Wog tech vs space opera

[Dulloldfart]

Not if he read any Sitchin (12th planet) Then he'd say we are all GMO - which explains all the crazy shit we do. Mimsey

I used to love Sitchin's stuff until that excellent refuting site* appeared. The 12th Planet book came out in 1976, but I don't detect any evidence of Hubbard having been influenced by it, like in anything he wrote.

*http://www.sitchiniswrong.com

Paul

 

[TheOriginalBigBlue]

And how did Homo Novis evolve smarty pants? Speaking of that... And have you heard that great pick up line used by the chief reg on her FSMs? Is that a clam in your pocket or are you just happy to see me?
Ka Ching!

Mimsey

How far do you want to go back? About 40-50 million years ago we were basically tree squirrels with opposable thumbs and a particular fondness for fermented fruit. According to LRH some of us still are.

http://schoolbag.info/biology/living/174.html
///
The story of human evolution begins then, around 65 million years ago, with the explosive radiation of a group of small, arboreal (tree-dwelling) mammals called the Archonta. These primarily insectivorous mammals had large eyes and were most likely nocturnal (active at night). Their radiation gave rise to different types of mammals, including bats, tree shrews, and primates, the order of mammals that contains humans.
///
About 40 million years ago, the earliest primates split into two groups: the prosimians and the anthropoids (figure 21.1). The prosimians looked something like a cross between a squirrel and a cat. Only a few prosimians survive today: the tarsiers, lemurs, and lorises. Most prosimians are nocturnal.
///

 

[TrevAnon]

View attachment 12940

Inb4CeilingCat

 

[Mimsey Borogrove]

How far do you want to go back? About 40-50 million years ago we were basically tree squirrels with opposable thumbs and a particular fondness for fermented fruit. According to LRH some of us still are.

http://schoolbag.info/biology/living/174.html
///
The story of human evolution begins then, around 65 million years ago, with the explosive radiation of a group of small, arboreal (tree-dwelling) mammals called the Archonta. These primarily insectivorous mammals had large eyes and were most likely nocturnal (active at night). Their radiation gave rise to different types of mammals, including bats, tree shrews, and primates, the order of mammals that contains humans.
///
About 40 million years ago, the earliest primates split into two groups: the prosimians and the anthropoids (figure 21.1). The prosimians looked something like a cross between a squirrel and a cat. Only a few prosimians survive today: the tarsiers, lemurs, and lorises. Most prosimians are nocturnal.
///

View attachment 12940

Wow. So let me see. 65 million years ago, explosive radiation causes tree squirrels to evolve into humans. So Hubbard made a 10 million year error when he date located incident 2? Why wasn't this brought to anyone's attention prior to this?

You say: Oh, you J & Der Mimsey - there was no such thing as incident 2. There were no H-bombs dropped on earth volcanos.

Ok. So, exactly how do you explain the radiation? A monster solar flare? A near by super nova? A monster meter strike blowing the atmosphere off allowing massive solar radiation to hit the earth's surface? Is their any proof of this?

Mimsey

 

[George Layton]

Wow. So let me see. 65 million years ago, explosive radiation causes tree squirrels to evolve into humans. So Hubbard made a 10 million year error when he date located incident 2? Why wasn't this brought to anyone's attention prior to this?

You say: Oh, you J & Der Mimsey - there was no such thing as incident 2. There were no H-bombs dropped on earth volcanos.

Ok. So, exactly how do you explain the radiation? A monster solar flare? A near by super nova? A monster meter strike blowing the atmosphere off allowing massive solar radiation to hit the earth's surface? Is their any proof of this?

Mimsey

Couldn't have been radioactive materials in the earth.

 

[TheOriginalBigBlue]

Wow. So let me see. 65 million years ago, explosive radiation causes tree squirrels to evolve into humans. So Hubbard made a 10 million year error when he date located incident 2? Why wasn't this brought to anyone's attention prior to this?

You say: Oh, you J & Der Mimsey - there was no such thing as incident 2. There were no H-bombs dropped on earth volcanos.

