The Little Thread Which Grew - the Apollo '73 to Everything But

[RogerB]

Lakey, Heidrun, Try This . . .

Originally Posted by hbeer View Post

There is a whole new brand of technology about this, called "Life Between Lives" (LBL), spreading quickly across the planet.

Its pioneer researcher is Michael Newton. He has written three books about his research, and edited a fourth. His trainees are just about everywhere now.

In his sessions he invariably comes back to the fact that people are planning their upcoming incarnation, sometimes in very fine detail, before they pick up the next body.

Lakey Replied:

Heidrun, this is really a hot button for me! If on a meter, it would fall full dial even with the sensitivy knob set at 1. Our own ESMB member, the erudite "Dull Old Fart" has a thread with many of Newton's taped lecures. I see that Dully has read this thread from time to time but has never posted wth us.

Here is a post I made back in January under the title:
Here's an Ascension Writeup That Might Help Some Folks

This is the link to the original:
http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?p=198701#post198701

I will now slot in the text of it from my original word document to save ya'll darting about . . . .

It is on the subject of knowingly choosing one's next life body and game

I have, errr, so to speak, been there, done that.
____________________________________________

I am moved to write this piece after reading the way the death of John Harvey affected some folks.

Also, it is a follow-up on my earlier post on this thread concerning my statement that I’ve had many ascension experiences as a result of using the tech. I also noted in that earlier posting that one can have ascensions on different subjects and/or areas of existence that have been mussed-up by the case one has accumulated.

This is a write-up on one particular ascension that happened late March-early April 1963, in Sydney, Australia. It was not my first ascension: I’d had a number before this one, also some very much larger ones after it.

For context, and so what I write will be more easily understood and aligned, it is appropriate I point out the following.

I started in Scn in late 1957; did 50 hours SCS (objectives process based on mechanics of control) in 1958, holographically experienced my first past lifetime later that year, did my professional auditor training in April-June 1960, did 200+ straight hours of CCHs in 1961 to phenomenal gains and huge O/Runs, plus delivering lots of stuff to others throughout this time. 1962 was spent dealing with own goals and the “fireworks” processes of listing lines plots of own items. I say this because this, and the ascensions I had doing it, set me up for what happened that (Aussie) autumn of 1963.

I used to swim 5-6 miles a day in training (1953-60), so the idea of going out into the huge surf late one afternoon with an old buddy did not bother me. Particularly since it was on the beach were I’d grown up as the local champion.

I was on a visit back home after having lived in Melbourne for two and a half years. Trouble was, I’d never known what it was like to be out of condition physically. Not having been in the water for a couple of years does that.

That afternoon, the surf was truly huge, and a little vicious as there was a bit of wind still driving it. When my buddy proposed we take a few waves, it was as much bravado that got me going as much as the idea of enjoying a few waves. We were body surfing: not on boards. My mate wore fins, I was just me, no extra gear.

Half way out through the break I began to realize just how out of condition I was. The lactic acid burn in my arms was intense, and my very heavy breathing and the feeling of the inability to supply sufficient oxygen to my system was something I’d not experienced before. Problem was, a very big surf requires a lot of breath holding when you have to go under the waves to get out through the break.

Eventually we got “out the back” where we could catch the waves as they broke, but the problem now was that we’d been swept by the “rip” (a current of out-rushing water to one side of the shallower location where the waves break, which is the outlet of all the water the waves bring in) to the south behind the reef at that end of the beach.

My mate was in better shape than me though. He had fins on his feet, and was able to get out of there and catch a wave. For me, I found the rip more than I could handle in my out-of-condition state. And I was pinned in behind the reef with monster waves beating up on me—and I knew I was in deep s**t. The rip that swung to the south around that reef was more than I could handle. It is to be noted that all the ocean currents on the east coast of Aussie run to the south, just as they do on the west coast USA.

My first response was deep anger that I’d let myself get into such a situation, and also at the fact that I was so out of condition. I was totally pissed at that!

Then the consequences of my situation began to dawn on me, and that moved me down scale into some fear of what could happen. Then interestingly enough, I “lost it.”

The interesting thing, here, is that the drop in mood was totally on automatic. It happened. I did not cause or choose it. It happened in an instant, so fast I did not see it coming; indeed I could not, it was so instantaneous.

What the mood of fear brought on (or brought with it) was a loss of presence and loss of ability to exercise volition, except, that is, to choose to flee from the fear scenario even more so (which I was smart enough not to choose).

That is, when my automatic vacating of presence there in that moment and place occurred, my powers as a spiritual Being also almost vanished. It’s what fear does to a Being (There is a lot more on this phenomenon for a later post.)

One thing I knew from the tech, however, was that one has to “confront what is going on and to view it as-is” if one is going have any semblance of sanity in dealing with it and any chance of handling the scene.

And so, even though I was not in control of the things that were happening, I was able to stay aware of what was occurring and determined to do so.

The next instant awareness I had was that I was detached from the body. I was not in or near it at all, and not perceiving it, not experiencing it. And I realized I had lost control of it, and was losing control of the situation as my mood continued to run on its automatic crash which continued till I was aware of and experiencing the enormous failure to have handled the whole situation. I was completely in a mood of failure concerning handling my body, the surf, the environment, the game, et al. And being pounded by huge waves didn’t help

And I recognized death. It was the experience of thus giving up on the game, the leaving of the (area of) failure, and the need to get free of it. I actually concluded/considered the body was lost, irretrievable.

As I drifted away I remembered Hubbard’s data from some tapes and such, about “in between-lifetime implants,” and his and others’ tales about the “light.”

As I drifted free form the scene, I became slightly aware of “the light” a little, but determined to not get interested in it or “go to it”; for I reasoned it likely had something to do with what triggers the “return mechanisms” Hubbard referred to. (That was my think then. I have a different view of it now.)

What was fascinating about this point in the event, is that I had retained all of my knowledge and training acquired this lifetime and was fully aware of it and of choosing to apply it.

