Tribalism within Scientology

[HelluvaHoax!]

Glad you liked it! You are if anything, consistent, You don't like my posts nor my cut and pastes and especially my videos. I post a definition that applies and you rail against it. I make commentary that is contrary to your viewpoint and you don't like it. When I post that you don't like my responses, you deny that you disliked my post.

I guess it comes down to this:

HH's tribe - Policy #1
Mimsey is wrong.

Policy #2
Must stop Mimsey at all costs, yet appear measured and graceful, inciteful, humorous, intelligent, sarcastic in a PC, meaningful way that boosts my own status as a raconteur par excellence.

Policy #3
If Mimsey posts anything that makes HH wrong, or has a grain of truth to it, it must be disavowed, stamped out, though peppered with token appreciation so as not to alienate my extensive fan base, which is way bigger than that of Mimsey's, because he is a narrow minded, progressive, liberal, socialistic, climate change denier scum who alleges Woo Woo spiritual experiences and tries to convince others they actually happened when we all know that it's just nuts.

Policy #4
If I, HH, can't find holes in his post's premise, his spelling and grammar is so god awful there is always something to find there to misdirect my fan base of readers away from his points.

Did I miss anything? Do I get a high five? Time for breakfast. Ta ta,

Highest ARC,

Mimsey

What makes you think I have singled out only you? This is a recurrent default theme you seem to go to when you get too frustrated with facts that debunk your feelings. Anyone reading my posts for the past 9 years is well aware that I don't "target" anyone for destruction.

If a poster writes something which muddies up understanding the cult of Scientology (such as your "TribeTech[sup]tm[/sup]) that's something I try to correct so that newbies or KSW Koolaiders don't get even more confused than Scientology has already intentionally made them. I never bothered to comment on the vast majority of your posts, only the ones that were particularly misinformational.

It may help you to know that the only other time I commented about "TRIBES" is when the disgraced troll "Alanzo" began flooding the internet with a steady diet of Scientology talking points that weaponized the "tribe" word--in order to "dead agent" Scientology critics. I called out that useful idiocy as well.

There is no reason for you to try and play victim of my posts. We both post things that the other doesn't agree with----It's a conversation. When you go into that "HH IS ATTACKING ME!" mode, it's not a good look for you. That's what Scientologists have done since 1950 when anyone starts to debunk or expose their fraudulent hoax--the poor innocent religion that evil bigots are "attacking".

Nobody is attacking you, but some of your ideas are being robustly challenged. Hang in there if you really believe in what you are saying.

However, if you discover that you don't know what you are talking about, there's nothing wrong with admitting it. I do that all the time. Like when I left Scientology---I began to rehabilitate a wholetrack OT "power" called humility, LOL. I was unbelievably naive, gullible and stupid and it feels good to admit it. That's how people get past cult-think, right?

.

 

[Mimsey Borogrove]

HH Loves Mimsey!! Film at 11. See their tearful makeup and tender hugs on Jimmy Fallon...

Mimsey
Dabbing his eyes with a tissue
I...I.. I couldn't have made it without HH's guidance. Oh I am so thankful
HH
Arms crossed
Oh, cut the bullshit.

Jimmy
Cogniting!
I know - lets play Pictionary!​

They assemble around the couch, HH and Billy Blowdown vs Jimmy Fallon and Mimsey.

Cut to:
The score is tied - it's the final round, winner takes all - Jimmy and Billy are at their pads drawing furiously. Mimsey hasn't got a clue what the hell Jimmy is drawing.​

HH
Oh! Oh! Tribe! You're drawing a tribe!
Billy
I knew you could do it.​

The Roots start playing furiously, Jimmy is congratulating HH, pounding him on the back. Big smiles, handshakes.
Smash cut to:
The alarm clock buzzing.​

Mimsey
Yawning
Oh god! It was only a dream.​

​

 

[Mimsey Borogrove]

This is a really interesting video - Towards the middle Sebastian launches into the roles people choose in life - In action movies for instance, they want to see an alpha male taking charge. They don't like women taking that role - they want to see her nursing the sick, the wounded. This is from many audience surveys. In essence there's two leaders. Oh - only in the movies you say, right? However, it plays out it real life.

