Suicide of Greg Bashaw

NoName

A Girl Has No Name
I don't remember where I read this - somewhere on ESMB or Ortega's blog probably. I heard that the Co$ was telling people to go buy up tickets to see the Master so that wogs wouldn't see it and get the wrong idea of Lafatty.

:lol:

I'd like to know what they think of it too, especially since so much of it is pulled verbatim from DMSMH, the TR's, the OCA, etc.
 

Auditor's Toad

Clear as Mud
I don't remember where I read this - somewhere on ESMB or Ortega's blog probably. I heard that the Co$ was telling people to go buy up tickets to see the Master so that wogs wouldn't see it and get the wrong idea of Lafatty.

:lol:

I'd like to know what they think of it too, especially since so much of it is pulled verbatim from DMSMH, the TR's, the OCA, etc.

They buy the tickets they might as well see the show, right ?

Dumb move OSA. Keep it up !
 
Well, I think you've managed to construe the issue rather narrowly. I don't think auditing is inherently bad, even if I think the supposed need for it it (including Book 1) is based on a flawed premise. Given the expense of auditing, the expense of being a Scientologist, the false promises associated with auditing, the destruction of all 8 dynamics by the Co$, and the fact that the Co$ generally blames it on the PC if the tech didn't work, I'd say that there is plenty of blame for the Co$.

i hear what you are saying about viewing what i've said about GB's suicide as narrow.

now try to understand what i'm actually saying:

this is a controversy. i am not going to presume anything about these other factors you cite all of which may or may not be pertinent to GB. i take this matter very seriously therefore i give serious consideration to the reports. i tentatively affirm what i can reasonably believe to be accurate and pertinent
 
Jesus! That's some harsh language. Again, do you know this person? Your reaction is way over the top (unless you have had past dealings with the person who made this video and KNOW his/her intent because he/she demonstrated this without question or directly told you). Wassup Birdie? Dang!

it is some harsh language. i stand by my assessment of the video's author and a whole lot is up

stay tuned sweetheart
 
Birdie,

Listen, I am not here to argue with you and I mean you absolutely no disrespect AT ALL. I also carry a healthy dose of annoyance when untruths are told, no matter where they come from or to whose benefit they belong. It can be infuriating to watch people blindly accept information as fact simply because it suits one's particular bent. Personally, that bugs that hell out of me and shows, to me at least, an equal and opposite cult-type mentality.

Truth is truth but, having said the above, I still wonder why you assume the person has vicious intentions. You call this person all sorts of names. Do you know the producer of this video? If not, and you know nothing more about this person, why can you not just point out what you see in it as false, chastise the person for not doing better research, and possibly have compassion for someone who may have lost someone to the cult and who has been damaged and may see the cult through the eyes of personal pain (something that does not always allow for complete rational/objective perception).

Why the vitriol?

i'm not arguing. always willing to agree to disagree. demonstrably willing to back off on statements

Thou Shalt Not Bear False Witness Against Thy Neighbor just happens to be a Commandment
when that is a false declaration of homicide it is an exceptionally great violation
 
Oh for cryin' out loud! The Mafia also makes sure that garbage gets picked up in the inner city, that public works and construction projects get completed (wink, wink, nudge, nudge, say no more, say no more). Seriously? You don't see the surveillance tactics, thuggery, false imprisonment, etc as totally criminal? What is wrong with you?

First of all, I am not talking about the philosophy of Scientology. Please split the two in your mind. I am talking about the organization.

Anyway, I really don't know what your purpose is and I will not continue to have these discussions with you as you are clearly an apologist for the cult and have a rough time differentiating between the philosophy itself (and the efficacy of such is neither here nor there and up to anecdotal interpretation only) and the crafty, money sucking, abusive organization.

You are presenting straw man argumentation here and I have said my peace. :)

the very great value of the discipline is personal experience although my statement to you is from your viewpoint anecdotal.

i am not familiar with the term "straw man argumentation" would you explain SVP?
 