I decided to stick close to the planet and to get myself familiar with operating in this spiritual condition, free from the body. This switched on my spiritual perception of the physical environment . . . I found myself looking at the several local beaches at that part of Sydney as though from an airplane above. This switch-on of perception was also as though automatic. It was not something I knowingly determined, like: “now I’m going to open my spiritual eyes and see!” It simply seemed as though my determination to act triggered or restored the abilities required.

The interesting thing at this stage of the event was that I was totally in the “Wow!” of the now. I was totally only aware of the present. I had no notion of future or any address to it.

Next, I realized I had to determine my next actions in the game of my overall existence, and I had to now look to my next game.

Then a change occurred. It was again instantaneous, and brought on (about) by my having decided on having a future. That deciding on having a future (of course I now know there is a basic on the long, long chain of that which kicked in) gave me a dimension across which I could then deploy my awareness and presence and thus have something to direct my attention and intention towards.

The key to this was that I had my awareness under my control, and as I began again to focus it, my presence came back under my control. I was now directing my powers of awareness and presence, not the environment or my “case”.

All the above, from anger through fear, failure, death and to determining I wanted a future was probably only an instant. No way to know (wasn’t wearing a watch, and probably wouldn’t have thought to time the incident!)

My next spiritual action (thought) in the sequence was the determining of what I wanted to do as and in my future. And the conclusion was that I wanted to get back into the game in a body in a scientologist family, for they had the tech and the knowledge of how best to bring up a child

Then, almost on automatic, but not really so as I knew what I had to do, I reached to know where that family was. I knew there was a Scn family in Brisbane and of course an army of them in Melbourne. There were none to connect with in Sydney.

Then, suddenly, spiritually, I was aware of the entire east coast of Australia. I was spanning the 1,000 miles from Brisbane to Melbourne and seeing if just like we are now familiar with as a result of satellite photos. And from this spanning position over those 1,000 miles I was reaching to perceive who was in the baby making business among the scientologists in those cities.

Only one couple resonated: Roger and Helen Meadmore in Melbourne.

I’d met Roger very briefly a few years before, but had never met Helen. Though she had nice vibes to the spiritual touch

As I reached to know more, I began to know their baby was going to be born in mid-September that year (1963). And I thought, “That’s it. That’s the family. I’ll pick up their baby.” And as I got closer to perceiving it all, I suddenly discovered it was going to be a girl!

Oh, Oh! Now I don’t want to offend any of the ladies on this board, but 1963 was about fourty years before they let women run the marathon in the Olympics In those days, all the girls did was sit on the beach while the boys had all the fun cracking the waves! And none played rugby like we boys could.

So, being a girl is something I did not want to be. No sir! Besides, so far, I am of the conclusion it does not suit my temperament.

In any event, it was a bit of a shock that it was a girl’s body I was nearly picking up.

So, suddenly becoming sober, I instantly thought, “What the hell am I doing? This is nuts. Get back in your body and see if you can rescue it!”

Now my awareness was with me under my control, able to be focused, not dispersed and not on an avoidance of unwanted experiences. I was able to be present and able to direct my attention and intention toward what I wanted and determined to do. I had spiritual power again.

I got back in/with my body, coughed a little water out of its lungs, got it in control of staying on the surface; and then began to compute on how the hell to get out “here” —this mess I was in.

There were only two options. One was a seven mile swim south to a safe bay named Thompson’s Bay (I was at Bronte Beach) where I could get ashore. Between me and there was seven miles of cliffs and reef lined coast. The other option was to attempt to use the huge waves to give me a lift up onto the reef I was trapped behind, and once up, to run like hell before the next wave hit.

Option two worked. I won’t bore you with the details, except to say I cut my big toe on a barnacle.

Many years later, probably 1981 or 2, at FSO when I was doing NOTs etc., etc., (we had lots of etceteras to do in those days) I was sitting in the sun by the pool, and this lady was walking toward me with whom there appeared to be some sort of familiar feeling. I did not recognize her, but we both caught each others’ attention.

“Hello, do we know each other?” we both seemed to say together.

“Helen Trachsel (spelling may be off; but that’s the phonetics), from Melbourne,” she said.

“No, I don’t remember that name.” said I.

“Well, you might remember me as Helen Meadmore. That was my former married name.”

My God! I thought.

“Helen, did you have a daughter in September, 1963 in Melbourne?”

“Yes, Samantha (or maybe Kathy, my memory is a little rusty after 25+ years)”

Well I told her the story above nearly picking up as her daughter. We had a good giggle together, and she promised to tell her daughter when she got back home.

Any of you folks in Melbourne who might know Helen (either as Meadmore or as Tracshel) give her a shout for me and tell her, Roger who nearly became Kathy/Samantha, says Hi!

There is a lot more I could say on all this, but we are already a little long.

The key message here is that we can and do stay spiritually connected to those who we care about and are dear to us. One can directly communicate with them, which is a subject I’ll deal with on another post.

It is also true that one can be fixed in ones connections with others with whom one is locked in combat or hatred . . . and that is not a pretty scene, so end all that shit while you have the chance

My lessons learned in this exercise is that one’s awareness is a basic and critical element of one’s powers and attributes. Directing it by choice is an act of volition as long as one is in control of one’s “faculties”; when one directs one’s awareness it focuses one’s attention at or on the thing, place or location in time or within one’s domain of existence and one is then knowingly present with/to that thing or location and can further exhibit power and exercise one’s potential. (‘Nuff said)

I did not get to grips with all that had happened all those many years ago for a long time. When I first studied Alan’s tech, it also used to be called “Ascensionism,” I began to get a glimpse of what I had really gone through. Based on Scn tech, it was an “incident,” that contained a lot of crap and one I managed to overcome.

When I viewed it from the perspective of Alan’s Knowledgism, I found I’d recovered some colossally, positive awareness, powers, abilities, and knowledge. Knowledgism tech enables one to address these positives and to make more of them and to more fully own and restore them to their proper level of availability and capacity. I don’t know of any other tech that addresses this specific need.

