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Spoilers***My Scientology Movie*** Look away now

Discussion in 'Movies, Plays, and Documentaries about Scientology' started by Emma, Sep 12, 2016.

  1. Emma

    Emma Con te partirò Administrator

    I hope the thread title is warning enough for those wanting to avoid spoilers.

    I'm not going to give a recap of the movie, only the points I thought were interesting or important.

    The first thing of interest was when Marty put Louis on the meter. It's hard to say what was done in editing but from my perspective, Marty doesn't read a meter properly. (I can see the eye rolls already!!) But seriously, it didn't affect the movie at all, but for me it felt weird that Marty would miss a read & take up a random Fall. I guess I feel like if you are gunna demonstrate something, something in which I believe Marty still believes has validity (auditing), you'd do it properly.

    Second thing was Marty's overall demeanor. He puts out this "don't fuck with me" vibe ALL THE TIME. Mark Headley, Jeff Hawkins and the others involved were calm, engaging & easy to talk to. Marty not so much.

    Third thing was the interview with Jeff Hawkins. I have SO much respect for him and I trust him. He believes Marty is hiding information. I doubt Jeff would say something like that lightly.

    Fourth thing was Mark Headley talking about how Marty was in a session with him where he was being interrogated. Marty takes him outside the auditing room & punches him right in the face and says "tell her what she wants to hear". Later Louis asks Marty how it felt to hit Mark Headley. I was expecting something from him. Some kind of remorse. Anything. All he said was that it hurt his hand because Mark is built like a brick wall (or something along those lines).

    Lastly, and this was a biggie for me...Marty is getting more & more agitated. They were in the film studio (a garage by the looks of it) and Marty walks out into the street. Two Scieno dirtbags walk up to Marty & start harassing him. One of them says something like "the money you make from the BBC plus foster payments is how you make money". Yeah disgusting right. Marty was really shaken up by it. He was upset that they had bought his son into it. "It was a legal adoption!" he said. Then he said he was "out" I think meaning he wanted no further part in the film. Louis sympathised with him and agreed that it was awful to be treated that way by the Scientologists, but then he says to Marty "you would have done similar things to people while in Scientology". Well Marty lost his shit. He told Louis to get fucked numerous times and said he never bought children into his actions while in the church. But he was super defensive & kept telling Louis to get fucked. After a few seconds Louis said "I consider myself fucked".

    This was important & telling to me. Early on in the film Marty took (what looked like to me anyway) great pride in telling Louis he was the "biggest & baddest" guy in Scientology. He was drilling Louis and the actors on TRs early in the film and made a point of how important bullbait was. This guy audited Tom Cruise right? Surely he has flawless TRs. The Scieno scumbags who came past were just bullbaiting him. Yes it was nasty, but it wasn't threatening. His son was not in danger. It was some nasty words. Then when Louis intimates that Marty would have done similar things he fucking lost it. If I was still in I'd be calling a massive missed withhold. In wog language I's say he looked guilty as hell.

    Louis did a good job. Overall the film should be renamed "Louis Theroux's look at Scientology through the eyes of Marty Rathbun". The film was far more about Marty than anything else.
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2016
  2. WildKat

    WildKat Gold Meritorious Patron

    Re: Spoliers***My Scientology Movie*** Look away now

    I was planning to see the movie anyway if it ever comes around in the US. But your review makes me more intent on watching. Good review, thanks Emma!

    (I don't mind spoilers. It's not really like there was anything to spoil.)

    P.S. Jeff Hawkins is a stand-up reputable guy....I believe him too.
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2016
  3. Chris Shelton

    Chris Shelton Patron with Honors

    Re: Spoliers***My Scientology Movie*** Look away now

    This would be one very big reason (perhaps not the only one) why Marty is so very desperate to trash Louis and the film before anyone else sees it.
  4. TrevAnon

    TrevAnon Big List researcher

    Re: Spoliers***My Scientology Movie*** Look away now

    Actually that is a reason for me to go see it! :lol:
  5. BunnySkull

    BunnySkull Silver Meritorious Patron

    Re: Spoliers***My Scientology Movie*** Look away now

    Oh, these spoilers only re-enforce how badly I want to see this movie now.

    Hawkins and the Headleys have always come across as good people who wanted to get the truth out there and to tell their stories honesty and how they lived it. I have the highest respect for both of them. Read and bought both their books. They told their stories of being at INT with honestly, humor, real perspective and humility.

