Alanzo
Bardo Tulpa
I think he is still a little too close to his subject matter.
Give him time.
He'll get better.
Mike Rinder Interview LIVE
- Thread starter OHTEEATE
- Start date
I think he is still a little too close to his subject matter.
Give him time.
He'll get better.
HelluvaHoax!
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Rinder's testimony in open court....
Investigators are startled when Rinder refuses to testify about Hubbard's criminal enterprise...
Investigators are startled when Rinder refuses to testify about Hubbard's criminal enterprise...
INVESTIGATOR
Were you at any time a member of
a crime organization headed by Vito Hubbard?
MIKE "PENTANGELI" RINDER
I don't know nothin about that!
Look, the FBI guys promised me a deal. So I made up a
lot of stuff about Vito Hubbard. Because that's what they
wanted. But it's all lies. Everything! And I kept saying Vito
Hubbard did this! And Vito Hubbard did that! So I said: 'Yeah--sure! Why not?'
INVESTIGATOR
We're going to get to the bottom of this!!!
MIKE "PENTALGELI" RINDER
Well, if you have no further questions, I'd like to take this
opportunity to show you a lovely pinch test demo on the e-meter.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eIonn9W9K6Y
Were you at any time a member of
a crime organization headed by Vito Hubbard?
MIKE "PENTANGELI" RINDER
I don't know nothin about that!
Look, the FBI guys promised me a deal. So I made up a
lot of stuff about Vito Hubbard. Because that's what they
wanted. But it's all lies. Everything! And I kept saying Vito
Hubbard did this! And Vito Hubbard did that! So I said: 'Yeah--sure! Why not?'
INVESTIGATOR
We're going to get to the bottom of this!!!
MIKE "PENTALGELI" RINDER
Well, if you have no further questions, I'd like to take this
opportunity to show you a lovely pinch test demo on the e-meter.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eIonn9W9K6Y
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Voltaire's Child
Fool on the Hill
??
SweetnessandLight
Crusader
Implying , Fluff, that it's using OSA repeater technique of a shore story to say that Mike and Marty have gotten all these people out of COS. Dunno if they have or they haven't, but I like that they seem to be working together to help correct the current scene, and get some ethics in at Int. I don't think it's all a vast conspiracy.
Hey, that they each got themselves out is a win. If they each only got one other person out, that's a win, too. However many will follow them, out of COS into Indy status, it's all good. No Ex is EVER gonna create a worse cult than Scientology already is...not in this information age.
Hey, that they each got themselves out is a win. If they each only got one other person out, that's a win, too. However many will follow them, out of COS into Indy status, it's all good. No Ex is EVER gonna create a worse cult than Scientology already is...not in this information age.
nozeno
Gold Meritorious Patron
Please accept my donation (attached) as proof of my support to the IAOH (International Association of Hoaxologists)
Voltaire's Child
Fool on the Hill
I was afraid of that. You can see how nasty that implication would be since I, a contributor to this forum, am the one making it. I didn't say THEY claimed it.
They have been contacted by SO members wanting to leave and they've also talked to a lot of other Scn'ists. This isn't a reflection on their beliefs, pro or anti.
SweetnessandLight
Crusader
Yeah, so it's all good. Anything that can help some of those poor souls in the SO, I'm all for. They NEED help!
Progress, slow or fast, is still progress!
Progress, slow or fast, is still progress!
Voltaire's Child
Fool on the Hill
Sure. There are FZers and Indies who help people. Quite a few, I believe. Someone having those beliefs doesn't preclude helping people out of the cult. I wonder why some people have such a difficult time believing that? I know part of it's disdain and/or anger about the two Rs still practicing - and proselytizing, I guess- Scn, but maybe also, some people think there's ulterior motives.
Thing is, people are mixed bags. I don't believe in vilifying someone who's an FZer. That's the kind of shit the cult does and it would not be very nice to see people emulating the cult.
