asset class - stocks, real estate, commodities, even high-yield bonds - suffered significant double-digit percentage
losses, resulting in the destruction of over $30 trillion of paper wealth."

Future returns:
- "Investors need to recognize these titanic shifts in market and public policies and be content with single-digit returns in future years. Perhaps the most
lucrative pockets of value are in high-quality corporate bonds and preferred stocks of banks and financial institutions that have partnered with the
government in programs such as the Troubled Assets Relief Program (TARP). While their profitability may be restricted, their ability to pay interest and
preferred dividends should be unhampered. Above all, stick to high-quality companies and asset classes. The road to recovery will be treacherous."


- "First of all, there's the magnitude of the stock market's move up and down. The real (inflation-corrected) value of the S&P 500 nearly tripled from 1995
to 2000, and by November 2008 was down nearly 60% from its 2000 peak. The only other comparable event was the one in the 1920s where real stock prices more
than tripled from 1924 to 1929 and then fell 80% from 1929 to 1932. Second, we've had the biggest housing bust since the Depression. Third, we've seen 0%
interest rates."

- "But homeowners have now lost $5 trillion, and 12 million families have mortgages in excess of the value of their homes. Therefore the economy will not
stabilize until mortgages are adjusted down to the value of homes, with affordable payment schedules, and until new mortgages become available across the
home-price spectrum. Till then, the poverty effect of falling house prices and unemployment moving up toward 7% will hold consumer spending back from its
former 70% contribution to our economy."

If the org held assets in anything other than Treasury Bonds, they probably suffered a big hit this year. October was particularly brutal. Was Davey clever
enough to predict these problems, and move assets to the "right side." Or did he listen to his "Financial Advisers," and get hammered? Does anyone know
where these assets are kept?

I think we all agree that most Scientology public are middle class. The middle class has been hammered in recent years through 1) taxes, and 2) wealth destruction.
Using the house as an ATM machine is gone forever. The rules for Home Equity Lines of Credit have changed (that is, if you can get a HELOC at all).
If the Scientology public has been paying for services and the IAS with credit cards, they are particularly at risk at this point in time...

Scientology public have been affected by the financial meltdown. Destruction of paper wealth and real estate values has been HUGE. Allot of Public own businesses,
which spin off good profits (must be, to afford Scientology services). It is not news that business profits are way down, and business is "sluggish" to say the least.
Given these factors, who is going to be able to afford higher level services, Ls, and IAS contributions?

You might think that the org will be OK, as they hold real estate assets. But remember, these assets are only worth what someone will pay, if they can be sold
at all. I have read online that "the org" owns allot of real estate (most of it office type buildings). These assets are at great risk (to lose value), as the economy
continues over the cliff.

The financial crisis is not going to be resolved for years (probably decades).

Given the "double squeeze" of wealth destruction of Scientology reserves and real estate, and reduced gross income, what is going to happen to the orgs? What is their plan?
Make it go right? Do you think they will be able to continue as before (after all, they do have free labor.. which will help ALLOT), or will they need to downsize
(as large corporations worldwide are now doing)?

I am curious if the is a high-level ex-staff member that would know about Scientology Assets (particularly SO Reserves). And if anyone knows about the current state of Org operations related
to money, please let us in on that.

The financial mess is going to get worse before it gets better. I recommend you load up on beans, bullets, and band-aids. Good luck out there.
 

Moonchild

Patron with Honors
Scientology and Money

Everyone in the world knows we are in the middle of the worst financial crisis since the Great Depression of the 30s. Scientology is not going to make these
problems disappear, and I posit that they are at great risk, just like the rest of us.

Please see: http://money.cnn.com/galleries/2008...rket_gurus.fortune/index.html?ref=patrick.net

Some of the more notable statements:

- "We are in the middle of a very severe recession that's going to continue through all of 2009 - the worst U.S. recession in the past 50 years"

- "Things are going to be awful for everyday people. U.S. GDP growth is going to be negative through the end of 2009. And the recovery in 2010 and 2011,
if there is one, is going to be so weak - with a growth rate of 1% to 1.5% - that it's going to feel like a recession. I see the unemployment rate
peaking at around 9% by 2010."

