Scientology Auditing on Children

[JustSheila]

This has been an explosive subject, but for the sake of those who are still wondering whether using Scientology auditing on children is destructive, I'd like to open the topic again and request from the posters that it only be addressed with genuine psychological, sociological and other objective research evidence.

When we speak of auditing children on Scientology, what, specifically, are we talking about? How do these processes measure up and compare to actual studies done with children?

Processes may include:

1) Locationals.

Though I don't think these would be particularly harmful to a child, what does a locational actually do?

It shifts attention. It distracts.

That's great for a crying infant, and lots of us wogs distract their attention and it stops them crying. That's okay.

For a somewhat older child, distraction may not always be the best idea. It could make them forget to do their homework, distract from confronting the bully, or teach them to ignore problems rather than address them. It's all about the age and context.

Scientology auditing does not take into account the differences in perception and life skills of different ages of children, and that can be destructive.

2) Objectives.

It seems to me, all these really teach a child to do is robotically follow orders. There is a reason a two-year-old says "no" all the time - it is because he is learning the concept of "self" and finally separating himself as a separate person from his parents. Objectives on a two-year old can be very destructive. What can happen to a child if that developing concept of self is stifled?

According to Erik Erikson's Stages of Development http://psychology.about.com/od/psychosocialtheories/a/autonomy-versus-shame-and-doubt.htm:

Autonomy versus shame and doubt is the second stage of Erik Erikson’s stages of psychosocial development. This stage occurs between the ages of 18 months to approximately age two to three years. According to Erikson, children at this stage are focused on developing a greater sense of self-control.Gaining a sense of personal control over the world is important at this stage of development. Toilet training plays a major role; learning to control one’s body functions leads to a feeling of control and a sense of independence. Other important events include gaining more control over food choices, toy preferences and clothing selection.
Children who successfully complete this stage feel secure and confident, while those who do not are left with a sense of inadequacy and self-doubt.

Does anyone else know of other Scientology processes done on children with comments regarding their safety or destructiveness to a child's development?

 

[Knows]

I saw some kid getting an assist - but it did not work.

I was at a Grand Opening of an Idle Morgue. It was really creepy but I did not know why I felt so creeped out - thought is was my "bank" but now I know why - it was Scientology.

Miss Cabbage was there with Lou - but I thought that was his wife. Sherman Speak was also tagging along with his mullet. He is a tiny man too. They are all tiny people.
The three of them were so fucking weird - I can't explain it. I got my photo taken with them....eeeewwwwww I burned it after I smashed my E-Meter into tiny bits and pieces and discarded the remains w/o sorrow.

Anon was protesting like crazy outside and there were TONS of them!

I felt like I was in another world - I was creeped out and not impressed with the Idle Morgue because I knew people that were losing their homes due to the crush fund raising. There were not that many people there really.

This kid ran into a wall - just crashed into it. He was about 3 years old. WTF? He started wailing and screaming. This odd man (I assume his father) was trying to do an assist...taking the kids head and trying to do the reach and withdrawal thing...the kid was going crazy....this went on for quite some time but the kid was making such a scene - the guy picked him up and carried him outside.

It was embarassing for Scientologist's to see the Tech Not Work....some asshat, gung-ho clam made a comment that he needed to be written up (KR) because he did not Hat the kid first and that is why the kid did not comply.

What I thought was weird is the kid running straight into the wall and crashing! WTF? - my kids never did stuff like that. Was the kid possessed with a demon or what?

I have also seen kids in Scientology act just horrendous - evil and insane. I think the BT's hanging around the Morgue's must drive these kids nuts or something!

Is that bizzare or what? I think children need to stay far, far away from the Occult of Scientology

I also tried to do a nerve assist on my daughter. She was feeling sick so I worked on her for 2 hours...no change! That was the last time I wasted my time on that. She thought it was weird and did not like it. I never brought her back to a Morgue again...she hated the course room - said the Sups creeped her out hovering over her like a mosquito waiting for her to pick her nose so they could find her MU. LOL

 

[JustSheila]

I saw some kid getting an assist - but it did not work.
...
This kid ran into a wall - just crashed into it. He was about 3 years old. WTF? He started wailing and screaming. This odd man (I assume his father) was trying to do an assist...taking the kids head and trying to do the reach and withdrawal thing...the kid was going crazy....this went on for quite some time but the kid was making such a scene - the guy picked him up and carried him outside.

It was embarassing for Scientologist's to see the Tech Not Work....some asshat, gung-ho clam made a comment that he needed to be written up (KR) because he did not Hat the kid first and that is why the kid did not comply.