Ok. So, exactly how do you explain the radiation? A monster solar flare? A near by super nova? A monster meter strike blowing the atmosphere off allowing massive solar radiation to hit the earth's surface? Is their any proof of this?

Mimsey

LOL, I knew you guys would have fun with the "radiation" thang....

radiation |ˌrādēˈāSH(ə)n|
noun
1 Physics the emission of energy as electromagnetic waves or as moving subatomic particles, especially high-energy particles that cause ionization.
• the energy transmitted by radiation, as heat, light, electricity, etc.
2 chiefly Biology divergence out from a central point, in particular evolution from an ancestral animal or plant group into a variety of new forms.

 

[uncover]

.....
You say: Oh, you J & Der Mimsey - there was no such thing as incident 2. There were no H-bombs dropped on earth volcanos.

Ok. So, exactly how do you explain the radiation? A monster solar flare? A near by super nova? A monster meter strike blowing the atmosphere off allowing massive solar radiation to hit the earth's surface? Is their any proof of this?
.....

No, there was no xenu, no incident two and no H-bombs.... thats only Hubbard-vomit.

But there was a 6 mile (10km) big asteroid who collided with earth 65 million years ago (exactly dated without a toy called E-meter: 66,038,000 years ago, plus or minus 11,000 years) in Yucatan (Mexico). The energy released would have been over a billion times the energy of the atomic bombs dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alvarez_hypothesis

Sorry, no El Con Hubbard-vomit-bonus.....

 

[Mimsey Borogrove]

No, there was no xenu, no incident two and no H-bombs.... thats only Hubbard-vomit.

But there was a 6 mile (10km) big asteroid who collided with earth 65 million years ago (exactly dated without a toy called E-meter: 66,038,000 years ago, plus or minus 11,000 years) in Yucatan (Mexico). The energy released would have been over a billion times the energy of the atomic bombs dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alvarez_hypothesis

Sorry, no El Con Hubbard-vomit-bonus.....

Re red - So the meteor was alive? Did it suicide? Perhaps it was PTS? So sad. G

 

[Mimsey Borogrove]

LOL, I knew you guys would have fun with the "radiation" thang....

radiation |ˌrādēˈāSH(ə)n|
noun
1 Physics the emission of energy as electromagnetic waves or as moving subatomic particles, especially high-energy particles that cause ionization.
• the energy transmitted by radiation, as heat, light, electricity, etc.
2 chiefly Biology divergence out from a central point, in particular evolution from an ancestral animal or plant group into a variety of new forms.

Curses! Foiled again. Damn homonyms... Mimsey

 

[Udarnik]

LOL, I knew you guys would have fun with the "radiation" thang....

radiation |ˌrādēˈāSH(ə)n|
noun
1 Physics the emission of energy as electromagnetic waves or as moving subatomic particles, especially high-energy particles that cause ionization.
• the energy transmitted by radiation, as heat, light, electricity, etc.
2 chiefly Biology divergence out from a central point, in particular evolution from an ancestral animal or plant group into a variety of new forms.

Likely driven by a shift in climate (and that goes even farther back in time than the dinosaurian / mammalian exchange of dominance, due to DNA mutation rates).

 

[TheOriginalBigBlue]

Likely driven by a shift in climate (and that goes even farther back in time than the dinosaurian / mammalian exchange of dominance, due to DNA mutation rates).

Right. There is always something earlier, more like a shrew. Be careful though, go back far enough and we just might discover that we really were clams and have to eat crow. Used copies of History of Man would jump a buck on Amazon.
_____
http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2013/02/ancestor-all-placental-mammals-revealed
///
Results suggest that the ancestor of all placental mammals evolved less than 400,000 years after the mass extinctions that wiped out the dinosaurs, the researchers report online today in Science. The hypothetical creature, not found in the fossil record but inferred from it, probably was a tree-climbing, insect-eating mammal that weighed between 6 and 245 grams—somewhere between a small shrew and a mid-sized rat. It was furry, had a long tail, gave birth to a single young, and had a complex brain with a large lobe for interpreting smells and a corpus callosum, the bundle of nerve fibers that connects the left and right hemispheres of the brain.
///
The new study used the genetic information to arrange the branches on the family tree of placental mammals but didn't use a molecular clock inferred from rates of mutation to determine when the various branches first appeared, Yoder says. Statistical methods that help researchers determine the length of those branches as well as their arrangement will certainly shed more light on mammalian evolution, she says.