He goes into a Canadian mining disaster. There is a cave in and these guys are trapped 2 miles down. Right away, there is a leader type - he gets guys motivated, yelling screaming, what have you, to start digging. And dig they do, but it's too much. They give up. They fall into depression, the batteries run out in their flashlights, they run out of food, water.

One of the other men starts with this: Come on we can make it - we have to wait it out. He has assumed the female leaders role - the nurturing role.

In a week and a half they are rescued - they were eating bark off the wood beams supporting the remaining tunnel, drinking their urine. Most lived of the 18 trapped there.

His point is there are these two roles that are essential for group survival. The liberal and the conservative. They need to balance each other - in a war you need the kick ass conservatives - a government run by liberals would be easy prey. Not so with the Conservatives. Our problem is it's currently out of balance.

He also makes an interesting point - the role of environment and genetics in whether one is liberal or conservative. While if you grow up in a liberal environment you are most likely to associate with that party, you could genetically be conservative. How they know this is so is very interesting:
Twins. Identical twins are usually both either liberal or conservative, but fraternal twins can be either. It's in the DNA.

it starts at about 43 minutes in.
Here's the link to his book:
https://www.amazon.com/Tribe-Homeco...79587&sr=8-1&keywords=tribes+sebastian+junger
it's a fascinating interview.
Mimsey

 

[Mimsey Borogrove]

My esteemed HH, you know my post about the rules of your tribe was a joke, right? I tried to drop clues, like the high five comment, the smiley face, the self deprecating humor? The rules themselves? They are kinda stupid aren't they? My alleged political affiliations? I was certain you'd see through it.

I thought a rif on my pet peeves would be kinda funny. I was laughing when I wrote it, sorry if you weren't.

But that's the problem with typed language - the humor doesn't always come across.

Anyway, I realize just because it (tribes) is a recent meme, doesn't make it the be all end all. I thought it was an interesting way to look at the different groups or fractions within scientology itself, and how they don't get along, though they are allegedly serving the same end.

C'est la vi.

Mimsey

 

[Enthetan]

From The New Yorker:

"We live in a time of tribes. Not of ideologies, parties, groups, or beliefs—these don’t convey the same impregnability of political fortifications, or the yawning chasms between them. American politics today requires a word as primal as “tribe” to get at the blind allegiances and huge passions of partisan affiliation. Tribes demand loyalty, and in return they confer the security of belonging. They’re badges of identity, not of thought. In a way, they make thinking unnecessary, because they do it for you, and may punish you if you try to do it for yourself. To get along without a tribe makes you a fool. To give an inch to the other tribe makes you a sucker."

..................

"Everything in American politics today entrenches tribalism: our winner-take-all elections, the dehumanizing commentary on cable news and social media, the people we choose to talk to and live among. The trends are not new, but they’ve dramatically accelerated and intensified under a President who rules by humiliation because he lives in fear of being humiliated."

"I’m using “tribalism” to refer to what George Orwell, in an essay he wrote at the end of the Second World War, meant by “nationalism”: “the habit of identifying oneself with a single nation or other unit, placing it beyond good and evil and recognising no other duty than that of advancing its interests. . . . The abiding purpose of every nationalist is to secure more power and more prestige, not for himself but for the nation or other unit in which he has chosen to sink his own individuality.” Our tribes are competing for power over the state, the media, public opinion, the verbal battleground. When politics becomes a perpetual tribal war, ends justify almost any means and individuals are absolved from the constraints of normal decency. People who would never tolerate cruelty or lying or even ordinary impoliteness in their children cheer every excess of their leaders, none more so than President Trump’s."

more: https://www.newyorker.com/news/daily-comment/a-new-report-offers-insights-into-tribalism-in-the-age-of-trump?mbid=nl_Daily 101418&CNDID=33375258&utm_source=Silverpop&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Daily 101418&utm_content=&spMailingID=14430926&spUserID=MTMzMTgzNzA0OTQ2S0&spJobID=1501111392&spReportId=MTUwMTExMTM5MgS2

Tribalism is nothing new. People have been involved in ethnic-identity politics since the beginning. Feminists have been doing it. Blacks have been doing it.