Thing is, people are mixed bags. I don't believe in vilifying someone who's an FZer. That's the kind of shit the cult does and it would not be very nice to see people emulating the cult.
degraded being
Sponsor
They got themselves out of favour with DM, which according to their own accounts is not that hard to do since tiny tot hates everybody.They are more dedicated scientologists than any other *out* people I have come across. They are not out of the delusions about Elron.
They are not out of scientology, and they really do not want to be out of the COS. They want nothing more than to be in it. Are they really *out*. No they just hate DM as much as he hates them.
Ty as I was busy so missed it myself.
Voltaire's Child
Fool on the Hill
I don't know that they don't want to be out of CofS. Maybe you're right. Maybe they want a new revamped DMless CofS. Or maybe they're fed up with all of it but like the ideas. Hard to say.
But I give them props for helping others.
Sharone Stainforth
Silver Meritorious Patron
I listened to the interview, surprisingly I thought he came across quite well.As always there was a lot that was not discussed.
Hartly and a couple of other anons once said to me that it was easier for them to understand the more complex things that crop up in scientology because they were looking at things from a totally unbiased viewpoint. They having never been in scientology.
I know my own viewpoint is totally against scientology in any form and it is so because of what I experienced in the sea org and with L. Ron Hubbard personally and that will never change,ever.
It's hard to imagine people staying in scientology for so long,although I do understand how that happens I still find it hard.
Anyway, after listening to Mike Rinder, and then watching the video of Tory in East. Grinstead this morning, it made me realise how short a time he's been out compared to how long a time he was in and if youv'e been in a long time, you really do believe it is your religion. It's a difficult one.
Hartly and a couple of other anons once said to me that it was easier for them to understand the more complex things that crop up in scientology because they were looking at things from a totally unbiased viewpoint. They having never been in scientology.
I know my own viewpoint is totally against scientology in any form and it is so because of what I experienced in the sea org and with L. Ron Hubbard personally and that will never change,ever.
It's hard to imagine people staying in scientology for so long,although I do understand how that happens I still find it hard.
Anyway, after listening to Mike Rinder, and then watching the video of Tory in East. Grinstead this morning, it made me realise how short a time he's been out compared to how long a time he was in and if youv'e been in a long time, you really do believe it is your religion. It's a difficult one.
Mick Wenlock
Admin Emeritus (retired)
They have? Proof of any kind?
Mick Wenlock
Admin Emeritus (retired)
Well maybe people think that inflicting Scientology on people is, in fact, a harmful act? That merely moving them out of one division of this isidious cult to another is not a helpful act but merely just one more piece of manipulation?
There IS a fundamental divide at work here. Some of us think that Scientology itself is a sham and is harmful in and of itself. I am one of them. Some people here think that the actual subject is not harmful but that nasty manuplators like DM make it so.
This is an irreconcilable difference. While YOU may think it is OK to get people out of DMs cult by getting them into Marty's cult - I do not.
ChuckNorrisCutsMyLawn
Crusader
I personally think the purpose of Scientology is clear, it's to create people dependent on Scientology, regardless of where someone is subjected to it.
That being said, I'd rather have an audit junkie getting his fix from the local dealer in the Freezone, than from Ron's Cartel in Clearwater, especially if that entails being a slave to the addiction in the Ron's Cartel's Sea Org.
HelluvaHoax!
Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on
Anybody sensing a pattern?
Cult leaders know their cultees just luvvvv when evil things are canceled for them!
The really cool part is that the same person who stood teary-eyed in awe-filled, cheering admiration of COB when he canceled "arbitraries" is the identical person who will stand teary-eyed in awe-filled, cheering admiration when it is announced that COB has been declared an SP and expelled.
The Scientologist is a simple species to control. They only require food, water and "clear" instructions of who/what they are supposed to hate.
L. RON HUBBARD
"The reactive mind is canceled!"
SCIENTOLOGISTS
(stand tall and erupt in unison)
Yayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy!!!