Roger

The present body I work with was knowingly chosen by me in 1935-6. It was selected from three I had focused on . . . but April 1936 made Sydney Australia and the parents of this body the optimum choice out of Marseille, France or a logging camp in the Pacific NW, USA. It was a wonderfully wise choice: my parents were wonderful and growing up in Sydney on the beaches (Bondi and Bronte) was the best possible for me.

Rog

 

[Blue Spirit]

Lakey,
one thing I have observed is that we quickly forget how painful the charge was, once it is handled and gone. I have deliberately made a few copies of conditions in order to never forget the immense positive changes that auditing has provided to me.

Like the sharp terrible sadness in which I was sitting before I ran the separation from static in my first chain of ARC-breaks. Or the deep feeling of guilt I kept having before I as-ised my role in the OT3 scenario. Or the embarrassment I used to perceive, without understanding it, while I had a "tractor beam" pulling at people running on automatic without knowing what I was doing.

Or the massy feeling in my body before NOTs. Or the "hooked" beam that was used on me by a guy who had a habit of letting women work for him, and that I dissolved by using a piece of L12 in a solo session. Or the 40 years of pain before my most recent auditing first revealed and then removed its roots in my last life.

I also made a copy of the engram I ran remotely with NOTs, which brought my child son's high fever down within an hour. And another one of the remarkable incident I ran of a tiny little plant that was starving in a drought, whose image had blown up to full body size, attached itself to my spine, and caused me to stand and walk bent forward with a feeling of collapsing for over 40 years of this life.

No hoax could have handled these things. When they were gone, I had to re-create them and specifically commit them to memory, in order to be certain that I would not start to believe the tech to be invalid, simply because all these things had gone without leaving any traces. It's sooooo easy to forget!

I am now auditing a Class VIII auditor who used to crack cases at Flag left and right. With so much of LRH tech having gone out of use and wrongly set priorities in C/Sing, they never cracked his own case. It's a shame - the most productive and brilliant people got so neglected.

But the tech is still there. It just needs to be APPLIED. We are piloting a version of auditing on the phone that takes the barriers of plane tickets and the need for weeks of vacation out of the picture. We just put on the headphones, start Skype and say "This is the session". It can be done, it IS being done - the tech is for use!
.

A belated Welcome to you !

I find your post most exciting, and UNLIKE many on this board who were failed by the tech (or visa-versa)

totally believable.


Please keep me / us informed on the Skype project.

 

[Blue Spirit]

Married ?

Well, that does it! It's kismet! You guys have GOT to become friends, now! Birthday twins! Pretty cool.

Is Lakey married ?

Is hbeer married ?

 

[hbeer]

Funny

Is Lakey married ?

Is hbeer married ?

You're funny really :

I divorced two guys after 9 years each. Then a sweet angel came to Austria from Canada, Paul Smith, http://www.sgmt.at/Paul/LifeInAustria.htm .

I lost him after 9 years (never, never would I have divorced HIM).

It was his fixed idea that all my marriages last 9 years. What can I say to that postulate??? He proved it! Does anyone want to prove it wrong?

In my understanding, I'm between marriages. A flash answer to the question how old I would get was "87 years". So I may want to wait until I'm 78, because I really don't want to lose another dear love. I'm 55 now.

On the other hand, the recent auditing has made me stronger and more adventurous. I have seen so many of my own deaths that death has "lost its sting", as the Bible says. But what I really want to do is to learn to go out of body and meet "my people" wherever they go when body-less.

Another point is that the air is really thin where I am operating. I spent nearly a year with online dating and my insight was that the chances to win the lotto are better than the chances to meet another crazy workaholic who is as much into saving the world as I am.

So I'll stick to raking in money, teaching my teenage sons household skills and translating the Clearbird materials for now

 

[hbeer]

Skype Auditing

A belated Welcome to you !

I find your post most exciting, and unlike many on this board who were failed by the tech (or visa-versa) totally believable.


Please keep me / us informed on the Skype project.

Thanks for the welcome and the positive feedback!

The Skype project is pretty well established by now. We do it with or without a web cam, and either with remote metering, or with pre-metering auditing styles (the same that LRH used before the first meter was conceived).

For a long time I thought that Robert Ducharme was the person who piloted remote metering (the auditor holds solo cans and gets the reads of the PC). Then to my total amazement a post of Alan C. Walter surfaced, who used remote metering on a routine basis for many years when debugging his many mission holders.

This after extensive tests that established that a PC on the meter and his auditor holding solo cans invariably had the same reads.

I had enormous wins as a PC with that phone auditing, and my PCs are happy as well



.

 

[hbeer]

The present body I work with was knowingly chosen by me in 1935-6. It was selected from three I had focused on . . . but April 1936 made Sydney Australia and the parents of this body the optimum choice out of Marseille, France or a logging camp in the Pacific NW, USA. It was a wonderfully wise choice: my parents were wonderful and growing up in Sydney on the beaches (Bondi and Bronte) was the best possible for me.

What an incredibly fascinating story!!

I don't dare to tell my own story of how I did NOT choose this life's body and circumstances. It's the most stupid thing I remember NOT doing... can only be excused with the shock and trauma of a suddenly dead WWII soldier.



.

 

[SweetnessandLight]

On Being Big!

Zinji, thanks for sharing that point about statistics. It helps to make me feel more connected to humanity. I have enountered more than a handful of birthday twins so far in my life. I've always liked them and had a special feeling of closeness with them when we've met in real life. It's kinda fun! Lakey, I'm glad you finally met one on the hoof, so to speak, instead of just in the history books! Having said that, I just want to go on record that I am absolutely a believer in KISMET, having lots of reality on it myself! But I love science, too!

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Lakey wrote: "I seemed to have something going on, which I named my "Sentinel", I am hearing talk radio while I ride around, I like the Denis Prager Show; I get a stimulus from the Sentineel to switch to the Classical station and do so and a favorite piece by Mozart or Haydn is just starting to play, or the Sentinel says to switch to Oldies radio and I do and Van Morrison's "Pretty Brown Eyed Girl" which I love is just starting or the song "Lean on Me" which I love or one of my favoites from Elvis or the Beatles, such as "Imagine". My success rate on this is at least 3 out of 4, which is too high to be just be chance.

