Was LRH bisexual?

[freethinker]

I concur.

That's a strange answer to the question.

I think it's time that Ulduz told us a bit more about himself and why he thinks the way he does, most of his threads read like distraction-trolling to me.

 

[uniquemand]

In my opinion, this sort of speculation says more about the speculator than the speculated-about.
When asked, "Why does it matter to you?" the answer was ....

Whatever Ulduz' answer was (OTO gay magick?).

That's a strange answer to the question.

I think it's time that Ulduz told us a bit more about himself and why he thinks the way he does, most of his threads read like distraction-trolling to me.

I'd like it if he cleared some of that up. I've actually enjoyed using him as a straight man. He asks a lot of questions that I like to answer. Maybe I should hire him to show up at my talks and ask questions.

 

[lotus]

You guys might also think ????

that

Afters years of scientology
Sea org
Auditing others (on sex - gay sex- self sex - sado-maso.....)
Being audited (on sex - gay sex - self-sex- sado- maso .....)
getting sec checked (on sex - gay sex - self-sex- sado-maso...)
After fes ing - C\s ing (sex- gay sex- self-sex - sado-maso....)

After filing tons of Kr about (sex - gay sex -self-sex-sado -maso....)

One of the subject of life that most of us are really not interested or excited in knowing about others

is

their sexual life stories and details

So....

 

[Ulduz]

In my opinion, this sort of speculation says more about the speculator than the speculated-about.
When asked, "Why does it matter to you?" the answer was ....


That's a strange answer to the question.

I think it's time that Ulduz told us a bit more about himself and why he thinks the way he does, most of his threads read like distraction-trolling to me.

It seems to me you don't have sense of humor, so you took my answer seriously. Well, that is not my fault.
You want to know more about me? Soon I'l place my Scientology story inmy biography folder.
If you don't like my threats, do not read them. Stay on your course and don't get distracted.

 

[Ulduz]

My posts say nothing about my personal attitide towards the gays, so let's not jump to conclusion. My favorite Positivist philosopher, Ludwig Witgenstein, was gay. So my suggestion is to concentrate on my posts and not on my personal views.

 

[Type4_PTS]

......" my suggestion is to concentrate on my posts and not on my personal views."

I concentrated on your OP and not your personal views and that's when I "disliked" your post. So I guess I followed your suggestion before you even put it in writing.

"........so let's not jump to conclusion."

And that's WHY I didn't like your OP. You jumped to a conclusion with not enough data IMO.

Parson and Hubbard standing naked inside the pentagram and trying to communicate with the Devil without screwing each other first? Give me a break!

 

[Ulduz]

I concentrated on your OP and not your personal views and that's when I "disliked" your post. So I guess I followed your suggestion before you even put it in writing.





And that's WHY I didn't like your OP. You jumped to a conclusion with not enough data IMO.

I posted a question, not an assertion. The expression "Give me a break" indicates a possibility of sexual intercourse, not a claim that it took place.
The claim would sound like this, "I know that LRH and Parsons had intercourse". As they say about the language -- the devil is in the details.

 

[Ulduz]

Expect more threats from me that the Freezoners wouldn't like -- I cannot please everyone, I am just doing my job of dismatling the Scientology views. My next posting is titled Utterly Useless Emplants, I will post it in couple days.

 

[Panda Termint]

While we're waiting... why not tell us a little about yourself ? (As long as it doesn't compromise your anonymity, of course.)

I'm curious to know more about what you've actually done and experienced in scientology, how long you were involved and why you think these things; speculation about Hubbard's sexuality, the fate of imaginary Implant Stations, the consequences of Imaginary Implants delivered by these Imaginary Implant Stations etc etc matter at all.

Tell us a little bit about yourself and your purpose in being here, Ulduz.

