"What is Scientology?" by Paul Allen, Pastor of Hope Church Australia

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"What is Scientology?" by Paul Allen, Pastor of Hope Church Australia.

https://pastorpaulallen.wordpress.com/2019/05/29/what-is-scientology/

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Here are a few thoughts that became clear after a conversation with a Scientologist. I think that these points will help us as we think through religions in general.

[SNIP]

3. Human beings will become gods

So many religions have a similar view that ultimately exalts humanity to the point where we can become gods. In Scientology, they have a creator but he, himself, is constantly expanding and growing in his glory. Human beings ultimately become gods themselves. And this is when, once again, I was reminded about this simple reality: the devil is in the business of stealing glory from God. He creates religions that aren’t neutral, but instead their main objective is to steal glory from God through exalting man and through causing man to either believe that they can earn their way back to God through works, which is blasphemy or through themselves achieving god-like status, which is also blasphemous. Either way, the goal is always to diminish God and His glory and to exalt man to steal His glory.

It’s really easy to mark some religions as ridiculous and make fun of them in our minds. Especially religions started by L. Ron Hubbard who (allegedly) made it clear he was doing it for the money. And yet, on Sunday I met a soul that will spend eternity in either heaven or hell, and my heart broke for him with compassion. I hope you will pray for Tim, and if you ever run into a Scientologist, or really anyone at all, that you will lovingly point them to Christ who is the only One who deserves glory and worship.

* * * * * END EXCERPT * * * * *
 
"What is Scientology?" by Paul Allen, Pastor of Hope Church Australia.

https://pastorpaulallen.wordpress.com/2019/05/29/what-is-scientology/

* * * * * BEGIN EXCERPT * * * * *

Here are a few thoughts that became clear after a conversation with a Scientologist. I think that these points will help us as we think through religions in general.

[SNIP]

3. Human beings will become gods

So many religions have a similar view that ultimately exalts humanity to the point where we can become gods. In Scientology, they have a creator but he, himself, is constantly expanding and growing in his glory. Human beings ultimately become gods themselves. And this is when, once again, I was reminded about this simple reality: the devil is in the business of stealing glory from God. He creates religions that aren’t neutral, but instead their main objective is to steal glory from God through exalting man and through causing man to either believe that they can earn their way back to God through works, which is blasphemy or through themselves achieving god-like status, which is also blasphemous. Either way, the goal is always to diminish God and His glory and to exalt man to steal His glory.

It’s really easy to mark some religions as ridiculous and make fun of them in our minds. Especially religions started by L. Ron Hubbard who (allegedly) made it clear he was doing it for the money. And yet, on Sunday I met a soul that will spend eternity in either heaven or hell, and my heart broke for him with compassion. I hope you will pray for Tim, and if you ever run into a Scientologist, or really anyone at all, that you will lovingly point them to Christ who is the only One who deserves glory and worship.

* * * * * END EXCERPT * * * * *
Pastor Paul Allen certainly doesn't seem to feel that he has to justify anything he says with references to any materials! It seems as if he is saying that he knows everything about Scientology from talking to one person, and that the only possible conclusion that can be derived from that is to turn to Jesus. I don't really see his logic. Did I miss something?
 
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Dulloldfart

Squirrel Extraordinaire
How demeaning to have the authority figure in a big group ask the congregation to pray for you, although I suppose he wasn't present. That reminds me of a weekly FCB staff meeting of the whole HGB crew, 500+ people, where two ITO course sups, recently taken off post, were excoriated, "Paul Adams for sexual perversion, and ____ for out-tech." Cringe. Funnily enough, I was pleased I wasn't accused of being out-tech, which would have been far worse in my opinion.

The sexual perversion? I had looked down a pretty girl's blouse in the course room.

Paul
 
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Dulloldfart

Squirrel Extraordinaire
Is that it? Well, that's bad enough but I was hoping for something a little more salacious. :coolwink:
It was the Sea Org in LA, 1995. Anything to do with sex, except for sanitized conjugal relations in the missionary position with the lights off while thinking KSW thoughts was verboten and considered perverted.

Slightly exaggerated, but not as much as one might think.

Paul
 

strativarius

Inveterate gnashnab & snoutband
It was the Sea Org in LA, 1995. Anything to do with sex, except for sanitized conjugal relations in the missionary position with the lights off while thinking KSW thoughts was verboten and considered perverted.

Slightly exaggerated, but not as much as one might think.

Paul
I don't know what the hard and fast rules were, but I was allowed to spend some time once a week with my lovely wifey while I was on the SH RPF. Of course there's nothing less romantic than pre-arranged conjugals.
 
I don't know what the hard and fast rules were, but I was allowed to spend some time once a week with my lovely wifey while I was on the SH RPF. Of course there's nothing less romantic than pre-arranged conjugals.
It was the Sea Org in LA, 1995. Anything to do with sex, except for sanitized conjugal relations in the missionary position with the lights off while thinking KSW thoughts was verboten and considered perverted.

Slightly exaggerated, but not as much as one might think.

