SPs: New Info on Getting Money Back

[Thrak]

I'm really surprised none of you seem to know about this website:

http://scientologypayback.org

which has been operating since 2004 IIRC. It sets out exactly what you should do and includes a legal letter template. Did no one type 'money back scientology' into Google?

Well in their own words they're saying getting IAS money is something they haven't figured out yet.

 

[Mockingbird6]

A logical catch

Hi Magoo,
On the video defending Sci the church spokeswoman says that it was recognized as a religion in 1983 by Aussie Parliament who investigated further than Sen X, etc.

The proper response to this is, "Are you saying the church was committing crimes like this back then and was still approved?"

The only answers to that are, "Yes, they were," or "No, this is data that parliament did not have when they investigated."

Thus the speaker is caught in the logic.

 

[thetanic]

That seems like good advice thetanic. I think that may be the only option left to us if things continue back and forth the way they are, and we get no where with this.

But we'll keep sending copies of everything to Senator Xenophon.

Seriously, they're hoping you'll go away. The only people who get different attention are the PTS legal threats and the only ones of those who are taken seriously are the ones who actually have lawyers.

There's nothing this back-and-forth is doing except hoping you'll give up and go away and they'll get to keep the money.

 

[HappyGirl]

Can anyone recommend an attorney to write the letter? I have a friend that is an attorney and she won't go near CoS. The attorneys I work for, same thing! And when I tried to sign up for prepaid legal they had several areas of law practice and Scientology didn't fit into any of them. Can anyone recommend a specific lawyer or prepaid legal service where they found an attorney to write them a letter? Thanks!!!

I'm really surprised none of you seem to know about this website:

http://scientologypayback.org

which has been operating since 2004 IIRC. It sets out exactly what you should do and includes a legal letter template. Did no one type 'money back scientology' into Google?

This is the response I received from http://scientologypayback.org:

Hi HG,

I ('B-org') only host the site.

The people who handled the paybacks have stopped their activities,
so I'm afraid you're on your own with getting your money back. In
the FAQ it's being explained how to do it. I hope you succeed.

With kind regards,

Jeta Eggers
Amsterdam
The Netherlands

So....CAN anyone recommend an attorney to write the letter?

 

[Sis O' Sign]

Well, if they turned you into an SP, those services must have been defective, right?

So you should get a refund on those, too, regardless of age.

Hi, a newbie here.

I am not a declared SP and officially haven't left the Church yet, working out now the practical details of how to do it.

Thinking about a refund: I got some Flag-only auditing which was obviously designed to solve a specific problem. Now, after 3 years, still have that same problem...

Within the 3 months, the idea of refund didn't even occure me, because the subject is such that it would be too short a time to expect stellar results of it (career). Not to mention how blind and decent parishioner I was!

And, from the next couple of weeks on, I became busy with handling the cancer I got, pretty much the same time when I was at Flag (as it was stated by an alternative medicine expert).

Any suggestions about asking for this money back?

Cheers,

Sis O' Sign
- Should I Stay Or Should I Go Now?

and here's another song:
Go Your Own Way

 

[Zinjifar]

good luck with the cancer; welcome aboard and hopefully you're not *only* looking at 'alternative medicine'.

Zinj

 

[Alanzo]

Hi, a newbie here.

I am not a declared SP and officially haven't left the Church yet, working out now the practical details of how to do it.

Thinking about a refund: I got some Flag-only auditing which was obviously designed to solve a specific problem. Now, after 3 years, still have that same problem...

Within the 3 months, the idea of refund didn't even occure me, because the subject is such that it would be too short a time to expect stellar results of it (career). Not to mention how blind and decent parishioner I was!

And, from the next couple of weeks on, I became busy with handling the cancer I got, pretty much the same time when I was at Flag (as it was stated by an alternative medicine expert).

Any suggestions about asking for this money back?

Cheers,

Sis O' Sign
- Should I Stay Or Should I Go Now?

and here's another song:
Go Your Own Way

Hi Sis -

Here are some threads for you:

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?t=8652&highlight=refunds+repayment


http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?t=12527&highlight=refunds+repayment

You can find more by using the search function along the top of the little bars up there.

And welcome to ESMB!!

 

[Outethicsofficer]

Hi SIS,
Many of us have been very successful in getting our $ back out the vampires. You have the links..read up and come back to us for further assistance if you need it.

Welcome to ESMB.
James

 

[Auditor's Toad]

Some people seem to have some concern ovew the "policies" regarding a repayment or a refund.

Do not get very concerned about policy as you will quickly find out they do NOT follow their own policies anyway. Meaningless trivia. Not binding by law anyway.