Smilla

Ordinary Human
i'm not arguing. always willing to agree to disagree. demonstrably willing to back off on statements

Thou Shalt Not Bear False Witness Against Thy Neighbor just happens to be a Commandment
when that is a false declaration of homicide it is an exceptionally great violation

Of the 613 commandments, one is failing to rebuke a wrong-doer.
 

NoName

A Girl Has No Name
i hear what you are saying about viewing what i've said about GB's suicide as narrow.

now try to understand what i'm actually saying:

this is a controversy. i am not going to presume anything about these other factors you cite all of which may or may not be pertinent to GB. i take this matter very seriously therefore i give serious consideration to the reports. i tentatively affirm what i can reasonably believe to be accurate and pertinent

Well, the next logical question is what are you calling Scientology? If you only mean processes like auditing, fine. It's a little harder to blame that for someone going off the deep end or a purif under competent medical supervision killing someone, since you don't really hear that shit happening in the Freezone or Indie versions of Scientology.

But in so-called "Corporate" Scientology, the extreme fundraising has reached a point where it may as well be a religious ritual. You can't get processing without IAS donos and Idle Morgue donos. So, when you talk about whether or not Scientology made a "Corporate" Scientologist go apeshit, I'm certainly not going to assume you **only** mean auditing. I see all of the crush regging and abusive stuff as bound up in the otherwise "good" tech that the Co$ might be delivering.
 
Regarding the tragic and avoidable deaths of Lisa McPherson and Greg Bashaw (and God knows how many other deaths that have been covered up that we don't know about) :no::

This is from New York statutes but I'm sure all the other states have similar laws:

"S 125.10 Criminally negligent homicide.
A person is guilty of criminally negligent homicide when, with
criminal negligence, he causes the death of another person.
Criminally negligent homicide is a class E felony.
"

"S 125.15 Manslaughter in the second degree.
A person is guilty of manslaughter in the second degree when:
1. He recklessly causes the death of another person;
or
2. He commits upon a female an abortional act which causes her death,
unless such abortional act is justifiable pursuant to subdivision three
of section 125.05; or
3. He intentionally causes or aids another person to commit suicide.
Manslaughter in the second degree is a class C felony."


"S 125.25 Murder in the second degree.
1. With intent to cause the death of another person, he causes the
death of such person or of a third person; except that in any
prosecution under this subdivision, it is an affirmative defense that:
(a) The defendant acted under the influence of extreme emotional
disturbance for which there was a reasonable explanation or excuse, the
reasonableness of which is to be determined from the viewpoint of a
person in the defendant's situation under the circumstances as the
defendant believed them to be. Nothing contained in this paragraph shall
constitute a defense to a prosecution for, or preclude a conviction of,
manslaughter in the first degree or any other crime; or
(b) The defendant's conduct consisted of causing or aiding, without
the use of duress or deception, another person to commit suicide.

Nothing contained in this paragraph shall constitute a defense to a
prosecution for, or preclude a conviction of, manslaughter in the second
degree or any other crime; or
2. Under circumstances evincing a depraved indifference to human life,
he recklessly engages in conduct which creates a grave risk of death to
another person, and thereby causes the death of another person;
or
3. Acting either alone or with one or more other persons, he commits
or attempts to commit robbery, burglary, kidnapping, arson, rape in the
first degree, criminal sexual act in the first degree, sexual abuse in
the first degree, aggravated sexual abuse, escape in the first degree,
or escape in the second degree, and, in the course of and in furtherance
of such crime or of immediate flight therefrom, he, or another
participant, if there be any, causes the death of a person other than
one of the participants; except that in any prosecution under this
subdivision, in which the defendant was not the only participant in the
underlying crime, it is an affirmative defense that the defendant:
(a) Did not commit the homicidal act or in any way solicit, request,
command, importune, cause or aid the commission thereof; and
(b) Was not armed with a deadly weapon, or any instrument, article or
substance readily capable of causing death or serious physical injury
and of a sort not ordinarily carried in public places by law-abiding
persons; and
(c) Had no reasonable ground to believe that any other participant was
armed with such a weapon, instrument, article or substance; and
(d) Had no reasonable ground to believe that any other participant
intended to engage in conduct likely to result in death or serious
physical injury; or
4. Under circumstances evincing a depraved indifference to human life,
and being eighteen years old or more the defendant recklessly engages in
conduct which creates a grave risk of serious physical injury or death
to another person less than eleven years old and thereby causes the
death of such person; or
5. Being eighteen years old or more, while in the course of committing
rape in the first, second or third degree, criminal sexual act in the
first, second or third degree, sexual abuse in the first degree,
aggravated sexual abuse in the first, second, third or fourth degree, or
incest in the first, second or third degree, against a person less than
fourteen years old, he or she intentionally causes the death of such
person.
Murder in the second degree is a class A-I felony."
 