BILL ROBERTSON
"Alien invader forces are canceled!"
SCIENTOLOGISTS
(stand tall and erupt in unison)
Yayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy!!!
DAVID MISCAVIGE
"Arbitraries are canceled!"
SCIENTOLOGISTS
(stand tall and erupt in unison)
Yayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy!!!
MARTY RATHBUN
"David Miscavige is canceled!"
SCIENTOLOGISTS
(stand tall and erupt in unison)
Yayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy!!!
"The reactive mind is canceled!"
SCIENTOLOGISTS
(stand tall and erupt in unison)
Yayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy!!!
BILL ROBERTSON
"Alien invader forces are canceled!"
SCIENTOLOGISTS
(stand tall and erupt in unison)
Yayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy!!!
DAVID MISCAVIGE
"Arbitraries are canceled!"
SCIENTOLOGISTS
(stand tall and erupt in unison)
Yayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy!!!
MARTY RATHBUN
"David Miscavige is canceled!"
SCIENTOLOGISTS
(stand tall and erupt in unison)
Yayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy!!!
Cult leaders know their cultees just luvvvv when evil things are canceled for them!
The really cool part is that the same person who stood teary-eyed in awe-filled, cheering admiration of COB when he canceled "arbitraries" is the identical person who will stand teary-eyed in awe-filled, cheering admiration when it is announced that COB has been declared an SP and expelled.
The Scientologist is a simple species to control. They only require food, water and "clear" instructions of who/what they are supposed to hate.
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Voltaire's Child
Fool on the Hill
At least one story is on Rathbun's blog.
I also have had personal friends who used to be in CofS, tell me that reading Rathbun's blog and The Truth Rundown spurred them (the friends, I mean) to making the decision to leave CofS.
smartone
My Own Boss
NeverMe
Patron
I listened to Mike's interview, was pleased that he spoke as freely as he did and I thought he did a great job. I was surprised he made so many comments against David Miscavige. It was also the first time I'd heard the back story about the part Mike played in the first Panorama TV interview and didn't realize he was ordered to be Tommy Davis' flunky at the time. As Mike spoke, I tried to imagine how he might have felt while in this particular situation, lying for DM, protecting him and then being spoken to and treated so nastily in return. Trying to imagine how he might feel now, maybe wishing he had it all to do over again.
I guess I expected it to be as heavily edited as the things we see on television. I don't know. Anyway, I decided to comment on Marty's blog, as encouragement to Mike and to anyone else entertaining the thought of speaking out.
Here's the comment I made:
NeverMe | October 16, 2010 at 12:34 am |
Good job, Mike. I can’t begin to imagine the regret you and so many others now feel for protecting a psycho like David Miscavige. I do understand the fear behind it, though.
The mental instability, paranoia and sickness inside the dude is growing by the minute. I hope that after others listen to this interview, they’ll gain courage and are moved to speak out about their own abuse or abuse they witnessed at the hands of David Miscavige and his flunkies. I mean, EVERYBODY can’t be lying, can they? It’s the only pitiful defense they have.
__________
Here was Marty's response shortly after I posted my comment:
martyrathbun09 | October 16, 2010 at 1:15 am |
What is with all this blame, shame and regret business on the blog tonight? Weird
__________
Another reader/non-scientologist like myself then responded to Marty's comment:
stella | October 16, 2010 at 2:19 am |
Marty — it is a celebration of our common humanity! Seriously, only a psychopath never feels a sense of shame, regret or genuine humility. Particularly those of us who have lived past adolescence and are here to tell the stories and to show the scars. We are all, as fellow human travelers, scientologist and non-scientologist alike able to embrace the remarkable human ability to learn and to grow, and to survive, no matter what!
