Tony O asks why we believe in Xenu

Veda

Sponsor
Current Freezone PR Nonsense:

1. Arriving 2 or 3 at a time on any thread critical of the Freezone, blustering and protesting with huge simulated moral indignance, injecting enough commotion into the mix to kill the thread. It's exactly the same fake moral outrage thing that the Cof$ uses, but without actually using the term bigot.

-snip-

Ah.... :)

This is ad hom bigotry. The method of reporting to mods dosn't seem to exist.
Hopefully they'll pick this up.

....

the deliberate persecution of those for whom the pursuit of scientology is seen as a spiritual practice and a religious right is nothing more than religious bigotry and religious persecution

....

Enlargement of bigotry and religious bigotry added.
 

Div6

Crusader
I see that as essentially the result of church culture, and specifically the sort of 'group think' encouraged & reinforced among members of the Sea Organization. The Sea Org was of course directly established by hubbard as his personal agency of control of the greater community of the church. It also appears itself to be largely a direct dramatization, or an acting out, of the xenu story.

My experience has been that the tendency is that the farther removed one was from involvement with the Sea Org the less that has been a factor.

Of course the Sea Org oversees much of the training and all of the advanced levels of the church, and thus the more deeply one is involved with the Co$ the more likely the individual has been pressured to accept a world view in keeping with the Sea Org mindset.


Mark A. Baker
Flag Order 652


http://www.american-buddha.com/cult.flagorder652.htm


...
Question: What auditor will the fourth Dynamic accept?

Answer: It will accept that auditor or regulator which it had and who had confidence in even though betrayed.

This then explains why the S.O. symbol of the Confederacy works.
...

Speaks to his state of mind at the time of the formation of the SO.

On the plus side he was "thinking big".
 

Smilla

Ordinary Human
delusional-disorder-grandiose-type.jpg


I am completely indignificated, ad hominated, obfuscated, disintegrated, dessicated, and a bit outraged, by your ill-informed comments.

outrage.jpg

 
Current Freezone PR Nonsense:

1. Arriving 2 or 3 at a time on any thread critical of the Freezone, blustering and protesting with huge simulated moral indignance, ...


Frankly, Smilla, you do moral indignance far more frequently & vociferously than I ever have. It's not a big issue for me, unlike yourself. What matters to me is the accurate statement of fact. Moral outrage counts for less, spin not at all.

Moreover, what do you call it when you and your coterie pile on posters with whom you disagree? :eyeroll:

As to comparisons of Co$ abuses with those of other so-call 'traditional' religions, that is all to the good. You often behave as if the Co$ is the only abusive cult in history. It isn't. That is an important part of the story of how the Co$ got to be so destructive. Much of what is bad in the church was learned from other so-called 'mainstream' institutions.

Overlooking that fact creates a very misleading impression of the history of scientology even if it makes you feel more comfortable about 'traditonal religion'.

Gut yontiff. :hattip:


Mark A. Baker
 

NoName

A Girl Has No Name
Well, if we're getting into wishes. . . .

I wish he hadn't quoted that Inside Edition segment about the E-meter as if it were valid. I commented in a post already about why it's false:

I don't know the first thing about e-meters, so I'll take your word on that one.
 

NoName

A Girl Has No Name
Without INCIDENT TWO on the TIME TRACKS of oodles of BODY THETANS there would be no OT 3.

And without IMPLANT INCIDENTS on the TIME TRACK, there would be no OT 2.

Why are you attempting to mislead people?

Incidents on Time Tracks are literal, down to the fraction of a second.

OT 2 is pretty crazy too, and the only reason that PRs, such as yourself, haven't done PR damage control, specifically, on OT 2, is that it hasn't been publicized.

"This is a cold blooded and factual account of your last sixty trillion years," Baker. DEAL WITH IT. It's SCIENTOLOGY.

Yeah, and I don't know where the Gorilla Goals and Obscene Dog incident and all that other crap falls on the bridge, but there is plenty more total and utter crap in the Scientology doctrine that requires a suspension of disbelief.

People who believe they have lived before on this planet are a dime a dozen. But people who think that they lived before on other planets and what not... slightly more exotic. But the Xenu crap, Gorilla Goals, Obscene Dog incident, Bubble Gum, Jack in the Box, and what not. Then the clams, weepers, etc. All that History of Man crap - I don't know where you read it (before or after OT III) - anyway, Xenu is a blip on the radar in the context of all that badly written Sci Fi.
 

Veda

Sponsor
Yeah, and I don't know where the Gorilla Goals and Obscene Dog incident and all that other crap falls on the bridge, but there is plenty more total and utter crap in the Scientology doctrine that requires a suspension of disbelief.

