The Ex Scn Personality

Zander

Patron with Honors
I think Nibs wrote/spoke about this somewhere.
He (LRH Jnr) "created" the TRs based on some Buddhist text.

Before Scn I was briefly involved with a Buddhist group. They practised something they called "Communication Exercises" which were remarkably similar to TR's, including the phrases "Do birds fly?" and "Do fish swim" in their version of TR1. Don't think they had anything like TR's 2, 3 and 4 though.

Later when applying to do the OT levels this came up and the MAA wanted to know all about it, to make sure I hadn't been a member of a squirrel group! So I had to find out how and where these "communication exercises" had come about. It turned out that the founder of their group had learned them from a woman in India in the 50's, but I never found out who that was or if she had learned them from scientology.
 
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La La Lou Lou

Crusader
I knew an ex Budhist monk who had to meditate, and rather than being flunked for twitching or whatever he was whacked with a big stick.
 

angel

Patron with Honors
Yikes LouLou

Im really glad we didnt get wacked with a stick for flunks. LOL

I went through a lot of phases after getting out which included getting back in and then out again. The only times I have ever had depression are when I am connected to someone who is over controlling. I am not sold on PTS/SP tech, but I am hyper-sensitive to someone who has to control me rather that accept me. I have come to the conclusion that I am different and will never fit back into the world so I made me a comfortable nitch to observe and see what happens.

I too am finding that ancient religions are the ticket. Study Tech has led me there. The Sumerians, Hindu's, Mayan's and Buddist records are the derivations of religion. One author John Major Jenkins has studied the Mayan translations extensively teaches we are in the time of Eastern religion and power. Western materialistic age is over. (I keep watching what China is going to do to the currency since I learned this). The author personally suggests the practice of Kundalini for this age. Anyway Yoga can be very very therapeutic and centering. Kundalini is big time pop out of this universe stuff for anyone interested.

Jen
 

Cinnamon_Girl

Patron with Honors
The Gut Instincts

Right on SuperPowers, I also shed the lingo mainly so I would make sense to other people but also to drop all aspects of the "tech" that I could. Some of my new friends wondered why I said "handle" all the time, I hadn't realized that was a Scn thing. to "handle" something. This made me realize that I spend my Scn life being handled all the time, cause now matter how good you are, if you not the @&#hole giving the orders, you're the one getting handled thereby implying something is wrong with you.

I also had a dark time getting over it all. I still do really, but it gets better every day. I blame myself for not listening to my gut in the beginning and consider it a really important life lesson I will not forget.

The really tough part for me as been the shunning of all belief systems. I just can't get out of my head that whatever system I am looking at now could just be a placebo, just like Scn. All subjective. Hard to accept help in that state. I bide my time though, and throw out the anchor during the dark stormy nights, waiting it out. The sun always comes out eventually.

As far as loving to hate Scn, for me it's the possibility to help others get out, to keep people from getting in without being fully informed and for my own healing. We all know what happens if you are critical in Scn, so what choice do we have but to vent, tell stories and seek the comfort of our brothers and sisters? Sure beats gang bang sec checking!

Here's to our healing and friendship!

Chris

I too blame myself a lot for not listening to my gut instincts. I wonder why we all do that?
 

Telepathetic

Gold Meritorious Patron
I guess the thing the "sticks us" are those "wins." But, when I think of these, I also ask myself...was it worth the time and effort?

I understand where you're coming from. I think I know what you're feeling. I am still going through a difficult period myself. But, I feel that time and distance, are our best friends:D

This Board and the dozens of books that I'll read over the last three years, since I left, have also helped me greatly.

TP
 

SuperPowers

Patron with Honors
The gut feeling

I too blame myself a lot for not listening to my gut instincts. I wonder why we all do that?

Hi Cinnamon Girl! :hattip:

Don't get me wrong. I've made lots of mistakes in life.

But in my experience, that gut instinct could also be that which gets us into trouble and brutally misleads us. That is what we consult when we don't have a clue. It could be the 50/50 choice, when one choice feels a tiny bit better than the other. And then it hurts when it didn't pay off.

I think the best we can do is to do study all the facts and get a good grasp of the premises, before we make our bet or give our trust away. I still think one could be both amiable AND well-informed.