Then of course the phenomena when things are just going so good and everything is going out the roof and one is totally blown out. Soon, some bummer of a thing comes your way to pour rain on your party. You get it handled but then another bummer comes and finally a third. After you handle the third one, that seems to be it. The thing is that handling the three bad pieces of news usually brings one done to their normal hum drum state and the euphoria which existed before the 3 unpleasant occurances is now gone. The euphoria will build up again and the cycle will repeat.

HAVE YOU OR ANYONE ELSE EXPERIENCED THIS AS I HAVE. It is almost as if there is something in your mind directing you to live through and handle unpleasant circumstances and it is seeing to it that you will not remain euphoric for long. I mention all this because it seems to tie in with these new technologies which you are describing."
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I just want to say that the looking for patterns of things in threes or other sets of sacred numbers (fours, fives, sevens, etc. depending on cultures) seems to be a universal human cultural phenomena hardwired into our brains by evolution and/or intelligent design as part of pattern recognition, possibly to help us recognize, remember and differentiate between harmful or helpful things in our environment, to aide our collective survival as a group. (Don't eat those berries, eat these berries!)

Yes, Lakey, I've experienced what you call having a Sentinal my whole life, as have all of my immediate family members. It does seem to come in flows, and wax and wane a bit like waves. Some peaks and valleys, but it's constantly there for me if I will just listen to it. I have gotten better and better at getting my ego and intellect out of the way and trusting it's guidance and direction as I have grown. Have also learned some bitterly painful lessons by not listening to it and ignoring or over-riding the guidance I have sometimes gotten through it. It literally has saved me from harm and guided me to great blessings many times in life, and I'm able to rely on it when helping others as well.

I've always called it "my little voice", but I know what you mean by calling it The Sentinal. Exploring the what and who of it has been a whole lotta fun, through other practices. I wrote a long post replying to this following your first posting, it was one of those I lost due to computer shut down. I won't recreate it here and now, but we will talk more about this later.

I do see and hear it as me, an aspect of myself, in constant contact with "my team", my higher power, the ancestors, beneficent forces, angels, spiritu guides, etc., whatever anyone wants to call it. Human concepts and language are totally inadequate to try and convey or catagorize it. Spiritually awake and aware people have reality on it and personal experience with it, and others tend to think we are a little looney. But our tribe recognizes each other and are drawn to our own kind. Being in comm with each other encourages, teaches and supports us, whether via words, deeds, or theta flows!

Heidrun has her own unique experiences and perspectives on the tech and everything else in life to share with us and to contribute to the ongoing conversation of this thread, I get the sense that she is following her own pathways as she sees clearly what is best for her, and I trust that she can hold her own with the very great diversity of opinion regarding the tech here and elsewhere. You have not spent much time in the Freezone yet, but there are as many camps and divisions of opinions there about the tech as there are on this board! We are all of us, collectively, all over the map on this.

The key for me is, do we communicate with love and respect for one another?
That measures who I allow to impinge on me or not.

To Roger's lovely post I would just add this, that he was responding to thoughts and considerations that you posted Lakey. Can you see how you are an important part of this interaction, calling it forth and creating the venue for the sharing of his insights on this subject?

Can you see how your ability to create has helped to co-create this? There is not that much seperation between us all, as we are dancing together towards more light.

In the short time that we have been friends and in comm I can clearly see you claiming so much more of your own personal Spiritual Power in this way, and playing a bigger game. When you do that, you attract "bigger" playmates! Playing with them, in turn, helps you to grow and accept more of your own "biggness" yourself. It's an ever increasing spiral dance of energy and intention that blesses all who play.

Do you understand more why I perceive us all more as equals? To put it in Roger's terminology, as all being players in this particular game together in this point in time, just holding different positions in space and having different viewpoints, based on our relative locations on the playing field?

Why I'm not so into heirarchy or patriarchical systems, of knowledge, religion, business or government.

I don't perceive it as arrogance, just as another world view.

This is why someone's class or status in training up to a certain level on the bridge holds very little importance or meaning for me, although I appreciate the value of the money and time and effort that they put in to "going up the bridge". But what I care about and value in them is this: what is the quality of their beingness? How does it make you feel to be in their presence, via words or thought or in the material world? How much does being in comm with them or influenced by them increase your havingness and your ability to assist others to create more? What kinds of effects with people are they leaving in their wake as they progress through life and various situations? Are they really making the world a better place or not by their presence here?

Roger is a Golden child, not because of his training or experience or contacts or material resources or influence, but because of his essential self awareness as a Spiritual being, and his ability to see others in the same light. To be bigger himself, and to help encourage others to be bigger. That's the funnest game I know.

Some of us are playing this game, many are not. Does this help to explain my attitude of perceiving us who are playing similar games as being more equals than not?

You Lakey, are Golden too. I understand that you haven't always seen yourself in this way. Athough you and Rog are two different individuals, I would say the only difference that I see between you in this respect is that Roger lets his light shine more often, and more strongly, and that you are letting your light shine more and more all the time. I see it, and I know others do too, and I want to encourage you to keep going...keep writing, thinking, talking these things over. You're on the right path in doing so. More power to you!

I see many of us here, and those who have gone before us, as being various shades of "Golden", and reflecting more of our inner light out into the world. I don't think we are the source of that light, but we are an essential part of it, it comes through us and we transmit it to a better or worse degree, as a clear or muddy window pane would allow light to pass through it to illuminate a room, to a greater or lessor degree. This is the real meaning that "clear" has for me, similar to but different from the Scientological meaning of being freed from your reactive mind. Being a clear transparency for Spirit to shine forth from, or through.

