Techy II, OT VIII Is Defective (aka Techy II, The Return of the Tech Post)

ULRC/S

Patron with Honors
I'd say people expect MEST skills from 'Theta Processes' because that's the entirety of Scientology's promise.

Where does LRH say that?

I don't give a flying fxxx for any Pr utterings.

I have experienced/caused "mest happenings" normally during moments of HIGH emergency, but can't do them at will, not do I expect to.

Regards, Allen
 

RogerB

Crusader
Wht an insane presumption!

Why do you expect MEST skills from theta processes?

To gain MEST skills you need to DRILL them, and there are no "drills" in any current OT lineup.

LRH is very clear about this in the PDC tapes, where he spends several lectures describing DRILLs to start such skills. That the salespeople may have said things differently is of no concern of mine, and shouldn't be to you either.

The most powerful demo of "OT skills" as you would have them wasn't from any ""OT", but a Aikido Master, who I and several other karate students saw throw a 6 ft 180 pound black belt through the AIR and into a wall like he'd been hit by a bus - WITHOUT EVEN TOUCHING HIM!

This is what's possible from a lifetime of drilling!

As an OT I have developed many skills in the theta region which I didn't have before, and I'm very happy with them.

But they didn't come from the CoS's "OTVIII", as i quit the CoS after audited NOTs, I gained them with Bill Robertson's upper bridge.

Regards, Allen

This is correct Allen.

One needs to get into action and do the exercises/drills that develop and strengthen your spiritual powers . . . . nothing weird in that; training athletes and oriental marshal arts types have been doing it successfully for years.

And therein is the proof of the premise.

Though it also true there are often impediments in the way of being able to freely use one's spiritual powers and these impediments often need to be removed with correctly applied processes. Though it is also true that some folks manage to "push through" the impediments with drills and exercises alone.

But, nonetheless, one needs to make the distinction between the two issues.

R
 
Last edited:

RogerB

Crusader
I'd say people expect MEST skills from 'Theta Processes' because that's the entirety of Scientology's promise.

Snipped . . .
Zinj

Well, Zinj, it was the promise in the early days to wit: as in the book "Creation of Human Ability" as an example, and all the early spiritual drill-like/exercise-like "processes" we used in those days.

And, for the record, the developing and expression of the putative "OT powers and abilities" did indeed occur.

The promise made at that time was delivered on . . . but only if one did the process actions needed.

The tragedy was, the tech was vastly incomplete and it did indeed also contain some errors . . . . and so the spiritual powers and abilities that did "turn on" often only did so fleetingly, or not under full knowing control.

However Alan did develop the tech to handle this "fleetingness" and random availability of abilities and powers regained.

But, what is to be noted is that the spiritual powers that turned on for folks in those days were of a vast array and different amongst us all. That is, what I got was quite different to what someone else got; and/or in different degrees for folks who had these powers turn on.

Where the current line-up of processes and promises on the "Bridge" is, I haven't a clue. And if they are still touting the "OT Levels" as cause over MEST and all that kind of stuff, then it is bullshit.

But, I will tell for from personal experience and from observation of many others, we did get the promise delivered . . . though I will also say in all honesty, that on many if not most occasions the degree of the delivery on the promise was only in terms of a small gradient. But, the degree of gain can be increased with continuance of the correct processes/drills/exercises.

This shit is not a magic-like light switch you can suddenly turn on to full glare!

In other words, it is easy to criticize the proposition if you've never attempted it (as with you guys who never were in and/or never did any of the processes) for the general notion folks have of "OT abilities" and "Cause over MEST" is actually often wrong.

A good exercise would be to ask/survey folks what they think those two phrases mean!

Then you'll get an idea of why it is some can think it is all "bullshit." :D

RogerB
 

RolandRB

Rest in Peace
Wht an insane presumption!

Why do you expect MEST skills from theta processes?

To gain MEST skills you need to DRILL them, and there are no "drills" in any current OT lineup.

