Why I post

Voltaire's Child

Fool on the Hill
Yes, but that's why I used the word "church" and not the "members of the church". As a group (Scientologists) people are not important, and thus they are mistreated.
It's not just about the tech. Most of the time they don't even try to apply the tech (not that it works anyways).

I think it depends on one's post. I've seen people in the tech division half kill themselves so that students, pcs and auditors could have a safe space to practice. But you know what else, though? They got messed with by their seniors and by uplines. Which, in a way, does support your point.
 

Cat's Squirrel

Gold Meritorious Patron
I think it depends on one's post. I've seen people in the tech division half kill themselves so that students, pcs and auditors could have a safe space to practice. But you know what else, though? They got messed with by their seniors and by uplines. Which, in a way, does support your point.

When you say "seniors" here, do you mean non-tech, management staff? If so, that's what I've been told in the UK as well; the tech staff are generally the best people in the orgs.
 

Voltaire's Child

Fool on the Hill
The tech staff aren't the ones regging people out of every dollar they own. I've known quite a few wonderful people there. Used to be one myself.
 

byte301

Crusader
Yes, I was NOT exaggerating about the being in trouble for posting. They even showed up at my house!! I lost one of my best friends over it. I kept suspending my posting cuz they'd hassle me, then I'd get pissed off about the freedom of speech issue and start posting again. Whenever I did, OSA would telex the org.

Then one day John the Wonderhusband posted a humorous JPG depicting a half naked "Sea Orger", so to speak, on the "Freewinds" and I got a call at my work. Boy, were they pissed. Another one he did was a staff photo of Flag execs with another half naked chick in a nautical cap photoshopped in with them with a humorous snarky caption. That one netted us some calls, too.

They just went apeshit over all that...that's why I'm so adamant about freedom of speech and people trying to censor others.
fluffy, I found this incredibly funny! OSA spending it's time surfing to find evil people shooping! LOL But it just shows me how low they've sunk.

Someone mentioned on another thread that Flubbard didn't want us to blindly follow him or believe him, etc. I think he was very smart by saying things like this. A lot of people would assume he had nothing to hide by "welcoming" inspection and critical thinking. So they wouldn't question his motives from then on. Nice. He was a manipulator and wanted nothing but blind faith from his followers. The people I do know that questioned didn't last long. And I've read many reports about people getting in trouble for going on the internet and researching for themselves. Freedom of speech and choice...hell, any kind of freedom really, means death to $cientology.
 

thetanic

Gold Meritorious Patron
The tech staff aren't the ones regging people out of every dollar they own. I've known quite a few wonderful people there. Used to be one myself.

On one hand, I wish I'd been a tech person rather than seeing the bowels of the organization.
On the other hand, I'd probably have stayed in longer if I had been.
 

Iknowtoomuch

Gold Meritorious Patron
I think it depends on one's post. I've seen people in the tech division half kill themselves so that students, pcs and auditors could have a safe space to practice. But you know what else, though? They got messed with by their seniors and by uplines. Which, in a way, does support your point.


I didn't mean that to come across as saying there aren't any good people there. That would be very unfair. What I meant was even the good people couldn't save you. Heavy ethics always gt in the way. Real communication about ones problems was not important to the organization. You were either completely on board or they threw you out.
Funny how Ron said that only the tigers survive but yet said to let someone (RPF reference) "let it out". Just another wtf moment for me.
 

Voltaire's Child

Fool on the Hill
fluffy, I found this incredibly funny! OSA spending it's time surfing to find evil people shooping! LOL But it just shows me how low they've sunk.

Someone mentioned on another thread that Flubbard didn't want us to blindly follow him or believe him, etc. I think he was very smart by saying things like this. A lot of people would assume he had nothing to hide by "welcoming" inspection and critical thinking. So they wouldn't question his motives from then on. Nice. He was a manipulator and wanted nothing but blind faith from his followers. The people I do know that questioned didn't last long. And I've read many reports about people getting in trouble for going on the internet and researching for themselves. Freedom of speech and choice...hell, any kind of freedom really, means death to $cientology.


Yes I agree. He said a lot about free speech, didn't he. Whenever they'd pull me in for a handling, I'd go in with a stack of LRH quotes about freedom of speech. Needless to say, this didn't stop OSA from hassling me and eventually expelling me.

