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There Is No Irony In Scientology

mockingbird

Silver Meritorious Patron
There is no irony in Scientology - not one bit ever. Ron Hubbard as a malignant narcissist was driven to pathologically lie constantly. He like many sociopaths was driven to constantly project and tell lies one hundred and eighty degrees from the truth . Meaning exact opposites. For example claiming godlike infallibility and superiority when in truth he simultaneously knew he was worthless, cowardly and utterly immoral but denying this and trying to wish a facade of his hyper competence and un-equalled wisdom into reality.

His fractured mind constantly engaged in doublethink. Fooling himself but hiding the evidence of his fraud from others at the exact same time. Knowing Scientology produces no benefit and having measures to hide this and conventional espionage agents while justifying his acts by pretending to be better than all others.

He displayed thinking , emotions and behavior that were entirely consistent with his personality disorder and the mindset of a cult founder. Once you factor in the subjects he plagiarized from and the influence he held over his victims and the severity with which they mimic him in many ways as mental pseudo clones there really is no detail of Scientology which is not consistent. Knowing the components and how they interact is the key.

Hypocrisy from Hubbard, the group or individual members ? To be expected. Callous cruelty towards anyone friend or foe ? Literally standard tech . Doublethink and inability to recognize contradictions in doctrine , emotions or actions ? Par for the course. Extremes of behavior unexpected in sane people , like pathological lying , projection, denial, age regression, blind trust in Hubbard, fanatical zeal, abuse crimes and cruelty that seem entirely unnecessary? Yep, that is the essence of Scientology. It isn't ironic because that kind of mind does those things continuously. And that influences the group and individuals under his authority to do the same .

Really Hubbard was so twisted frankly it is like he held a get out of sanity and decency and moral responsibility and internal consistency card and always played it. He was the opposite of what he pretended to be and did the opposite of what he claimed and put his actual crimes on others . No irony - only patterns of thought , emotion and behavior. Truly evil and selfish and immature and harmful ? Definitely without a doubt. But not one bit surprising when you know what and who you are dealing with. He and his cult are about as easy to understand as a stone sinking in water once the relevant factors are understood. If he could have chosen a different path is best left to others . The path he did choose has been revealed and it in my opinion lacks irony.

I recently read about what one author called reverse projection. Different people define it in entirely different ways. The idea I was introduced to is that normal people with a functional conscience and humility look at people who don't follow a conscience or humility and project their qualities onto them.

So a normal person thinks a pathological liar for example is merely a liar who lies a lot while that is not quite right. A sociopath or narcissist often lies in particular ways that warrant exposure. They frequently tell lies that are motivated by a facade of superiority and infallibility to hide true feelings of inadequacy and worthlessness they hide if a narcissist for example.

And narcissists commit crimes and abuses and have the inner self exist in an atrophied state with the emotional maturity of a young child. A young child who is petulant and belligerent and lacks conscience or humility. This results in constant projection of negative characteristics onto others and constant false claims of outstanding personal character, ability and achievements for the narcissist. Simply put they tell lies one hundred and eighty degrees from the truth nearly one hundred percent of the time.

If you don't understand that sociopaths and narcissists are compelled to behave this way it appears ironic but not when you see Hubbard as hardwired to lie in this manner constantly and his cult is modeled after him in both the macro through the doctrine and organization itself and the micro through the beliefs , emotions and behavior of individual Scientologists.They are often so extremely influenced by the thought reform in Scientology that they adopt a state of being a mental pseudo clone of Hubbard and mimic his behavior unknowingly.

With all these factors taken into account and an understanding that Miscavige is certainly also a person without conscience displayed in his behavior and the same quality of lying constantly and pretending innocence while attributing crimes to others, there is in my opinion no irony in Scientology.

But if it seems ironic in a way that upsets, bewilders or offends you that shows you have a conscience in most instances. Your conscience can guide how you feel people should behave . So take it as a compliment to your character if Scientology offends you.
 

prosecco

Patron Meritorious
Isn't the Hubbard definition of humour something along the lines of rejection? So following this logic, if one laughs, it's considered a dismissal of whatever is being read, said or discussed.

Scientologists on the whole, are the most humourless people in the world. They can't engage or laugh at themselves because that would be J & D and goodness knows that it intolerable. (Can we please have a sarcasm emoticon?)
 