Some of us have a sense of growing into this awareness of our essential selves (boy, have I changed and grown, I really am evolving, I'm not at all the person I used to be!), and others of us have always seemingly had this sense of self confidence in who and what we were, and our purpose in life in place (gee, I really haven't changed all that much, except in the outward form. My essential personality and nature, my beingness, has always been there to my awareness, I'm still the same person I've always been). I fall into this second group, and I know others have shared that they feel much the same. I don't know why some of us have to learn about our nature as spiritual beings, and others just know it intuitively and are pretty self-aware and self-confident about it. Maybe it's whether or not we have reality on it from an early (human lifetime speaking) age, or not.

I think my big cog about someone's "being an old soul" is that is has much to do not just with self-knowledge, but with confidence, self-empowerment, and certainty. It's that SPIRITUAL CERTAINTY that Tone 40 training is all about, often missing the mark, especially in recent years it would seem, with what has degenerated into a lot of screaming, shouting and physical abuse by Corporate Scientology management over the years. Which illustrates the problem that a person could feel totally self confident and also be really mentally ill and in need of help. I think many here have seen that played out before their eyes, and a minority here have experienced it personally. It is always possible to heal this, in yourself and others, and to learn how to use Power with a big "P" (real Spiritual Power), and not power with a little "p" (force over others) in creating an effect in the world.

This is what I see mainly divides the sheep and the goats among Scientologists, (and Ex's still practicing the tech to any degree...) to put it in Biblical terms:

Some are training hard to go up the bridge, and feel that they must have the assistance of an outside party to help them "handle their case" or overcome their problems. They are always searching for that next magical process that will work, a better list, a better meter, a better group, or a better auditor to help them "advance", etc.

Others are self aware and self confident enough in their own nature as a Spiritual Being that when they enounter the same kinds of problems or life difficulties that we all do, they just create a bigger game for themselves, and it blows. (To use Roger's and Lakey's terminologies on this.) They are persistant and keep going, no matter what, and they mostly win in life, and often win big, depending on their goals!

I don't really believe in "case", as such, although I see how it is a useful and helpful concept for some people. But some Scientologists are in charge of their own case, so to speak, they are the managers of it utilizing their internal Power (Spiritually) to guide them as they learn and progress through life, while others are being managed by their case, their whole lives' pursuit is in "solving" their case, always looking outside of themselves to an outside power or authority to do so.

I'm with Roger, I say persist, no matter what, create a bigger game, and have fun doing it! You will succeed!

Lakey, you are creating something wonderful here and IN YOUR LIFE! I want to acknowledge you for that!

 

[Blue Spirit]

Your Own Thread

Thanks for the welcome and the positive feedback!

The Skype project is pretty well established by now. We do it with or without a web cam, and either with remote metering, or with pre-metering auditing styles (the same that LRH used before the first meter was conceived).

For a long time I thought that Robert Ducharme was the person who piloted remote metering (the auditor holds solo cans and gets the reads of the PC). Then to my total amazement a post of Alan C. Walter surfaced, who used remote metering on a routine basis for many years when debugging his many mission holders.

This after extensive tests that established that a PC on the meter and his auditor holding solo cans invariably had the same reads.

I had enormous wins as a PC with that phone auditing, and my PCs are happy as well
.

First, I used the wrong word in my post, which was corrected, but I can't correct it in yours, so would you, please ?
"like" should be "UNLIKE", as I still believe in the tech and am getting wins.

Second, since you have so much to contribute may I suggest starting your

own thread on these OT subjects of which you have eclectic awareness

and training. Perhaps starting with selected posts from this thread to be

moved by a Moderator.

Thank you for considering this.

 

[SweetnessandLight]

I love the barnacles dropping off!

A year or so ago, I had the pleasure of enjoying a beer with Rog and V at a nice little neighborhood bar and restaurant...V left us boys alone to go attend to some errand and the two of us visited and admired the very shapely young girl tending bar. She was certainly worthy of our attention and was a delight to be with too. Certainly she found the two of us a bit out of the ordinary perhaps - but I think it fair to say that she liked us a fair bit.

I am just going to quote a caption found under a favorite cartoon of mine by a guy named George Booth whose work was often to be found in "The New Yorker" magazine and around.

"Before the break is over, I'n going to introduce you to our first violinist, Mrs. Ritterhouse. After one has a good long talk with Mrs. Ritterhouse, all the barnacles let loose and fall of and one sits higher in the water. Here, have another watercress sandwich."

That's kinda the way just havin' a beer with Rog is. :wink2:

EP
Mike Horton

Mike, I love you! That is so very clear for those of us who have not yet had the benefit in real life of bending the elbow with Rog (or gone sailing with him.......still part of my game plan! V is welcome to come help crew!).

EeePee, in your own down-home friendly, comfortable way, you are every bit as Golden as any of us here! And what's wonderful, YOU KNOW IT!

 

[hbeer]

Be Prepared

I know that I have been helped through having LRH tech applied to me! Even a person such as me has had their certainty shaken by some of the excellent arguments I have heard from serious people from the opposite camp to Heidren's camp. It is from Class VIII types such as you, and Diana, Class VIII and other people with good backgrounds as auditors and tech people in the Church such as Dart, Roger B., Carmelo and Purple Haze that I have kept my perspective alive that much of LRH tech can work if only it is applied accurately and with care.


Just a note - I am not a Class VIII - in fact I'll have to do quite a bit of work to get my certificates in order. In the church I trained only up to NED, everything else (up to NOTs) I did outside the church.

But yes, the tech does work! At least it is a workable toolbox. If it is used on people who have to prove that it doesn't work (or they would be wrong), well their rightness is more important to them than any case gains.


[...]

I was shocked and asked how could you take her out of Valentine's if they resolved her problem and they said, "Our family Specialist strongly advised us against Chiropractic and said it was a scam" Incredulously. I said, "but Valentine got rid of her problem, how could you discontinue their treatment?" and they said, "Oh, the specialist told us that these problems were cyclical and often show a relapse for a short time and then came back even stronger.


