What is trolling?

[Type4_PTS]

I think one important discerning point is also the frequency of posting.
Do I care about posts by indie scientologists, people with weird opinions, wingnuts or communists, avid conspiracy theorists, antisemites, flat earthers, UFO fans, parapsychology fans, health woo, or people who sense psy ops everywhere? Not much. And somethimes they add interesting things to the discussion and sometimes they're right. Chances are I'll want to read it, like everything else here.
On the other hand, what if someone starts to post some kind of crap (or even completely correct facts!) everywhere, making 10-50 posts a day, posting the same kind of stuff on every fucking thread, making dozens of threads about the same thing, seeking to hijack all discussions, because, well, "it's haaappening"? Or because some really, really likes cheesecake? That's fucking trolling. It's simply disruptive, boring, and terribly repetitive. And thus annoying.
(Edit, note: not referring to Alanzo as much as to Arnie!)

@Enthetan I don't think dishonesty is such a crucial point. It does help to discern between some troll types, as well as between someone putting out perhaps silly but honest questions or on the other hand loaded-question-games and such, but it is otherwise not central. My reason: that would virtually exclude all psychotic and/or paranoid people from ever being called trolls, but nothing could be more wrong than that. On the contrary, I think most internet trolls (i.e. people about whom a lot of other people say "hey, that's a fucking troll") are mentally ill the one or the other way. Because, what leads to incessant shitposting? Either they are bored, lonely young men on the verge of sociopathism, or for example borderliner women who feel they've been wronged, or autists who do not even realize they're being silly/annoying, or the ubiquitous paranoid psychotics.
The fear, the urgency, the shitposting, the shouting (again and again) of "wake up sheeeple", the "mission", the narcissism, the terrible compulsions, the anger and hate, it all can be very "honest" ... but it's still trolling - if posted with high frequency, otherwise, as I wrote, I don't care much.
For discerning personally, I'd go by the disruptive factor, and an (admittedly) "ad hom" method: does the person behind it seem to be insane?
If something is posted only occasionally, it's an opinion. Perhaps irrelevant, weird, dumb, or uninformed, but still. If something is posted on every fucking thread, on the other hand, it's plain trolling.
YMMV!

I'm happy you brought up cheesecake!

What's you're favorite variety?
























If I do that on a regular basis with the intent to piss you off and/or change the subject of which you're writing about, is that not trolling?
IMO, yes, it is. YMMV.

 

[Enthetan]

I love cheesecake!

My wife's homemade cheesecake accounts for much of my present waistline.

 

[Lurker5]

I love cheese cake too, but am allergic to dairy, so I do Daiya products, including cheese cake. Daiya is the best substitute IMHO.

 

[Type4_PTS]

See how easy it is for a troll to change the subject?

 

[AryaZ]

In the meantime, can you go and look and tally up all the insults Alanzo's given, compared to the one's he's received.

Maybe you could add an ouch emoji option for perceived insults:

 

[TheOriginalBigBlue]

Getting back to the original topic: What is the difference (if any) between the troll and the "thought provoker"?

It's hard to know for sure, because the difference depends on intent, and it's hard to get inside somebody's head to discern intent.

The objective of the thought-provoker is constructive, to get people to examine their assumptions. The thought provoker is honest about what he's saying.

The objective of the troll is destructive, to create conflict within a community which potentially can rip it apart, or to create so much noise within a discussion that people get tired of it and walk away. The troll is dishonest about what he says, saying things for the effect they cause, rather than because he actually believes it.

I agree. So is the intent intentional or incidental? If someone is trolling because they have a program or agenda they might be able to do this by still being logical and sane. If a CIA agent is trying to disrupt the chat site for Iran's nuclear engineers so they can't focus on developing that new trigger mechanism then we might say that is a clearly purposeful trolling.

If someone has a psychological issue or obsession then maybe they just can't help themselves and everything they do and say emanates from that state of mind and if it is an unhealthy state then the consequences of their trolling will be unhealthy. I think they tend to just shat up threads until they are useless. Someone said that ESMB has evolved into a group of people who enjoy each other and I think this is very true. Consequently threads will go off into friend tangents but I don't consider this as trolling. Unless the thread premise is completely absurd or trolling itself then if the thread originator wants to sensibly bring a thread back on track, they can.

Now let's take OSA. Here you have people under a lot of duress, sleep deprivation, peer pressure and milieu indoctrination. They sincerely believe in what they are doing and saying. But their critical thinking processes are really messed up. And they are under orders to troll. Maybe we could call that institutional cult trolling.

I think trolling of ESMB would be problematic for the COS because to be effective their trolls must remain in their milieu control and ESMB is the complete antithesis of Scientology milieu control. Like Tory, the consequences of having a troll become detrolled can be disastrous. Scientology doesn't like unpredictable head cases - they like sensible people like Tory who can be manipulated. The problem with sensible people who can be manipulated is at some point they can become sensible people who are no longer manipulated. That must be a very difficult criteria for the OSA troll human resources department. My sense is that most trolls on ESMB are somewhere between the psychological kind and unofficial Scientologists who are self-motivated in the name of the cause. OSA probably appreciates the willingness and determination of volunteer trolls but they are undisciplined and when they become associated with Scientology it ends up being bad PR. This is probably a good argument for letting a certain amount of pro-Scientology trolling on ESMB because it can serve as an inspiration for discussion that further defines Scientology thinking and behavior.

 

[anonomog]

Watching some early Masterchef US auditions and some chap cooked askwirl.

Maybe some freshwater fish? An exotic veg?

Oh.

There was a bit of Type4_PTS in a pan.
Glad to see you are still posting.