Ogsonofgroo

Crusader
Though there may not be a lot of ironing in the scilon world, it seems to me full of irony and dichotomy. Face it, a sci-fi hack creates a religion, wants to get rich, sets up a 'self-help' system cobbled together from all over the place, that ends up screwing up more people than it has ever/will ever, truly help. That, to me anyhow, is the epitome of LRonny/irony, Lron's confabulation, meh, isn't it Lronic that the dead, lying, con-artist, died a lonely, drug-addled, miserable end, hiding like the criminal he surely was, and likely eaten by his own creations...
Oh my.

:omg:
 

mockingbird

Silver Meritorious Patron
Prosecco I lack an eidetic memory sadly, but I believe Hubbard defined humor as the ability to reject outpoints. Hubbard in a way reminds me of a much,much less intelligent Nietzsche. Much, much dimmer bulb.

Martha Stout called intuition our sixth sense and a conscience our seventh sense. She describes people in her book The Sociopath Next Door. I will paraphrase. There is a hypothesis that a sociopath lacks a conscience because almost all emotions are very weak or flat.

They don't have normal intensity emotions for anything except staying alive and so simply don't care about anyone except themselves. Narcissists experience emotions quite strongly but lack humility and compassion. It's like they get half the emotional spectrum. It ends at their own nose: they don't have positive emotions for anyone else. Now it is a bit more complex if you use subgroups like vulnerable narcissists (they have split minds and are truly lacking confidence and create a false self to hide this) and invincible narcissists (who, if they exist which I am not sure of, lack the split nature and just genuinely feel superior to everyone else) and traumatic narcissists (Daniel Shaw describes them as a kind of malignant narcissist that abuses people habitually and may be a cult leader).

So, Hubbard if he had the half an emotional world of a traumatic narcissist (malignant narcissist) could literally only care about himself in a positive way. To him everyone else had no real value except as a kind of object to use or mirror to show himself a beautiful reflection in. With that warped view he had severe trouble understanding positive emotions and social interactions.

Others have defined humor as a quite different idea. There is a heightening of tension with sudden comfortable relief. A person has their mind focus on, say a joke, then rapidly see the punchline or situation as absurd. When it relieves the tension of focusing attention rapidly and comfortably we find it funny.

Similarly if someone is scared by a surprise then immediately realizes they didn't need to be scared they often burst into laughter.

This is from generating tension then relieving it. The same experience can occur if you mess with someone by giving them a claim that is worrisome but absurd and just exaggerate it until they are worried and focused but realize you are pulling their leg. The relief sometimes makes them happy, sometimes pissed that you lied to and traumatized them. You better know your audience.

But my point is humor, like many other subjects Hubbard pretended to have the exclusive answers for, has much better answers from other subjects. In this case cognitive dissonance theory and social psychology. From studying books on those subjects the heightening of arousal and focusing of attention are described along with the effect of information going from important to trivial. The realization that a joke no longer requires serious focus helps to make it funny. You don't even need to like the joke - the creation of focused attention, confusion and the moment of blankness from cognitive dissonance being exploited rapidly make the joke funny. That is why timing is crucial. Your mental state rapidly changes.
 

I told you I was trouble

Suspended animation
Isn't the Hubbard definition of humour something along the lines of rejection? So following this logic, if one laughs, it's considered a dismissal of whatever is being read, said or discussed.

Scientologists on the whole, are the most humourless people in the world. They can't engage or laugh at themselves because that would be J & D and goodness knows that it intolerable. (Can we please have a sarcasm emoticon?)


Yes, I believe hubbard stated somewhere that humour was the "rejection of illogic".

:melodramatic:

Nothing, not even spontaneous laughter escaped his boring inclination to try and own and over explain everything.

 

Jump

Operating teatime


Incoming telex from Target2 .. rattle ..


START

WHO TITLED THIS THREAD

EVERYONE KNOWS THAT SCIENTOLOGY IS TOTALLY I

RONNY

COUGH


 

BunnySkull

Silver Meritorious Patron
Well, I don't think anyone has ever thought there was any irony in Scientology. There's no humor so you certainly can't have it's close relative, irony. Scientology wouldn't work if people didn't take it so damn seriously.

Hubbard sold members the story that they were saving the universe and what a terrible serious job it was since he had given humanity it's first chance in ten gazillion years to free itself. If you even give the whiff of a smile or an eye roll while spewing that whopper people would never join. Gotta be hard to sell this this bullshit with a straight face so you must be sure the people pitching are terribly earnest believers.
 

HelluvaHoax!

Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on
...

--snipped--

Well, I don't think anyone has ever thought there was any irony in Scientology. There's no humor so you certainly can't have it's close relative, irony. Scientology wouldn't work if people didn't take it so damn seriously.