Kudos to Mike for his raw, vulnerable, real telling of how it is and was for him, as well as yours and the many many others who speak on this forum. As a non-scientologist, it is daily inspiration to me. As F. Scott Peck said in the first sentence of his book, “The Road Less Travelled” “Life is hard.” And yes it is, but ain’t it also grand? This blog is a tribute to the grandness of the human spirit. IMHO.
__________
Now, I have to say that Marty's response confused, surprised and disturbed me. I scanned all the previous comments and didn't see anything else that he could be referring to. And his comment immediately followed mine. I would rather ask him what he meant but I've asked questions on the blog before and received no answers. Soooooo ...... I wonder, what could he have meant?
Does his comment truly show that he didn't understand what I meant?
Or does his comment mean that he doesn't feel any of the things he mentions in his response - blame, shame, regret - and couldn't understand why anyone else would, either?
Or is this some scientology thing? Where as a scientlologist, you become ABOVE those kinds of feelings and you aren't motivated by them? That I would have difficulty with, though. We're human beings first and feelings like shame and regret help keep us grounded and humble.
However, I loved Stella's response. She put MY feelings into words much better than I was able to.
Any thoughts or insight? I genuinely would like to know...... Thanks.
I guess I expected it to be as heavily edited as the things we see on television. I don't know. Anyway, I decided to comment on Marty's blog, as encouragement to Mike and to anyone else entertaining the thought of speaking out.
Here's the comment I made:
NeverMe | October 16, 2010 at 12:34 am |
Good job, Mike. I can’t begin to imagine the regret you and so many others now feel for protecting a psycho like David Miscavige. I do understand the fear behind it, though.
The mental instability, paranoia and sickness inside the dude is growing by the minute. I hope that after others listen to this interview, they’ll gain courage and are moved to speak out about their own abuse or abuse they witnessed at the hands of David Miscavige and his flunkies. I mean, EVERYBODY can’t be lying, can they? It’s the only pitiful defense they have.
__________
Here was Marty's response shortly after I posted my comment:
martyrathbun09 | October 16, 2010 at 1:15 am |
What is with all this blame, shame and regret business on the blog tonight? Weird
__________
Another reader/non-scientologist like myself then responded to Marty's comment:
stella | October 16, 2010 at 2:19 am |
Marty — it is a celebration of our common humanity! Seriously, only a psychopath never feels a sense of shame, regret or genuine humility. Particularly those of us who have lived past adolescence and are here to tell the stories and to show the scars. We are all, as fellow human travelers, scientologist and non-scientologist alike able to embrace the remarkable human ability to learn and to grow, and to survive, no matter what!
Kudos to Mike for his raw, vulnerable, real telling of how it is and was for him, as well as yours and the many many others who speak on this forum. As a non-scientologist, it is daily inspiration to me. As F. Scott Peck said in the first sentence of his book, “The Road Less Travelled” “Life is hard.” And yes it is, but ain’t it also grand? This blog is a tribute to the grandness of the human spirit. IMHO.
__________
Now, I have to say that Marty's response confused, surprised and disturbed me. I scanned all the previous comments and didn't see anything else that he could be referring to. And his comment immediately followed mine. I would rather ask him what he meant but I've asked questions on the blog before and received no answers. Soooooo ...... I wonder, what could he have meant?
Does his comment truly show that he didn't understand what I meant?
Or does his comment mean that he doesn't feel any of the things he mentions in his response - blame, shame, regret - and couldn't understand why anyone else would, either?
Or is this some scientology thing? Where as a scientlologist, you become ABOVE those kinds of feelings and you aren't motivated by them? That I would have difficulty with, though. We're human beings first and feelings like shame and regret help keep us grounded and humble.
However, I loved Stella's response. She put MY feelings into words much better than I was able to.
Any thoughts or insight? I genuinely would like to know...... Thanks.
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HelluvaHoax!
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Ron's holy scripture: "Never regret yesterday..." has inspired mankind to reach undreamed of heights.
Marty is one of those so blessed...
We are Shackonomous.
We do not forgive.
We do not regret.