What I thought was weird is the kid running straight into the wall and crashing! WTF? - my kids never did stuff like that. Was the kid possessed with a demon or what?

I have also seen kids in Scientology act just horrendous - evil and insane. I think the BT's hanging around the Morgue's must drive these kids nuts or something!

Is that bizzare or what? I think children need to stay far, far away from the Occult of Scientology

I also tried to do a nerve assist on my daughter. She was feeling sick so I worked on her for 2 hours...no change! That was the last time I wasted my time on that. She thought it was weird and did not like it. I never brought her back to a Morgue again...she hated the course room - said the Sups creeped her out hovering over her like a mosquito waiting for her to pick her nose so they could find her MU. LOL

Thanks, Knows.

Kids are already so imaginative, who knows? Maybe the kid took the "true for you" part so literally, he thought he could run through the wall. They are so literal at that age, just about anything said to them becomes a fact. We really DID believe in the Easter bunny and tooth fairy then, remember?

It's sad when they are set up to fail like that but not old enough to evaluate how something they are told could possibly not be true. It ruins their concept of trust, which is so vital to a small child.

I think nerve assists are pretty worthless, too. In a nursing class, I was taught techniques for increasing circulation and they don't work like that, but they certainly help the body heal when circulation is poor.

 

[8-8008]

I saw some kid getting an assist - but it did not work.

I was at a Grand Opening of an Idle Morgue. It was really creepy but I did not know why I felt so creeped out - thought is was my "bank" but now I know why - it was Scientology.

Miss Cabbage was there with Lou - but I thought that was his wife. Sherman Speak was also tagging along with his mullet. He is a tiny man too. They are all tiny people.
The three of them were so fucking weird - I can't explain it. I got my photo taken with them....eeeewwwwww I burned it after I smashed my E-Meter into tiny bits and pieces and discarded the remains w/o sorrow.

Anon was protesting like crazy outside and there were TONS of them!

I felt like I was in another world - I was creeped out and not impressed with the Idle Morgue because I knew people that were losing their homes due to the crush fund raising. There were not that many people there really.

This kid ran into a wall - just crashed into it. He was about 3 years old. WTF? He started wailing and screaming. This odd man (I assume his father) was trying to do an assist...taking the kids head and trying to do the reach and withdrawal thing...the kid was going crazy....this went on for quite some time but the kid was making such a scene - the guy picked him up and carried him outside.

It was embarassing for Scientologist's to see the Tech Not Work....some asshat, gung-ho clam made a comment that he needed to be written up (KR) because he did not Hat the kid first and that is why the kid did not comply.

What I thought was weird is the kid running straight into the wall and crashing! WTF? - my kids never did stuff like that. Was the kid possessed with a demon or what?

I have also seen kids in Scientology act just horrendous - evil and insane. I think the BT's hanging around the Morgue's must drive these kids nuts or something!

Is that bizzare or what? I think children need to stay far, far away from the Occult of Scientology

I also tried to do a nerve assist on my daughter. She was feeling sick so I worked on her for 2 hours...no change! That was the last time I wasted my time on that. She thought it was weird and did not like it. I never brought her back to a Morgue again...she hated the course room - said the Sups creeped her out hovering over her like a mosquito waiting for her to pick her nose so they could find her MU. LOL

Nicely SAID.

 

[oneonewasaracecar]

If someone had never her of Scientology before, how would they respond to the phrase:

Auditing on Children.

Scientology really does alter the language.

 

[AngeloV]

This is a re-post from another thread that I wrote earlier.

DO NOT AUDIT CHILDREN EVER!​

I don't often get upset on the board but auditing children is a form of psychological abuse. It should never, ever be condoned period. Auditing is repetitive, hypnotic quackery that can have severe negative effects on a young mind.

Aren't there enough stories about childhoods lost?
Aren't there enough stories of mental anguish?
Aren't there enough stories about psychological suffering?

'Running' commands on a child will fuck them up. It is not natural to repeat commands over and over and over again, especially to a young child. That is sick. Children need to be nourished with 'regular' communication: talking and listening, helping and being helped, feeling and touching, showing love. NOT doing robotic activity that is devoid of ANY empathy and feeling.

Even touch assists. Feel my finger, feel my finger, feel my finger.....on and on. What the hell does that communicate to a child? That you care? That you are concerned? That you want to make them feel better? Not at all. You are telling that child that you are a robot not concerned with the pain they are suffering....that you are emotionally disconnected from them!

Auditing children is an abomination and so was lrh. He didn't give a shit about children. Why the hell would you use procedures he invented on them?

