Tampa Bay Times Entheta Tsunamis

[WildKat]

Wow! Ten pages on a new thread already!
This is a hot story.
But the question that comes to my mind: If Miscavige stopped paying them to spy on Broeker early this year, what triggered that? Is Broeker dead? Did he cut a deal? Is there some bigger story about to explode on the scene?
Or is the church running out of money???
Let me know if I missed something. No time to read all the comments so far.

 

[NoName]

Wow! Ten pages on a new thread already!
This is a hot story.
But the question that comes to my mind: If Miscavige stopped paying them to spy on Broeker early this year, what triggered that? Is Broeker dead? Did he cut a deal? Is there some bigger story about to explode on the scene?
Or is the church running out of money???
Let me know if I missed something. No time to read all the comments so far.

Jeffrey said he intends to call Pat as a witness. So, I would guess that either the cash cow's tits have been milked dry, or something huge is about to happen.

 

[HelluvaHoax!]

.
.
Who's that on the horizon?

A large group of PI's who have sniffed money?

Funny enough, about two years ago I posted that prediction here on ESMB. That disgruntled PIs would be a major future (unexpected) source of meltdown for the cult.

It was a thread or conversation about what would be the greatest dangers or catastrophes for the COS that would spell critical mass and doom. I think I put Tom Cruise and John Travolta blowing as #1 and #2. After that, at #3, I had mercenary PIs who saw a big payday from whistleblowing cult secrets.

I put COB on the list somewhere near the top too, but not #1because there is always a chance that his replacement might be a twinkly-eyed, saint-like savior who gives the cult a full makeover as part of his/her convincing performance.

The cult (nowadays) lives by lawyers, PIs, celebrities and defrauded parishioner donations. It's interesting that those very strengths are also the cult's greatest weaknesses.

 

[Arthur Dent]

Love this lawsuit. Cult members can put up with a lot of shit in the name of total freedom but after they get sec checked to death for the most minor of financial infractions they just may have made enough case gain to actually see this one for what it is. This may be the last straw for a whole new exodus from the cult.

I'm thinking Davey stays in bed in the mornings with the blankets over his head, dreading each new day in the press. Bummer, Davey!

 

[Lurker5]

God, I truly HOPE so

A little afraid there, davey?

 

[Lermanet_com]

Jeffrey said the church's payments to the men became irregular, then stopped completely early this year.

When money no longer buys silence
either due to unwillingness of participants, or a lack of money,
and the PI's start coming forward
the end is near..

 

[Mimsey Borogrove]

Isn't this like the old whore that is being shaken down by anybody that has anything on her? My guess is that the govt. seeing the other jackals tearing off chuncks of her haunches will want to get in on the action - going after big fines. But what about all the faithful who supported the cult all those years, paid the big bucks into the IAS?

nada. zip. Unless they get a class action going, they /we are going to be on the outside, watching the feast, hoping for scraps.

Mimsey

 

[HelluvaHoax!]

Just like with Debbie Cook, it will first appear like a veritable wonder of wonders - and we all wax enthusiastic about how great it all is. Then a few weeks later, it's all over, she got a nice paycheck, and THAT bit of truth is buried and gone forever. At least Debbie got to spill her guts for the media and for the public record (which can't ever be hidden away).

But, from the larger view, as long as these sort of nasty media events continue to unfold for Scientology and Miscavige, which I don't see how they can't, it will be the gradual chip, chip, chipping away at Scientology's credibility and image (which is already in the gutter).

As they said in the Limbo Dance, "how low can you go"? The image and credibility of Scientology can still go FAR lower!

Too bad cult members are "not allowed" to read "entheta" about the COS meltdowns, so the word will only get out in certain limited networks that over $10M of parishioner donations was spent for putting PIs for a quarter century on Broeker.

A lot of parishioners today are now a lot BROEKER than they would have been, had they had not begged and borrowed money to make those donations.

I would guess the Indies are kicking that story out to the 10,000-plus mailing list to active Scientologists. I wonder how many of them actually read it. Probably the majorities are so guilt-striken, if they even so much as look at part of that story, and promptly write KRs on themselves and make a suitable donation.

If that (or a similar) story ever gets traction within the cult's check writing public triggering mass defections, that donation scam will dry up and the Battleship COS is gonna start sinking so fast that BTs will start co-auditing each other in order to get the hell out of there!