 

[Mimsey Borogrove]

Right. There is always something earlier, more like a shrew. Be careful though, go back far enough and we just might discover that we really were clams and have to eat crow. Used copies of History of Man would jump a buck on Amazon.
_____
http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2013/02/ancestor-all-placental-mammals-revealed
///
Results suggest that the ancestor of all placental mammals evolved less than 400,000 years after the mass extinctions that wiped out the dinosaurs, the researchers report online today in Science. The hypothetical creature, not found in the fossil record but inferred from it, probably was a tree-climbing, insect-eating mammal that weighed between 6 and 245 grams—somewhere between a small shrew and a mid-sized rat. It was furry, had a long tail, gave birth to a single young, and had a complex brain with a large lobe for interpreting smells and a corpus callosum, the bundle of nerve fibers that connects the left and right hemispheres of the brain.
///
The new study used the genetic information to arrange the branches on the family tree of placental mammals but didn't use a molecular clock inferred from rates of mutation to determine when the various branches first appeared, Yoder says. Statistical methods that help researchers determine the length of those branches as well as their arrangement will certainly shed more light on mammalian evolution, she says.

Why does it always come down to stats? Has 2 pm Thursday been around that many millions of years? No, really, how accurate can determining the rate of dna change be? It seems like a lot of hocus pocus / fudge factors used to make your favorite theory fit the facts or lack of them. For instance, how do they allow for climate change affecting evolution in these statical models? Do they factor in the major known cataclysms, eruptions, meteor strikes? Movements of the crust, ice ages, sea level changes etc?

Do they really have a long line of skellingtons that show this postulated / assumed evolution?

Or are you trying to justify Teryl calling Johnny Good Boy Tyler a rat brain?

Mimsey

 

[Ogsonofgroo]

I highly recommend watching this short BBC series Mims, if you haven't already, it will probably answer many of your questions, dunno.

Part 1 ~

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7ET4bbkTm0

 

[Dulloldfart]

Curses! Foiled again. Damn homonyms... Mimsey

It's not a homonym, although maybe it looks like one. What's that called? An inverted beardonym?

Paul

 

[Helena Handbasket]

I have read about and seen pictures of people who have had their past lives verified, but it is mostly a phenomenon of the very young - they seem to forget it after they age.

I recall the general details of my past 5 lifetimes -- in particular, in my last lifetime and in the one before, I had sudden and quite upsetting deaths. No wonder I'm such a mess this lifetime! Or as I like to say, the last 100 years have really been a bitch.

If super luminary speeds are unobtainable, the only space societies would be either inter planetary or in a tight cluster of stars. With our current lever of technology - it is a 50 year one way flight to get to proxima centari, our nearest neighbor, if there's a habitable planet there.

According to the OT 3 materials, the trip to Teegeeack via DC-8 took up to a few months. Doing some calculations, that would suggest a top speed of 3600C (3600 times the speed of light). Apparently, a electrogravitic drive (see the writings of Paul LaViolette) is immune to the effects of relativity.

LaViolette also described a means for supraluminal communication (in fact fully instantaneous). Some science fiction book I read years ago (I don't recall the title) called such a thing an ansible, so that's what I call it.

Helena

 

[Helena Handbasket]

It all does sort of beg the question, "We know where BTs came from so where did all the non-BT thetans come from?"

This of course requires an additional narrative - other waves of thetan migration using DC-9s, etc.

You want a narrative? I'll give you a narrative:

At the beginning of our story, there was nought but the class I NIMAT. And there may have been other things before this, but since none of these things persist to our day, they are not important to our discussion.

The class I NIMAT can make decisions. It can view its surroundings. It can have desires. It can attempt to fulfill those desires. It can feel joy in success and disappointment in failure. These are characteristics of all Nimats, save for the most severly degraded, although as we said, there were no other Nimats in existence at this time.