Well, that could happen. Or not. The point is that the exact WHY will solve the situation, and anything else will not. It often takes several attempts before the correct WHY is found. To rule out any possibility before it has been checked would be pure stupidity.

This comes from my computer training as well as SCN training. Bias and preconceived opinions are unprofessional.

Another thing is that the correct WHY can sit on different levels of what I call the "scale of solidity" (a term recently coined by me for an Ivy article). If it is mental, a medical approach won't fix it. And vice versa. Of course it also can be a combination of both.


DOUBLE BLIND TESTS WITH PLACEBOS - Heidrun, the university educated detractors of Scientology consider stories such as I told above as anectdotal and demand Double Blind tests from Scientology using placebos. They think that Scientology itself is a placebo and that one pays a lot of money as is assured by a large group of people whom they like and respect that certain results will be attained. They claim that the gains obtained such as the ones which you have recorded are all anectdotal and they demand Double Blind Testing where one group gets placebos such as sugar pills while another trial group would get Scientology auditing. Years have to go by with the results being tabulated by the medical community and certified medical specialists have to publish their research results in recognized journals. Only then would Scientology truly be proved to work.


Well, if they provide the test devices, why not? I bet it would be possible to document the changes before and after a session, for instance with Kirlian photography (which makes a person's aura visible).

But isn't the proof in the pudding? If a person turns from insane to sane, or from sick to healthy, how much more proof do they need?

They are willing to take you on, so just be forewarned, if you pursue your beliefs on ESMG, many will fight them, some respectfully and with logic and sum degrader types with rants and foul language. Be prepared!

Lakey

Not a problem really. I have spent so much time on ARS (the newsgroup alt.religion.scientology) that I am completely flat on such attacks.

I believe I was the first FZ Scientologist whom the critics there respected, and who got the Freezone viewpoint across to them. Actually I went Freezone while I was already posting there. They even respected me as a church Scientologist! I simply used the "Manners" policy - a good comm cycle, and granting importance. And I had a bit of humor. That surprised them

A little anecdote: long before my late husband Paul ever contacted me, he had followed my "Clear Baby" posts on ARS. Around that time, I perceived a vibration of caring in my lonely environment that I couldn't explain. I was so much longing to connect to the source of it. Then when we were together, I recognized it in him - and he told me that yes, he had admired my ARS posts for a long time, and as he was quite able spiritually, it seems that he had been with me to some extent long before his body followed!



.

 

[lkwdblds]

Roger does it again!

Great Story about the near death experience Rog. Sort of a combination of good LRH and good Jack London, set in 1963 down under in Oz. I've never been to Oz, often thought it would be a fascinating place to visit. I read about the City of Alice Springs, a little town of of 20,000 to 25,000, about the only thing bigger than a few hundred people in the inland portion of Oz, half way between the various coasts. I pictured it something like Barstow in the California desert, 1/2 way between L.A.and Las Vegas. When you are far from civilization, a city of 25,000 seems like a metropolis. About 12 years ago, an acquaintance was going to Oz and mentioned her itinerary passed through Alice Springs and I made her promise to send me some photos of the town. She complied and I have an accordian shaped affair of connected post card pictures, about 9 pictures in all, of Alice Springs.

I know 0z is huge with land but small in population, 23,000,000 people, only about 60% of what California has and yet you guys have such a huge presence in Scientology plus some of the international sporting and boating venues. Is it a land of Big Beings or what?

I read your entire story and enjoyed it immensely and got a lot out of it.
Lakey

 

[hbeer]

First, I used the wrong word in my post, which was corrected, but I can't correct it in yours, so would you, please ?
"like" should be "UNLIKE", as I still believe in the tech and am getting wins.

Done!

Second, since you have so much to contribute may I suggest starting your

own thread on these OT subjects of which you have eclectic awareness

and training. Perhaps starting with selected posts from this thread to be

moved by a Moderator.

Thank you for considering this.

Hmmm... I have to learn the forum better first. A little every day. But thank you for the idea.

Do you really think I should? I wouldn't know where to start. So far I was only reacting to cues. Would it not be seen as a counter intention to the board's main direction?


.

 

[lkwdblds]

What are you a matchmaker?

Is Lakey married ?

Is hbeer married ?

Blue - There is a Yiddish name for matchmaker. It is called a "shadchen". I always heard it prounounced as shot kin so I Googled it. It sounds like someone who rode shot gun on the old 1800's stage coaches.

I've been married for 28 1/2 years and we are separated. We have agreed to dissolve the marriage and it should be dissolved by next month. We live together for economic reasons and we are best pals and friends and close confidants. We have a lot of equity tied up in our home and don't want to sell with the pricess down about 1/3 from 2 years ago. We go out for dinner about once a week and have company over, such as cousins all non Scientologists, and no one knows we are breaking up. Our kids are 22 and 27 now but we have no grandchildren. We both love the kids equally. I married above my pay grade just like you, Blue, she stuck it out with me until the kids were raised and then unlike your beautiful wife, she wanted more romance than I was able to give her. She's 13 1/2 years younger than me and still beautiful but the old magic was not there anymore for me. I told her to start dating, said I still love her but more like a friend and a confidant and not a lover, you know a brother and sIster type of love. As far as another 2D, I can take it or leave it. I can still perform the act well but it would have to really be somebody special to make me want to start a new serious 2D. Now dating and having fun, yes that would be tremendously exciting but all shadchens keep your distance from me.

Heidrun and me are like sould mates, same birthday, she's from Austria and I have track there, in the 18th and early 19th centuries and I love to speak German, we both love opera. Our approaches to Scientology are very similar. She has taken the time to read every page on my damn thread, every time I log in, she is on line reading and posting. Had I met her 35 years earlier, yes, it sounds like a perfect match for marriage, raising a family and all that but for now, just good friends, close friends, confidants, perhaps working together on a project, discussing books we've read, movies we've seen and all that type of stuff but no shadchens please.
Lakey

 

[SweetnessandLight]

A wonderful Partner!

Not a problem really. I have spent so much time on ARS (the newsgroup alt.religion.scientology) that I am completely flat on such attacks.