- "The value of homes has already fallen 25%. In my view, home prices are going to fall by another 15% before bottoming
out in 2010."

- "It was a year in which every major asset class - stocks, real estate, commodities, even high-yield bonds - suffered significant double-digit percentage
losses, resulting in the destruction of over $30 trillion of paper wealth."

Future returns:
- "Investors need to recognize these titanic shifts in market and public policies and be content with single-digit returns in future years. Perhaps the most
lucrative pockets of value are in high-quality corporate bonds and preferred stocks of banks and financial institutions that have partnered with the
government in programs such as the Troubled Assets Relief Program (TARP). While their profitability may be restricted, their ability to pay interest and
preferred dividends should be unhampered. Above all, stick to high-quality companies and asset classes. The road to recovery will be treacherous."


- "First of all, there's the magnitude of the stock market's move up and down. The real (inflation-corrected) value of the S&P 500 nearly tripled from 1995
to 2000, and by November 2008 was down nearly 60% from its 2000 peak. The only other comparable event was the one in the 1920s where real stock prices more
than tripled from 1924 to 1929 and then fell 80% from 1929 to 1932. Second, we've had the biggest housing bust since the Depression. Third, we've seen 0%
interest rates."

- "But homeowners have now lost $5 trillion, and 12 million families have mortgages in excess of the value of their homes. Therefore the economy will not
stabilize until mortgages are adjusted down to the value of homes, with affordable payment schedules, and until new mortgages become available across the
home-price spectrum. Till then, the poverty effect of falling house prices and unemployment moving up toward 7% will hold consumer spending back from its
former 70% contribution to our economy."

If the org held assets in anything other than Treasury Bonds, they probably suffered a big hit this year. October was particularly brutal. Was Davey clever
enough to predict these problems, and move assets to the "right side." Or did he listen to his "Financial Advisers," and get hammered? Does anyone know
where these assets are kept?

I think we all agree that most Scientology public are middle class. The middle class has been hammered in recent years through 1) taxes, and 2) wealth destruction.
Using the house as an ATM machine is gone forever. The rules for Home Equity Lines of Credit have changed (that is, if you can get a HELOC at all).
If the Scientology public has been paying for services and the IAS with credit cards, they are particularly at risk at this point in time...

Scientology public have been affected by the financial meltdown. Destruction of paper wealth and real estate values has been HUGE. Allot of Public own businesses,
which spin off good profits (must be, to afford Scientology services). It is not news that business profits are way down, and business is "sluggish" to say the least.
Given these factors, who is going to be able to afford higher level services, Ls, and IAS contributions?

You might think that the org will be OK, as they hold real estate assets. But remember, these assets are only worth what someone will pay, if they can be sold
at all. I have read online that "the org" owns allot of real estate (most of it office type buildings). These assets are at great risk (to lose value), as the economy
continues over the cliff.

The financial crisis is not going to be resolved for years (probably decades).

Given the "double squeeze" of wealth destruction of Scientology reserves and real estate, and reduced gross income, what is going to happen to the orgs? What is their plan?
Make it go right? Do you think they will be able to continue as before (after all, they do have free labor.. which will help ALLOT), or will they need to downsize
(as large corporations worldwide are now doing)?

I am curious if the is a high-level ex-staff member that would know about Scientology Assets (particularly SO Reserves). And if anyone knows about the current state of Org operations related
to money, please let us in on that.

The financial mess is going to get worse before it gets better. I recommend you load up on beans, bullets, and band-aids. Good luck out there.


Yep. If any brains they got, they should have sold off a bunch of real estate about 24 months ago...18 at the latest and bought gold.
 

scooter

Gold Meritorious Patron
They're still BUYING real estate, remember - davey's orders :duh: :D

can't be too much longer before :shithitfan: :happydance:
 

Voltaire's Child

Fool on the Hill
Actually, this would be a great time to buy real estate. It's cheaper now.