The class I NIMAT consisted and does consist of pure information. It has no embodiment in material stuff nor is structured upon energy as we know it, but it can create both of those things.

The class I NIMAT can indeed create whole universes at a thought. But those creations do not persist. One look at what it has created and that creation will vanish.

It can not create something and leave it alone for a while, then come back to it like a child comes back to a favorite plaything. For as soon as the class I NIMAT returned to it, it would disappear.

And so it was bored.

And so it was lonely.

But it has one other characteristic---it could create class II NIMATs to keep it company. It would create these by cleaving off some of its own substance, but this would not leave it diminished.

And class II NIMATs have all of the same characteristics as the class I NIMAT, even to the point of being able to create other class II NIMATs.

... and so on, until the entire universe was populated.

Helena

 

[George Layton]

I recall the general details of my past 5 lifetimes -- in particular, in my last lifetime and in the one before, I had sudden and quite upsetting deaths. No wonder I'm such a mess this lifetime! Or as I like to say, the last 100 years have really been a bitch.


According to the OT 3 materials, the trip to Teegeeack via DC-8 took up to a few months. Doing some calculations, that would suggest a top speed of 3600C (3600 times the speed of light). Apparently, a electrogravitic drive (see the writings of Paul LaViolette) is immune to the effects of relativity.

LaViolette also described a means for supraluminal communication (in fact fully instantaneous). Some science fiction book I read years ago (I don't recall the title) called such a thing an ansible, so that's what I call it.

Helena

With the similarity between the "Whole Track" and "Akashic records", why hasn't anyone thought maybe they are catching glimpses of past thoughts, forgotten dreams or mental ideas, rather than believe anything you can daydream up was a physical reality? With hubbard, any true data he put forth can be found to have been published previous to his re-description. hubbard didn't get it right, he made things wrong.

 

[TheOriginalBigBlue]

You want a narrative? I'll give you a narrative:

At the beginning of our story, there was nought but the class I NIMAT. And there may have been other things before this, but since none of these things persist to our day, they are not important to our discussion.

The class I NIMAT can make decisions. It can view its surroundings. It can have desires. It can attempt to fulfill those desires. It can feel joy in success and disappointment in failure. These are characteristics of all Nimats, save for the most severly degraded, although as we said, there were no other Nimats in existence at this time.

The class I NIMAT consisted and does consist of pure information. It has no embodiment in material stuff nor is structured upon energy as we know it, but it can create both of those things.

The class I NIMAT can indeed create whole universes at a thought. But those creations do not persist. One look at what it has created and that creation will vanish.

It can not create something and leave it alone for a while, then come back to it like a child comes back to a favorite plaything. For as soon as the class I NIMAT returned to it, it would disappear.

And so it was bored.

And so it was lonely.

But it has one other characteristic---it could create class II NIMATs to keep it company. It would create these by cleaving off some of its own substance, but this would not leave it diminished.

And class II NIMATs have all of the same characteristics as the class I NIMAT, even to the point of being able to create other class II NIMATs.

... and so on, until the entire universe was populated.

Helena

This sounds like a combination of the Great Thetan Theory and The Factors. Is there some special significance to "NIMAT"? I am either not familiar with that or have forgotten it.

I got into Scientology exactly because I believed in reincarnation and if one believes in the spirit by any other name then it begs the question, "Where did they come from and when?". It is a big universe(s) and I've always adhered to the idea that if anything can be conceptualized then it probably has or will exist in reality some place, somewhere, sometime in some manner. I still do believe this but Scientology has taught me that this kind of thinking can lend one to gullibility and to balance such open thinking with common sense.

There must be a beginning for everything. We didn't go from a single cell organism in some pond to what we are without there being something in between. We may not know or be able to prove all the details and time line for that but we do know the transition existed. If its OK for a platypus to be what they are why can't we have come from something like a shrew?

Even if we assume that human evolution was wholly or partially the result of an alien hybridization project, we still have to ask where was the origin for that? How did the aliens that created us evolve? Were they also the result of some other alien's genetic experiment and so on and so forth? Of course this concept is now well entrenched in popular Sci-Fi as we see aliens represented that clearly evolved from other evolutionary lines such as fish, reptiles, etc.