Paul
Well you were perverted! Looking down a poor girls blouse!!! You probably wanted to look up her skirt too! (Did you see anything besides a bit of bra?)
 

Dulloldfart

Squirrel Extraordinaire
Well you were perverted! Looking down a poor girls blouse!!! You probably wanted to look up her skirt too! (Did you see anything besides a bit of bra?)
Well, as everyone must know, most girls with big boobs can't resist flaunting them (within the limits of decorum for that time and place), whether to taunt the less-endowed females or titillate the males or both. So I never felt particularly bad about looking -- it was the female exec behind me who decided it was outrageous, not the girl.

Of course, it's different (to the girl) whether you're a hunky guy doing the ogling or some pervy old man.

Paul
 
Well, as everyone must know, most girls with big boobs can't resist flaunting them (within the limits of decorum for that time and place), whether to taunt the less-endowed females or titillate the males or both. So I never felt particularly bad about looking -- it was the female exec behind me who decided it was outrageous, not the girl.

Of course, it's different (to the girl) whether you're a hunky guy doing the ogling or some pervy old man.

Paul
Since you were so persecuted, prosecuted and punished for your crime of sexual perversion; I just wanted to know if you at least got an eyeful of something nice! (I've always been a pretty good sport about receiving the attentions of perverted guys; just so long as it doesn't get too out of hand.)
 
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How was the rule about sex only in the missionary position enforced? Did they put one of those teen age Messengers in the room with you?
 
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Dulloldfart

Squirrel Extraordinaire
Since you were so persecuted, prosecuted and punished for your crime of sexual perversion; I just wanted to know if you at least got an eyeful of something nice! (I've always been a pretty good sport about receiving the attentions of perverted guys; just so long as it doesn't get too out of hand.)
Did I get an eyeful? Nothing spectacular, and certainly not worth the consequences, but it wasn't bad.

How was the rule about sex only in the missionary position enforced? Did they put one of those teen age Messengers in the room with you?
The chilling effects of after-the-fact sec checks and O/W write-ups. Plus the occasional over-the-top Comm-Ev. Example: a man and a woman were sent together on a mission (insane at the outset). Mission funds were sparse, as usual, so to save money at one point they shared a hotel room with a double bed. They slept fully-clothed so they couldn't be accused of out-2D. Later, I assume after the returning-mission sec check, the woman got RPF'd for this "out-2D."

I got this information from the ethics order -- maybe there was other stuff going on, but that's what was stated.

Paul
 

CaliMule

Work Hard and Bray
Pastor Paul Allen certainly doesn't seem to feel that he has to justify anything he says with references to any materials! It seems as if he is saying that he knows everything about Scientology from talking to one person, and that the only possible conclusion that can be derived from that is to turn to Jesus. I don't really see his logic. Did I miss something?
Established rhetorical devices present something abstract in some personification. If you have a degree in African studies and personally spent a year of sociological study on the ground in Africa, you might nevertheless present your results in the form "I had a conversation with an African the other day . . . " There is a specific name for this technique because it is used so often. The alleged conversation which your pretend took place is basically dialogue meant to ham-handedly present your abstract views in a way a listener finds easier to assimilate, and also trust as if based on a real event rather than your imagination. As with many rhetorical devices, it is easy to use deceitfully.

You might do this if you've been trained in formal rhetoric according to Western conventions, as Christian pastors often are. Christian pastors often act as if being hegemonic in society or being smugly assured of the rightness of their religious views entitles them to use rhetorical devices even when they are blatantly deceitful. After all, he isn't being some cult-like exploiter by being deceitful, he's helping ignorant people know the "truth" by using deceitful tricks such as rhetorical devices - for GOOD purposes unlike those nasty evil cultie people who use rhetorical devices for evil.

The pastor may or may not have had a conversation with a Scientologist, but he is presenting well established views of how Scientology and fundamentalist Christianity are incompatible through this alleged conversation.

The logic involved is: arguments of the Apostle Paul that (1) humans are incapable of salvation except by divine intervention are true, (2) such salvation is improbable where human pride or vanity prevents seeking it, (which actually tends to disprove "salvation by grace" in favor of "salvation by election") and (3) therefore self-effacement or self-mortification and conversely glorification of God alone is desirable to assure salvation. This is standard Pauline fundamentalist thinking and has informed Christianity for millenia. The inherent flaws in its reasoning, or alternatively contradictions involved between the "grace" and "election" camps of salvation have long been noted. Scientology's claims to be compatible with all other religions fails when one examines fundamentals of the Apostle Paul's version of Christianity, anyhow, which is the real point and logic of the pastor here.

Actually it doesn't really matter whether a conversation with a Scientologist was had or not, as fundamentalist Christians have been asserting the same point of view endlessly before Scientology even arose. Perhaps the pastor is simply using the a Scientologist as a rhetorical foil, a despised person who harbors ideas that are wrong from the pastor to seem heroic in attacking. Scientologists in Australia are getting a very bad public vilification campaign because of the state of the Australian press and the state of Scientology staff's tendency to do despicable things for the press to cover.

It is easy and profitable for a Christian pastor in Australia to beat up on either real or imaginary Scientologists currently.
 
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