People who believe they have lived before on this planet are a dime a dozen. But people who think that they lived before on other planets and what not... slightly more exotic. But the Xenu crap, Gorilla Goals, Obscene Dog incident, Bubble Gum, Jack in the Box, and what not. Then the clams, weepers, etc. All that History of Man crap - I don't know where you read it (before or after OT III) - anyway, Xenu is a blip on the radar in the context of all that badly written Sci Fi.

And yet, (apparently self-assigned) Scientology PRs, such as Marty Rathbun, and Mark Baker& Terril, will lie and spin about it to "wogs" and to potential "raw meat."

My objection, strangely enough, is not to the content of any one's self-determined recall, but with the hypnotic aspects of Scientology, its manipulative mixture of abreaction (catharsis) with indoctrination or "programming," its use of e-meters as a truth detectors, and its implantology levels - CC - OT 3 - where the person is told the contents of his own mind, AND that Scientologists insist on LYING and SPINNING about it.

"Incident 2" is lied about and spun because it's an embarrassment and places Scientology in a bad light. As times change, the lies and spin change, but it's still lies and spin.
 

Smilla

Ordinary Human
Frankly, Smilla, you do moral indignance far more frequently & vociferously than I ever have. It's not a big issue for me, unlike yourself. What matters to me is the accurate statement of fact. Moral outrage counts for less, spin not at all.

Moreover, what do you call it when you and your coterie pile on posters with whom you disagree? :eyeroll:

As to comparisons of Co$ abuses with those of other so-call 'traditional' religions, that is all to the good. You often behave as if the Co$ is the only abusive cult in history. It isn't. That is an important part of the story of how the Co$ got to be so destructive. Much of what is bad in the church was learned from other so-called 'mainstream' institutions.

Overlooking that fact creates a very misleading impression of the history of scientology even if it makes you feel more comfortable about 'traditonal religion'.

Gut yontiff. :hattip:


Mark A. Baker

That's all well and good Mark, but this kind of behaviour is just going too far, and must be stopped.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyy50Penbvw

 

NoName

A Girl Has No Name
And yet, (apparently self-assigned) Scientology PRs, such as Marty Rathbun, and Mark Baker& Terril, will lie and spin about it to "wogs" and to potential "raw meat."

My objection, strangely enough, is not to the content of any one's self-determined recall, but with the hypnotic aspects of Scientology, its manipulative mixture of abreaction (catharsis) with indoctrination or "programming," its use of e-meters as a truth detectors, and its implantology levels - CC - OT 3 - where the person is told the contents of his own mind, AND that Scientologists insist on LYING and SPINNING about it.

"Incident 2" is lied about and spun because it's an embarrassment and places Scientology in a bad light. As times change, the lies and spin change, but it's still lies and spin.

:goodposting:

Of course anyone who took psych 101 as an undergrad could tell you that the real "implants" were coming from the Co$. Too bad Tubbard dropped out of college before that.
 
And yet, (apparently self-assigned) Scientology PRs, such as Marty Rathbun, and Mark Baker& Terril, will lie and spin about it to "wogs" and to potential "raw meat." ...

That's all your own dub-in, V. Apparently just like your earlier involvement with the church you are still making up facts to fit your belief system. :eyeroll:


Mark A. Baker
 

Lone Star

Crusader
That's all your own dub-in, V. Apparently just like your earlier involvement with the church you are still making up facts to fit your belief system. :eyeroll:


Mark A. Baker

Okay, everyone playing the Mark Baker drinking game do a shot of liquor or down one can or bottle of beer! He said "dub-in"! :thumbsup:

:lol:
 

Smilla

Ordinary Human
Okay, everyone playing the Mark Baker drinking game do a shot of liquor or down one can or bottle of beer! He said "dub-in"! :thumbsup:

:lol:



Dubbin is a wax product used to soften, condition and waterproof leather and other materials. It consists of natural wax, oil and tallow.
It is different from shoe polish, which is used to impart shine and colour to leather.
Dubbin has been used since medieval times to waterproof and soften leather boots.
The name dubbin is a contraction of the gerund dubbing, describing the action of applying the wax to leather.[1]


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dubbin
 

R6Basic

Patron Meritorious
Even when I was 'in' ( I tend to use that phrase a lot) I thought people, press, made too much about "what is hidden in Scn."

There are many books and lectures that anyone could buy, or now look on the internet, that show what is taught in Scn.

Just pick up 'A History of Man.' That is suppose to have things that happened billions of years ago.

'Have you lived b4 this Life?' Name says it all.

"Ethics and Conditions" talks about discounting from an SP.