Addendum:

The reason the 3-year old was screaming was because he intrinsically sensed that his dad was acting strange and not talking and soothing the child's hurt by moving his head/body in a strange, repetitive manner. Totally screwed up....NOT empathetic. Kids sense that immediately. He needed a huge hug and and the feeling of dad holding him in a SAFE, SOOTHING manner close to his body. NOT what he was doing. It's so incredibly obvious to anyone except a scilon.

 

[Bea Kiddo]

I think in my personal opinion being raised in the Sea Org, the whole subject of auditing on children can be summed up like this:

A hug from a loving parent would have gone a lot further than sitting me down and questioning me over and over about stuff while holding cans and answering questions being asked by someone I have never seen in my life.

 

[He-man]

I think in my personal opinion being raised in the Sea Org, the whole subject of auditing on children can be summed up like this:

A hug from a loving parent would have gone a lot further than sitting me down and questioning me over and over about stuff while holding cans and answering questions being asked by someone I have never seen in my life.

What she said.

My opinion - TR's, O/W's, touch assists, locationals, Dianetics Auditing, the Child process rundown thingy - All of it I'd rather have thrown to hell, a cuddle from Mum or a day out with Dad would have better mileage on keeping me sane.

The dangerous part I see in "child auditing" is the repetitive process with NO chance to get away from it until you get an "EP" And that NO instruction is given as to how to deal with whatever problems you have, apart from bollox information on 3rd parties, ARC and what not.

 

[8-8008]

I have seen parents being regged over and over for their kids (and I can say "I was part of it"... sorry for those people).

That was an easy way to get money into the Church.

Well for the "Auditing Children" part, I was surprised to see my kid (little one) some times ago putting his head against the wall. I never gave him auditing and will never do but I asked my wife (who never did any scientology) what he was doing. She said "well, I don't know. he hurt his head against the wall for the first time. I think he got surprised about it and he is doing it again." He did it 3 times and went on to play. Later on, I saw him doing it again when he bumped into the table...

As somebody mentioned it earlier in this thread, he is learning about life, about sensations, feeling... It has nothing to do with Scientology auditing.

I thought it was kind of cute

 

[8-8008]

I agree with you and this is why I spend a lot of times with my kid, enjoying life, getting him to discover new things by going to the forest, library for kids.... He really likes his parents and he is giving it back to us with hugs too. I am loving it.

 

[Charles Carmichael]

I was rarely hugged as a child. Normally the words of a serial killer when asked "Why did you do it?" I guess I am lucky, I have never killed, nor do I feel the urge. But I was rarely hugged as a child.

I did, however, receive plenty of sec checks. I received plenty because I would keep doing the same stuff over and over again. I guess I should count myself lucky, all the sec-checking left no time for actual bridge stuff, so I was able to avoid possibly damaging my young and developing liver with mass amounts of niacin on the purif, or the repetitive hypnosis the is the Objectives. It was a bit of a mind fuck though, I was always in my head wondering why auditing does not work for me, because I kept doing the same things. I guess I was just an evil being in a small body. I mean, mum and dad were very busy "doing their posts". How dare I try getting their attention.

 

[Bea Kiddo]

I have seen parents being regged over and over for their kids (and I can say "I was part of it"... sorry for those people).

That was an easy way to get money into the Church.

Well for the "Auditing Children" part, I was surprised to see my kid (little one) some times ago putting his head against the wall. I never gave him auditing and will never do but I asked my wife (who never did any scientology) what he was doing. She said "well, I don't know. he hurt his head against the wall for the first time. I think he got surprised about it and he is doing it again." He did it 3 times and went on to play. Later on, I saw him doing it again when he bumped into the table...

As somebody mentioned it earlier in this thread, he is learning about life, about sensations, feeling... It has nothing to do with Scientology auditing.

I thought it was kind of cute

I am not sure how old your child is, but if he repeatedly bangs his head, or rocks his head, you do need to get him checked. It is a red flag. My son started doing this as soon as he was able to hold himself on his hands and knees. He did it all the time at night. He was wearing a doc-band which may or may not have been part of it (doc-band is a band that is for young children whose skulls have been incorrectly formed in the growing stages). We did start telling him nicely to stop, and he did. He does it here and there, but still, if it is not improving, or he continues to do it, you should mention it to the doctor.

Not trying to scare you, but you can look it up - head banging and rocking in small children can be a red flag and early intervention is important.

Hugs to you and yours.

 

[Xenu's Boyfriend]

I think in my personal opinion being raised in the Sea Org, the whole subject of auditing on children can be summed up like this:

A hug from a loving parent would have gone a lot further than sitting me down and questioning me over and over about stuff while holding cans and answering questions being asked by someone I have never seen in my life.

