The Ashtray? "Stand Up!""Thank you!" ..."Sit down in that chair!" "Thank you!"

I think the important point here -if you want to realize what Laffy was really up to- is the fact that if your spending hours 'intending' orders to an ashtray, you are also being do that drill! You are back-handedly training YOURSELF to always comply with authoritatively given commands.

This was his real magnum opus. That he set up a system where we all hypnotized OURSELVES AND EACH OTHER to obey Scientology, and by extention, the founder.

DING DING DING!!! Right on, Mackie!!! :thumbsup: :happydance: :hifive:


Good topic, Idle Morgue. From your OP, it's pretty clear you understand the control factor that pervades all Scientology relationships. Scientologists usually experience it on "all flows," (i.e., giving, receiving, observing, and self-administering.)

Hubbard was pretty clear about what TR 8 (the ashtray drill) was for.

Here's the drill:

After drilling Tone 40 on an Object, above, Scientologists drill "Tone 40 on a Person" on TR-9. The Tech Dictionary entry for Training Routines provides the [claimed] purpose of each of the drills. From the last part of HCOB Upper Indoc TRs:

"To obtain obedience," is the ev purp of any slaver. And disobedience is how Scientologists determine whether you are a degraded being.

Caroline, This is unbelievable as written by hubbard as you post:

"Very degraded beings alter-is. Degraded ones refuse to comply without mentioning it. Beings in fair condition try to comply but remark their troubles, to get help when needed. Competent higher-toned beings understand orders and comply if possible but mainly do their jobs without needing lots of special orders.

Degraded beings find any instruction painful, as they have been painfully indoctrinated with violent measures in the past. They therefore alter-is any order or don’t comply.

Thus, in auditing pcs or in org, where you find alter-is (covert noncompliance) and noncompliance, given sensible and correct tech or instructions, you are dealing with a degraded low-level being and should act accordingly.


Degraded beings, taking a cue from SP associates, instinctively resent, hate and seek to obstruct any person in charge of anything or any Big Being.

Anyone issuing sensible orders is the first one resented by a degraded being.

A degraded being lies to his seniors, avoids orders covertly by alter-is, fails to comply, supplies only complex ideas that can’t ever work (obstructive) and is a general area of enturbulence, often mild seeming or even “cooperative”, often even flattering, sometimes merely dull but consistently alter-ising or non-complying.

Hubbard, L. R., (1967, 22 March). Alter-Is and Degraded Beings. Technical Bulletins (1991 ed., Vol VIII, pp. 98-9). Los Angeles: Bridge Publications, Inc."

The above is actually a hypnotic statement by hubbard given or commanded to members, once a person truely believes in the tech. And truely believes in engrams, secondaries & lock as the cause of human insanity or aberration. Hubbard is basically saying if you don't do as I say, you are a degraded being. The untruth being that if you don't believe me, hubbard, you are against me or don't believe in the tech. And since you do not believe in the tech, you are connected to an SP. OMG, he really knew how to twist his false hood of scientology being the only route out. He really created thought stopping and stopped critical thinking skills and in fact put an end to critical thinking skils. And critical meaning able to judge something as true or false.
Jamie DeWolf appeared on CurrentTV's "The Young Turks" on Thursday night and spoke with host Cenk Uygur about how Scientology is able to convince people -- including big-name celebrities like Tom Cruise, John Travolta, Kirstie Alley and Juliette Lewis -- to believe its message.

"I think it is one of the most brilliant and devious, systematic brainwashing systems that's ever been invented," DeWolf told CurrentTV. "It works through electrified hypnosis. It works through past life regression therapy. It works through a lot of hodgepodge of ideas that you sort of throw together with this extremely brutal sort of security sense and this kind of like CIA-like structure that becomes really intoxicating to people."

