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The Earlier Confusion - Why I Didn't Make It in the CoS

haiqu

Patron Meritorious
In my recent thread "Why I No Longer Support the Church of Scientology" I mentioned that by 1982 my situation was such that I felt a need to go to Flag for handling. So what happened between 1975 and 1982 that caused this?

I could enumerate a number of issues. I was dragged off my basic purpose to become an auditor on many occasions, for one thing. The org always seemed to need someone to handle a GO project, or Div 6 dissem, and there were also two disastrous trips on staff which I won't expand on here.

However, when one is making case gain he can handle this kind of randomity. So what was going on with my auditing?

Without naming names I'd like to outline some GAEs that were unhandled until much later when I decided to run my own case solo. They were certainly never handled by the CoS, but I naively expected to be able to get them off to someone at Flag.

Auditor #1, female SO member, class unknown: Totally in propitiation, distracted the session constantly with cries of "Oh, Rob!" any time the session wasn't going well. She wasn't suited to be an auditor at all. This auditor also ran me on the Sunshine R/D herself, which I later found to be a gross error since it's a solo action.

Auditor #2, female SO member, probably Class VI: After getting off a discreditable withhold she completely distracted me from cogniting by bursting out crying in session.

Auditor #3, female SO member, probably Class VI: After I got off an embarrasing session MWH she said, "Oh, that's a common one" as if to lesson the overt. It had the effect of cutting off my ability to blow a chain of E/S WHs and threw the attention on her instead. In another session I had become very agitated, to the point where I felt a need to walk around the block to cool off. I said that I was really angry, but not at her. Instead of handling the origination she complied. I ranted constantly about some issue during the walk and have no idea if this data ever got into the folders.

Auditor #4, male Dn auditor: On running into a heavy this-life secondary I burst out crying, at which he visibly flinched enough to distract me. It turned out this was also an off-line case action since he audited me without folders, and I was AO public in a Class IV org.

The constant error here is OUT TR's.

I was a basic courses supervisor and had passed TR's 0-9 the hard way (two hours of no blink, flubless TR0 as the basic standard). I deserved better than this.

There were also some very basic case programming errors, although these came from changes in the tech rather than C/Sing errors. I have absolutely no complaints about Peter Sparshott or Martin Bentley as C/Ses. An example was having to do the CCRD and then the DCSI after being declared Clear. The guy who checked me out originally, Les Verity, had been a Clear checker at St. Hill and he got it right the first time. Everything after that was a Q&A.

The Purification Rundown was utter Dev-T. I had spent three months in Cairns in 1973 working outside in 40 degree heat and eating good fresh food, and had already sweated out any chemicals in my system. In fact an SO survey was done some months prior to its release asking anyone in the org if they had handled prior drugs and if so how they handled them, and this data was given to them. I suspect that it may have been used as a basis for the actual creation of the sweat program in the first place!

I could go on, but this should be enough data to outline the point: The tech inside the CoS has been crap for over 30 years. Anyone who aims criticism at the Freezone had better look inside his own camp before making comment. And bringing up the GoaT tech as a "solution" won't wash with me either, that's the weirdest dramatization I've seen yet: the stupid leading the bland.

Rob Judd
Clear 13611
 
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Ogsonofgroo

Crusader
Crap for only 30 years? Oh come on matey, pretty sure it was crap right from the start, that'd be nearly 65 years and counting.

:yes:

:whistling:
 

Free Being Me

Crusader
xenu-pam.jpg
 

RogerB

Crusader
So, Rob . . . Les Verity, eh?

You're a lucky man . . . Les and I were on staff together in Melbourne. A sweeter dude you'll never find. He's a gem.

He was on the Mel ACC . . . he had the tale to tell about a PC during the ACC who manifested a bank of computers in the auditing room. The auditor didn't know what to do, so put in a break to get a case advice . . . Dick Halpern (assisting LRH in running the ACC) said: "Bloody go back in there and run it out!"

R
 

Veda

Sponsor
In my recent thread "Why I No Longer Support the Church of Scientology" I mentioned that by 1982 my situation was such that I felt a need to go to Flag for handling. So what happened between 1975 and 1982 that caused this?

I could enumerate a number of issues. I was dragged off my basic purpose to become an auditor on many occasions, for one thing. The org always seemed to need someone to handle a GO project, or Div 6 dissem, and there were also two disastrous trips on staff which I won't expand on here.

However, when one is making case gain he can handle this kind of randomity. So what was going on with my auditing?