Maybe it takes a lifetime to master how to look through the hazes of make-believe(rs).

Maybe it's because we tend to devaluate that feeling of distrust and the critique 'cause we are eager to be a member - even in a Hammer-Out-Of-Existence Culture". (Do you have overts/withholds? Do you have an MU?) And there are expected wins to be lost and the painful thought of losing friendship. So - this really is not an easy situation to find the truth.

Scientology was claimed to be non-authoritarian. Clearly it was not, it was just another false pretense. That's also why we're gathering here, speaking anonymously but freely. And hopefully we all get a little wiser by and by.

:thewave:
 

Zinjifar

Silver Meritorious Sponsor
I knew an ex Budhist monk who had to meditate, and rather than being flunked for twitching or whatever he was whacked with a big stick.

that's fairly standard. I had a japanese monk as a roommate at one point and he used to tell us stories of the masters whacking them with the sticks :)

He was a crack up anyway :) Went into the monastary at 15 and spent 10 years there till they sent him to Germany to 'see the world' and get him out of their hair.

Zinj
 

MrNobody

Who needs merits?
I too blame myself a lot for not listening to my gut instincts. I wonder why we all do that?

Maybe you did listen to (some of) your gut instincts? Instead of some thoroughly fact-checking, you probably fell hook, line and sinker for something you wanted to believe in at that time. Please don't take what I said as criticism, it's just something that I realized in myself, while analyzing why I had fallen for one scam or another. What I learned from that was that blaming myself would be wrong and would only lead to stomach ulcers and an unhappy life. So I just accepted that I had made a mistake, tried to learn from that experience as much as possible, and went on with my life.

Hi Cinnamon Girl! :hattip:

Don't get me wrong. I've made lots of mistakes in life.

Who hasn't? That's how we learn. A toddler learns from trying to squeeze a round peg into a square hole, a grown-up learns from more complicated (or sometimes more stupid) mistakes. I've made a lot of mistakes in my life, and I'm surely not proud of them, but they made me who I am, and I'm sure that trying to learn from them made me a better human.

But in my experience, that gut instinct could also be that which gets us into trouble and brutally misleads us. That is what we consult when we don't have a clue. It could be the 50/50 choice, when one choice feels a tiny bit better than the other. And then it hurts when it didn't pay off.

Gut instincts can be unreliable beasts, one never knows when better NOT to trust them, but that's also part of the normal "live and learn" experience.

I think the best we can do is to do study all the facts and get a good grasp of the premises, before we make our bet or give our trust away. I still think one could be both amiable AND well-informed.

This.

Maybe it takes a lifetime to master how to look through the hazes of make-believe(rs).

Once you've understood the basic concepts, it's pretty easy. "Street wisdom" is a very useful teacher, but I understand that this kind of learning experience is not for everybody. Also, it might be dangerous, especially for newbies, and it often has some quite unpleasant lessons.

Maybe it's because we tend to devaluate that feeling of distrust and the critique 'cause we are eager to be a member - even in a Hammer-Out-Of-Existence Culture". (Do you have overts/withholds? Do you have an MU?) And there are expected wins to be lost and the painful thought of losing friendship. So - this really is not an easy situation to find the truth.

Distrust is a very useful tool - after I learned how to use it, my life definitely became easier. Just don't overuse it.

"expected wins to be lost"
Ugh, yeah, some healthy skepticism and yes, even some distrust is needed here. How many "real" wins could you objectively observe in others?

"and the painful thought of losing friendship"
Hmm... Friends come and go, and some even come back after a decade or two. Strangers come and go - some as strangers, some as friends. Why be afraid of that? I understand that it's a scary situation when you're in a cult and have to fear to lose all of your friends at once should you decide to leave, but that's just normal cult tactics. Since you've left, you've probably found a lot of new friends, maybe re-established some pre-cult friendships, and maybe you could even help some old friends with their escape. Doesn't sound that bad to me.

Scientology was claimed to be non-authoritarian. Clearly it was not, it was just another false pretense. That's also why we're gathering here, speaking anonymously but freely. And hopefully we all get a little wiser by and by.

:thewave:

That was a good closing statement.

Disclaimer: I'm not an Ex, because I've never been "In"
 
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Gottabrain

Guest
Dear Superpowers,

This is a terrific thread. Thank you for starting it. I couldn't agree with you more - CBT is fantastic stuff with an experienced practitioner, and I have had a bit of that myself.