 

[Ulduz]

This is my response to humorless Panda Termint -- I feel your pain, mate, you cannot take simple jokes. The Scientology must have fried your brain.
I said before and I say it again -- I ask those questions to show how ridiculous the Scientology teachings are. Expect more questions from me.
Now, about my Scientology story -- I already posted it in the biography section (I did it couple of minutes ago). For your convenience I'm posting it here, too. I do not care about my security and I'm hiding from the Church. Soon I will post my real name. For now you can call me Wally.

My encounter with Scientology.​

It was my last semester in college (I got MS in Mechanical Engineering with concentration in Control Systems Theory) when I bought the infamous book Dianetics. I like it. Next week I went to Scientology Center of New York and took introductory course in Dianetics. I liked it, too, and was thinking about going up the Bridge. But, as a college student, I did not have much of a money, so it was an unpleasant situation for me. Then I read the words of wisdom by Hubbard -- anyone can pick any of my books and start auditing by himself, which is exactly what I did. I read Dianetics Volume I and II and begun auditing. There were plenty of Scientology customers who did not want to pay exuberant fees to become Clear, so they resorted to my auditing. Of course, I did auditing free of charge just for the love of it. I audited a friend of mine who had MS (multiple sclerosis). His ability to walk did not improve, but his speech did. That happened because he used to talk a lot during the sessions. But I ascribed it all to Hubbard’s genius (didn’t we all?) After graduation from college I signed 1 billion year contract and went to Los Angeles where I joined ASHO Foundation. I moved my ass through the EPA in 2 weeks and begun my work at ASHO. They promised they’ll allow me to audit, which was the main reason why I became a Sea Org member. But that was a lie, like anything else -- they said that I have to get my ass on the Bridge to become an auditor.
My first hint of disappointment with Hubbard came when I read the first book of his Management Series. I took an elective in Management during my undergraduate studies. Hubbard’s book was so obtuse that I did not know what to think. But then I said to myself, “He was the Founder of the most advanced religion, not an economist”, and put my doubts to rest.
I found it quite strange that my engrams did not re-stimulate during the auditing sessions back in New York City -- I was not a Clear (they checked me if I’m a natural-born Clear and told me that I’m not). But that was a small quirk of Dianetics and I did not pay much attention to it (I should have)
Sea Org looked like a boot camp to me, and I hated it. Plus, I was not allowed to audit while being on staff. After 4 months of slaving for ASHO I decided to quit. My Sec Check procedure went fast and in 3 days I was out of Sea Org.
I got engineering job in Los Angeles and begun auditing again. I did not feel it was necessary for me to get on the Bridge, so I was attending Scientology seminars only. I did not receive any auditing.
After 18 more months of auditing I came across Hubbard’s book, Have You Lived Before?, or something like that -- I do not remember the exact title. “This is either extreme stupidity of Hubbard or one of his famous jokes that I heard about”, I thought (I joined the cult after LRH’s death). Somehow I convinced myself that this was a cosmic joke. Then I read another book of his whose title I completely forgot -- its about thetans stealing mental pictures from one another. That was more than I could take -- this shit shows that Hubbard either went insane or was a conman. I got a hold of OT data, which was easy and came to conclusion that Scientology is a sham. I left the cult.
Certain events took place after my departure from the cult -- I gave interview criticizing the cult to Los Angeles Times. That interview resulted in my scuffle with CoS. I will write more about that some day (maybe soon). I was not alone; Los Angeles Times correspondents interviewed several ex-Scientologist. I never met those people and do not know what happened to them afterwards.

 

[Panda Termint]

Thanks for answering. It sounds like you've had a quite unusual experience.

There's no need to get personal, btw, I'm quite surprised to read that you think of me as humorless; I've laughed at almost everything you've written.

 

[Ulduz]

Thanks for answering. It sounds like you've had a quite unusual experience.

There's no need to get personal, btw, I'm quite surprised to read that you think of me as humorless; I've laughed at almost everything you've written.

I'm glad that you have sense of humor.
I realize that some people may think that I am trying to defend Scientology -- I am still new to this group, and the members do not know me well.
Wally

 

[Ulduz]

In the last several days I was going over the old threats on this website and realized that a lot of trolling occurred here. At first I though that the trolling constitutes attempts to defend Scientology. But then I detected much more subtle forms of it. I suspect there were also threats against the members of the group, although I have not found them so far. But I spent only 30 minutes studying the old data. I think it is only natural to suspect very active new members like myself of being the agents of OSA.
On some topics I have strong opinions that may go against the norms of society. I expressed my opinion about the adolescent sex and mature women. But that was the only one of my strong opinions expressed on this website.
Another one of my controversial subjects is my opposition to the theory of evolution (I am NOT planning to discuss this topic in any of the forums, no need to worry about that)
I made a name on DIGG by constantly bringing up this topic (there my login name was fx666; some of you may have heard about me)
As a Clinton supporter, I blasted Obama supporters on DIGG; those discussions involved a lot of cussing and references to one’s mama. Well, Obama is the President now; I’m not gonna attack his supporters here, it is water under the bridge (I’m not talking about The Bridge to Total Freedom)
I have a suggestion for those who hate my guts and itching for a fight -- let’s take it to DIGG. This group is far too nice to see how brutal I can be. To my knowledge, DIGG is the only Internet place without mediation. You can say anything you want there, no one ever got expelled from DIGG.

 

[Clarence Rockaway]

Apparently, Hubbard believed himself to have been a homosexual in his past life as Cecil Rhodes:

The thread: http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?4319-The-Rhodesia-Story&highlight=cecil+rhodes


From DartSmohen:

This was told to me by the brother of the guy who was in Rhodesia with Hubbard in 1966. As to whether it is totally true or not, I will never know, but the two brothers were very dour, humourless management consultants from Manchester. I cannot think of any reason to doubt their story.

As you know, Hubbard was usually very down on anyone who thought they had been a famous person in a past life. Except him, of course.

Hubbard firmly believed he was Cecil Rhodes in his previous life. In fact, one of the main reasons he went to Rhodesia was to try and discover where Rhodes had hidden his treasure. (This treasure hunting was a theme through Hubbard's later life).

Cecil Rhodes was an outrageous homosexual in his day. In order to get into the "mindset" of Rhodes, Hubbard had to take on his attributes. this is rather ironic, considering Hubbard's intolerance of gay men and women.

He got a house out in the bush, very near the Rhodesian side of the Victoria Falls. The brother in Rhodesia (We shall call him JOE) was conscripted as Hubbard's gofor. There was no telephone and one job Joe did was to arrange a land line to be installed across 40 miles of open bush.

Hubbard was networking very closely with the Rhodesian Government, led by Ian Smith, Hubbard was looking to create a safe territory for Scn.

In order to get into the part of Rhodes, Hubbard apparently used to dress up in a kaftan, turban, embroidered slippers and used a long art-deco cigarette holder. He also apparently used face rouge.:

Joe drove down to the house one day and Hubbard opened the door.

Joe was gobsmacked. He suddenly remembered something in the car and was around the side of the house doubled over with hysterical laughter. Christ, what the hell is going on here!!

Anyway, Joe composes himself and tries to go back in again. It took three attempts to control the laughter.

In the house Hubbard is mincing about the place and Joe is ramming his nails into his hand to stop bursting out laughing. Hubbard is talking about his plans to find the treasure and also how his networking is going.

After a while Joe has to leave and quickly drives away, only to stop about one mile up the road, convulsed in laughter and now becoming rather worried about what he has become involved in.
A few days later Hubbard is in Bulawayo meeting with top officials and meets up with Joe. Everything is normal. Nothing is said about the incident.

This goes on for a few months, Joe down at the house, Hubbard all dressed up, still no idea about where the treasure is buried. Interestingly enough, nothing was ever mentioned to me about any drugs or stuff. There was plenty of drinks, also no reference to any upper level research.Hubbard invited dignitaries down to the house on several occasions, where he entertained them well.

However, one day one of Ian Smith's men called by unannounced. Hubbard, decked out in all his finery, opened the door.! The look on the man's face must have been priceless!!

Within a couple of days Hubbard's visa was revoked and he was out of the country. He arrived back at London Airport to an organised welcoming crowd.

It was not long after this that the troubles started with Scientologists coming into the country.

Ian Smith had been in secret talks with the British Government over the resolution of Rhodesia's breakaway independence action. I personally have no doubt that Hubbard's escapades in Rhodesia were fully mentioned at that time and that they may well have triggered the government clampdown on Scn activities in the UK.

Hubbard gave a talk on Rhodesia. Obviously he said nothing about what really went on. Instead he went on about OT's needing to work together, how they could not succeed alone. For Hubbard, the Rhodesia incident became a closed book.

I asked Joe one day about Rhodesia and all he would say was "Don't get me started on that" (said laughingly).


From Alan:

Hubbard came back from Rhodesia and stated "A lone OT will fail!"

What he left out was: Especially if they dress up in a kaftan, turban, embroidered slippers, use a long art-deco cigarette holder and face rouge.

He also stated: "It takes a team of OTs to win!" He also left out: "We'll dress them in pretty sailor suits - and they can salute each other and call each other, Sir!"

I had heard about this Rhodesian episode from two other sources - a fairly high up GO person who had to try and help LRH stay in the UK - and someone who had audited one of the brothers. I had to clean the auditor up (coffee shop) as what came up caved him in!

Apparently Ian Smith the then Prime Minister of Rhodesia was still in talks with the Prime Minister of England Harold Wilson and the subject of LRH came up that started a whole chain of events - which eventually led to LRH forming the SO and also led to him escaping arrest for deportation at the last moment - when we stole out of Southhampton in the middle of the night on the Royal Scotsman's maiden voyage.

Ah! The good old days! - Such intrigue, such adventure and such comedy!

Maybe not bisexual but probably bi-polar. Also, from the above photo, Hubbard might well lay claim to having inspired the 1920's catch phrase...the bee's knees.

 

[Ulduz]

I always wanted to know where the phrase Bee Knees came from. Now I know.

 

[Clarence Rockaway]

I was wondering how powerful the OT magic is. Without gay sex no one could get to the OT Infinity level. (or, maybe, I'm talking about OTO levels)

Was he bisexual? Who cares? In his last days he wasn't even bipedal.

 

[Ulduz]

Was he bisexual? Who cares? In his last days he wasn't even bipedal.

We keep mulling over the same topics. Don't you think so? I'm moving to another threat and not coming back to this one. You can catch me at my new threat, Utterly useless implants.
NOTR to everyone who reads this threat: Do you want to know my real name? Go to Utterly useless implants; you'll find more personal data about me there.

 

[guanoloco]

-SNIP-

Crowley also directed his disciples to perform 'unspeakable acts' in order to destroy the ego or something in some twisted way.

-SNIP-

Rmack, where did you hear this? I would like to read about that.

 

[guanoloco]

It's too bad so many of the so called "critics" here become utterly uncritical when they are presented with things they want to hear.

Expediency over truth...

 

[GoNuclear]

Hubbard’s mentor and idol, Aleister Crowley, was bisexual. Early in his life Crowley expressed no interest in men. But he also knew that homosexual act greatly enhances magical powers. To bring his magick to a new level Crowley begun having sex with his male followers. I’m not sure how Crowley managed to get erection; his biographers are mute on this topic. Perhaps, he was engaged in group sex with his partners being both female and male.
LRH and Parsons tried to produce the “child of abomination”, mystical Babilonia; they also tried to evoke Satan. Those are very powerful rituals requiring homosexual contact.
Parson and Hubbard standing naked inside the pentagram and trying to communicate with the Devil without screwing each other first? Give me a break!
Has anyone heard about LRH’s homosexual exploits?

From what I understand he was cornholed by Jack Parsons in the middle of one of their rituals. It doesn't mean he liked it, it means he was willing to go to that extent to achieve results with ritual magic.

Pete