LRH is very clear about this in the PDC tapes, where he spends several lectures describing DRILLs to start such skills. That the salespeople may have said things differently is of no concern of mine, and shouldn't be to you either.

The most powerful demo of "OT skills" as you would have them wasn't from any ""OT", but a Aikido Master, who I and several other karate students saw throw a 6 ft 180 pound black belt through the AIR and into a wall like he'd been hit by a bus - WITHOUT EVEN TOUCHING HIM!

Regards, Allen

That must of been one hell of a plate of beans!
 

RolandRB

Rest in Peace
I'd say people expect MEST skills from 'Theta Processes' because that's the entirety of Scientology's promise.

Of course, once that fails, practitioners have to scale back their expectations or face the failure.

Zinj

They can pick up the chair with their hands instead of their postulates and prove they are OT by "making it go right" at the end and regging a few tens of thousands of dollars off the chumps.
 

Veda

Sponsor
From the 'Scientology Technical Dictionary', 1975:

"OPERATING THETAN, 1. a thetan exterior who can have but doesn't have to have a body in order to control or operate thought, life, matter, energy, space, and time. 2. willing and knowing cause over life, thought, matter, energy, space and time. And that would of course be mind, and that would of course be universe. 3. an individual who could operate totally independently of his body whether he had one or didn't have one... this state is being attained by drills and familiarity after the state of Clear has been attained."

For a long time, the above is what was sold as "OT 8" - which was also described as "Total Freedom and Total Power" - but that was before the Bait and Switch of the latter 1970s, when "OT 8" went from being the final and top ("Total Power!") "OT level," to being the first "OT level."

It's actually painful to post this link, but I'll do it since it provides further explanation:

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=218625&postcount=252

Almost 60 years ago L. Ron Hubbard wrote boldly and matter-of-factly of "thetans" conquering the "homo saps" of Earth - and many a fixed glare was inspired by his words.

The "Scientology Bridge to Total Freedom and Total Power" has been around for a long time; that "Bridge":

1) was "The only hope for Mankind," and the "closely taped path out of the labyrinth"

2) It justified:

a) Security ("Have you ever had unkind thoughts about LRH?") Checking ("Are you a pervert?")

b) The Children's Security Check, with page after page of questions to be asked of children age 6 - 12, with those after 12 being eligible for adult Security Checking

c) Implantology Mind F__k

d) The Suppressive Person doctrine

e) Disconnection

f) The Fair Game Law

g) Hard Sell

h) Deceit, used in recruiting "Raw Meat"

i) Oily PR tactics, including manipulative use of "ARC," particularly "love bombing" and gushing Affinity, to "handle" the "Wogs." (This part of Scientology tech is currently "out" in the CofS.)

j) De facto slave labor

k) Child abuse

l) Fraud

And, now, that the millions have been made, and shipped safely to overseas bank accounts, the founder's name, and his words, carved in steel and buried in vaults, and the monuments to the founder have been built (called Orgs), there are still stray Scientologists wandering about, disoriented and confused. Be kind to them.

By the way, I wasn't making fun of the idea of telepathy, just the, "I thought the phone would ring, and it did!!!" 'Advance!' magazine "OT Success Story" mentality.

Please note the earlier link to Rosicrucian telepathy. http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=430680&postcount=65 :)
 

Panda Termint

Cabal Of One
I sometimes think that when Hubbard was describing/defining the "characteristics of OT" he might have had Doc Smith's fictitious Arisians in mind. They seem to fit the bill perfectly whereas those who have actually done OT Levels never do.

As for any abilities which might be gained in pursuing scientology's route to these abilities; the price, in terms of human suffering and misery (of others), is MUCH too high and far outweighs any possible gains.
 

Terril park

Sponsor
I sometimes think that when Hubbard was describing/defining the "characteristics of OT" he might have had Doc Smith's fictitious Arisians in mind. They seem to fit the bill perfectly whereas those who have actually done OT Levels never do.