Exactly!

Ain't no humor, no way, no place in the un-Amusement Park known as ScientologyWorld.

Hubbard once did an Eval on the culture and discovered that the WHY was "World Out Of Jokes". Ron stated that this is why the tone level was so low, resulting in criminality & insanity.

That's when LRH ED 4 May 1973 RA was issued, which formed a new worldwide project. Every org and mission had to send (minimum) two staff members to be in the brand new JOKE CORPS, where they would be trained full time on the LRH tech of humor, jokes, et al.

The project got off to a rather shaky start when LRH got the first batch of videos sent uplines for a pass. The trainees had to submit 1-3 minutes of their standup comedy routine and if the jokes didn't make Ron laugh, he would send it back downlines with a cram.

It was during this period that LRH was writing up new HCOBs, which later formed The Comedian Series, including the breakthrough HCOB called Punchlines and Low TA--where Ron discovered that comedians whose jokes don't make people laugh are routinely found to have low TA. The remedy was an auditing assist which could be run right there in the courseroom, consisting of just one command run repetitively to EP: "What joke would cause a being to be overwhelmed?"

Other new developments which came out of this period was the discovery that when a comedian was required to clay demo their jokes to a pass, their laughter stats would go into normal or above.

In '74 it was a pretty big deal when the first HQCS (Hubbard Qualified Comedy Specialist) graduated and was fired back to their org to perform a standup routine on staff. Through some rather unfortunate circumstances, the staff members just stared ahead during the whole standup comedy performance never laughing once. The comedian was instantly recalled to Flag for a full retrain, but he blew while hitchhiking there (FP had not yet approved PO). When Hubbard sent a mission to the org to sort it all out, he had them pull the string on why the staff never laughed at any of the HQCS's standard jokes. One for one, the staff members stated that they thought they during the performance, they thought they were supposed to keep their TRs in.
 
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gbuck

oxymoron
Yes, I believe hubbard stated somewhere that humour was the "rejection of illogic".

:melodramatic:

Nothing, not even spontaneous laughter escaped his boring inclination to try and own and over explain everything.


Isn't it ironic that understanding the bullshit of Scientology results in complete rejection of the
subject and laughter.
 

gbuck

oxymoron
Irony
i·ro·ny[/h](ī′rə-nē, ī′ər-)n. pl. i·ro·nies1. a. The use of words to express something different from and often opposite to their literal meaning.


Help me out here,

Isn't the the word and the definition of a 'Clear' ironic?

Is the word, in fact an iRONicism?!
 

Knows

Gold Meritorious Patron
Isn't the Hubbard definition of humour something along the lines of rejection? So following this logic, if one laughs, it's considered a dismissal of whatever is being read, said or discussed.

Scientologists on the whole, are the most humourless people in the world. They can't engage or laugh at themselves because that would be J & D and goodness knows that it intolerable. (Can we please have a sarcasm emoticon?)

Hubbard lies to the sheeple and tells them "JOKING and DEGRADING" means the PC does not UNDERSTAND (see how he uses the suggestion that Joking - is Degrading...by combining the two words.

LOVE this post Mockingbird!! :thumbsup::happydance:You need to write a book - please???:yes:
 

Knows

Gold Meritorious Patron
I appreciate what you have to say Mockingbird and I always have HUGE CHUNKS of my "Scientology Case" COME OFF - when I read your writings.

I have to say though, that there is irony in Scientology. In fact - the whole entire scam is irony without HUMOR.

Let's start with the Aims of Scientology.

Scientology claims to have the goal of:
"A civilization without insanity, without criminals and without war, where the able can prosper and honest beings can have rights, and where man is free to rise to greater heights, are the aims of Scientology".



Look at the condition of most long term Scientologist's - you will see people who cannot even function outside of the cult.

Scientology creates insanity and criminals. Honest beings have no rights in Scientology - try to get their own "tech" in By DOING SOMETHING ABOUT IT ...and look out. You will get CAVED in for sure until you break into taking on the identity of a robot that will do, say, think and believe EVERYTHING the cult tells you. It will shatter your identity and ruin your ability to see things the way they are. You will get punished beyond belief and financially ruined if you agree that you are bad for shining a light on the criminal activities that runs rampant within the "Cherch"

in Scientology is not free to do anything but spend money on Scientology - regrading the courses and bridge - there are NO GREATER HEIGHTS except pain and suffering from shattered lives, lost dreams and goals, ruined families, financial devastation.
 
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