What freaks out the Left is the idea that white Christian males might decide to start doing it too.

 

[Coyote13]

I definitely witnessed different tribes, subgroups, factions, cliques, whatever word you choose to call it, but the behavior is such that, even scientologists all follow hubbard/policy, not all scientologists consider themselves equal to other scientologists.

Different subgroups of scientologists come with differing status based often times on money, social status/connections, power( ability to get others to do things for them), and others. These differing status enable individuals of one subgroup to exert power over others of less influential subgroups without fear of recourse, or enable individuals within that subgroup to decide which policy is senior and which to ignore if theres a conflict.

Money itself doesn't seem to be an indicator of ones status, if you have hella money, you may be treated as if you are part of a particular subgroup, but unless you have other characteristics that can be used in the longer term, the money can be drained and you can be discarded.

Perhaps "tribalism" is a hot button word at the moment, but insert whatever word you want to describe that behavior, it definitely exists within scientology. Everyone in scientology(supposedly) follows Hubbard, but not everyone's interpretation of Hubbard is the same( no verbal tech, so it's just assume we all read the same thing, and cleared any words we misunderstood, so we all must have the same understanding of what hubbard said, so no need to discuss it).

There are cults of personality within scientology as well( flow power to power and you get more power kinda thing). Scientology is hella small and inflates the ego with ideas of superiority, and in order to feel superior, you need to have others over which to feel/exert your superiority.

It's all a mind fuck, it's just that the mind fuckery runs hella deep with this particular cult named scientology.

 

[guanoloco]

There's definitely something to groups and group ideology. I think an unhealthy form of it is tribalism, perhaps.

I believe this to be true: there's been a social engineering putsch to eliminate adherence to God, a sovereign nation, family, government, etc. With this implementation of this plan there has arisen a commensurate disruption in the sense of community. This is the buzzword of "tribalism".

I think it's disastrous to not recognize this group mentality of the human being. I knew a woman who had a kid who liked to color on the walls of her home. Most people would punish and stop this behavior and see it as negative, including myself. What she did was to agree with the kid that at a certain time of the day or week or whenever that that was "color on the walls time". When the time came she hung up construction paper and the two of them had at it. Pretty ingenious, I thought.

The same thing about this pack animal mentality of humans. It should be recognized and channeled into healthy things instead of denied or punished or ignored.

If it were channeled into constructive activity such as a sports or school spirit mode it could be coupled with teaching how to be proper sports and hosts and hostesses while still allowing healthy competition to occur.

If it's denied or punished or ignored we get gangs, marginalized minorities and all sorts of unhealthy tribalism where there's outright pitched battles over turf and resources and people are selected out to be enemies and attacked. That's the "Lord of the Flies" deal...the Crips and the Bloods.

I think this dissociative aspect could be a factor in people falling prey to cults. The cult, then, fulfills this tribal aspect or group need or whatever and then consumes the host.

What's equally destructive, or, perhaps, more so, is the current identity Marxist politics where now race and gender are classes of political regimes or classes within a political regime. Like true Marxism these classes are then exploited to stake out territory and combat. This is the useful idiot and a greater tool for civil unrest has never been manufactured than this.

I don't really see any tribalistic "us vs them to the death" stuff within Scientology groups. Definite hierarchy and status with an unhealthy pecking order but the real enemies (not just the ethics bait) are all external to Scientologists.

 

[JustSheila]

My neighbor's dogs increased their tribe because they hadn't neutered them. Two dogs became four dogs left out in the yard all day barking. An annoying tribal practice, to say the least.

After they got bored playing tribe pack barking at everything that moved from sunrise on, the pack began another tribalistic practice. The older ones taught the pups and all together as a tribe they dug a huge hole in the yard, at least 5 feet by 5. Their faces, feet and bodies were covered in ritualistic mud and they had a great time.