Some nasty s**t he put together


Gold Meritorious Patron
My gripe with the drill from the outset is that I GOT IT just by READING the bulletin -- tone/volume of voice is not "intention." I didn't need to holler to "prove" that it wouldn't work. However, the actual EP of the drill for me was that I discovered I was incapable of coming up with sufficient "intention" and wanted to see a real OT because surely that person could intend the ashtray to "stand" (what does a standing-up ashtray look like, anyway??)

I always thought it would be a total hoot if somehow a special ashtray could be brought in ... one that appeared normal, but had a magnetic plate in it of some sort ... and some sort of electromagnet could be placed discretely on the underside of the chair, not visible to the casual viewer, and the whole apparatus could be operated by a very discrete remote control device. You yell "STAND UP!" and the ashtray jumps up, apparently on its own. I could just picture everybody in the course room shitting a brick. Of course, there could be variations ... you yell "STAND UP!" and nothing happens, and then you tell the ashtray "STAND THE FUCK UP OR I WILL SMASH YOU TO SMITHERENES!!!!" and that is when it "stands up." Of course, the whole thing would need to be covertely videocammed and youtubed!



Patron with Honors
Oldtimer, I don't want to offend you but feel that I must reply here that in many cultures it is considered to be rude for a woman to look directly into a man's eyes, or for a younger person to do that with an older person. Very likely, to her viewpoint, you were staring and she was trying to maintain a respectful distance, and stay on friendly terms. Looking directly into someone's eyes is also considered to be a flirtatious opening or even a sexual/romantic "comeon" in almost all cultures that I know of. Many religiously devout people of both sexes practice "conservation of the eyes" when speaking even with close friends of the opposite sex. Many of my friends do so, and I understand and don't fault them for it.

In some cultures, a too direct look or stare is an invitation to fight, and makes people tend to get combative or withdraw for their own protection. (Called "Hard looks" in the barrio and "Stink eye" in Hawaii!)

One of the "tells" of a Scientologist and some former Scientologists (or an OSA operative sent in to a group as a "spy" or enturbulator) is how aberated the way they look at people is, from the norm of mainstream culture. They do tend to stare, give hard looks, look directly too much and for too long into one's face, try and "capture" someones eyes and attention in this way. Even when they are talking and smiling, they still tend to put people off and make them uncomfortable, often folks can't pinpoint exactly what it is, something just seems "off" about them, due to their habitual too direct gazes and staring at someone.

At the risk of being stoned...I will also report that many social workers, teachers, cops, mental health workers and others are taught in their training that in a person who is looking at someone too directly, holding a gaze for too long, or refusing to drop one's eyes in conversation, that is a "tell" of certain kinds of mental illness. Really! I got this in my professional training.

I think Ron did it to try and make his paramilitary group intimidating. It does not imply good communication skills at all, in and of itself.

good post. when i was at Flag - for a limited time only - a Sea Org dude (respectfully "dude") would come up right into my face and stare and say "what are you doing?". i think he thought he was tone 40 or that he was just plain cool. Either way my balls dissapeared into my stomach. I liked doing the Pro-TRs when I could just relaxedly give a command knowing the person would do it. This can be used in a bad way. LRH was a contradiction. over and over. On one hand he was covertly making military personnel; on the other hand he was saying Tone 40 is not Tone 40 if it has bad intentions. I guess numbnuts at Flag had not understood that. My only regret at Flag is I did not carry a Tazer.


Putting intention into an ashtray is a gradient to placing intention into people. Nancy Many describes this upper gradient in her book.

phenom anon


I think the important point here -if you want to realize what Laffy was really up to- is the fact that if your spending hours 'intending' orders to an ashtray, you are also being do that drill! You are back-handedly training YOURSELF to always comply with authoritatively given commands.

This was his real magnum opus. That he set up a system where we all hypnotized OURSELVES AND EACH OTHER to obey Scientology, and by extention, the founder.

I think it had more to do with little girls in hot pants holding his ashtray. :angry:

But seriously, the drill is much more fun when you are actually smoking a [STRIKE]joint[/STRIKE] cig. :hysterical: