Were we stupid to join Scientology?

[Clay Pigeon]

This for you Clay P

Eleven times?!??? Thank the Gods I missed ten of them . . . once was enough . . . and A to E???? . . . I just never accepted their lies . . . what I did do was do the entire parade of Boards of Reviews . . . including the final one, done somewhere else in the universe without me present wherein they added new charges and accusations I'd never seen before to declare me guilty of . . .

At the time, in truth, I still thought it possible to correct these idiots, hence the continued appeals "up lines" . . . . but eventually, I realized the pigs in control were truly not honest or sane and had to write the whole affair off. And that was when I did a trip around the US to find out what the hell had been going on and who was doing what.

And that was when I learned of the truths of the shafting of Alan Walter, Mark and Ellen Jones , et al.

Even so, this was before the days of the internet, and so the total truths regarding the increased insanity that took over the cult were not available. . . only individual personal histories of folks one could personally contact was obtainable.

As to LRH . . . I was disappointed that he falsely claimed he earned a PhD when we learned of it. I well remember Major (or did he make it to Colonel?) Peter Wakely . . . Peter was the British Military Attache at the UK embassy in Canberra and did his HPA in Sydney (driving up weekends) . . . . well Peter, being old school military ethical was enraged when he learned of Hubbard's lie was exposed. I remember Peter walking down the aisle during a Scientology Congress 1965-6 in London, bellowing at the top of his lungs at the level of insult and fraud that Hubbard had committed on folks.

My attitude at the time was that, well, I could understand and forgive the fib but still wondered how and why it had come about. It was not until we began to discover the full extent of Hubbard's actual factual lies, his "affirmations" and the facts of his destructive actions to all in sundry that I then was able to totally write him off.

Elron bought his PHD certificate from unacreditted Sequoia University and the original document was hanging in his office at FCDC when I was there.

I knew then what it was and I do not now nor then begrudge it to him. His body of work is well worth a PHD.

It is also well worth being ignored for an honorary degree by any mainstream institution.

Hey

Lighten up!

After all I'm a bohemian "OT", a psychedelic ranger and the first psychedelic music was produced by...

The CHARLATANS!!!

 

[Clay Pigeon]

Bill,

There was one clinical study in the early fifties and dianeticists were unable to retrieve material read to subjects drugged unconscious

And I don't know as I have ever retrieved material received while unconscious

But I have produced dramatic case gain often

It's not a "hard" science but it is a "soft" science.

And an art.

 

[phenomanon]

I think the big thing was the Sea Project. When he was at St Hill, it kept him at least somewhat grounded in the real world.

At sea, as The Commodore, being able to exercise absolute and arbitrary power over the crew, I think it let a lot of inner demons out


I think so, too.

 

[pineapple]

Compelling evidence that LRH had lost his marbles way before the 60's: a letter to Helen O'Brien, July 1953. Hubbard wants the "electronic eager beavers" to build him a device that will enable him to walk into insane asylums, hypnotize the insane, exteriorize and audit them. He says, "The Japanese have registered many patents on such devices and have even, I think, killed a goat with one at 300 yards."

http://www.carolineletkeman.org/c/archives/10733

There's a link at the end to a handwritten version of the letter, in LRH's handwriting.

 

[Bill]

Bill,

There was one clinical study in the early fifties and dianeticists were unable to retrieve material read to subjects drugged unconscious

And I don't know as I have ever retrieved material received while unconscious

But I have produced dramatic case gain often

It's not a "hard" science but it is a "soft" science.

And an art.

So, basically, you support my observations. Great.

 

[HelluvaHoax!]

Compelling evidence that LRH had lost his marbles way before the 60's: a letter to Helen O'Brien, July 1953. Hubbard wants the "electronic eager beavers" to build him a device that will enable him to walk into insane asylums, hypnotize the insane, exteriorize and audit them. He says, "The Japanese have registered many patents on such devices and have even, I think, killed a goat with one at 300 yards."

http://www.carolineletkeman.org/c/archives/10733

There's a link at the end to a handwritten version of the letter, in LRH's handwriting.

What an entirely remarkable and incriminating document that is!

Not only does Hubbard fully intend to secretly test his quack devices on human guinea pigs, he even gives written instructions to lie to officials about what the machine is used for, in order to circumvent FDA and other consumer protection agencies.

Hubbard, in his megalomanically grandiose fashion, thought nothing of dreaming up some theoretical "cure" which would make him rich, and then perpetrate a fraud upon the public and the unfortunate victims of his criminal charlatanism.

This handwritten letter is Hubbard at his nefarious worst! Scheming, lying and perpetrating covert treachery in order to defraud and place others under his electronically-induced hypnotic control It's called "implanting" and "enslaving", the very thing that Hubbard LATER sold the cure for---at prices starting as low as $499,999.

Hubbard billed himself as "Mankind's Greatest Friend". But friends don't subject unwitting victims to insane medical experiments that are better left to that category of person that ultimately gets convicted of war crimes and crimes against humanity, like those infamous Nazi butchers who called themselves doctors.

Decades after his fortunate death in 1986, Hubbards evil gravitational force is still being used to collect hundreds of millions of dollars for medical malpractice called by various names, including but not limited to "THE PURIFICATION RUNDOWN", "THE INTROSPECTION RUNDOWN", CHAIN-LOCKER THERAPY, REHABILITATION PROJECT FORCE, OVERBOARDING THERAPY, ET AL...

Have I mentioned recently that Hubbard was a degenerately misanthropic con man?

.

.

 

[DagwoodGum]

Hubbard billed himself as "Mankind's Greatest Friend"

Fiend he meant to say, fiend!
Where do people come up with this "friend" funny business?
The "R" is for Reserved for RON exclusively and NOT for use in otherwise trivial VOCABULARY such as "friend"!
I mean, shouldn't it be obvious by now?
"Sheesh, I created ARC, didn't mean I had any?"

 

[screamer2]

Compelling evidence that LRH had lost his marbles way before the 60's: a letter to Helen O'Brien, July 1953. Hubbard wants the "electronic eager beavers" to build him a device that will enable him to walk into insane asylums, hypnotize the insane, exteriorize and audit them. He says, "The Japanese have registered many patents on such devices and have even, I think, killed a goat with one at 300 yards."

http://www.carolineletkeman.org/c/archives/10733

There's a link at the end to a handwritten version of the letter, in LRH's handwriting.

So basically what hubbard was after was one of these:

setup to act on the stomach.

 

[Clay Pigeon]

Compelling evidence that LRH had lost his marbles way before the 60's: a letter to Helen O'Brien, July 1953. Hubbard wants the "electronic eager beavers" to build him a device that will enable him to walk into insane asylums, hypnotize the insane, exteriorize and audit them. He says, "The Japanese have registered many patents on such devices and have even, I think, killed a goat with one at 300 yards."

http://www.carolineletkeman.org/c/archives/10733

There's a link at the end to a handwritten version of the letter, in LRH's handwriting.

Hubbard certainly walked down some strange paths.

I don't hold that against him and in fact have managed to survive some weird and ferocious detours myself.

The material in this letter is NOT material I studied to become a CLIV HGDS, more than 90% of which I have found to be gentle, wholesome, sound and effective.

This still being a free land and auditing being an optional activity, those who would avoid and/or invalidate the auditing material on the basis of such things as this letter, "The Affirmations" etc. are at liberty to do so

 

[Clay Pigeon]

What an entirely remarkable and incriminating document that is!

Not only does Hubbard fully intend to secretly test his quack devices on human guinea pigs, he even gives written instructions to lie to officials about what the machine is used for, in order to circumvent FDA and other consumer protection agencies.

Hubbard, in his megalomanically grandiose fashion, thought nothing of dreaming up some theoretical "cure" which would make him rich, and then perpetrate a fraud upon the public and the unfortunate victims of his criminal charlatanism.

This handwritten letter is Hubbard at his nefarious worst! Scheming, lying and perpetrating covert treachery in order to defraud and place others under his electronically-induced hypnotic control It's called "implanting" and "enslaving", the very thing that Hubbard LATER sold the cure for---at prices starting as low as $499,999.

Hubbard billed himself as "Mankind's Greatest Friend". But friends don't subject unwitting victims to insane medical experiments that are better left to that category of person that ultimately gets convicted of war crimes and crimes against humanity, like those infamous Nazi butchers who called themselves doctors.

Decades after his fortunate death in 1986, Hubbards evil gravitational force is still being used to collect hundreds of millions of dollars for medical malpractice called by various names, including but not limited to "THE PURIFICATION RUNDOWN", "THE INTROSPECTION RUNDOWN", CHAIN-LOCKER THERAPY, REHABILITATION PROJECT FORCE, OVERBOARDING THERAPY, ET AL...

Have I mentioned recently that Hubbard was a degenerately misanthropic con man?

.

.

O don't be silly HH...

This letter's just a rumdrenched belch on one of Elron's bad hair days. It don't mean anything more than a fart in a hurricane

 

[Clay Pigeon]

So, basically, you support my observations. Great.

Yes indeedy Bill!

In presenting Dianetics in both DMSMH and the original thesis Hubbard's primary and central concept is that the sole source of human psychological aberration is verbal material during moments of pain and unconsciousness which can be contacted and undone with auditing.

In and of it self, I do believe you speak rightly in saying these are some weak beans.

However our two opinions quickly diverge. It's not patently illogical to think, as you do, if a the central point of a presentation is weak the ancillary points are either false or moot

That is not what I speak of applying basic principles...

Start with The Auditor's particularly it's true noble spirit and noting in the letter of it there is some proCoS spin like the spin of a spider's web.

To AUDIT...

Is to LISTEN!!!

Very therapeutic in and of itself and much more so if one can listen intelligently and knowledgably

Timetrack.

Immensely valuable concept and my own independent research has gone places the published material doesn't.

Indicators.

Read 'em like book baby; read 'em like Tom Brady reads a defense; read 'em like a French whore reads a john.

Analytical thought vs. reactive thought.

I mean like really...

You can't perceive a watershed difference betwixt someone who is responsive and someone who is reactive?

Body ruds.

Ya hungry? Have a sandwich. Tired? Get some rest

Put in the Itsa maker line...

Get the person in P.T.

These and many other things are the basic principles of Dianetics to which I refer and have proven so often invaluable to myself and those around me.

 

[Gib]

Yes indeedy Bill!

In presenting Dianetics in both DMSMH and the original thesis Hubbard's primary and central concept is that the sole source of human psychological aberration is verbal material during moments of pain and unconsciousness which can be contacted and undone with auditing.

In and of it self, I do believe you speak rightly in saying these are some weak beans.

However our two opinions quickly diverge. It's not patently illogical to think, as you do, if a the central point of a presentation is weak the ancillary points are either false or moot

That is not what I speak of applying basic principles...

Start with The Auditor's particularly it's true noble spirit and noting in the letter of it there is some proCoS spin like the spin of a spider's web.

To AUDIT...

Is to LISTEN!!!

Very therapeutic in and of itself and much more so if one can listen intelligently and knowledgably

Timetrack.

Immensely valuable concept and my own independent research has gone places the published material doesn't.

Indicators.

Read 'em like book baby; read 'em like Tom Brady reads a defense; read 'em like a French whore reads a john.

Analytical thought vs. reactive thought.

I mean like really...

You can't perceive a watershed difference betwixt someone who is responsive and someone who is reactive?

Body ruds.

Ya hungry? Have a sandwich. Tired? Get some rest

Put in the Itsa maker line...

Get the person in P.T.

These and many other things are the basic principles of Dianetics to which I refer and have proven so often invaluable to myself and those around me.

I'm not quite sure why you keep promoting dianetics. Your postings are about PSTD which maybe the principles of dianetics addresses. But dianetics certaintly doesn't produce a "clear".

Maybe you ought to write a book, based on the principles of LR Hubbard and later the COS under DM control, LRH being mankinds greastest friend and DM being one who saved scientology, and both got it all wrong, and how to achieve freedom from PSTD.

Afterall, a engram is really just a stressful event.

"PTSD is a disorder that develops in some people who have experienced a shocking, scary, or dangerous event."

Key word being here "some" people and not like Hubbard said all people,

what a con.

 

[programmer_guy]

Gib,

You said "Afterall, a engram is really just a stressful event".
Not just that. According to Hubbard's use of the term "engram" it must also include unconsciousness.

 

[From the Ashes]

<p><br data-mce-bogus="1"></p>

 

[RogerB]

You said "Afterall, a engram is really just a stressful event".
Not just that. According to Hubbard's use of the term "engram" it must also include unconsciousness.

Ya, and my old memory seems to be telling me that and "engram" also contains "a real or imaginary threat to survival" . . . or is that dub-in by me as a result of going through the trauma of 28 years of Scientology???

 

[DagwoodGum]

Ya, and my old memory seems to be telling me that and "engram" also contains "a real or imaginary threat to survival" . . . or is that dub-in by me as a result of going through the trauma of 28 years of Scientology???

My recollection, and in honor of Count Alfred Korzybski who oddly enough discovered the phenomenon just the decade prior to the plagiarist getting his hands on it and spinning a web of lying case histories so as to manufacture the basis and credibility necessary to sell it.
There need be sufficient overwhelm and threat to continued survival that the rational mind checks out and the subconscious takes over.
From there the event is cross-wired by the sub-conscious to "earlier similar" memories which all would have to be earlier to the event at hand of course or a "chain" could not be created.
I never experienced any actual relief from running out the stuff but this is how, in theory, it's supposed to work.
And what took me less than half a page to describe, he managed to spin a massive impossible to fully digest "manual" on it - DMSMH
Of course being we're not describing anything experienced by all there would be no reason to be anally exact in how we define "it".
This is how he became "The Wordler", as he mastered the art of spinning mental prisons from a spider's web of words.

 

[Terril park]

Ya, and my old memory seems to be telling me that and "engram" also contains "a real or imaginary threat to survival" . . . or is that dub-in by me as a result of going through the trauma of 28 years of Scientology???

No dub in see below. This def.is not included in
Tech Dict.

This comment re compulsory exteriorization is new to
me. Don't think thats fully valid or at least not in all cases.
I spent 8 years from age 6 with many experiences of
compulsory ext, which though scary the first few times
were not engramic, and in fact led to the ability to go
ext at will.

https://stss.nl/stss-materials/English/Miscellaneous Materials/ACC_Preparatory_Manual_1957.pdf

"ENGRAM—An energy recording of a finite period of time, containing pain and unconsciousness,
with a real or imaginary threat to survival, and containing command value, and
containing compulsory exteriorization."

 

[Terril park]

On the issue of when did Hubbard begin to go odd the rails

Like all things, physical, mental or spiritual, it happened in stages.

When it began precisely, is rather lost to history . . . but for him personally, it was likely when he told his first lie to us and misrepresented his whole scene. From then on, as we can observe with any other liars, they have to keep lying to cover up the first lies and the continuation of the lies get bigger and bigger and more outrageous as time goes on.

The first evidence of Hubbard losing it, as far as I personally experienced it was back in early 1963 when he pulled us all off of the own goals GPM trip to tell us a) all GPMs contacted early on the case are not your own, but implants and, b) he told us he'd been to Heaven and so have you all . . . and off we all went into Helatrobus and all that shit!

There is also a dialogue on ESMB between Alan and DartSmohen regarding what they and Hubbard saw in one of the Spanish ports the ship called into just before the OT3 garbage was released by Hubbard. Dart and Alan reveal that the religious ceremony they witnessed was simply a ringer for the nonsense that Hubbard within days/weeks released as stuff in the OT3 R/D!!!!

Thus, the comments above about drug withdrawal psychosis is valid as he was also very likely suffering such since folks on the ship have reported on his extensive "medicine cabinet" and mercurial behavior at the time, it is likely the imagery of the actual real world "religious parade" triggered delusions he put into the tech released at that time.

One of these days a report on the historical progression of Hubbard's delusion(s) and bullshit he fed the believers should be written up

Rog

There is also a dialogue on ESMB between Alan and DartSmohen regarding what they and Hubbard saw in one of the Spanish ports the ship called into just before the OT3 garbage was released by Hubbard. Dart and Alan reveal that the religious ceremony they witnessed was simply a ringer for the nonsense that Hubbard within days/weeks released as stuff in the OT3 R/D!!!!
with any other liars, they have to keep lying to cover up the first lies and the continuation of the lies get bigger and bigger and more outrageous as time goes on.

ceremony they witnessed was simply a ringer for the nonsense that Hubbard within days/weeks released as stuff in the OT3 R/D!!!!

Thus, the comments above about drug withdrawal psychosis is valid as he was also very likely suffering such since folks on the ship have reported on his extensive "medicine cabinet" and mercurial behavior at the time, it is likely the imagery of the actual real world "religious parade" triggered delusions he put into the tech released at that time.

One of these days a report on the historical progression of Hubbard's delusion(s) and bullshit he fed the believers should be written up

Rog

 

[Terril park]

Rog said:-

"There is also a dialogue on ESMB between Alan and DartSmohen regarding what they and Hubbard saw in one of the Spanish ports the ship called into just before the OT3 garbage was released by Hubbard. Dart and Alan reveal that the religious ceremony they witnessed was simply a ringer for the nonsense that Hubbard within days/weeks released as stuff in the OT3 R/D!!!!"

OT3 went into the handling of body thetans. A spiritual teammate by an other name. Alan also wrote here about
good experiences and gains on OT3. I had some also.

So what is working here? I'm inclined to think creative processing/visualization. I don't believe in the OT 3
story.

 

[lotus]

Funny,

To the opposite of some other I really believe in the OT3 story.

This story is true.
It comes from either an evil, abusive, criminal mind fucked up with untreated severe mental ilnesses, alcohol, durg, and pink and greys....
or from a kid's mind abused and manipulated by his criminal evil father pushing drug on him.

Pure psychedelic fabulation and hallucinations sold as life truth

Yes..OT3 is true, like scientology is true...it does exist to the degree other human beings agree that mental mindfuck is true piece of wisdom....

AFAIAC - I was truly stupid to join scientology when I ws presented the bridge and materials to study. I should havegot at this moment it was a stupid scam...but..hey..if so many others are so winning and having such great spiritual gains...it must be of great value....

Stoopidity..not relying to your own intuition..not relying to your guts...