Question for all former scientologists

[Cat's Squirrel]

I think the Church's attacks on psychiatry have some truth (ECT is appalling, for example, in its effects on long term memory) but they are wrong to attribute universally evil motives to mostly well intentioned people, and they also take isolated scandals that occur in psychiatry as being standard practice, which they are not.

Psychiatry in the UK at least is faced with massive demand upon very limited resources, and a lot of its problems are the result of attempts to cope with that reality.

In passing, I doubt that most people on Scn staff could name even one significant researcher in academic psychology, clinical or otherwise, from the last forty years.

 

[Voltaire's Child]

Well, they do know about Szasz, but mainly what CofS tells them...

Yes, I see a lot of problems with the fields of psychology and psychiatry but I also know they do some good.

Thing is, Hubbard thought that "psychs" were/are dramatizing whole track implant tech and were, knowingly or unknowingly, furthering some whole track Marcabian conspiracy.

Nobody in CofS would be even allowed to have so much as a talk session with a nice Bob Newhart type psychologist.

 

[Free to shine]

Even when I was at my most indoctrinated, I could not get my head around the thought that ALL psychiatrists and Psychologists were bad, evil people, part of a conspiracy to suppress the world. That is just too bizarre. Sure there are awful abuses and it's good they are exposed (like deep sleep therapy) yet I always thought to myself (very quietly at the time) that most wanted to help people, and that was the acceptable medical way to do that.

 

[Bea Kiddo]

Even when I was at my most indoctrinated, I could not get my head around the thought that ALL psychiatrists and Psychologists were bad, evil people, part of a conspiracy to suppress the world. That is just too bizarre. Sure there are awful abuses and it's good they are exposed (like deep sleep therapy) yet I always thought to myself (very quietly at the time) that most wanted to help people, and that was the acceptable medical way to do that.

I believe that LRH thought that the psyches were more of a front group for a more sinister mob. And there was no way to get to that group, so the psyches became the target.

I am sure there are confidential advices about what would be the next target, that eliminated...

 

[Free to shine]

Bea, I guess there has to be a 'them' for the 'us'. Thats how I rationalised it anyway. Scary stuff.

 

[Cat's Squirrel]

Bea, I guess there has to be a 'them' for the 'us'. Thats how I rationalised it anyway. Scary stuff.

True, but the CofS went PTS type III which meant they saw enemies everywhere (effectively, group paranoid schizophrenia).

 

[Cat's Squirrel]

Hey Mick,

I know these questions were directed toward Lee, but since I posted that I agree with him, I thought I'd answer them from my point of view also.

As far as counseling and bipolar. I took Lee to mean you cannot treat bipolar with therapy *alone*, not that it wouldn't or couldn't help dealing with it.

As far as sad versus depression. I think it is an important distinction. I feel the line does get blurred sometimes.

Again, in my experience though, it is the general practitioner who is doing the over-prescribing.

Krysti

Dorothy Rowe (who has written a lot about depression) says that the main difference between sadness and depression is that the depressed person is more isolated, in her words "alone in a prison".

I'm just picking up odd points as I go here but I had an excellent handling for my agoraphobia from conventional psychological medicine, better than I've yet had from anywhere else (including auditing, and I had a very fine auditor).

I suppose it's useless to hope, let alone expect, that the CofS will develop a more broad minded perspective on these matters. Maybe this needs a new thread, but I've been wondering recently whether the millions pumped into the CofS by the likes of Tom Cruise will in the long term prove to be more of a curse than a blessing for them, as it has temporarily relieved them of the need to change and adapt to new realities in order to survive.

 

[programmer_guy]

True, but the CofS went PTS type III which meant they saw enemies everywhere (effectively, group paranoid schizophrenia).

IMO, this is a reflection of the personality of LRH himself.

As they say in the U.S. military... "shit rolls downhill".

 

[Krysti]

Dorothy Rowe (who has written a lot about depression) says that the main difference between sadness and depression is that the depressed person is more isolated, in her words "alone in a prison".