I've been watching the prices of properties rise at an alarming and inflated rate- prompted by our government's deregulation of the banks and the banks' total insanity. I've seen loans that were signature only, negative amortization, people didn't even live in the property and weren't asked for any down payment in any of those cases. It was inevitable that it would adjust back downward.

I am not at all happy that people are losing their jobs. That's a terrible thing. But this housing bubble had to burst sometime.
 

uniquemand

Unbeliever
Yep. If any brains they got, they should have sold off a bunch of real estate about 24 months ago...18 at the latest and bought gold.


Why? Why not hold onto it and wait 5 years? It'll all go up again eventually: it's a law of economics. It's called supply and demand. The population is growing, and the quantity of property is fixed (on this planet). Thus, by law, it's value will grow over time, so long as the population is growing.
 

Moonchild

Patron with Honors
Why? Why not hold onto it and wait 5 years? It'll all go up again eventually: it's a law of economics. It's called supply and demand. The population is growing, and the quantity of property is fixed (on this planet). Thus, by law, it's value will grow over time, so long as the population is growing.

Back at the beginning of 2007 before property prices started to tumble gold was priced at around $20,000 per kilo; not for long admittedly...it crept up to around $22,000 in the first few months of that year, sat there until August '07 and then began a steady rise peaking just short of $30,000 at the beginning of 2008. Right now, after a steep fall around mid-'08 it's back up to approx. $26,400 and shows signs of continuing its climb.

Anyone who sold property and bought gold in the first half of 2007 would have done quite well for themselves, especially if they'd anticipated the fall in the price of gold that we saw a few months back.

As to the "supply and demand" argument I think that only holds water when there is sufficient "real" money in circulation; a couple of years ago when the demand for property was intense people stretched themselves to the limit (and then some) to get their hands on bricks and mortar; this avidity was fuelled by the irresponsible lending by banks and similar institutions which has precipitated the crisis we're now enjoying.

Supply and demand is fine as long as contained within certain limits...which have unfortunately been exceeded...too much has been staked on "make-believe" money. I believe the upshot will be that property will take a lot longer than 5 years to regain the sort of value it commanded 2 years ago.

Oh and yes..."the quantity of property is fixed"? Really? Perhaps I just imagined all those new houses they've been building in SE England over the last couple of years...:coolwink:
 

The Clam

Patron with Honors
You missed the most salient points. George is bringing the home and putting them on American soil which violate posse comatatus act, The federal government is bypassing state government, KBR has been building fema camps.
Congress/sen/pres. have passed the 8 trillion dollar bail out giving the tres sec. the power to keep where the money goes a secret, the banks are not lending the money but buying up valuable assets and giving them self bonuses, the federal government is giving the federal reserve banks the power to completely regulate them selfs when they where the ones who caused this mess,by intention, America as we have know it is gone and you are worried about the COS. Time to buy food and guns the revolution will not be televised
 

XGO

Patron
You missed the most salient points. George is bringing the home and putting them on American soil which violate posse comatatus act, The federal government is bypassing state government, KBR has been building fema camps.
Congress/sen/pres. have passed the 8 trillion dollar bail out giving the tres sec. the power to keep where the money goes a secret, the banks are not lending the money but buying up valuable assets and giving them self bonuses, the federal government is giving the federal reserve banks the power to completely regulate them selfs when they where the ones who caused this mess,by intention, America as we have know it is gone and you are worried about the COS. Time to buy food and guns the revolution will not be televised

Good Points. How is the Org going to operate in a state of Anarchy? Oh, I forgot... they have the Volunteer Ministers to sooth our wounds.
As we quickly approach Depression, and the biggest ripoff of all time is happening before our eyes (Wallstreet and Government ripping off the middle class), all bets are off. The bad guys win, Scientology loses. So much for "Salvaging this sector of the Universe."

I have my food and guns already. I will be loading up on more ammo, and hooking up the generator...
 

Anne Ominous

Patron with Honors
I have my food and guns already. I will be loading up on more ammo, and hooking up the generator...

Calm down dear, it's only a financial crisis.

Although I agree that DM's Ideal Org system is weakened as a result of the situation.
 
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