By all means read everything you can find- and follow it . This is NOT the place to go inventing the wheel !

If you try to be nice you will get endlessly handled -handled-handled.
The "nice" way these days is a long long time getting completed.

Get a lawyer, pitch a bitch, and you'll get money back. I know, that sounds insane but it is the way it is dealing with these underfed, almost sleepless, wildly enturbulated, and very PTS staff.

The crazier YOU seem to them the faster they will do whatever it takes to make you go away.

Decise if you want your money in a week or maybe in a year and act accordingly - do follow the well laid out instructions from the people who have successfully gotten a whole lot of money back.

And do NOT forget the IAS - use the LA addy

 

[Sis O' Sign]

Thanks for all the replies and for the links! I'll check out the other threads and will come back if I have further questions.

Zinj, I am appareantly OK since then, handled cancer relatively fast - with standard and alternative medicine combined.
And I just realized NOW the real PTS sit - hence the disconnection process :-D

Huhh, Auditor's Toad, acting as a crazy bitch will be not easy, for I am known as an extraordinarily theta and sane person... ) (I am an artist)
. But with that, they won't want me to go to the media either. Not threatening, just sayin'.

And yes, IAS-money is in the plans, too.

Sis O' Sign
- Should I Stay Or Should I Go Now?

and here's another song:
Go Your Own Way

 

[Dulloldfart]

Some people seem to have some concern over the "policies" regarding a repayment or a refund.

. . .

Get a lawyer, pitch a bitch, and you'll get money back.

My understanding is that it is a *lot* harder to get a refund (service taken) than a repayment (service not taken). Have refunds become easier now?

Paul

 

[Lurker5]

Hello !

Hello, Sis, and welcome.

Oh - and good luck. I hope it goes well for you.

 

[Auditor's Toad]

"My understanding is that it is a *lot* harder to get a refund (service taken) than a repayment (service not taken). Have refunds become easier now?"

Repayment of advance pays is easier.
Refunds are more difficult but not impossible.

They will drag out all kinds of policies that this that or the other MUST be done. BS. Quote the 1993 agreement by the church to the IRS for "prompt" repayments. It is part of what the church stated to get it's tax exempt status.

No routing forms are required. No going in the org is required. Some sign the form to get the check others not. My legal advice says I do not have to sign to get my money back and I know people who refused to sign and still got their check. Meaningless piece of paper anyway - under duress and you won't be given a copy ( that ain't legal ! ).

And, yes, damn it, most of us do prefer to be nice and polite in all our dealings.
If you want to be nice and polite on this cycle by all means do not just pack a lunch but also pack the clothes you will need for the next 2 or 3 seasons of the year. They will dance you into next next year if - and only if - you allow them to control the deal. They don't, you do.

Just get a lawyer - prepaid legal works just fine - and get down to it in lap 1.

They are motivated to keep enturbulation off the org lines and law suits not taken to court.

On a repayment they do not want to go to court ( where they can not win and they damn well know it ) and risk paying interest, paying legal fees, possible penalities, possible treble damages for "Bad Faith" performance, and yet another precedent of losing a court case.

On a repayment you hold ALL the cards !

Yes, they will "excommunicate" you. That proverbial hair different than a " declare" but expect those on lines to disconnect from you. Terminal is the IJC for either. Most likely neither will be made public as it is out PR to have the MAA buletin board 3 feet thick with declares. They do NOT want their public to know the exodus is well underway

Get your money !

 

[This is NOT OK !!!!]

Hey Sis,

Make an intro post on the New Member's topic and we can all welcome you with "Love Bombing" - just kidding.

Welcome.

 

[Wisened One]

"My understanding is that it is a *lot* harder to get a refund (service taken) than a repayment (service not taken). Have refunds become easier now?"

Repayment of advance pays is easier.
Refunds are more difficult but not impossible.

They will drag out all kinds of policies that this that or the other MUST be done. BS. Quote the 1993 agreement by the church to the IRS for "prompt" repayments. It is part of what the church stated to get it's tax exempt status.

No routing forms are required. No going in the org is required. Some sign the form to get the check others not. My legal advice says I do not have to sign to get my money back and I know people who refused to sign and still got their check. Meaningless piece of paper anyway - under duress and you won't be given a copy ( that ain't legal ! ).

And, yes, damn it, most of us do prefer to be nice and polite in all our dealings.
If you want to be nice and polite on this cycle by all means do not just pack a lunch but also pack the clothes you will need for the next 2 or 3 seasons of the year. They will dance you into next next year if - and only if - you allow them to control the deal. They don't, you do.

