The Little Thread Which Grew - the Apollo '73 to Everything But

[lkwdblds]

Past lives collectively is sometimes referred to as case.

Why is one's past life always referred to as one's case?

Is everything that happened before right now one's case, just because it's a past memory?

Many people do not believe in past lives and some who do believe in them do not like to talk about them outside of sessions. Then again, a few don't mind at all talking about their past lives.

Often times, when I was deeply involved in Scientology, I was told not to discuss my past lives except when in session.

I do not know where Hats stands on this subject. I was just asking her a question about her past lives at sea, if she had any, and I was telling her that it was okay with me if she did not want to answer. That is all there was to my question.
Lakey

 

[lkwdblds]

No, you were implying/inferring/extrapolating that I had made a statement...which, functionally, is a re-statement...that I clearly had not made.

Here is an additional comment I have re: your most recent post on the "Shooting Stars" Thread.

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=557953&postcount=241

Lakey, I would think that in my thousands of words I have posted on ESMB regarding El Ron and the CMO that what should be abundantly clear is my "Take" is that El Ron handed the “keys to the Kingdom” for four reasons; Protection, Extortion, Enforcement and Execution with Blind Obedience, Graven Fealty and Wonton Willing-ness in the Performance Thereof.

Of course, I am certainly not the "Holy Grail" when it comes to El Ron so you are very free to analyze whatever you wish about Hisself...but I'd appreciate it if you could refrain from misquoting me and putting words in my mouth, devining "real" intents "behind" what I've said and "explaining" my "thoughts" and "meanings" to others for me. Face

Face, I read and reread the lines above which I highlight in blue plus I looked up the word "fealty" and now I get the gist of what you were saying there.

At the time I read it, it did not register with me as your opinion of what Hubbard had in mind as far as who he was going to give the reins of power to when he was ready to die. To me it told why he would turn them over or the qualities which he was looking for in a successor but it did not tell me who.

Certainly, yesterday, when I read installment #11, I did not remember a word of your earlier quote nor did I remember what your position was on LRH's turn over of power to a successor.

I did remember well that he first sent Mayo a long letter appointing Mayo as the head of tech and he appointed Bill Franks and then at the live meeting at the Palladium auditorium in 1986, which I attended, I saw that he turned over the reigns to not DM but to Pat Broker. Therefore, I have been confused ever since as to how DM came to power, particularly if LRH wanted that to happen or not.

When I read your recent post, the passage which Veda quoted above influenced me to speculate on my own that perhaps LRH did want DM to lead the church. That is why I came away from your post feeling the way I did.

Anxious not to offend you, I reread what I wrote and found one sentence where I had put words in your mouth so I quickly corrected that sentence and made it my own thought. I feel that was an honest mistake which I made and since I corrrected it quickly when it came to my attention, I thought it was no big deal.

As far as this comment you made, "you are very free to analyze whatever you wish about Hisself...but I'd appreciate it if you could refrain from misquoting me and putting words in my mouth, devining "real" intents "behind" what I've said and "explaining" my "thoughts" and "meanings" to others for me."

I admit that I did put some words in your mouth briefly but I caught my error, reworded the passage and publicly apologized for my error. Other than that one transgression I don't believe that I did any of the other items which you mentioned above.

Everything I said, other than the opening clause of my new Item #4, was just my own analysis and a factual report on how I came away feeling after I read your post. I agree with you that the best thing to do is to just move on from here.
Lakey

 

[Auditor's Toad]

Many people do not believe in past lives and some who do believe in them do not like to talk about them outside of sessions. Then again, a few don't mind at all talking about their past lives.

Often times, when I was deeply involved in Scientology, I was told not to discuss my past lives except when in session.

I do not know where Hats stands on this subject. I was just asking her a question about her past lives at sea, if she had any, and I was telling her that it was okay with me if she did not want to answer. That is all there was to my question.
Lakey

Didn't Hubbard Himself talk about who He had been in a previous life ... more than once?

And what about that whole mission into time thing?