Oh for cryin' out loud! The Mafia also makes sure that garbage gets picked up in the inner city, that public works and construction projects get completed (wink, wink, nudge, nudge, say no more, say no more). Seriously? You don't see the surveillance tactics, thuggery, false imprisonment, etc as totally criminal? What is wrong with you?

First of all, I am not talking about the philosophy of Scientology. Please split the two in your mind. I am talking about the organization.

Anyway, I really don't know what your purpose is and I will not continue to have these discussions with you as you are clearly an apologist for the cult and have a rough time differentiating between the philosophy itself (and the efficacy of such is neither here nor there and up to anecdotal interpretation only) and the crafty, money sucking, abusive organization.

You are presenting straw man argumentation here and I have said my peace. :)

o yeah...

now that i think about it although i don't think of mtself as an apologist i must admit some of my writing on this board technically could be categorized as Apologia

jesus! shit don't get much fukkin' nerdier than that do it?
 

Crashed Alien

Patron with Honors
For the newbies, here a story of a true Scientologist... who was betrayed
Based upon the story ""Death of a Scientologist," by Tori Marlan, Published in The Chicago Reader August 16, 2002

January 16, 2003
By Rick Ross
Scientologist Greg Bashaw reached far beyond the mythical plateau of achievement that Scientologists call "clear." Bashaw rose to Operating Thetan Level 7 or "OT7."

Putting this in pop perspective, movie stars John Travolta and Tom Cruise have not yet reached the level Bashaw achieved.

The highest level a Scientologist can hope for is OT8.

But after 20 years of Scientology courses, auditing and training Bashaw killed himself.

He was married and left behind a teenage son. Bashaw was once a successful advertising executive, but he died broke, deeply in debt and unemployed. And the church he had dedicated so much of his life to abandoned him through "excommunication."

Greg's father Bob struggles to understand what happened to his son. He says, "I knew him and this wasn't him -- What the hell happened here?"

However, Bob knew about his son's dedication to Scientology. Early on Greg borrowed thousands of dollars from his father for Scientology-related courses.

Bob says Greg used one of the loans to go with Laura to the church's Los Angeles complex for course work; he paid it back with interest, explaining that he'd felt pressured by the church to pay. He wrote his father, "Our financial officer for the Church informed us we would need another $1,700 to pay for the package we were securing. It was imperative to get it this past week; otherwise the annual price increase, which he had held off for us through administrative fancywork, would go into effect. Simply put, if we didn't send the money Wednesday, the prices would have gone up on us by $500."

Greg's parents were divorced. His mother quickly realized that her son was involved in something she felt was potentially dangerous. Bob received a letter from his ex-wife during 1981 citing an article about Scientology in Reader's Digest titled, "Scientology: Anatomy of a Frightening Cult."

Greg's mother said in her letter that when she'd questioned Greg about the article, he claimed it was part of a conspiracy contrived against Scientology by "psychiatrists."

Greg's mother passed away before her son's suicide, but it was clear that she was deeply concerned about his involvement with Scientology.