    Every "story" Marty ever told seemed to have some sort of an agenda, every antidote he shared made him look like a tough guy, tech expert or Mr. VIP. I've never felt Marty had any desire to tell the truth but more to pump up his own legend or reassure himself about himself. Many times he seems immune from showing remorse or admitting he was wrong in any way. Merely trying to get him to express remorse about his past behavior seems to trigger him terribly and can make him very angry.

    It is surprising that Marty would get so upset by a few Scio scumbags taunting him. For a guy who went on and on about his perfect, blinkless TRs you would think some Scio cunts spewing nastiness wouldn't shake him up so bad. Maybe it's because bullbaiting and TRs are a bunch of bullshit.

    Marty was asked a similar question very gently (with kid gloves) in Going Clear about how he felt being the target of the type of harassment he used to inflict and he responded "he died a little death" each time. I felt Marty was being truly honest and open - and it touched me. It was one of the few moments I felt Marty let his guard down and was honest. After Going Clear I saw Marty in a new unit of time and thought maybe he really had evolved. I think that's why the past few months have been particularly disappointing to me. After years of not trusting Marty and his motives, I found myself defending him and thinking he was really changing. Only for all of that to be flushed right down the toilet with this new series of events. It made me wonder if that profound statement Marty made in Going Clear was just another part of the act for the public - one he really nailed.

    It seems like Marty is angry and bewildered by the show of remorse that is expected of him. A LOT of journalists have asked about the irony of the former IG thug being the target of harassment, and it always angers or irritates Marty. I don't think he's ever gotten used to being asked questions he doesn't like, for to many years he was the one "asking the questions."

    I get being sick of a question being asked repeatedly, but good lord is really hard for him to understand why it's being asked again and again? This irony is the main reason Marty's story is so interesting. Marty seems to think him being an expert in the "tech" or being a VIP exec is why the media should be interested in him, but the main pull has always been the personal narrative. (also because he's so guarded about discussing any specifics in leadership it's not worth bothering with) No one in the public cares about Marty masting the con job of the tech or how important he was in the cult - they are interesting in the human experience of a true believer of a man who did nasty things now getting the same treatment and how that feels and how he processes the experience.
  6. arcxcauseblows

    arcxcauseblows Patron Meritorious

    Re: Spoliers***My Scientology Movie*** Look away now

    I'm starting to expect ex/scientologists to be exploited by journalists and documenterians

    I always wonder what Marty knows but I doubt we will find out because it's self incriminating

    Confessions of a Scientology warrior, would have to be a fiction based on a true story
  7. Knows

    Knows Gold Meritorious Patron

    Re: Spoliers***My Scientology Movie*** Look away now

    Wow - Great Job Emma! We are so excited about watching this movie.

    We are working with a therapist to heal the deep and infected wounds we received from being affiliated with such an evil, high demand control group - Scientology. Our whole family is "in Session" with a cult recovery therapist who is EXCELLENT and really helping us look at everything we allowed to "believe" due to hypnosis, high pressure sales manipulation and deceit THAT IS Scientology.
    We are sorting out what we really believe and what Scientology manipulated us into believing. IE... "Ron is Source". The truth - Ron was SAUCED:bong::wacko::booze:

    We just want to be healed from the mind fuck so we can live somewhat normal lives and put Scientology in the proper prospective - it is an evil cult that disguises itself as a "religion" so it can commit crimes daily and get away with it. Pure and simple!!

    I have to say - there is a lot that gets "restimulated" from that mind fuck of Scientology - within ourselves. It runs deep and has tangled itself up into what we become in life...what we believe.

    I believe what you see is Marty getting restimulated - who wouldn't.

    That had to be very hard to confront - re living the scenes of beatings to self and giving beatings to others....very uncomfortable.

    We are working very very hard - on forgiveness to all of those people who harmed us. Crush registrar's, lying sack of shit staff, High Ranking officials who took blood money (DEBBIE COOK) in exchange for SILENCE...

    and Marty is right up there -

    Personally, I have a lot of BPC on what I perceive to be MARTY RATHBUN betraying the group again by cancelling the lawsuit and allegedly taking the blood money in exchange for attacking ex Scientologist's and those who expose the cult.
  8. ethercat

    ethercat Cat in flight

    Re: Spoliers***My Scientology Movie*** Look away now

    Some posts have been moved because they contained speculation with no supporting facts.
  9. ethercat

    ethercat Cat in flight

    Perhaps I should have included my request in this thread also:

    This will apply to all public threads about Marty.