Just get a lawyer - prepaid legal works just fine - and get down to it in lap 1.

They are motivated to keep enturbulation off the org lines and law suits not taken to court.

On a repayment they do not want to go to court ( where they can not win and they damn well know it ) and risk paying interest, paying legal fees, possible penalities, possible treble damages for "Bad Faith" performance, and yet another precedent of losing a court case.

On a repayment you hold ALL the cards !

Yes, they will "excommunicate" you. That proverbial hair different than a " declare" but expect those on lines to disconnect from you. Terminal is the IJC for either. Most likely neither will be made public as it is out PR to have the MAA buletin board 3 feet thick with declares. They do NOT want their public to know the exodus is well underway

Get your money !

Yes:

 

[Auditor's Toad]

And someone who has been on lines more recently than I have might be able to fill in the real role ( other than get a person on a routing form in the org so they can be 'salvaged' ) of the CVB. The Claims Verification Board.

At one time that function was under OSA... is it still ?

There function to to "verify" claims and authorize payment. Here is where it gets fuzzy. At one time the CVB had funds. To prevent a flap ( in the org, with media, or legal ), OSA can step in and fund a cycle then pull the funds from the org.

What happens these days is after the CVB "approves" the request goes the org and the funds come out of this weeks GI...BUT... only a certain percentage of the weeks GI can be pulled out for repayments/refunds.

It can take WEEKS for an org to stash enough to pay a claim. Right now the ship is the slowest of all but flag has gotten about as slow recently.

( Oh, when does an org start the stash? When CVB approves it. Nevermind the person has spent MONTHS to get to that point! )

Anybody that can add current facts would be appreciated !


As a tip, I have been involved in about 10 of these. Following the instructions works and works quickly. Those that decide to invent the wheel on this are many months into getting jacked around with no end in sight. Just saying.

 

[Sis O' Sign]

And, yes, damn it, most of us do prefer to be nice and polite in all our dealings.
If you want to be nice and polite on this cycle by all means do not just pack a lunch but also pack the clothes you will need for the next 2 or 3 seasons of the year. They will dance you into next next year if - and only if - you allow them to control the deal. They don't, you do.

Just get a lawyer - prepaid legal works just fine - and get down to it in lap 1.

They are motivated to keep enturbulation off the org lines and law suits not taken to court.


...

Yes, they will "excommunicate" you. That proverbial hair different than a " declare" but expect those on lines to disconnect from you. Terminal is the IJC for either. Most likely neither will be made public as it is out PR to have the MAA buletin board 3 feet thick with declares. They do NOT want their public to know the exodus is well underway

Alrighty, then I will have to be a crazy bitch - I LOVED Clearwater Beach, but no intention for months long holidays there...

And thanks for the other tips as well!

You are absolutely right about the SP declares: last week I went in my local org to see the SP declare of a friend of mine, which she allegedly got in the last couple of months, but such issues were not available to the public. Asked the Ethics Officer, and she told me to come back in about one week so that she can find the issue or she can get some info via telex...

(My "SP" friend is a very theta girl, an artist...)

Sis O' Sign
- Should I Stay Or Should I Go Now?

and here's another song:
Go Your Own Way

 

[Sis O' Sign]

And someone who has been on lines more recently than I have might be able to fill in the real role ( other than get a person on a routing form in the org so they can be 'salvaged' ) of the CVB. The Claims Verification Board.

At one time that function was under OSA... is it still ?

There function to to "verify" claims and authorize payment. Here is where it gets fuzzy. At one time the CVB had funds. To prevent a flap ( in the org, with media, or legal ), OSA can step in and fund a cycle then pull the funds from the org.

What happens these days is after the CVB "approves" the request goes the org and the funds come out of this weeks GI...BUT... only a certain percentage of the weeks GI can be pulled out for repayments/refunds.

It can take WEEKS for an org to stash enough to pay a claim. Right now the ship is the slowest of all but flag has gotten about as slow recently.

( Oh, when does an org start the stash? When CVB approves it. Nevermind the person has spent MONTHS to get to that point! )

Anybody that can add current facts would be appreciated !

This was 5 years ago: OSA.
(As a Sea Org member, I was in the Finance Network in an Org and it was the DSA who was dealing with these matters. And yes, it can be very painful for an org to pull these monies off from the weekly FP.)

 

[Auditor's Toad]

"Alrighty, then I will have to be a crazy bitch ..."

Uh, no, you have to act like a crazy bitch...just for them

It is fun when you know you are playing a role

 

[This is NOT OK !!!!]

Anyone in the US know the tax implications for successfully receiving a refund for a payment made to Scientology in past years and deducted on those past years' taxes?