Update on Hubbard's physics education

Student of Trinity

Silver Meritorious Patron
I've commented before on Hubbard's meager physics education, so this is just a short update. I've seen Hubbard's transcript before, but I just heard Hubbard's own story about his education, from 'the university years' section of the lronhubbard.org site. This changes a couple of points for me.

Assuming that the recording there really is Hubbard's own words, then he must at least have learned a little bit of atomic physics, because he acknowledges that the course he studied was actually called 'atomic and molecular phenomena'. He states that nuclear physics is only a small part of that larger topic, and in one way that's true, although nobody would really put it that way today. (It's a bit like saying that cellular biology is one small part of economics.) And the brief summary of the subject that he makes is a fair summary of the very basic idea.

So Hubbard didn't just skip all his classes, and he wasn't just an idiot who was totally out of his depth in an intro physics course. The fact remains: he took one course in atomic and molecular physics, and failed it. He only passed a few very basic college physics courses. For a year or two, he was a 'physics major'. He flunked out. He did not take even an undergraduate degree. The people who built the atomic bomb were physics professors with doctoral degrees and many years of advanced research behind them. L. Ron Hubbard was never a physicist.

And yet in the voiceover on lronhubbard.com — if that's really Hubbard — he makes what sounds like a plausible case. He makes out that he became a fully trained nuclear physicist, a 'Buck Rogers boy', but could get no work in the field because there was no money for such advanced stuff in the Depression. So he turned to science fiction, he says, because he was such a sophisticated scientist. It's a plausible story, if you have no idea what's involved in an actual physics education.

What this means is just that Hubbard was a deliberate and knowing fraudster about his academic background. He knew enough to know that what he was claiming was fraud.
 
speaking of this on another thread, you or someone said the only way you flunk an introductory course is by not trying at all

that's not so. you can flunk by just refusing to accept the data given. ron was on his way to being a scifi writer; he wasn't going to accept 186,000 mps as the speed limit. i suspect he flunked for seventeen different permutations of saying the spectrum from a prism disproves the speed of light

and the g.w. course is just his formal education; it gives him the right to say "i took one of the first..." yadayada. ron was a voracious reader. that and late night brainstorming sessions with the campbell crowd were the bulk of his education...
 

SpecialFrog

Silver Meritorious Patron
speaking of this on another thread, you or someone said the only way you flunk an introductory course is by not trying at all

that's not so. you can flunk by just refusing to accept the data given. ron was on his way to being a scifi writer; he wasn't going to accept 186,000 mps as the speed limit. i suspect he flunked for seventeen different permutations of saying the spectrum from a prism disproves the speed of light

and the g.w. course is just his formal education; it gives him the right to say "i took one of the first..." yadayada. ron was a voracious reader. that and late night brainstorming sessions with the campbell crowd were the bulk of his education...

We know Hubbard took the course and failed it. We know he misrepresented his science education. We know he continued to demonstrate a lack of understanding of physics (such as his statements about the speed of light).

You can "suspect" all the imagined facts you want to fill the gaps but it doesn't change the basic fact that he never became someone who could get hired as a physicist.
 

Type4_PTS

Diamond Invictus SP
<snip>

"....Hubbard was a deliberate and knowing fraudster about his academic background. He knew enough to know that what he was claiming was fraud.

Anyone know the earliest time on record of when he first misrepresented his academic background? (was it prior to 1950?)
 
We know Hubbard took the course and failed it. We know he misrepresented his science education. We know he continued to demonstrate a lack of understanding of physics (such as his statements about the speed of light).

You can "suspect" all the imagined facts you want to fill the gaps but it doesn't change the basic fact that he never became someone who could get hired as a physicist.

i couldn't get hired as a physicist either

i did not study the man's work for his physics

nor did i study because he was a master mariner, which he surely was. but i knew he was a master mariner and i knew old salts tell tall tales. it was a simple deal. study the materials and see if they work

the materials work

Co$ suxxx
 
Anyone know the earliest time on record of when he first misrepresented his academic background? (was it prior to 1950?)
How about when he said he was the youngest eagle scout when they weren't even tallying that as a stat? I think he bragged about that as a kid or a teen.
 
Do they?