I believe I was the first FZ Scientologist whom the critics there respected, and who got the Freezone viewpoint across to them. Actually I went Freezone while I was already posting there. They even respected me as a church Scientologist! I simply used the "Manners" policy - a good comm cycle, and granting importance. And I had a bit of humor. That surprised them

[Sweetness says see, I told ya so ! ]

A little anecdote: long before my late husband Paul ever contacted me, he had followed my "Clear Baby" posts on ARS. Around that time, I perceived a vibration of caring in my lonely environment that I couldn't explain. I was so much longing to connect to the source of it. Then when we were together, I recognized it in him - and he told me that yes, he had admired my ARS posts for a long time, and as he was quite able spiritually, it seems that he had been with me to some extent long before his body followed!
.

Heidrun, thank you for your openess in sharing your and Paul's story of a wonderful marriage, I was very touched by it! I do think that Soulmates can find each other across seeming distances of space and time, if they allow themselves to do so! Paul seems like such a lovely being and I feel that I got to know him well through your website on him. I am sincerely sorry that he was not able to stay with you physically longer, but I know he did his best. My sense is that he lived much longer with you in his life, and clearly had more happiness, than he would have without you. That he loved you completely clearly shines forth in his pictures, and is palpable still! Love never dies. I love the pictures of him and the cats!

My take on the nine year thing is this...not so much that he postulated that was all the time that he would have, but that he postulated that he would have that much time with you, his body was already struggling with many serious problems when you met and married.

If he had not had the courage to follow up on his attraction to you, including moving to a foreign country and becoming an instant Father to four, think of how much joy and happiness you both would have missed out on! Happiness helps us to overcome our physical limitations. He might not have lived nearly as long as he did, if he had given in to fear or self-defeating thoughts about going for happiness with you! I think also that he, even while struggling with such serious physical health issues, having such a good sense of humor, lasted nine years because he did not want to be bested by either of your previous husbands! I see him as a Big Being and a real winner at what really matters in life!

Thank you again for sharing your story together here.

 

[SweetnessandLight]

Getting started

Hmmm... I have to learn the forum better first. A little every day. But thank you for the idea.

Do you really think I should? I wouldn't know where to start. So far I was only reacting to cues. Would it not be seen as a counter intention to the board's main direction?
.

Heidrun, by all means, search and read threads. You don't have to make this like a work project, you can just look around and have fun. You will find that there are some which are quite Freezone friendly, and OT powers talk friendly, as well as ones with jokes and stories and cooking recipes, and pet pictures, not at all serious, but fun. Others are very earnest about activism, etc. Some are just rants, to blow off steam (and charge!). Everything under the sun.

I feel confident that you have much to contribute, but take your time and get to understand the culture of the ESMBers a little more, get familiar and feel comfortable. Then start your own thread(s).

You have kind of jumped in to the deep end of the pool here by starting with this thread, feel free to wade around and get comfortable elsewhere, too.

If you are talking about the tech, or auditing outside of Corporate Scientology, there are sections here for that where you can begin a new thread on a subject or technique. You can also introduce yourself in the new member section first, which might makes things a little easier. I think it is against the rules for you to advertise a product or service, but you can put a link to your website, many do that. It will not be showing any counter intention to the purpose of the board, which is just to provide a safe space for Ex's, Freezoners and Critics to meet and talk with one another.

I'm very glad you joined us here!

Blue, don't push the river! Just trust in the Universe, and let it flow!

 

[lkwdblds]

Lakey Hostess ?!

Heidrun, by all means, search and read threads. You will find that there are some which are quite Freezone friendly, and OT powers talk friendly, as well as ones with jokes and stories and cooking recipes, and pet pictures, not at all serious, but fun. Others are very ernest about activism, etc. Some are just rants, to blow off steam (and charge!). Everything under the sun.

I feel confident that you have much to contribute, but take your time and get to understand the culture of the ESMBers a little more, get familiar and feel comfortable. Then start your own thread(s).

You have kind of jumped in to the deep end of the pool here by starting with this thread, feel free to wade around and get comfortable elsewhere, too.

If you are talking about the tech, or auditing outside of Corporate Scientology, there are sections here for that where you can begin a new thread on a subject or technique. You can also introduce yourself in the new member section first, which might makes things a little easier. I think it is against the rules for you to advertise a product or service, but you can put a link to your website, many do that. It will not be showing any counter intention to the purpose of the board, which is just to provide a safe space for Ex's, Freezoners and Critics to meet and talk with one another.

I'm very glad you joined us here!

Blue, don't push the river! Just trust in the Universe, and let it flow!

Sweet - I just wanted to than you for teaching Heidrun the ropes and wearing the hat of host here. I think you gave her good advice, first the new member section and then links to her website and then start her own threads.

Heidrun - I think you should follow S & L's advice. Meanwhile, you are more than welcome to post your stuff here as long as you like. It hleps increase my viewership as well. You have so much to say that is worthwhile that there will soon come a time when you want to host your own threads.
Lakey

 

[SweetnessandLight]

Lakey's Thread Wins Again!

Blue - There is a Yiddish name for matchmaker. It is called a "shadchen". I always heard it prounounced as shot kin so I Googled it. It sounds like someone who rode shot gun on the old 1800's stage coaches.

I've been married for 28 1/2 years and we are separated. We have agreed to dissolve the marriage and it should be dissolved by next month. We live together for economic reasons and we are best pals and friends and close confidants. We have a lot of equity tied up in our home and don't want to sell with the pricess down about 1/3 from 2 years ago. We go out for dinner about once a week and have company over, such as cousins all non Scientologists, and no one knows we are breaking up. Our kids are 22 and 27 now but we have no grandchildren. We both love the kids equally. I married above my pay grade just like you, Blue, she stuck it out with me until the kids were raised and then unlike your beautiful wife, she wanted more romance than I was able to give her. She's 13 1/2 years younger than me and still beautiful but the old magic was not there anymore for me. I told her to start dating, said I still love her but more like a friend and a confidant and not a lover, you know a brother and sIster type of love. As far as another 2D, I can take it or leave it. I can still perform the act well but it would have to really be somebody special to make me want to start a new serious 2D. Now dating and having fun, yes that would be tremendously exciting but all shadchens keep your distance from me.