Without naming names I'd like to outline some GAEs that were unhandled until much later when I decided to run my own case solo. They were certainly never handled by the CoS, but I naively expected to be able to get them off to someone at Flag.

Auditor #1, female SO member, class unknown: Totally in propitiation, distracted the session constantly with cries of "Oh, Rob!" any time the session wasn't going well. She wasn't suited to be an auditor at all. This auditor also ran me on the Sunshine R/D herself, which I later found to be a gross error since it's a solo action.

Auditor #2, female SO member, probably Class VI: After getting off a discreditable withhold she completely distracted me from cogniting by bursting out crying in session.

Auditor #3, female SO member, probably Class VI: After I got off an embarrasing session MWH she said, "Oh, that's a common one" as if to lesson the overt. It had the effect of cutting off my ability to blow a chain of E/S WHs and threw the attention on her instead. In another session I had become very agitated, to the point where I felt a need to walk around the block to cool off. I said that I was really angry, but not at her. Instead of handling the origination she complied. I ranted constantly about some issue during the walk and have no idea if this data ever got into the folders.

Auditor #4, male Dn auditor: On running into a heavy this-life secondary I burst out crying, at which he visibly flinched enough to distract me. It turned out this was also an off-line case action since he audited me without folders, and I was AO public in a Class IV org.

The constant error here is OUT TR's.

I was a basic courses supervisor and had passed TR's 0-9 the hard way (two hours of no blink, flubless TR0 as the basic standard). I deserved better than this.

There were also some very basic case programming errors, although these came from changes in the tech rather than C/Sing errors. I have absolutely no complaints about Peter Sparshott or Martin Bentley as C/Ses. An example was having to do the CCRD and then the DCSI after being declared Clear. The guy who checked me out originally, Les Verity, had been a Clear checker at St. Hill and he got it right the first time. Everything after that was a Q&A.

The Purification Rundown was utter Dev-T. I had spent three months in Cairns in 1973 working outside in 40 degree heat and eating good fresh food, and had already sweated out any chemicals in my system. In fact an SO survey was done some months prior to its release asking anyone in the org if they had handled prior drugs and if so how they handled them, and this data was given to them. I suspect that it may have been used as a basis for the actual creation of the sweat program in the first place!

I could go on, but this should be enough data to outline the point: The tech inside the CoS has been crap for over 30 years. Anyone who aims criticism at the Freezone had better look inside his own camp before making comment. And bringing up the GoaT tech as a "solution" won't wash with me either, that's the weirdest dramatization I've seen yet: the stupid leading the bland.

Rob Judd
Clear 13611

Do you still have attention on these examples of poor C/Sing and auditing or have they been resolved?
 

haiqu

Patron Meritorious
So, Rob . . . Les Verity, eh?

You're a lucky man . . . Les and I were on staff together in Melbourne. A sweeter dude you'll never find. He's a gem.

He was on the Mel ACC . . . he had the tale to tell about a PC during the ACC who manifested a bank of computers in the auditing room. The auditor didn't know what to do, so put in a break to get a case advice . . . Dick Halpern (assisting LRH in running the ACC) said: "Bloody go back in there and run it out!"

R

Good story. Yes, Les was (is?) a legend. He came in for only a short while to do this, then disappeared again. He was fond of telling one that his name meant "The Truth" in French.

At the time (1978) he lived on a yacht in Sydney Harbour. This was actually how I came to be living on a yacht myself ... when all was lost and I couldn't figure out how to survive with the costs of living I followed his example.

Rob
 
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haiqu

Patron Meritorious
Do you still have attention on these examples of poor C/Sing and auditing or have they been resolved?

They have been resolved on a personal level. Once I attained OT these things looked fairly trivial, but at the time they prevented me from handling what needed to be done to get ahead in life. There's certainly some residual resentment at the loss of opportunities and goals not made this lifetime because of these issues. Good thing we don't only live one lifetime, that's about the only consolation I can muster. In real terms these errors probably cost me millions in potential lost income, not to mention the years of anguish accompanying the mess. I was pretty ambitious in those days.

Looking at this from a more pan-determined level, I can see that my ability to forward Scientology and play a bigger game was lost for many years. I'll leave it to Int Mgmt to calculate out what that cost them.

Rob
 

Veda

Sponsor
They have been resolved on a personal level. Once I attained OT these things looked fairly trivial, but at the time they prevented me from handling what needed to be done to get ahead in life. There's certainly some residual resentment at the loss of opportunities and goals not made this lifetime because of these issues. Good thing we don't only live one lifetime, that's about the only consolation I can muster. In real terms these errors probably cost me millions in potential lost income, not to mention the years of anguish accompanying the mess. I was pretty ambitious in those days.