    Please carry on with discussion of Louis Theroux's Scientology Movie.
  10. WildKat

    WildKat Gold Meritorious Patron

    I just want to know when it comes to Netflix. Or Hulu.
  11. tetloj

    tetloj Silver Meritorious Patron

    This is what I posted at the Bunker after seeing the film opening night in Melbourne - from a never-in who has been watching from the stalls for the last five years or so....(I confess I was sitting in the theatre making time-stamped notes like a real geek)

    Last edited: Sep 13, 2016
  12. tetloj

    tetloj Silver Meritorious Patron

    This was a stunning moment of the film, and the audience around me felt it (audible shock).
  13. Gib

    Gib Crusader

    I haven't seen the movie, thanks for the review.

    Me thinks, Marty maybe is a little pissed from what the movie portrayed him as, and when one compares to what he did in this you tube by Marty Mar 13, 2013 to explain scientology and his new philosophy combined, which has to date has had 13,187 views, and of course there are always the comments left by viewers of the vid:
  14. uncover

    uncover Gold Meritorious Patron

    Look, you have only been in the "wrong film". You want to see remorse from Marty ?

    Here you go for the tears when he had to confess that he himself had beaten others..... so heartbreaking..... - look for yourself here at 0:36:


    or here at 1:17:


    How do you like it ?
  15. Emma

    Emma Con te partirò Administrator

    I don't speak German so I don't know what has upset him in the first video.

    In the second video he's upset because he can't make friends because of the Scientology harassment. I do feel bad for him, but I feel worse for the people he beat up.
  16. prosecco

    prosecco Patron Meritorious

    I haven't seen the movie, but based on your review, it's typical Louis Theroux:

    1. Find a weird/controversial group.
    2. Get the weirdest person to talk to you.
    3. Gain their trust.
    4. Get them to speak about the subject
    5. Portray them as vulnerable.
    6. At this stage, Louis will go slightly OTT thus gaining the sympathy of the audience towards the person.
    7. Watch the person explode.

    The other feature of a Louis Theroux film is in the editing, so he will make various facial gestures which says so much without ever opening one's mouth.

    Both Tony Ortega and Marty seem to agree that the producers of the film wanted Marty in the film and approached him, so this aspect is not in dispute. I don't quite get the angle of the film, whether it was to mock Marty or scientology? I will reserve judgment until I actually see it, but what I liked about, 'Going Clear,' was although there were moments of general taking the mickey (i.e. Xenu), the people who were in the film were generally portrayed with dignity.
  17. WildKat

    WildKat Gold Meritorious Patron

    Could you explain what "go slightly OTT" means? Or "general taking the mickey (i.e. Xenu)" means? I don't understand.
  18. prosecco

    prosecco Patron Meritorious

    If you watch any other Louis Theroux documentaries, take your pick, there is a pattern. He will push the people, but do it very subtlety. He is very interested in people's lives.

    As far as my comment about, 'Going Clear,' although there was the part where Xenu was discussed, it was done by poking fun at the subject, and in a comic style. In other words, it was hilarious as it made fun of the subject while walking a line between having compassion for those who were in the cult.

    Seems to me that it's easy enough to wind Marty up and film that. I find that sort of journalism rather lazy and am uncomfortable watching it.

    There is so much that could have been investigated, such as where is all the money going, the human trafficking, the child labour, the practice of old staff members not being cared for, etc, but all the personal reviews I have read seem to be based on Marty.

    Just seems like an opportunity missed.
  19. skep

    skep Patron with Honors

    Re: Spoliers***My Scientology Movie*** Look away now

    Great analysis of what many suspect is going on with Marty, particularly the point that after being in a senior position of power directing the whole organization, that now his influence is minimal on any group of people, beyond that of being a source of speculation.

    It probably is likely that he still reflects back on the time when he said 'jump' that the normal response was 'how high, sir?'. He probably still reflects back to the time when his actions and influence made massive impacts, such as the IRS settlements. It is the past glory he misses, which was obvious in the comment about being the biggest bad-ass to Theroux that he made.

    Too bad he can't get rid of those demons, and put his focus on his young son and his wife. I'm certain he missed the humanity of being with a person he could love, and having a child, and that part he was able to obtain later in life. That is a blessing to him. It's those demons, however, that are hurting him more than he will ever admit.

    I wish him serenity at some point in the future. Only he can obtain that, no one can teach him.
  20. cakemaker

    cakemaker Patron Meritorious

    By it's nature, speculation is not fact driven. It's simply an opinion and, if presented politely and within the guidelines for decorum, should be allowed.
    Just censoring speculation in general is a conversation killer.