Sorry - cheesecake thread.

 

[lotus]

I love to watch all the masterchief ( aussie, British. American etc..)

My favorite is the Australian master chief and I recall one time they did cheesecake...with creative new variations on a theme.

Miam

Are we trolling the trolling trolls thread???

 

[anonomog]

I love to watch all the masterchief ( aussie, British. American etc..)

My favorite is the Australian master chief and I recall one time they did cheesecake...with creative new variations on a theme.

Miam

Are we trolling the trolling trolls thread???

I felt inferior after watching Masterchef Junior. Some kids could barely see over the counter and cooked up a storm. Really impressive.
Probably got more inspiration from Junior than the adult show.

Answer - we might get done for trolling but Masterchef

 

[lotus]

I felt inferior after watching Masterchef Junior. Some kids could barely see over the counter and cooked up a storm. Really impressive.
Probably got more inspiration from Junior than the adult show.

Answer - we might get done for trolling but Masterchef

Ditto

The kids are impressive though.
Passionate beings and their plates are quite elaborated.
Whoo...imagine having such a kid at home..want!
Although, It's weight gain for sure!

 

[TheOriginalBigBlue]

I love to watch all the masterchief ( aussie, British. American etc..)

My favorite is the Australian master chief and I recall one time they did cheesecake...with creative new variations on a theme.

Miam

Are we trolling the trolling trolls thread???

Absolutely!

 

[AD1950]

See how easy it is for a troll to change the subject?

boom shakalaka, boom shakalaka

 

[TheOriginalBigBlue]

TROLLING AS MULTI-QUOTIENT HARMONICS: A new look at inter-personal relations and achieving happiness through expression of the inner self. By TheOriginalBigBlue

Available in your local bookstore now.
10% Discount with IAT (International Association of Trolls) membership.

 

[Glenda]

I really like the way this thread has meandered its way into cheesecake territory. I have an opinion about cheesecakes.

Some of the store-bought cheesecakes are terribly sweet. Not to my liking. However I know folk who can make cheesecakes which are to die for (not literally). I have been known to whip up an fairly good cheesecake though not in recent times. I can't remember when I last made a cheesecake. My family is having a big gathering later in the year so that might be a good time to cheesecake or be damned.

I really can't think of anything else to write about cheesecakes at this time but if I do I promise I will let you know.

Oh wait! I have this excellent recipe for an orange and chocolate cheesecake. I am fond of the combination of orange and chocolate flavours. The ratios of flavours needs to be balanced just right so that one flavour doesn't over-power the other. But get that right and oh my goodness. Delicious!

Okey dokey, I'll go and construct some other posts about cheesecakes and get back to you...

 

[TheOriginalBigBlue]

I really like the way this thread has meandered its way into cheesecake territory. I have an opinion about cheesecakes.

Some of the store-bought cheesecakes are terribly sweet. Not to my liking. However I know folk who can make cheesecakes which are to die for (not literally). I have been known to whip up an fairly good cheesecake though not in recent times. I can't remember when I last made a cheesecake. My family is having a big gathering later in the year so that might be a good time to cheesecake or be damned.

I really can't think of anything else to write about cheesecakes at this time but if I do I promise I will let you know.

Oh wait! I have this excellent recipe for an orange and chocolate cheesecake. I am fond of the combination of orange and chocolate flavours. The ratios of flavours needs to be balanced just right so that one flavour doesn't over-power the other. But get that right and oh my goodness. Delicious!

Okey dokey, I'll go and construct some other posts about cheesecakes and get back to you...

You're making me hungry. Is that trolling?

 

[AryaZ]

I don't like seeing him suddenly being favoured over other long term posters though ...

Yes, as Emma requested, a specific example of Alanzo being favored, would be beneficial (at least for me) in understanding what it is that you "don't like seeing".

 

[AryaZ]

I you had a dragon I would hire the Knight King myself and buy him a dozen ice spears.

Perhaps Alanzo should rename his profile:

 

[He-man]

Yes, as Emma requested, a specific example of Alanzo being favored, would be beneficial (at least for me) in understanding what it is that you "don't like seeing".

Alanzo, as you might have seen, can have a very confrontational style and he does like to go on crusades, talks to the crowd et cetera. This has led to drama in the past and are making a lot of peeps upset now as well. I think you would have to go years back to understand it, reading a ton of threads.

Best way to get a grasp of it would be to do a search and read through the threads he has posted in I suppose. Then you'd see the open discourse as is.

Emma explains all of in her thread in the off topic section.

GLHF It might take a couple of days to plow through it all.

EDIT: I don't think Alanzo is being favoured at all.

 

[Alanzo]

It's clear that no one here really knows whether Alanzo is a Paid OSA Troll, or simply a cynical asshole who's here to exact his revenge on years of cyberbullying and abuse, to destroy ESMB, making it melt down into a dumpster fire of distrust and disagreement between all of you. Someone who waltzes right into this complacent supper club to squat and shit on top of the main banquet table.

Or if he is simply an Ex-Scientologist who cares about his friends, and who realized the horrible pseudo-science of the anti-cult movement belief system and the damage it does to a person, and who wants one last crack at writing his deeply held, sincere beliefs, in a venue that helped him so much after Scientology.

No matter what the truth is, you do realize that, for Alanzo, this situation of deep uncertainty and nail-biting fear among all of you, is ideal.


I'm going to be writing a post next that I believe is an incredibly important post to write on ESMB, and which I have been blocked from being able to say for so many years.

So gird up your knickers.

It's going to be a bumpy night.

 

[tesseract]

I love cheesecake!

Me too! All of 'em! ... And my country has a lot to offer in regards to cheesecakes!