Religions and cults have been based on or capitalized on the belief in past lives and whole track recall since people could first think of it and so has the challenge of sifting the truth from theory. My core beliefs have not changed, but my trust in LRH and Scientology to explain it sure has.

 

[Mimsey Borogrove]

This sounds like a combination of the Great Thetan Theory and The Factors. Is there some special significance to "NIMAT"? I am either not familiar with that or have forgotten it.

I got into Scientology exactly because I believed in reincarnation and if one believes in the spirit by any other name then it begs the question, "Where did they come from and when?". It is a big universe(s) and I've always adhered to the idea that if anything can be conceptualized then it probably has or will exist in reality some place, somewhere, sometime in some manner. I still do believe this but Scientology has taught me that this kind of thinking can lend one to gullibility and to balance such open thinking with common sense.

There must be a beginning for everything. We didn't go from a single cell organism in some pond to what we are without there being something in between. We may not know or be able to prove all the details and time line for that but we do know the transition existed. If its OK for a platypus to be what they are why can't we have come from something like a shrew?

Even if we assume that human evolution was wholly or partially the result of an alien hybridization project, we still have to ask where was the origin for that? How did the aliens that created us evolve? Were they also the result of some other alien's genetic experiment and so on and so forth? Of course this concept is now well entrenched in popular Sci-Fi as we see aliens represented that clearly evolved from other evolutionary lines such as fish, reptiles, etc.

Religions and cults have been based on or capitalized on the belief in past lives and whole track recall since people could first think of it and so has the challenge of sifting the truth from theory. My core beliefs have not changed, but my trust in LRH and Scientology to explain it sure has.

Did you ever read any Robert Monroe? If I recall, his out of body explorations led to meeting higher level beings, who believed a really alien being created the universe we inhabit. That being was so alien - the high level beings couldn't even begin to grok him/her/it. He also goes in to the purpose of this planet, what we spiritual beings are doing here etc. You can get his books on Amazon.

That closely parallels an idea I had - the relationship between man god and bees. I have a bee hive out back, and off and on I go there, check what they are doing, give them a new jar of sugar syrup to encourage them to make comb, so they can lay more eggs etc. I think they know about as much about me as I know about the life of God, or whoever or whatever created this universe.

I just can’t handle the concept that a singularity hatched out of nothing, exploded and Voila – here we are in a nifty universe. Maybe that was how Monroe’s Alien super whatever the heck the Alien uber consciousness created the universe.

Quien sabe?

Mimsey

 

[TheOriginalBigBlue]

Did you ever read any Robert Monroe? If I recall, his out of body explorations led to meeting higher level beings, who believed a really alien being created the universe we inhabit. That being was so alien - the high level beings couldn't even begin to grok him/her/it. He also goes in to the purpose of this planet, what we spiritual beings are doing here etc. You can get his books on Amazon.

That closely parallels an idea I had - the relationship between man god and bees. I have a bee hive out back, and off and on I go there, check what they are doing, give them a new jar of sugar syrup to encourage them to make comb, so they can lay more eggs etc. I think they know about as much about me as I know about the life of God, or whoever or whatever created this universe.

I just can’t handle the concept that a singularity hatched out of nothing, exploded and Voila – here we are in a nifty universe. Maybe that was how Monroe’s Alien super whatever the heck the Alien uber consciousness created the universe.

Quien sabe?

Mimsey

I must admit that I find LRH’s organic concept that the physical universe is the byproduct of a whole lot of thetans shedding particles of mock ups n stuff over a whole lot of time and that it congealed into something with its own set of rules. Its about as plausible as the Big Thetan Theory. And it isn’t difficult to merge the two or variations on the themes.

Personally, I find it presumptuous to assert that I know what actually happened. I find that it is difficult as it is to assert just the existence of the spirit when all I have to go on is my own intuition and the desire that it be so. I’ve yet to remember where I left my most prized keepsakes in another life or to meet someone else who has.

I’m satisfied that other people can be self assured in their beliefs as long as it doesn’t cause harm to anyone else - and there’s the rub.

For lack of a proven understanding of the soul, the next best thing is reason and justice.