Sure seems like while not in session that Hubbard didn't mind talking at length about His case.

WTF is Lakey this stuff he claims?

 

[Hatshepsut]

I replied to you Lakey...I just wanted to save my spot under FoTi's post and went back and edited out my dots with what I had to say. so page back

 

[lkwdblds]

When we had our Hurricane Charlie in Fla in 2004 hitting us with compact force, I got some associated recalls. I was in the center of the state and I'd not been affected for 40 yrs. I was shocked. I had a flasback or two. I got out some old maps on the pc and checked to date locate my memories.

I came from a Portuguese family that had interests in shipping and spices. I was in Argentina early on. It seems my position of command was inherent on family money though I proved competent. I spoke French too. I was associated with them but
my vessel was a Spanish prize, go figure. I ended up near the Southern Louisiana coast. The British were there. I did not want to be seen by them. There was a big hurricane. I ended up in some cove like Jean Lafitte taking over Galveston Island and sending his privateered goods into Port Orleans to sell. I was not a privateer. Was in charge of a nice vessel. Islanders brought goods to me as they got them without license and could not put a stamp on things going inland or whatnot. I'm sure I had a racket whereby I profited most. Although I started out allied to Spain, I ended up allied to France and then to just myself. I stayed on my moored ship (office) for 7 yrs in a bay with mostly creoles in a port and no crew. Inventory, beans, dried peppers, etc I did every afternoon and the Caribs took the goods to a market. My ship was a cloistered office. There was war around me and I was getting the spoils quite often. Probably could've been hung by anyone at any time. But most likely could buy my way out. An horrendous hurricane washed up a (today I don't know the word) carrier in the shoals. Coin and other documents as good as money. I was very lucky. Actually this was probably around 1746 --1749. Good god, I remember how it was to always feel lucky.

Wow, thanks for the story Hats!! Well I mentioned the British, Spanish and French and overlooked the other two naval powers of the day, the Portugese and the Dutch. I am not surprised that you spoke French, you seem to have a bit of a French aura about you.

Yikes, Galveston Island. I worked in Houston for one year, 1964 to 1965, working at NASA. I drove down to Galveston twice. I thought it would be Houston's answer to Manhattan or Redondo Beach in Southen California. It was nothing at all like those trendy beach towns. Galveston was old, with no beaches for human sunning or swimming, no surf, mainly oily water where older boats were moored. Their downtown was old and older. Some of the shopkeepers bragged that there were buildings there which went back to civil war days. Nothing there survived all the way back to 1746-1749.

The one thing they had which was good was plenty of top Sea Food Restaurants. I had never eaten crab until I had it in Galveston. The crab cakes were memorable.

Hats, during those years in the 18th century, I assume that you must have been a man during that life. Women folk just didn't do that type of things which you were doing during that life, right?

Very nice about the luck which you encountered there, with the money and the important papers washing up. Good to have some pleasure moments there on the backtrack. I must say, you really have excellent recall on that past life. Is your track open like that in general or is that life exceptional in that you remember it so well?

Food for thought for FoTi. If a past life such as Hat's has pleasure moments of falling into a lot of money by chance, would that life be considered "case". In other words, are pleasure moments also part of one's case?
Lakey

 

[Auditor's Toad]

In a pure scientological sense unless pleasure moments are charged they won't run as case. Just won't.

Almost by definition a pleasure moment does not have charge, so there you go.

Hey, anybody who still aduits - would you pick up the cans and try running out some pleasure moments - then post the results here

What is addressed " in session" is case, so also by definition pleasure moments are not case.

This is really very very basic auditing stuff.

 

[Hatshepsut]

Wow, thanks for the story Hats!! Well I mentioned the British, Spanish and French and overlooked the other two naval powers of the day, the Portugese and the Dutch. I am not surprised that you spoke French, you seem to have a bit of a French aura about you.

Yikes, Galveston Island. I worked in Houston for one year, 1964 to 1965, working at NASA. I drove down to Galveston twice. I thought it would be Houston's answer to Manhattan or Redondo Beach in Southen California. It was nothing at all like those trendy beach towns. Galveston was old, with no beaches for human sunning or swimming, no surf, mainly oily water where older boats were moored. Their downtown was old and older. Some of the shopkeepers bragged that there were buildings there which went back to civil war days. Nothing there survived all the way back to 1746-1749.

The one thing they had which was good was plenty of top Sea Food Restaurants. I had never eaten crab until I had it in Galveston. The crab cakes were memorable.

Hats, during those years in the 18th century, I assume that you must have been a man during that life. Women folk just didn't do that type of things which you were doing during that life, right?

Very nice about the luck which you encountered there, with the money and the important papers washing up. Good to have some pleasure moments there on the backtrack. I must say, you really have excellent recall on that past life. Is your track open like that in general or is that life exceptional in that you remember it so well?

Food for thought for FoTi. If a past life such as Hat's has pleasure moments of falling into a lot of money by chance, would that life be considered "case". In other words, are pleasure moments also part of one's case?
Lakey

I wasn't on Galveston Isand but near there , west. I get wholesale recall if something in my environment closely approximates an earlier scenario. I can get avalanches of 3d stuff. Always have. That's why its so dangerous for me to run into somebody I've known before this life. I have no skin, and if its bad, its very bad. Especially if its off planet stuff. I get uncomplimentary minds chafing. Stress.
I'm usually in some military capacity except lately, so I guess I naturally would be male. However, this identity generally emanates from a female aspect which is even higher. If I incarnate female, it is usually to spy.

 

[lkwdblds]

Blabbing may have ended for me.

I had been getting about one session a week from Candy but 3 weeks went by without a session and then she offered to come over today and give me one.

Well, since our last session, Ted and Roger had given me some processes to run regarding service facs. I had mentioned that I have a compulsion to blab and Ted gave me some commands to run concerning blabbing. I ran the first two flows that Ted had given me and had some pretty good results from doing so, including finding the service fac worded, "WHY ARE YOU UPSET WITH ME, I MEANT YOU NO HARM?"

Well, I thought I better tell Candy that I ran these on myself last week since she is running sessions on me. I gave Candy the processes that both Ted and Roger had written up on this thread. Well, our first order of business was to check out the two flows which I had run using, using the commands given me by Ted. Our sessions are metered.

I would talk, itsa style, and as long as my TA was moving, I would keep talking until I floated the needle. We would then take up some other area having to do with running Ted's processes.

So many twists and turns happened where I would blab because I thought it would further my survival. Not to divulge too much detail but I will blab just a bit here. I could see that blabbing always hindered my survival and made people dislike me and not trust me but I still felt compelled to keep on blabbing anyway. I had a computation that though in the short run blabbing hurt my survival that in the long run, some time in the "future" my blabbing would pay off. Spotting this computation caused further deeper looks into this area and ultimately led to an absolutely huge win for me.

The session lasted one hour and left me teared up and with a floating TA. It was a very satisfying session. Maybe, just maybe I may no longer have my compusion to blab everything I know. It will take a little time to see if this is true or not but I suspect my blabbing days are now over.
Lakey

 

[Hatshepsut]

Don't worry too much. Serfacs are not something you think about. They actually defy inspection cause they are over you like a contact lenses. But if you can catch yourself at it, spotting what you are doing from the right angle you get undeniable TA and laughter. It just blows. Computations like Rog said are evaluations. So they are your postulates on how to handle life henceforth. I brightened when I could replace the idea of computations with how I evaluated things. That took up every them vs me prejudices. I had to re evaluate the position I assumed. It was wonderful to realize I was wrong in at least one instance.

 

[lkwdblds]

Fascinating!

I wasn't on Galveston Isand but near there , west. I get wholesale recall if something in my environment closely approximates an earlier scenario. I can get avalanches of 3d stuff. Always have. That's why its so dangerous for me to run into somebody I've known before this life. I have no skin, and if its bad, its very bad. Especially if its off planet stuff. I get uncomplimentary minds chafing. Stress.
I'm usually in some military capacity except lately, so I guess I naturally would be male. However, this identity generally emanates from a female aspect which is even higher. If I incarnate female, it is usually to spy.

Really interesting stuff, Hats! Male emanating from a female aspect which is even higher. Really?! Are you doing any spying this life?

I seem to be hanging around with mainly females during the later stages of this life. Being older in years if not mentally or even in appearance to some degree, and having already done my duty siring and raising a family, I seem to gravitate towards having many more female friends than male friends. I am not a threat to women as I am not always on the make and usually just enjoy them for who they are. As a younger man, I could not enjoy this benefit because, like most males, I was always on the make, trying to "score".

Being older has some real perks to it and being able to interact with females without thinking only about sex is probably my biggest perk for being "old".

I find it remarkable that being placed in certain environments causes you to have a lot of 3d pictures flood in. Do you have any track in German speaking areas? I would guess not, but I can sure see you in Spain, Portugal and France. How about Italy, you must have sampled living there for sure, I would guess yes.?

Lakey

 

[Hatshepsut]

Really interesting stuff, Hats! Male emanating from a female aspect which is even higher. Really?! Are you doing any spying this life?

I seem to be hanging around with mainly females during the later stages of this life. Being older in years if not mentally or even in appearance to some degree, and having already done my duty siring and raising a family, I seem to gravitate towards having many more female friends than male friends. I am not a threat to women as I am not always on the make and usually just enjoy them for who they are. As a younger man, I could not enjoy this benefit because, like most males, I was always on the make, trying to "score".

Being older has some real perks to it and being able to interact with females without thinking only about sex is probably my biggest perk for being "old".

I find it remarkable that being placed in certain environments causes you to have a lot of 3d pictures flood in. Do you have any track in German speaking areas? I would guess not, but I can sure see you in Spain, Portugal and France. How about Italy, you must have sampled living there for sure, I would guess yes.?

Lakey

Yep, for sure relaying info. Still.

I don't like my slavic or Black forest track. I also have a lot of stolen banks. I'm a shameless thief.

And Gary, maybe you are hanging around more females because you are longing to be appreciated and admired rather than competed against. We all get to a point where we just want to be loved.

 

[FoTi]

Hat, I love reading your posts.

 

[FoTi]

Food for thought for FoTi. If a past life such as Hat's has pleasure moments of falling into a lot of money by chance, would that life be considered "case". In other words, are pleasure moments also part of one's case?
Lakey

Why is this food for thought for me?

I don't know why falling into a lot of money by chance would be considered case, unless there was charge on it.

LRH spoke of running aberated pleasure moments. I guess he considered that case, no?

I thought case was just charge or aberations.

 

[Hatshepsut]

Thankyou

 

[lkwdblds]

Precisely

Why is this food for thought for me?

I don't know why falling into a lot of money by chance would be considered case, unless there was charge on it.

LRH spoke of running aberated pleasure moments. I guess he considered that case, no?

I thought case was just charge or aberations.

I guess you sort of answered your own question. You know in thinking about your original question about whether or not a past life is automatically case, per the definitions of case in the Scn tech dictionary, past lives do not fall under that definition.

Still, I know that it wasn't considered good form to discuss past lives informally when I was very active in the 70's, 80's and 90's. Perhaps the thought was that one is pulling in these pictures and unless a person really knew what they were doing, a person could get into trouble if the wrong pictures came to view, pictures that the person was not trained to handle.

On the subject of pleaseure moments. Unless they had aberation connected with them, I do not believe that pleasure moments would be considered case.

More recently, I have heard it said that a mental therapy could be constructed of examining pleasure moments instead of moments of pain. If pleasure moments were brought to view and any postulates were looked for that led to those pleasure moments occuring, that could be developed into a full blown therapy. In Hubbard's book, Self Analysis, I recall there were a lot of commands asking a person to look for pleasure moments.

All this meandering is just my 2 cents worth of opinion. I am no authority on these subjects.
Lakey

 

[Gottabrain]

Why is this food for thought for me?

I don't know why falling into a lot of money by chance would be considered case, unless there was charge on it.

LRH spoke of running aberated pleasure moments. I guess he considered that case, no?

I thought case was just charge or aberations.

Just as an interesting little subthought on this --

People get suicidal and/or depressed from big change - BOTH good and bad. A life-changing event like falling into a heap of money can actually become the trigger for depression and not uncommonly either - no kidding! :confused2:

 

[Mark A. Baker]

Didn't Hubbard Himself talk about who He had been in a previous life ... more than once?

And what about that whole mission into time thing?

Sure seems like while not in session that Hubbard didn't mind talking at length about His case.

WTF is Lakey this stuff he claims?

Actually, from my recall Laky is substantially correct. During the time I was in casual discussion of past lives & other details associated with case or auditing was strongly discouraged. Clears & OTs could get away with such things in private discussions, especially if they were held away from an org or mission. Yet, even those private discussions could be problematic if a knowledge report was filed about them, or they were seen as affecting others in some fashion.

I left in the early '80s and it wouldn't surprise me if this 'practical guidance' developed into something more rigid along with everything else. Your argument is rather a strained one as you have publicly noted on numerous occasions that Hubbard did many things which were forbidden to others.


Mark A. Baker

 

[Veda]

Flaky mis-duplication by Lakey makes me shaky

Face, I had 3 possibilities or conjectures about LRH's exit strategy when he knew he was dying. After reading your Installment #11, a 4th conjecture or possiblity popped into my mind......

-snip-

Face

-snip-

When I read your recent post, the passage which Veda quoted above influenced me to speculate on my own that perhaps LRH did want DM to lead the church. That is why I came away from your post feeling the way I did.

-snip-

As someone who does not follow the Apollo thread, I'm really not up to date on the latest whatever - but it would seem that your 4th conjecture occured before I posted and before you read that post and speculated.

BUT IT DOESN'T MATTER.

Now I'll be on my way before I go

 

[RogerB]

No, you were implying/inferring/extrapolating that I had made a statement...which, functionally, is a re-statement...that I clearly had not made.

Here is an additional comment I have re: your most recent post on the "Shooting Stars" Thread.

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showpost.php?p=557953&postcount=241

Lakey, I would think that in my thousands of words I have posted on ESMB regarding El Ron and the CMO that what should be abundantly clear is my "Take" is that El Ron handed the “keys to the Kingdom” for four reasons; Protection, Extortion, Enforcement and Execution with Blind Obedience, Graven Fealty and Wonton Willing-ness in the Performance Thereof.

Of course, I am certainly not the "Holy Grail" when it comes to El Ron so you are very free to analyze whatever you wish about Hisself...but I'd appreciate it if you could refrain from misquoting me and putting words in my mouth, devining "real" intents "behind" what I've said and "explaining" my "thoughts" and "meanings" to others for me.


Face

Yes, it's best to give one's own view and opinion . . . not to try and "explain" or restate what another's view or opinion is "in your view" . . . . It gets very spinny when that last thing is attempted

And it's easy to piss friends off by trying to say what they are saying/thinking when it is not what they're saying/thinking.

It comes under the heading of: (mis)evaluation, wrong item, wrong indication, and even invalidation of the truth of the earlier statement.

R

 

[RogerB]

On this discussion regarding "pleasure moments" and whether or not case is or is not associated with them

The correct answer is: SOMETIMES

The reason I say this is, ever hear of anyone who is/has been addicted to pleasure?

Where this is the case, I can assure you the individual is continuously building up big time charge. The only problem is . . . or maybe it is the real problem . . . the addiction is possibly also the acting out of a "serfac."

And the real problem with serfacs is that they leave one feeling "this is the way things should be." That is, as a safe solution, the Being thinks the scenario created by the serfac is a correct and natural condition.

Rog