Bob instead essentially accepted his son's involvement and did nothing.

Bob knew about Scientology's bad press, but when Greg said the stories about were not true, Bob accepted it.

Greg unsuccessfully tried to recruit his father.

Bob continued to have nagging doubts, but says, "There wasn't any big red flag that went up. And that's really what I was looking for."

At times Bob defended Greg to other family members. He said that he would "do battle" with Greg's aunts. In a letter to one of them he wrote: "The horror stories of Scientology victims and my imagination, plus what I have read, certainly conjure up rage and anxiety." But he couldn't bring himself to take any action. He said, "Integrity does not permit me to have a loving relationship with him while covertly working against what he sincerely believes in."

Bob concluded that his son was "free to make his own choices in life."

Greg largely cut his mother off after she criticized Scientology. Bob was afraid the same thing would happen to him. A bitter divorce had isolated him from his other children, but Greg had been away at college during that period. Bob wondered, "Do I take this position to not alienate him because he is the one of three children of mine that I am in touch with? The only one I can share my feelings and he truly shares his feelings with me? The answer is no."

So Bob decided to remain silent about Scientology.

Greg went to Clearwater, Florida, a bastion of Scientology, to take courses, which strained his budget. His wife and son did not accompany him because it cost too much. Money became tight for the Bashaw family, despite the fact that Greg earned a large income.

However, like most Scientologists Greg thought it was all worth it. He wrote, "Scientology has saved my ass, that's for sure. Now I'm unstuck, in the know, and working towards completion. It will be a new life when I get back."

Greg even believed his training enabled him to talk to the dead. He wrote Bob, "It's easy, like talking on a telephone, when you have the hang of it." Greg didn't divulge details because his talks with the dead "happened in the context of formal auditing sessions and so are confidential."

Bob remembers thinking, "What is this crap?" He considered doing something and claims he knew it was "bullshit." But in the end he did nothing. He rationalized; that maybe it is possible to speak with the dead?

Greg seemed to have a "good life." Married with a son, living in a two-story house on 16 acres of land in Barrington Hills, Illinois. And he was a highly paid successful executive at a well-known advertising firm.

But Greg was spending large sums of money on Scientology. Greg not only paid for costly courses; he donated even more cash to the controversial church. So much that they made him a "patron" of the International Association of Scientologists.

And Greg Bashaw decided to take on Scientology's critics by harassing them at anti-cult conferences.

"None of my encounters with Greg were pleasant," says Reg Alev, a former executive director of the now defunct Cult Awareness Network (CAN), which was bankrupted by Scientology lawsuits. He says Greg even confronted him on the way to the bathroom, yelling about CAN being a terrorist organization. Alev adds, "He was extremely confrontational and loud."

Jim Beebe also once associated with CAN says Greg picketed outside the CAN office and even outside staff members' homes. In 1992 Greg and other Scientologists sued the group, claiming religious discrimination, when they were refused membership. And Greg filed a complaint with the Illinois Department of Human Rights.

Cynthia Kisser, executive director of CAN after Alev, said Greg's actions were part of an organized effort to "harass and disrupt" the network. She says that during the early to mid 90s Scientologists like Greg filed 50 nearly identical lawsuits and human rights complaints against CAN. Eventually they were dismissed, but they took their toll on the organization financially. Scientology eventually sued CAN into bankruptcy.

Greg left one advertising firm for another in 1997, but it was demotion according to his father. Bob later found out Greg quit after his old firm took on Prozac as a client, a drug that Scientology's Citizens Commission on Human Rights (CCHR) claimed could lead to "homicidal rages," suicide and had tried to get the FDA to ban.

Scientology believes they have the answers for mental health and are totally opposed to psychiatry and psychiatric drugs such as Prozac.