As for any abilities which might be gained in pursuing scientology's route to these abilities; the price, in terms of human suffering and misery (of others), is MUCH too high and far outweighs any possible gains.

Unless you go the Freezone route perhaps?
 

Panda Termint

Cabal Of One
Unless you go the Freezone route perhaps?
Perhaps, Terril.

I hear there's no slave-labour, human trafficking, enforced abortions, punitive ethics, RPF, face-ripping, SRAs, no-exchange donations, over-inflated pricing, cultic control mechanisms, para-military, children in chain lockers, over-boarding, peanut-pushing, sekret command lines, Finance Police, Thought Police, Office of Special Affairs etc etc etc...

But that's just what I've heard.
 

Veda

Sponsor
From the 'Scientology Technical Dictionary', 1975:

"OPERATING THETAN, 1. a thetan exterior who can have but doesn't have to have a body in order to control or operate thought, life, matter, energy, space, and time. 2. willing and knowing cause over life, thought, matter, energy, space and time. And that would of course be mind, and that would of course be universe. 3. an individual who could operate totally independently of his body whether he had one or didn't have one... this state is being attained by drills and familiarity after the state of Clear has been attained."

For a long time, the above is what was sold as "OT 8" - which was also described as "Total Freedom and Total Power" - but that was before the Bait and Switch of the latter 1970s, when "OT 8" went from being the final and top ("Total Power!") "OT level," to being the first "OT level."

It's actually painful to post this link, but I'll do it since it provides further explanation:

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=218625&postcount=252

Almost 60 years ago L. Ron Hubbard wrote boldly and matter-of-factly of "thetans" conquering the "homo saps" of Earth - and many a fixed glare was inspired by his words.

The "Scientology Bridge to Total Freedom and Total Power" has been around for a long time; that "Bridge":

1) was "The only hope for Mankind," and the "closely taped path out of the labyrinth"

2) It justified:

a) Security ("Have you ever had unkind thoughts about LRH?") Checking ("Are you a pervert?") (See recent "Success Story" in FZ section.)

b) The Children's Security Check, with page after page of questions to be asked of children age 6 - 12, with those after 12 being eligible for adult Security Checking

c) Implantology Mind F__k

d) The Suppressive Person doctrine

e) Disconnection

f) The Fair Game Law (at times, to some degree) ("Trick" and "lie to" are still used by some in the FZ, and Pierre E. threatened to sue Emma)

g) Hard Sell (in some instances in the FZ)

h) Deceit, used in recruiting "Raw Meat"

i) Oily PR tactics, including manipulative use of "ARC," particularly "love bombing" and gushing Affinity, to "handle" the "Wogs." (This part of Scientology tech is currently "out" in the CofS.)

j) De facto slave labor (not practical in FZ)

k) Child abuse

l) Fraud

And, now, that the millions have been made, and shipped safely to overseas bank accounts, the founder's name, and his words, carved in steel and buried in vaults, and the monuments to the founder have been built (called Orgs), there are still stray Scientologists wandering about, disoriented and confused. Be kind to them.

By the way, I wasn't making fun of the idea of telepathy, just the, "I thought the phone would ring, and it did!!!" 'Advance!' magazine "OT Success Story" mentality.

Please note the earlier link to Rosicrucian telepathy. http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=430680&postcount=65 :)

I hear there's no slave-labour, human trafficking, enforced abortions, punitive ethics, RPF, face-ripping, SRAs, no-exchange donations, over-inflated pricing, cultic control mechanisms, para-military, children in chain lockers, over-boarding, peanut-pushing, sekret command lines, Finance Police, Thought Police, Office of Special Affairs etc etc etc...

But that's just what I've heard.

Scientology lite is an improvement, but it maintains those points that have been bolded (above).

An old technique is to tighten the slave bracelets until they chafe, then after a while, loosen them so they're comfortable.

Time will tell where this leads.
 
Top