Somehow, I don't think they'll be left in the yard alone on their own tomorrow. The tribal dog barking problem sort of solved itself.

 

[Leland]

I don't know Sheila......I see spade marks on the walls of that pit.

Perhaps the owners helped....

Perhaps a way to cool the dogs off a bit?

But I LOL anyway....funny story.

 

[JustSheila]

I don't know Sheila......I see spade marks on the walls of that pit.

Perhaps the owners helped....

Perhaps a way to cool the dogs off a bit?

But I LOL anyway....funny story.

That's not their hole, it was just an example. I couldn't find a way to upload my picture here on exscn. (If you or anyone else can tell me how to do that, it would be appreciated.)

No, the dogs really dug a big hole and had the time of their life doing it, too. They were funny to watch. Looks like the owner covered it over today. He's not letting them out alone in the yard for hours at a time anymore, either. That's good - I think they dug it to keep the puppy warm. It's in the 40s here part of the day. Some breeds of dog get cold a lot faster than others, and these are poodles.

 

[TheOriginalBigBlue]

I couldn't find a way to upload my picture here on exscn. (If you or anyone else can tell me how to do that, it would be appreciated.)

There is an "Upload a File" tab next to the "Post Reply" tab but you can also drag and drop an image file into this new format which is very cool.

 

[Leland]

Yes, just drag the photo from your desktop to the typing words area.... (what ever that is called...)

If photo is on your phone...I have to upload it to my computer first...

 

[phenomanon]

My neighbor's dogs increased their tribe because they hadn't neutered them. Two dogs became four dogs left out in the yard all day barking. An annoying tribal practice, to say the least.

After they got bored playing tribe pack barking at everything that moved from sunrise on, the pack began another tribalistic practice. The older ones taught the pups and all together as a tribe they dug a huge hole in the yard, at least 5 feet by 5. Their faces, feet and bodies were covered in ritualistic mud and they had a great time.

Somehow, I don't think they'll be left in the yard alone on their own tomorrow. The tribal dog barking problem sort of solved itself.

Pretty Brindle dog.

 

[phenomanon]

That's not their hole, it was just an example. I couldn't find a way to upload my picture here on exscn. (If you or anyone else can tell me how to do that, it would be appreciated.)

No, the dogs really dug a big hole and had the time of their life doing it, too. They were funny to watch. Looks like the owner covered it over today. He's not letting them out alone in the yard for hours at a time anymore, either. That's good - I think they dug it to keep the puppy warm. It's in the 40s here part of the day. Some breeds of dog get cold a lot faster than others, and these are poodles.

I can hardly wait for someone to tell you how to upload your picture.

 

[strativarius]

phenomanon said:

I can hardly wait for someone to tell you how to upload your picture.

Don't look at me, I'm not falling for that one again!

 

[JustSheila]

There is an "Upload a File" tab next to the "Post Reply" tab but you can also drag and drop an image file into this new format which is very cool.

Thanks! EXSCN has changed since I was on it last.

"The uploaded file is too large." I'll be back after I shrink it a bit.

 

[JustSheila]

Yes, just drag the photo from your desktop to the typing words area.... (what ever that is called...)

If photo is on your phone...I have to upload it to my computer first...

I'll try that too, thanks!

 

[strativarius]

Yes, just drag the photo from your desktop to the typing words area.... ([bcolor=#ffff00]what ever that is called[/bcolor]...)

<snip>

Whitespace.

 

[JustSheila]

I shrunk the pic but it's still too large and it won't let me shrink it again. Will try sending a small version to my phone instead and see if that works.

 

[TheOriginalBigBlue]

I shrunk the pic but it's still too large and it won't let me shrink it again. Will try sending a small version to my phone instead and see if that works.

Are you saving to JPEG? Other formats like TIFF can be pretty big. Photoshop has a "save for web" option that automatically saves as a JPEG in a file size suitable for web and email. You can also take a screen capture of it. Those tend to be smaller files.