Looking at this from a more pan-determined level, I can see that my ability to forward Scientology and play a bigger game was lost for many years. I'll leave it to Int Mgmt to calculate out what that cost them.

Rob

Thank you for the response.

I agree that there is such a thing as bad(ly done) auditing, and also well done auditing; there is also the dilemma that Scientology's tech is flawed and some say booby-trapped.

As a general rule, the higher one goes on its Grade Chart, notably its confidential portions, the more the built-in ("Standard") actions become the antithesis of what auditing was supposed to be when the person was first introduced to auditing.

If the person has been prepared - "set up" - the person likely won't mind or even notice.

In short, you seem to believe that if you can just do Scientology right, then you'll have the full gains that have been promised. If that's the case, then you'll be the first one.

Also, by describing yourself as a "Clear," with a Clear number no less :), you're placing yourself in an Hubbardian mind box.

IMO, Scientology does have some positive aspects, but it does not contain the secrets of life, the universe, and everything, and has not produced any actual Clears, and certainly no OTs.

And that's not just because "tech is out."

Reading you reminds me of myself 30 years ago. I was trying to figure out what happened, still (more or less) believed in the "tech," had quit the CofS, and even audited for the better part of a year outside the CofS.

Over time my view changed.

I graduated from Scientology.

You'd be surprised how much "case" disappears when one stops thinking like a Scientologist.

If you get out of that box with that Clear number on it, I think you'll find it refreshing. :)
 

Gadfly

Crusader
Crap for only 30 years? Oh come on matey, pretty sure it was crap right from the start, that'd be nearly 65 years and counting.

:yes:

:whistling:

True.

When did the "tech" EVER make an actual "clear" or "OT" (as defined so differently and haphazardly by Hubbard)? :confused2:
 

Ogsonofgroo

Crusader
They have been resolved on a personal level. Once I attained OT these things looked fairly trivial, but at the time they prevented me from handling what needed to be done to get ahead in life. There's certainly some residual resentment at the loss of opportunities and goals not made this lifetime because of these issues. Good thing we don't only live one lifetime, that's about the only consolation I can muster. In real terms these errors probably cost me millions in potential lost income, not to mention the years of anguish accompanying the mess. I was pretty ambitious in those days.

Looking at this from a more pan-determined level, I can see that my ability to forward Scientology and play a bigger game was lost for many years. I'll leave it to Int Mgmt to calculate out what that cost them.

Rob

Oh come on, spill the beans, how much have you made (monatary-wise) since you left? That is what they lost. You lost nothing, and had/have a chance to gain your own person and path in the world, now that you aren't stifled by Hubbard bs., count your lucky stars, and gtfo of the house and breathe! :)

(I mean this in the nicest of ways mon, seriously, forwarding/using Rotten Ronnie's agenda, in my honest opinion, is like tying an anchor to your ass and jumping in the ocean)
 

haiqu

Patron Meritorious
I just snorted my coffee....

We- or they diverted haiqu's thread. Sorry... :unsure:

Hi Bea,

I actually don't mind so much. Certainly not going to sit here going:

ABSOLUTEABLE SERIOUSNESS

anyhow, since I'm well out of the matrix.

Rob
 

haiqu

Patron Meritorious
Thank you for the response.

I agree that there is such a thing as bad(ly done) auditing, and also well done auditing; there is also the dilemma that Scientology's tech is flawed and some say booby-trapped.

As a general rule, the higher one goes on its Grade Chart, notably its confidential portions, the more the built-in ("Standard") actions become the antithesis of what auditing was supposed to be when the person was first introduced to auditing.

If the person has been prepared - "set up" - the person likely won't mind or even notice.

I reject this. As early as 1962 Hubbard had already mentioned that auditing procedures had exceeded the mind's protection, so lack of this knowledge is just a matter of the PC not studying the tech.

When actions are programmed or performed incorrectly then yes, we get into trouble. Shiploads of it.

In short, you seem to believe that if you can just do Scientology right, then you'll have the full gains that have been promised. If that's the case, then you'll be the first one.

You seem to have overlooked the "Catch 22" of Scientology: nothing is promised, but "we always deliver what we promise." ;-)

Also, by describing yourself as a "Clear," with a Clear number no less :), you're placing yourself in an Hubbardian mind box.