Bob says he could tell Greg was changing. His conversation was stilted and often he just repeated what someone else said. He wasn't his usual self. A former professional associate characterized Greg as "a deep thinker," but observed that his old friend's "creativity was not at the same level of consistency." Greg admitted that this was "connected to the auditing." Auditing is the intensive question and answer sessions Scientologists undergo with their "auditors," in an effort to supposedly "clear" themselves.

In September of 2000 Greg Bashaw returned once again to Clearwater for more Scientology training. His father finally said, "Greg, you're spending a hell of a lot of time down there. I don't understand it. You're spending time away from your job, and you're spending time away from your family." But Greg only answered, "You're right, dad. You don't understand it."

Greg was now an OT7 and he didn't get back from this trip for a month. When he saw his father again he admitted that he'd been fired from his job.

When Bob met with Greg later after that trip he learned that his son planned to kill himself. Greg was going to drive to a forest preserve and drink a bottle of Drano. Bob said, "I'm holding him, and he's saying he failed everybody, he isn't worth anything, he's a total failure."

Greg's last trip to Clearwater was apparently a disaster. "They threw him out," Bob says. Greg told his father that his church said they couldn't help him and sent him away, telling him never to return.

At this point the reality of his son's situation hit Bob hard. He said, "This is when the whole thing hit the fan with me. I realized what the hell [Scientology] had done to him."

Bob wanted his son to go to a psychiatric hospital and he says Greg's wife agreed. "That surprised me," Bob said, but it seems by this time Greg's wife had quit Scientology.

Greg checked into the psychiatric ward of a local hospital, such places are anathema to Scientologists who ardently oppose psychiatry.

The following morning in the psych unit, the first thing Bob told his son was that Scientology was evil and that it was his enemy. Greg seemed upset by this. "It was as if I'd slapped him in the face," says his father.

Greg tried to commit suicide twice in the next couple of months. His teenage son found him the first time on the floor, almost dead. The second time he emailed a suicide note to a friend who alerted the police. They arrived just in time to save his life again.

Then Greg promised his father he wouldn't try to kill himself again.

A Scientology spokesperson denied that the church excommunicated Greg. She said, "He seemed to be having some rather large troubles and he left the church to go sort out his life." But she added, "Frankly, no Scientologist would ever seek psychiatry as a solution to their problems."

When asked why so many former Scientologists so ardently oppose the church its spokesperson said, "There's only one reason and one reason only, they have lots of words they don't understand." A cryptic allusion that whatever failure there was it was a personal failure, rather than anything Scientology did.

In the Spring of 2001, things seemed hopeful. Greg was working again. An old friend found him a job. Bob visited with his son and he seemed to be getting better.

But Bob still wondered would he be alright? He wrote his son about a retreat for cult survivors in Ohio called Wellspring. Greg wasn't interested. He responded that "One of the things that happens when you have the bad experiences that I've had is that people assume your own beliefs are faulty." Greg rejected any possibility of professional help Wellspring might offer.

Greg then began to shut down. Phone messages from his father went unanswered and letters were returned. Greg finally wrote back and explained, "It's almost as if I had a stroke on a mental and spiritual level, and I have to start with learning how to use a fork again, metaphorically."

Greg Bashaw finally admitted, "For the last 10 years I was fooling myself regarding the services I was taking [with Scientology], and whether they were advancing me. I wanted them to be... In retrospect, I would have been better the last ten years to have focused on simply building a family life, and on work, as most people do... Being on the services the whole time was almost unbelievably demanding in terms of time, money and commitment. The fact that it did not 'pay off' has been an exceptionally bitter pill to swallow. The fact that at the end of the road I ended up in worse shape than I'd ever been in my entire life... well, that has been completely irreconcilable with any concept of reality."

But Greg seemed to be considering his future, He said, "I would like to get to a point where the focus of my life is not on my disability. It's been very difficult talking to people lately, because typically the whole conversation pivots around how well I'm doing or not doing."

But whatever optimism Greg expressed it dissipated by that summer. A former Scientologist he confided in said Greg told him that he "had broken something that the Church of Scientology could fix, [but] they weren't going to fix it."