 

[degraded being]

Marty want's it for himself. Why is it even a question? Why in hell else would he position himself constantly as the protector of LRH's image - he is quietly building up a base of Indi's that declare DM's an SP, and LRH's tech is the greatest thing since the invention of sliced bread. It is patently obvious. They all want back on the real bridge that DM's "denying" them. They are afraid for their future spiritual freedom. It is DM's biggest fear other than Broker. He fears a coup.

If Broker were to surface, and proclaim he has the upper OT levels which he has carefully saved, just as Miscavage was going down, Marty would be the jilted bride. His base would evaporate in a nano second to get on board with that OT action.

Mimsey

DM's 25 year surveillance of Broeker may have been relatively benign.....just to be sure Broeker wasn't planning anything untoward. But if there really was some likelihood that DMs surveillance being exposed, would bring Broeker out into the spotlight -- the spotlight that Marty thinks should be his-- then Marty's way of coping with that might be less benign than DM's surveillance campaign. And Marty already has a lot of intel on Broeker. By the way, is Broeker in good health?

 

[Gadfly]

Marty want's it for himself. Why is it even a question? Why in hell else would he position himself constantly as the protector of LRH's image - he is quietly building up a base of Indi's that declare DM's an SP, and LRH's tech is the greatest thing since the invention of sliced bread. It is patently obvious. They all want back on the real bridge that DM's "denying" them. They are afraid for their future spiritual freedom. It is DM's biggest fear other than Broker. He fears a coup.

If Broker were to surface, and proclaim he has the upper OT levels which he has carefully saved, just as Miscavage was going down, Marty would be the jilted bride. His base would evaporate in a nano second to get on board with that OT action.

Mimsey

I wonder though, is it possible, under any legal scenario for others to "take the Church of Scientology from DM"? I have no doubt that DM has set it all up where HE is the signatory on ALL of the accounts. He has had over 25 years to obtain legal advice, so that he could be sure to make it virtually impossible for anybody else to "push him out".

For example, if DM died tomorrow, WHO would become the top dawg, and become the signatory on all corporate letters and bank accounts? WHO would be the holder of all the deeds for all of the Scientology properties?

It seems to me that the ownership of the various aspects of Scientology has been incredibly (intentionally) clouded with endless dummy corporations, and that possibly, the ONLY thing that allows Miscavige to control it all is that the rest of the Sea Org members go along with it. I suppose the big question is, what happens if and when they STOP going along with it?

Also, since there really IS NO CENTRALIZED control or ownership on paper anywhere for all the assets of Scientology, for it to "all work", the participants simply need to all agree on who is the boss. THAT is why a takeover is possible. Marty understands all of this. Most others do not, and he sure isn't about to explain it to them.

I get this picture:

DM has been tossed out, or ran away and hid, but he is GONE. There is a huge vacuum now for a LEADER. A HUGE event is announced in LA to be held at the Forum. ALL are invited - all current members and ALL past members. It is hinted that there will be an amnesty for anybody ever declared an SP. There will be no restrictions on who may attend.

Many thousands attend. At one point in the four hour event, that chronicles the details of Miscavige's sabotage of the wonderful Church of Scientology, all of these people appear together on the stage - arm in arm, shoulder-to-shoulder:

Guillaume Lesevre (ex ED INT)
Pat Broeker (First Loyal Officer)
Mark Ingber (ex CO CMO INT)
Marty Rathbun (ex whatever)
Mike Rinder (ex CO OSA)
Debbie Cook (ex Captain FSO)

and others.

It will be the VVVVVGIs, blow down, floating TA moment for MANY thousands of Indies and current Scientology members.

Indies and corporate Scientologists will be seen hugging in open view!!!! It will be just like the end of the American Civil War! Families reunited! Friends back together! It will so amazingly joyous.

They will have taken back the TRUE SOUL of Scientology!!!!!

An amnesty will be announced, where ALL SP Declares are cancelled, as long as you write up ALL your overts and withholds and turn them in with your acceptance of the Amnesty (and of course, ALL of what you write up with be entered into the CENTRAL DATA BASE used by senior INT executives and OSA).