And I don't know how many public lectures Hubbard goes on about Space Opera.

I know when he relieved the Org. Board he said that part of it use to be used to run a very large section of the galaxy, but they didn't have some of the Div. so it only lasted like a million years. (The tape might have only been for staff, maybe not public?)

And where does it say that pyschs have been the ruin of every civilization for the last trillion years and are working hard to destroy this one?
 

DagwoodGum

Squirreling Dervish
How Dr. Strangelove may have inspired OT3 (Purely speculation on my part)


So imagine this if you will:
In the year of 1966 or so night owl L. Ron Hubbard spends an evening banging Peruvian Flake, crank and chugging Jim Beam until he decides to put something on the boob tube to keep him entertained. He decides to watch Dr. Strangelove which came out late January of 1964, just a few years ahead of OT3, which was released in 1967. So the madman watches it while strung out, the back of his head, neck and hair drenched in sweat and begins to notice how much Major T.J. Kong, played by Slim Pickens, looks like him. Being a former military man, he immediately identifies with Major Kong as he still lived in his Walter Mitty “I’m a military hero” delusional mindset. He begins to see himself as the hero Major Kong and when he sees him climbing on top of the nuclear warhead in the bomber, then riding it bareback like a crazed rodeo bronco buster, he begins his delusional descent into the hell of “Incident 1”, or so he imagines it to be. When Major Kong starts whooping it up in his crazed cowboy voice as he rides towards oblivion in Russia, this mimics L. Ron’s crazed inner psyche to such an extent that L. Ron begins to spin a delusional weave of his psychotic demonic theories from his Crowley days with his new “Incident 1” delusion. This has a lasting effect on him so he decides that he must be on to something here and stays buzzed and strung out for days weaving this concept into a new level for his flock. After all, he thought we all had his case so we’d of course need to be run on it. But as he scribbled it down he imagined that he’d stumbled upon a secret of this sector of the universe so powerful that it would drive anyone similarly insane if they were to run it improperly. They’d end up free-wheeling on it for weeks like he apparently did. His freewheeling probably lasted till he ran out of drugs. But alas, a new Scientology OT level had been born from his identifying with Major Kong on his descent into a hellish nuclear blast as he pondered the lasting effects this would have on a being. Thusly the concept of BT’s was born and the rest is history.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JlSQAZEp3PA
 

Terril park

Sponsor
And yet, (apparently self-assigned) Scientology PRs, such as Marty Rathbun, and Mark Baker& Terril, will lie and spin about it to "wogs" and to potential "raw meat."

My objection, strangely enough, is not to the content of any one's self-determined recall, but with the hypnotic aspects of Scientology, its manipulative mixture of abreaction (catharsis) with indoctrination or "programming," its use of e-meters as a truth detectors, and its implantology levels - CC - OT 3 - where the person is told the contents of his own mind, AND that Scientologists insist on LYING and SPINNING about it.

"Incident 2" is lied about and spun because it's an embarrassment and places Scientology in a bad light. As times change, the lies and spin change, but it's still lies and spin.

There is one person who continually lies and spins in this area and thats
you Veda.

I have often stated that I don't believe in Xenu. yet you tell me
and everyone else I'm lying. On less often occasions I mention that the many people I surveyed who'd done Ot 3 to good results also didn't believe in Xenu. Yet you insist I'm lying.

Marty has also written in his book that Hubbard wanted to do a pilot
whereby people skipped OT 3 and went straight onto NOTs.

Whatever Mark says I'm quite sure he is telling the truth about it.

Liar Liar pants on fire.

Spin spin spin till the looney bin.
 

Veda

Sponsor
There is one person who continually lies and spins in this area and thats
you Veda.

I have often stated that I don't believe in Xenu. yet you tell me
and everyone else I'm lying. On less often occasions I mention that the many people I surveyed who'd done Ot 3 to good results also didn't believe in Xenu. Yet you insist I'm lying.

Marty has also written in his book that Hubbard wanted to do a pilot
whereby people skipped OT 3 and went straight onto NOTs.

Whatever Mark says I'm quite sure he is telling the truth about it.

Liar Liar pants on fire.

Spin spin spin till the looney bin.

Do you recommend people do OT 3? Without Incident 1 there is no OT 3.

Scientologists have been lying about "OT 3" since 1968. It hasn't changed.

It wasn't Hubbard who wanted to do a pilot. The idea was shot down. And it wasn't by Miscavige. Guess who shot it down.

You're promoting a dishonest subject with a bridge that isn't a bridge that leads to varying degrees of induced mental illness.

If you don't think people should do OT 3, then stop promoting OT 3.
 
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