Here is a link to his JPGs. The one they freaked out about was the "ride the Freewinds" one and the other one that pissed them off was the "Penny Price" one.

http://s107.photobucket.com/albums/m299/claireswazey/John Pix/
 

Voltaire's Child

Fool on the Hill
I'm not posting the actual pix here because they contain nudity. About a fifth of J's JPGs contain nudity- the rest don't. But still, for that, on a public forum, a link's good enough.
 

Cat's Squirrel

Gold Meritorious Patron
I didn't mean that to come across as saying there aren't any good people there. That would be very unfair. What I meant was even the good people couldn't save you. Heavy ethics always gt in the way. Real communication about ones problems was not important to the organization. You were either completely on board or they threw you out.
Funny how Ron said that only the tigers survive but yet said to let someone (RPF reference) "let it out". Just another wtf moment for me.

Sadly (speaking as one who likes tigers as well as other big cats) that isn't true. Tigers, especially the Siberian tiger, are an endangered species at the moment; they've been hunted almost to the point of extinction.
 

Axiom142

Gold Meritorious Patron
Sadly (speaking as one who likes tigers as well as other big cats) that isn't true. Tigers, especially the Siberian tiger, are an endangered species at the moment; they've been hunted almost to the point of extinction.

Good point Cat's Squirrel!

Elron says you have to be a tiger to survive. Tigers are endangered in all their natural habitats. Clearly they are not surviving very well. Possibly the only tigers that will survive are those held in captivity, never knowing true freedom.

Perhaps this is what Hubbard meant?

Axiom142
 

Axiom142

Gold Meritorious Patron
A wonderful person or a tech person? Hmmm...I try to be the former...The latter? Not interested in auditing anyone at this point.

Fluffy,

I meant the former.

But don't mind me, I just take delight in noticing ambiguous statements.

But seriously, I seem to recall you mentioning that you still consider yourself a Scientologist. Wouldn't that imply that you still use at least some of the Tech? I am interested to know which parts you use on a regular basis. And why not auditing?

Axiom142

ESMB’s Pedant-in-Chief
 

Cat's Squirrel

Gold Meritorious Patron
Good point Cat's Squirrel!

Elron says you have to be a tiger to survive. Tigers are endangered in all their natural habitats. Clearly they are not surviving very well. Possibly the only tigers that will survive are those held in captivity, never knowing true freedom.

Perhaps this is what Hubbard meant?

Axiom142

Thanks. Apparently Texans are doing their bit, there are estimated to be 4,000 or so tigers in the state of Texas alone;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiger#Conservation_efforts

Must be rich Texans given the amount they eat.
 

Voltaire's Child

Fool on the Hill
Fluffy,

I meant the former.

But don't mind me, I just take delight in noticing ambiguous statements.

But seriously, I seem to recall you mentioning that you still consider yourself a Scientologist. Wouldn't that imply that you still use at least some of the Tech? I am interested to know which parts you use on a regular basis. And why not auditing?

Axiom142

ESMB’s Pedant-in-Chief

Hi,

re auditing- yes, receiving, fine. Still do. Had some just two months ago. Not interested in taking on any pcs.

I was just differentiating myself from a tech staff member who word clears or audits or C/Ses or supervises a courseroom or Academy.

Yes, I still use Scn on a regular basis. I use Hubbard's concepts. I consider that the large majority of what he wrote is still useful to me and beneficial. I only differ with him on some policy and maybe a very few tech type things, nothing major there. I once posted on a.r.s. that given the huge amount of material LRH produced, that my estimation was only 2% maybe was toxic,like disconnection, RPF, all that sort of thing, leaving 98% that was not. The howls and shrieks I got from that- I even lost a net friend over it- were amazing. An extremely well known critic kept posting that I said that 98% was "good" and kept going on about "your 98% that you think is so good". Well, in the first place, duh, news flash- Scn'ists like Scn. But in the second, my point was that with all the commentary about the innate flaws in Scn itself put there by Hubbard- which is TRUE and there ARE some- well, if you look at the stacks and stacks of lectures, PABs, HCOBs, PLs, FOs, Exec directives and god knows what else that he produced, only a little bit pertains to the shit that has done the most damage to lives and to the very cult that purveys it. Most of his stuff is about theta and mental mechanisms. Love it or hate it, that's all there is.

This is why it's very easy for me to separate the wheat from the chaff. It's not a matter of picking out teeny nuggets of something good from an ocean of crap. It's more the other way around. Big ocean of something (that I consider good and that certainly does no harm) ...x....and itty bitty nuggets of crap that shouldn't be there and that truly is harmful.
 
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