Marty will then come out later in FULL SO Whites, being announced as the NEW "COB"! There will be 12 Sea Org members lined up, six on a side, holding swords up high, with gold lanyards in place, as Marty walks from off stage to the podium. Many audience mmebers fall down in fits of going exterior and line charging.

But, will it actually be a "new and gentler Scientology"?

How gentle can the application of Hubbard's policies on "hard sell" be?

How gentle can one exactly apply "always attack, don't discuss"?

How kind can one be when one is applying the ruin-finding drill to a new sucker?

How kind is it really when the SCAM simply continues under a new guise, and continues along with the SAME LIES? The biggest lies being:

1. Scientology is Man's only hope.

2. Scientology must succeed or your future is fucked.

3. Anyone who is against us is stopping the advancement of Man.

and so forth and so on . . . . . .

Only time will tell.

Note: If you don't think the above is possible, then you don't understand the inner workings of the minds of these people (on both sides).

Also, people WANT to FEEL certain emotions, and they will sacrifice and violate all sorts of intellectual integrity to do so.

 

[degraded being]

.
. Aaaaand...if the PI's do take shut-up money, are they really going to shut up as obediently as exes and Ron's faithful apostates, such as Debbie.?

Will they start a new kind of indie group, Scientology EXSpies ORG, and work out how to spread the leaking truth around to their PI mates so they can keep Dave on his tiny toes while they still mantain the appearance of legal requirements on keeping their mouths shut and harvesting all the while from the tiny one's money tree?

There are endless possibilities.

 

[Gadfly]

Too bad cult members are "not allowed" to read "entheta" about the COS meltdowns, so the word will only get out in certain limited networks that over $10M of parishioner donations was spent for putting PIs for a quarter century on Broeker.

A lot of parishioners today are now a lot BROEKER than they would have been, had they had not begged and borrowed money to make those donations.

I would guess the Indies are kicking that story out to the 10,000-plus mailing list to active Scientologists. I wonder how many of them actually read it. Probably the majorities are so guilt-striken, if they even so much as look at part of that story, and promptly write KRs on themselves and make a suitable donation.

If that (or a similar) story ever gets traction within the cult's check writing public triggering mass defections, that donation scam will dry up and the Battleship COS is gonna start sinking so fast that BTs will start co-auditing each other in order to get the hell out of there!

Sadly, I suspect that the HARD CORE of the overly-dedicated Scientology public have long ago insulated themselves against contacting ANY form of "entheta". Such communications go right into the trash, without ever being perused.

Sad, but true.

 

[Smilla]

.
. Aaaaand...if the PI's do take shut-up money, are they really going to shut up as obediently as exes and Ron's faithful apostates, such as Debbie.?

Will they start a new kind of indie group, Scientology EXSpies ORG, and work out how to spread the leaking truth around to their PI mates so they can keep Dave on his tiny toes while they still mantain the appearance of legal requirements on keeping their mouths shut and harvesting all the while from the tiny one's money tree?

There are endless possibilities.

DM's paranoia will scale new heights. Who can he trust?

Nobody at all.

 

[AnonyMary]

Here we go again......

MostlyLurker | September 22, 2012 at 2:51 am

“Mr. Miscavige and his allies cancelled Mr. Hubbard’s Order promoting the Broekers by asserting that the Order was a forgery.”

Was it a forgery or it wasn’t?
What do you think Marty?

martyrathbun09 | September 22, 2012 at 8:24 am

I think 50/50 chance, and somewhat academic in either event – but people are going to have to wait for either a) my testimony in this case, or b) my third or fourth book (whichever comes first) before I offer much clarification.

How could it have been a forgery when many of us received a copy at the time of distribution?


Additionally, saw this by post by Heather G, explaining who Mitch Daniel's is in relation to the complaint.

Mitch Daniels used to be a senior VP of Eli Lilly. He was sued (unsuccessfully) in defamation by the church for saying:

“The source of virtually everything you’ve heard about Prozac has come from the Scientologists, with a boost from trial lawyers whose self-interest is obvious. One thing we want you to understand is that the Church of Scientology is no church. It’s a commercial enterprise. Every judge and every investigative journalist who has ever looked at it has come away with that conclusion. It is organized for only one purpose, which is to make money.”

http://law.justia.com/cases/federal/appellate-courts/F2/992/1329/45067/

Lovin that this guy is now Governor of Indiana, lol
http://www.in.gov/gov/

 

[Gadfly]

Here we go again......