Heidrun and me are like sould mates, same birthday, she's from Austria and I have track there, in the 18th and early 19th centuries and I love to speak German, we both love opera. Our approaches to Scientology are very similar. She has taken the time to read every page on my damn thread, every time I log in, she is on line reading and posting. Had I met her 35 years earlier, yes, it sounds like a perfect match for marriage, raising a family and all that but for now, just good friends, close friends, confidants, perhaps working together on a project, discussing books we've read, movies we've seen and all that type of stuff but no shadchens please.
Lakey

LOL Lakey! Who knew that at this point in life you would have a Yenta nudging you! Just kidding, no offense meant... to Blue or anyone. I don't think he's really channelling his inner shadchen... Don't get defensive on us now! Nobody's bossing you around! I can see why Blue would ask the obvious question, because of all the commonalities and affinity between you, it's always exciting for us when our friends meet other friends with so much in common. I have a feeling that Blue is secretly a real Romantic under that hardshelled tough-guy exterior! After all, look at the shining goddess that is his dear wife! That ought to give you some hope for the future!

Lakey, you are right, you are in the space of adjusting to being single again and need time to date and have some fun before getting involved in any serious commitment. But isn't it nice to know that your thread and your writing and beingness attracted such a nice and interesting woman to it? As you said, she is reading the whole thread!!! Most would not take the time or trouble to do so, even if they liked us and wanted to get in the pool and play with us. Remember when BlueWigGirl entered the God thread by yelling, "What's goin on, What's this thread all about?! Sorta broke up the energy and momentum for a time, didn't it? Heidrun fits right in with our little cadre on this thread, so it's all good. We just accept her into the fold as one of us.

And I've got to say this, do you have any idea how many of my friends would give their eye teeth for this kind of companionship, even in a close friend?: "Had I met her 35 years earlier, yes, it sounds like a perfect match for marriage, raising a family and all that but for now, just good friends, close friends, confidants, perhaps working together on a project, discussing books we've read, movies we've seen and all that type of stuff." Sounds pretty good to me! I see a pretty big win just in that, you are making new friends here Lakey, of good quality people. That's a lot to celebrate!

Maybe it's a very nice cosmic birthday present to you both from the Universe! Did you ever consider that? "Here's a new friend that you can play with and will have lots in common with"...And the rest of us just get to have warm fuzzies for a moment by getting to play along with you on this thread!

I promise you, as a friend, I won't be a yenta! I'm more the Earth Mother type, anyway!

Don't get mad because we're tickled that you "pulled in" a very nice woman to your thread! That's all it is.

 

[SweetnessandLight]

Being a newbie feels strange

Sweet - I just wanted to than you for teaching Heidrun the ropes and wearing the hat of host here. I think you gave her good advice, first the new member section and then links to her website and then start her own threads.

Heidrun - I think you should follow S & L's advice. Meanwhile, you are more than welcome to post your stuff here as long as you like. It hleps increase my viewership as well. You have so much to say that is worthwhile that there will soon come a time when you want to host your own threads.
Lakey

Hey, I got to wear a hat and didn't know it! Thanks for the ack!

Thanks, Lakey, I just remember how lost I felt when I first joined, after having lurked for awhile. A few gentle pointers went a long way to helping me feel at home here. I bumbled around and learned, but some people weren't very nice to me at times, and I think people need encouragement in life, it's part of my Zeitgeist as a teacher!

I should add Heidrun, that some members who have a blog, website or book to sell, etc. put the link down in their signature line, which you can edit from your profile page, I think. That way it appears wherever you go, following like your shadow Take a look at Nexus or DullOldFart.

Thanks for the tip about the movie, guys, I want to see it, but think I am going to see Avatar next. Either IMAX or 3-D version. I heard it's terrific. You know me, as an artist, I'm into visuals! Visio is my favorite perceptic!

 

[Blue Spirit]

Too Serious

Blue - There is a Yiddish name for matchmaker. It is called a "shadchen". I always heard it prounounced as shot kin so I Googled it. It sounds like someone who rode shot gun on the old 1800's stage coaches.

I've been married for 28 1/2 years and we are separated. We have agreed to dissolve the marriage and it should be dissolved by next month. We live together for economic reasons and we are best pals and friends and close confidants. We have a lot of equity tied up in our home and don't want to sell with the pricess down about 1/3 from 2 years ago. We go out for dinner about once a week and have company over, such as cousins all non Scientologists, and no one knows we are breaking up. Our kids are 22 and 27 now but we have no grandchildren. We both love the kids equally. I married above my pay grade just like you, Blue, she stuck it out with me until the kids were raised and then unlike your beautiful wife, she wanted more romance than I was able to give her. She's 13 1/2 years younger than me and still beautiful but the old magic was not there anymore for me. I told her to start dating, said I still love her but more like a friend and a confidant and not a lover, you know a brother and sIster type of love. As far as another 2D, I can take it or leave it. I can still perform the act well but it would have to really be somebody special to make me want to start a new serious 2D. Now dating and having fun, yes that would be tremendously exciting but all shadchens keep your distance from me.

Heidrun and me are like sould mates, same birthday, she's from Austria and I have track there, in the 18th and early 19th centuries and I love to speak German, we both love opera. Our approaches to Scientology are very similar. She has taken the time to read every page on my damn thread, every time I log in, she is on line reading and posting. Had I met her 35 years earlier, yes, it sounds like a perfect match for marriage, raising a family and all that but for now, just good friends, close friends, confidants, perhaps working together on a project, discussing books we've read, movies we've seen and all that type of stuff but no shadchens please.
Lakey

I was just having a bit of fun, and then you have to get all serious on me.

 

[SweetnessandLight]

Big Hug to Blue Spirit!

There, See?