I left the SO in '86, left Scn probably completely about 3 yrs later. So I've been out for ages. I locked everything that was Scn away in a box in my mind "to be dealt with later" and had no one I could talk to about it completely until coming on here, Dec 1.

The impact of all the restim from that blew me away. I had to get off here & other sites for nearly 2 wks. I made it through, but the last 2 wks have been a really tough go to finally get to the point where I can deal with this and other things and talk about it if I wish. The mental pain and hardships I have endured personally during and after Scn because of what went on there took a long time to recover from so I could live life normally again. I didn't want to kick it all up again, but it had to be done for me to complete my healing. I had to talk to others who could relate.

I want to post more threads of the basic Scn using CBT to untangle these things and help others heal. But meanwhile, I am having a difficult time on this site dealing with those who still hang onto so many of the Scn concepts and artifacts simply because they do not know better and are unwilling to let go of some of these basics or go to the original sources.

I really wish we could have our own little section of the "FULLY OUT" exScns. The others are kind of upsetting to me with their insistencies of "parts of the tech" being right, etc, and I've had enough of that causing upset in my life. I'd rather use the original sources. I wish Elron and Scn was never in my life, except for some of the wonderful friends I made there that I've found again here. That is the only good thing that came of it.
 
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Gottabrain

Guest
RE: GUT INSTINCT

I just want to add a note on this.

Gut instinct is unreliable as an indicator of truth, happiness and the right way. It does not always represent spiritual instinct. It could be animal instinct, or not even an instinct. It could be, really, any reason you feel something is good based on your past experiences and could be very, very wrong.

Goodness is always a better indicator:

1 Thessalonians 5:21 (New International Version)
21Test everything. Hold on to the good.
 
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Gottabrain

Guest
Yeh, Voltaire, I'm with you all the way on that one.

There are a lot of different ways to test something.
 

SuperPowers

Patron with Honors
Dear Superpowers,

This is a terrific thread. Thank you for starting it. I couldn't agree with you more - CBT is fantastic stuff with an experienced practitioner, and I have had a bit of that myself.

I left the SO in '86, left Scn probably completely about 3 yrs later. So I've been out for ages. I locked everything that was Scn away in a box in my mind "to be dealt with later" and had no one I could talk to about it completely until coming on here, Dec 1.

The impact of all the restim from that blew me away. I had to get off here & other sites for nearly 2 wks. I made it through, but the last 2 wks have been a really tough go to finally get to the point where I can deal with this and other things and talk about it if I wish. The mental pain and hardships I have endured personally during and after Scn because of what went on there took a long time to recover from so I could live life normally again. I didn't want to kick it all up again, but it had to be done for me to complete my healing. I had to talk to others who could relate.

I want to post more threads of the basic Scn using CBT to untangle these things and help others heal. But meanwhile, I am having a difficult time on this site dealing with those who still hang onto so many of the Scn concepts and artifacts simply because they do not know better and are unwilling to let go of some of these basics or go to the original sources.

I really wish we could have our own little section of the "FULLY OUT" exScns. The others are kind of upsetting to me with their insistencies of "parts of the tech" being right, etc, and I've had enough of that causing upset in my life. I'd rather use the original sources. I wish Elron and Scn was never in my life, except for some of the wonderful friends I made there that I've found again here. That is the only good thing that came of it.

Thank You, Gottabrain! :)

I think a thread which deals with CBT and other psychiatric treatment would be very interesting to follow, there might have been such discussions here but I haven't detected them so far.

I think it has a therapeutic value to be able to share and discuss feelings and ideas with people on this forum and I'm greatful to those who share their experiences with the rest of us. Right now I'm in the middle of reading Emma's long and interesting story on her Scn background. It's an excellent summary of her dedicated life on staff and how a good life :happydance: experience turned ugly. :hotwater:

Emmas post: http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?t=169

-------------------------------------------

"You'll find that life is still worthwhile,
If you just :)." - Charlie Chaplin
 
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Gottabrain

Guest
Dear Chris,

Scn looked at the parts. Smaller and smaller and smaller, it looked at parts.

Maybe sometimes we need to look at the whole.

Sheila
 
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