MostlyLurker | September 22, 2012 at 2:51 am

“Mr. Miscavige and his allies cancelled Mr. Hubbard’s Order promoting the Broekers by asserting that the Order was a forgery.”

Was it a forgery or it wasn’t?
What do you think Marty?

martyrathbun09 | September 22, 2012 at 8:24 am

I think 50/50 chance, and somewhat academic in either event – but people are going to have to wait for either a) my testimony in this case, or b) my third or fourth book (whichever comes first) before I offer much clarification.

How could it have been a forgery when many of us received a copy at the time of distribution?

Marty is such an asshole.

Marty, WHY make people WAIT? Just tell the truth as you see it NOW.

But then, he needs to keep up the demand and eager expectations for his "third or forth book".

Marty has such an over-exaggerated notion of his own self-importance.

 

[NoName]

Hello boys.

Is that Marty on the left?




Couldn't find a photo of Gov Le Petomaine trying to play with the ping pong paddles

I found confidential footage of an Anonymous raid on John Travolta's private IAS fundraising event:

[video=youtube;JMK6lzmSk2o]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JMK6lzmSk2o&feature=youtube_gdata_player[/video]

 

[secretiveoldfag]

<mightily snipped...>
I wonder though, is it possible, under any legal scenario for others to "take the Church of Scientology from DM"? ...

Possibly, the ONLY thing that allows Miscavige to control it all is that the rest of the Sea Org members go along with it...

The participants simply need to all agree on who is the boss. THAT is why a takeover is possible. Marty understands all of this. Most others do not, and he sure isn't about to explain it to them.

I get this picture: An amnesty will be announced.... Marty will then come out later in FULL SO Whites, being announced as the NEW "COB"... But, will it actually be a "new and gentler Scientology"?

Note: If you don't think the above is possible, then you don't understand the inner workings of the minds of these people (on both sides).

Also, people WANT to FEEL certain emotions, and they will sacrifice and violate all sorts of intellectual integrity to do so.

Do Not Laik this picture. Though I have no doubt it is possible. The dynamics are working that way.

But if Scientology Inc is broke, it might be less attractive to MRMRetc.

 

[secretiveoldfag]

Marty is such an asshole.

Marty, WHY make people WAIT? Just tell the truth as you see it NOW.

But then, he needs to keep up the demand and eager expectations for his "third or forth book".

Marty has such an over-exaggerated notion of his own self-importance.

Maybe he still has to sort out a few shore stories...

He's such a liar and has so little imagination.

 

[Gadfly]

Do Not Laik this picture. Though I have no doubt it is possible. The dynamics are working that way.

But if Scientology Inc is broke, it might be less attractive to MRMRetc.

It depends whether MRMRetc. are simply "money motivated", or are actually True Believin' fruitcakes who respond to the Higher Call Of Duty (to the Scientology Cause - and all the subtle textures THAT entails)!

Didn't Hubbard list out some chart of motivation in some HCOPL, where money and personal gain were at the bottom and DUTY (to some cause) was at the top?

It is impossible to know. True fanatics, who believe the nonsense they peddle, say and promote the same things as do the scammers who want to sucker the rest of the believers for personal gain.

The problem with criminals and con artists is that they pretend to be honest and sincere. They look and appear just like the decent people. :confused2:

Again, only time will tell. There are many ways that this can all play out. And, I am not any good at reading minds or fortelling the future. Maybe if I had stayed in Scientology and continued advancing up the OT Levels, I would have GAINED THOSE ABILITIES!

 

[Jquepublic]

HOLY SHIT!!! WHEEeeeeeeeeeeeee!

Go Ray Jefferies! Debbie Cook's lawyer was gunning for a fight and Cook was just a warm up! I bet he will be milking the cult dry. I'm thinking someone is pointing him in the right direction and when some people saw he was willing to take on the cult, and win, his phone lit up by calls by some very interesting people.

I agree, I think someone else is guiding this.

For me, the most interesting aspect is Broeker having been named as a successor by Hubbard. If someone were to convince him to do it, could he not force Miscavige in court over that?