Beautiful.

 

[Lurker5]

I was rarely hugged as a child. Normally the words of a serial killer when asked "Why did you do it?" I guess I am lucky, I have never killed, nor do I feel the urge. But I was rarely hugged as a child.

I did, however, receive plenty of sec checks. I received plenty because I would keep doing the same stuff over and over again. I guess I should count myself lucky, all the sec-checking left no time for actual bridge stuff, so I was able to avoid possibly damaging my young and developing liver with mass amounts of niacin on the purif, or the repetitive hypnosis the is the Objectives. It was a bit of a mind fuck though, I was always in my head wondering why auditing does not work for me, because I kept doing the same things. I guess I was just an evil being in a small body. I mean, mum and dad were very busy "doing their posts". How dare I try getting their attention.

just cuz

 

[8-8008]

I am not sure how old your child is, but if he repeatedly bangs his head, or rocks his head, you do need to get him checked. It is a red flag. My son started doing this as soon as he was able to hold himself on his hands and knees. He did it all the time at night. He was wearing a doc-band which may or may not have been part of it (doc-band is a band that is for young children whose skulls have been incorrectly formed in the growing stages). We did start telling him nicely to stop, and he did. He does it here and there, but still, if it is not improving, or he continues to do it, you should mention it to the doctor.

Not trying to scare you, but you can look it up - head banging and rocking in small children can be a red flag and early intervention is important.

Hugs to you and yours.

Hello Bea,
Thanks for checking and your advices. Nothing serious, it does not happen often. This is when he is playing and trying to do stuff older kids are doing. He is only 2 years old so the little one trying to what a 6 years old does, is funny sometime. Here in our country, there are "mandatory" checks on kids till they are 3 or 4... Everything is cool with him !!! But thanks for caring.

When are you coming to see us ?

 

[Demented LRH]

Thanks, Knows. Kids are already so imaginative, who knows? Maybe the kid took the "true for you" part so literally, he thought he could run through the wall. They are so literal at that age, just about anything said to them becomes a fact. We really DID believe in the Easter bunny and tooth fairy then, remember?It's sad when they are set up to fail like that but not old enough to evaluate how something they are told could possibly not be true. It ruins their concept of trust, which is so vital to a small child.I think nerve assists are pretty worthless, too. In a nursing class, I was taught techniques for increasing circulation and they don't work like that, but they certainly help the body heal when circulation is poor.

As far as I know, touch assist is similar to “kiss the booboo” method which is used to send confusing signals to the brain and to dull the pain. Both methods are not recommended because of the confusion that they create, although their negative effect is minimal. When I was in EPF, I was working at the Scientology kindergarten located near the LA Celebrity Center. I heard that some children with behavioral problems were subjected to Dianetics auditing. Even though I believed in Dianetics at that time, I thought that it was unnecessary because a nanny told me that the kids scream and thrash during the sessions.

 

[Bea Kiddo]

Hello Bea,
Thanks for checking and your advices. Nothing serious, it does not happen often. This is when he is playing and trying to do stuff older kids are doing. He is only 2 years old so the little one trying to what a 6 years old does, is funny sometime. Here in our country, there are "mandatory" checks on kids till they are 3 or 4... Everything is cool with him !!! But thanks for caring.

When are you coming to see us ?

Mai we!

Arent you in France? I would love to visit Europe again!

Alas, I am in Texas (which is as big as France.... does that count? ). It is hard with little ones to do much of anything! Maybe when they are a bit older. They are 15 months and my girl is about to have her 4th birthday party in a few weeks.

 

[8-8008]

Mai we!

Arent you in France? I would love to visit Europe again!

Alas, I am in Texas (which is as big as France.... does that count? ). It is hard with little ones to do much of anything! Maybe when they are a bit older. They are 15 months and my girl is about to have her 4th birthday party in a few weeks.

you are funny. I did not know about the little 15 months old one.

yes France. You knew that already !!!! JP came last year for a week and he stayed at our home. It was fun. Visiting Paris, D-Day Landing beaches and lots more.

Yes I agree with a little one it is not easy and this is why I am waiting for my little one to be 4 or 5 before going back to the US for vacations.

Speak to you later.

 

[Charles Carmichael]

just cuz

Awww, thanks Lurker!!

 

[Dean Blair]

Children under no circumstances should ever be audited period! For that matter, adults should never be audited either. The only part of auditing I would ever trust would be listening, duplicating, and acknowledgement. But this is something that caring and sane people have been doing for each other for a very long time.