How many Clears and OT's (as described by Hubbard) were produced using these materials?

lol...

how the fuck should i know f'crissakes?

why the fuck should i care?

the materials work

didn't you see the stanley cup playoffs?

that was my finest work to date; that was my "Requiem". you want to try to tell me that was not sublime and spectacular? balance, pacing, sustained articulation, sustained dramatic tension, PYROTECHNICS!

a requiem for to bombs; two bombs grasped in desperation against toronto; two bombs a denouement against chicago. it was not time for victory and glory; it was time for
 
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SpecialFrog

Silver Meritorious Patron
i couldn't get hired as a physicist either

i did not study the man's work for his physics

You talked as if his formal education in physics -- and lies about it -- weren't important because of his "real education" on the subject that he got elsewhere. When that was challenged, you said that his physics knowledge is irrelevant because the tech works.

Why not just start with the non-sequitur defence of the tech in future?
 
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Type4_PTS

Diamond Invictus SP
lol...

how the fuck should i know f'crissakes?


You're the one who is claiming that "the materials work", so I thought you might have the statistics on how many Clear's and OT's have been produced (as defined and described by Hubbard)

Here's my count:

# of Clear's made in Scientology = 0

# of OT's made in Scientology = 0


Anyone have different numbers?

Back in 1950 Hubbard attempted to do a public demonstration of an actual Clear. Here's what happened:

[video=youtube;7R7XAWNAb9s]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7R7XAWNAb9s[/video]

Later on he found a solution to avoid such future embarrassments. Clears and OT's don't have to demonstrate their alleged abilities because it would be considered "out-reality". And Hubbard additionally made it a Crime in Scientology to invalidate a Clear.
 
You're the one who is claiming that "the materials work", so I thought you might have the statistics on how many Clear's and OT's have been produced (as defined and described by Hubbard)

Here's my count:

# of Clear's made in Scientology: 0

# of OT's made in Scientology: 0


Anyone have different numbers?

Back in 1950 Hubbard attempted to do a public demonstration of an actual Clear. Here's what happened:

[video=youtube;7R7XAWNAb9s]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7R7XAWNAb9s[/video]

Later on he found a solution to avoid such future embarrassments. Clears and OT's don't have to demonstrate their alleged abilities because it would be considered "out-reality". And Hubbard additionally made it a Crime in Scientology to invalidate a Clear.

what fucking numbers

the materials work

now as i was saying before i was so rudely interrupted...
 
lol...

how the fuck should i know f'crissakes?

why the fuck should i care?

the materials work

didn't you see the stanley cup playoffs?

that was my finest work to date; that was my "Requiem". you want to try to tell me that was not sublime and spectacular? balance, pacing, sustained articulation, sustained dramatic tension, PYROTECHNICS!

a requiem for to bombs; two bombs grasped in desperation against toronto; two bombs a denouement against chicago. it was not time for victory and glory; it was time for

valor and humility

ha!

how many mistook denouement for climax?

climax is we brought the cup to boston and filled it with our tears!!!

not the time for thunderous ovation; time for silence, time for all new england to be one with the bereaved...

a requiem...

and you want to try to tell me the materials don't work?
 
You talked as if his formal education in physics -- and lies about it -- weren't important because of his "real education" on the subject that he got elsewhere. When that was challenged, you said that his physics knowledge is irrelevant because the tech works.

Why not just start with the non-sequitur defence of the tech in future?

you listen to lies

i listen to tall tales from an old salt who had scant formal education and got his learnin' otherwise...

i did not say his knowledge of fizzicks is irrelevant

i said it was a simple deal and that implied nothing in the simple deal involved whether elron ever petted schoedinger's cat

if you find ron's knowledge of physics to be pertinent to anything whatsoever...

would you...

PLEASE!

explain how it is pertinent to anything whatsoever
 
speaking of this on another thread, you or someone said the only way you flunk an introductory course is by not trying at all

that's not so. you can flunk by just refusing to accept the data given. ron was on his way to being a scifi writer; he wasn't going to accept 186,000 mps as the speed limit. i suspect he flunked for seventeen different permutations of saying the spectrum from a prism disproves the speed of light

and the g.w. course is just his formal education; it gives him the right to say "i took one of the first..." yadayada. ron was a voracious reader. that and late night brainstorming sessions with the campbell crowd were the bulk of his education...

You took the projectionist course?
 

Type4_PTS

Diamond Invictus SP
and you want to try to tell me the materials don't work?


If you claim that the materials work to produce Clear's and OT's than I expect that you would be able to demonstrate that.

And I would expect that you can demonstrate the abilities gained in such a way that outside observers can actually verify that.

Otherwise I would suspect that you are just perpetuating the same fraud that Hubbard did for so many decades.
 
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