I'm just picking up odd points as I go here but I had an excellent handling for my agoraphobia from conventional psychological medicine, better than I've yet had from anywhere else (including auditing, and I had a very fine auditor).

That's a good distinction...

I used to have pretty severe arachnophobia. I even went so far as to try to get rid of it through hypnosis. A side effect of the meds I take for bipolar has been the arachnophobia is way less severe now. I still hate spiders and don't want them near me, but it doesn't affect me to the point where it is debilitating to my life like it used to be. (I once quit a job because there were spiders in the parking garage where I had to park!)

That would be another distinction between sadness and depression. Depression is debilitating to your life. I've had times where I literally could not get out of bed (and I had no reason to be depressed). Scary...

Krysti

 

[Terril park]

I believe that LRH thought that the psyches were more of a front group for a more sinister mob. And there was no way to get to that group, so the psyches became the target.

I am sure there are confidential advices about what would be the next target, that eliminated...

Not really true. He said he could help psyches, and help them make more money.

I'll bring that quote up soon, after I've smacked Alert around a bit.

 

[Jimmy Cricket]

I'll bring that quote up soon, after I've smacked Alert around a bit.

Odd, a quick check on ars, and the only person I see lately who is consistently trying to smack around Alert is LaserClam. Terril, please tell me that you are not LaserClam.

 

[TheSneakster]

not important

 

[Pixie]

Hi Pixie,

Keep an open mind about psychiatry. There may be a lot of room for improvement, but there is such a thing as mental illness and people who need medication. I am one of the them. If it weren't for medication, I wouldn't be where I am today.

Welcome to the board.

Krysti

Hi Krysti, sorry about the delay in replying! Phew! Only a year late. Sure, I'll keep an open mind, I guess it was just all those video nasties they'd show us on a Saturday night, really got to me and something snapped I guess, but thanks for sharing that with me, I'm not usually so black and white but my mother's been on psyc drugs most of her life and she freaks me out she's so far gone so that doesn't help either, but I do get what you're saying so thanks for the reply and the welcome and my warmest wishes to you.. P

 

[Voltaire's Child]

Odd, a quick check on ars, and the only person I see lately who is consistently trying to smack around Alert is LaserClam. Terril, please tell me that you are not LaserClam.

I like you Jimmy,but you are waaaay off base here.

You should google Terril Park and Basic Basic. (same dude).

Terril's VERY well known as an FZer and a critic.

laserclam's an OSA bot.

If Terril's talking to Alert or about her, it's because she often writes about the Freezone and Freezoners. She's written a lot of things about both Terril and about me on quite a few occasions.

Is there a double standard here?

 

[Pixie]

Welcome to the board, Pixie!!!

Hey thank you Bea Kiddo!

 

[Pixie]

It seems the whole second dynamic is taboo there now, so I would reckon the staff have to suppress themselves and so then are somewhat pts to themselves

When I was on staff and a short time in the SO, the second dynamic was almost obssesional. Liking someone was a 'crime' in thier eyes and having a relationship was in no way encouraged, if anything, it was discouraged beyone belief. If I had a pound for every time I had to m7 '2d rules' I'd be a millionaire. I fell in love with someone a year into the cult and got into a whole heap of trouble. More trouble than I can describe in words. We were duly split up and posted to different orgs. Two years later, I met someone else, the same thing happened. I finally flipped and disagreed profusely and asked what the hell was going on, I was told it was more 'ethical' to be married. So, we got married, and got into even more trouble. I was accused to being 'out 2d' and a 'slut'. I'd been hauled into 'ethic's and assigned 'Treason' for smiling too much at another staff member, one of many many examples, you know what, I could have written the book 1984 myself. I won't go into a big long story here, but believe me when I tell you, the 2d was an obsession and was suppressed beyond words. I had to suppress myself so much that even now I find it hard to just be myself in a relationship, I've not been able to show affection in public since. Wanting closness to another human is normal and completely natural, but this we were reminded daily was 'other fish to fry'.