I was never anything else, but I acknowledge Hubbard as the being who correctly pointed out what it was that made me different.

IMO, Scientology does have some positive aspects, but it does not contain the secrets of life, the universe, and everything, and has not produced any actual Clears, and certainly no OTs.

That really depends on how one defines these things. And anyone who had gained real OT ability would be fairly foolish to exhibit it, nie?

There are a few real OTs about. I don't mean these clowns who can make a car get out of their way or find a parking space at will, either.

Rob
 

Infinite

Troublesome Internet Fringe Dweller
. . . That really depends on how one defines these things. And anyone who had gained real OT ability would be fairly foolish to exhibit it, nie? . . .

Au contraire, mon ami . . . anyone who can demonstrate any OT ability as defined by L Ron Hubbard would, single handedly, deliver Scientology from its current slow-motion death within the ongoing maelstrom of international ridicule and bring about a rehabilitation of L Ron Hubbard. In fact, anyone who can demonstrate the state of Clear would do the same thing. And, hey, even if such an outcome was not worthy of your interest, a million dollars is not to be sneezed at.
 

Idle Morgue

Gold Meritorious Patron
In my recent thread "Why I No Longer Support the Church of Scientology" I mentioned that by 1982 my situation was such that I felt a need to go to Flag for handling. So what happened between 1975 and 1982 that caused this?

I could enumerate a number of issues. I was dragged off my basic purpose to become an auditor on many occasions, for one thing. The org always seemed to need someone to handle a GO project, or Div 6 dissem, and there were also two disastrous trips on staff which I won't expand on here.

However, when one is making case gain he can handle this kind of randomity. So what was going on with my auditing?

Without naming names I'd like to outline some GAEs that were unhandled until much later when I decided to run my own case solo. They were certainly never handled by the CoS, but I naively expected to be able to get them off to someone at Flag.

Auditor #1, female SO member, class unknown: Totally in propitiation, distracted the session constantly with cries of "Oh, Rob!" any time the session wasn't going well. She wasn't suited to be an auditor at all. This auditor also ran me on the Sunshine R/D herself, which I later found to be a gross error since it's a solo action.

Auditor #2, female SO member, probably Class VI: After getting off a discreditable withhold she completely distracted me from cogniting by bursting out crying in session.

Auditor #3, female SO member, probably Class VI: After I got off an embarrasing session MWH she said, "Oh, that's a common one" as if to lesson the overt. It had the effect of cutting off my ability to blow a chain of E/S WHs and threw the attention on her instead. In another session I had become very agitated, to the point where I felt a need to walk around the block to cool off. I said that I was really angry, but not at her. Instead of handling the origination she complied. I ranted constantly about some issue during the walk and have no idea if this data ever got into the folders.

Auditor #4, male Dn auditor: On running into a heavy this-life secondary I burst out crying, at which he visibly flinched enough to distract me. It turned out this was also an off-line case action since he audited me without folders, and I was AO public in a Class IV org.

The constant error here is OUT TR's.

I was a basic courses supervisor and had passed TR's 0-9 the hard way (two hours of no blink, flubless TR0 as the basic standard). I deserved better than this.

There were also some very basic case programming errors, although these came from changes in the tech rather than C/Sing errors. I have absolutely no complaints about Peter Sparshott or Martin Bentley as C/Ses. An example was having to do the CCRD and then the DCSI after being declared Clear. The guy who checked me out originally, Les Verity, had been a Clear checker at St. Hill and he got it right the first time. Everything after that was a Q&A.

The Purification Rundown was utter Dev-T. I had spent three months in Cairns in 1973 working outside in 40 degree heat and eating good fresh food, and had already sweated out any chemicals in my system. In fact an SO survey was done some months prior to its release asking anyone in the org if they had handled prior drugs and if so how they handled them, and this data was given to them. I suspect that it may have been used as a basis for the actual creation of the sweat program in the first place!

I could go on, but this should be enough data to outline the point: The tech inside the CoS has been crap for over 30 years. Anyone who aims criticism at the Freezone had better look inside his own camp before making comment. And bringing up the GoaT tech as a "solution" won't wash with me either, that's the weirdest dramatization I've seen yet: the stupid leading the bland.

Rob Judd
Clear 13611

I was in the last 5 years - they don't let anyone become "auditors" - everyone's goals are thwarted because Miscavige wants slaves to make him money and give him admiration. He spins people around with new releases, new pilots, changing everything monthly so no one knows what is going on...then he fleeces everyone while they are in total confusion but "thinking" they are cause!
 
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