During the last two months of his life Greg had no work. He stayed at home and deteriorated. He owed the bank $27,000 and $29,000 on credit cards. Bob says that early that year Greg's wife talked about suing Scientology to recover the money they'd paid in advance for auditing and course work. Bob says he was told they had "a balance of nearly $200,000 in credit."

However, Greg wouldn't sue. He wrote his father, "It would subject me and my family to a great deal of shame and embarrassment, and additionally such a stance does not reflect what I believe to be true."

His old friend got a call from Greg. "He asked me, 'What can I do?' He was in torment. He felt like he was losing control. I didn't have an answer. I asked him to come here right away." Greg drove for hours to his friend's home in another town. His friend recalled, "He arrived at my house, coherent but just barely hanging on. Greg was shaking and had all but lost the ability to function."

Greg agreed to check himself into a hospital. At first he refused medication and counseling. As a devoted Scientologist he had been drilled to resist the evils of psychiatry.

Bashaw had spent more than 20 years in Scientology. He gave the group everything he had spiritually, mentally, and financially. He wanted to lose his "reactive mind," but in the end he just lost his mind. His father says, "There were periods of time he was rational and he realized he was losing it and it was a terror, a horrible thing to him."

A former long-term member of Scientology explained that the church claims "it has the solution to all your problems. Then you realize most of the problems you had, Scientology created. That former member, who met Bashaw concluded, "Greg knew this but couldn't accept it. Greg Bashaw could not let go of the mental indoctrination he'd swallowed hook, line, and sinker -- he had a hard time struggling with the fact that he'd been living a lie. Everything he thought was real wasn't real anymore."

Greg wrote his father for the last time during the summer of 2002, "I wanted to call on Father's Day but was hospitalized and had no calling card. My condition worsened dramatically three weeks ago. I have been in the hospital the last two weeks and am now moving to an intensive outpatient status."

But despite his condition Greg still insisted that his wife not sue Scientology. He said, "They would put 50 lawyers on the case. They would employ private investigators, and the like, to help win their case. And the stress would be enormous... If you could get her to consider these points, as I have repeatedly over the last few months, it would be greatly appreciated."

Greg then said, "I told them this morning I still felt depressed and suicidal," and ended cryptically, "P.S. Thanks for being a great dad."

After leaving the hospital Greg drove to his friend's house and had dinner. It seemed like he was recovering and he talked about further treatment. But just three days later Greg Bashaw pulled onto the shoulder of a road, duct taped a hose from the exhaust pipe of his car into a window and sealed it tightly with a towel. He then sat in the passenger seat until he took his last breath of carbon monoxide.

Greg Bashaw ended his life just like Scientology's founder L Ron Hubbard's son had 25 years earlier.

The police found a suicide note in his hotel room. It said simply, "Goodbye [son], you were a good buddy. Love dad."

Note: Based upon "Death of a Scientologist," by Tori Marlan, Published in The Chicago Reader August 16, 2002

I think I can relate to him... I think I understand him...

But I don't think I would do that to my family... I would hope I would not...

But if I did not have a family... Well, who knows...

Sometimes, just for a moment, the thought brings a sense of relief... and then it is gone...

Crash
 
The Reader is big here in Chicago and this story was on the front page of the reader, in newstands across the Chicagoland area. It was impossible not to see and yet the Scientologists in the org, myself included, didn't talk about it. Very sad.

I do think there was an effort to reach out to the family by certain "authorized" people in the org but, it was kept quiet. Why put this entheta on people's lines? :ohmy::bigcry:

It wasn't until the year that I left and was really getting disillusioned that I asked a long time staff member if anyone ever cared for his family afterward. It was a ballsy thing to ask as it could have appeared like I was disaffected (which I was) but it took me getting to that state for me to even inquire. :nervous:

images


I am sorry to say, NO they never took care of his family. In fact they did nothing to assist, and in fact actually did more harm to his wife and son. I was in touch with Greg before he died, and also with his wife since. She has moved forward with her life and is doing well. Nancy
 
Highly likely in a DoP interview at flag he said he had suicidal thoughts & they labelled him an illegal PC.

They may have been compliments of the " SNR CS INT ".

And, yes, I've known that to happen to someone.


No greg has no suicidal thoughts while at Flag. it was only after months of them throwing him out did suicide become an option.

He received some incorrect questions in a session and expressed that he felt 'strange' He told me "they had me packed up and to the airport so fast it would make your head spin."
 
I think because Greg is a suicide, many are inclined to not talk or think about it. Yeah, it is an uncomfortable subject . . . But this story, like the Lisa McPherson story, NEEDS to be out there, and talked about - this man, Greg Bashaw needs to be remembered too - as a victim, a fatality, of scno/co$.
Yes this story needs to be more out there and explored. Greg WAS NOT suicidal while at Flag. Not in the least.

nancy
 
Heya Lurker. :bighug:

I skip the suicide threads because I've had a gutty of seeing people I love die because of Scientology and half a dozen were suicides of good people I really loved. I'm sensitive. I still cry to think about them. It's difficult because it was so unnecessary, so callous, so wrong.

RIP, Greg. You were loved. May you always bathe in the warm embrace of love and kindness. :heartflower:

The church was callous and nasty with Greg and his family.
 
:bigcry:
The story of Greg Bashaw is very important to me to be known by every one.
I left Scientology as a Public around the time of his death. I lost my husband of more than 23 years, because I saw all the fraud in the Cult, and how it was dominating my life. My husband was interested in his Oatee Levels, so he remained in the Cult.
I had a beautiful family, home, and life. Suddenly, I lost every thing that was important in my life, just because I did not want to continue in the Cult.
I started reading the Internet after I left, and had learned about Greg's story. I was so devastated, because I had had the same toughts that life did not matter any more. The sense of betrayal was devastating to me. I could not sleep or eat. I lost a lot of weight, and cried often.

Then, I got the support of my family, friends, exes, Tory, Arnie Lerma, and many others. I decided to go back to College and go on. Well, I survived it all.
I have graduated from College the second time, have a wonderful career, and I thank all the support I got in ars, xenu.net and here, because without all emotional support, I am sure I would not have survived. Lately, I even have a partner, ex boyfriend that I love and loves me. The message is that the Cult destroys lives :omg: , and every one should be away from it. :notworthy:

There is life after Scientology!!!

It was a great decision, and I have learned a lot.


Much love to all of you!

Yes, those of us who were lucky to survive, need to keep alive the stories of those that didn't. Especially the suicides that arrive after a nervous breakdown.
In Scientology YOU CAN"T GO FOR HELP WITH MENTAL ISSUES!!!!
 
this thing is putrid

off the top, greg died by his own hand. yes, i believe CoS was incompetent in it's conduct but i don't know the facts of the case because all i have is the data produced by people whose personal disregard for truth is obvious and gross and whose hatred for the subject is worn on their sleeve. they plainly have no interest in seeing CoS improve it's conduct they only seek to invalidate it and destroy it and they utterly deny the great value of the study. they also deny american jurisprudence. "innocent until proven guilty" my friends. was susan meister murdered? maybe. her death was ruled a suicide but there appear to be material facts suggestive of foul play. we are unable to determine the veracity of those facts. if she was murdered it was done by a person. and that would most likely been personal reasons. of course the maker of this wretched video wants you to presume she was murdered as anofficial act of CoS

etcetera...

this video stinks and of course it is presented anonomously

i'm not anonymous



i'm william birdwood and i am personally responsible for all writing posted under the avatar "commander birdsong"

I am also not anonymous. I suggest you read Greg's letter to Debbie Cook. It comes right from Greg's heart. He wanted help and assistance from the church he had supported and gave so much to. He never received it, and THEN began to feel suicidal. His church abandoned him in his greatest time of need.

nancy many
 
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