The Little Thread Which Grew - the Apollo '73 to Everything But

[lkwdblds]

Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

Question;
Allan Walters mentions approximatley 100 folks were part of the reseach teams at St Hill in the late 50s. There were famous actors Drs and a few fortune 500 CEOs. He does not name them. Does anyone know who they were?

Hubbard boasts about working in Hollywood in the late 30's on the screenplay for a serial called the "Treasure of Sierra Madre". I believe that it was serial shown in weekly installments rather than a full length feature film. During his short stint in Hollywood, he encountered some of the well known actors and actresses at the studios, in the lunch rooms lunch rooms, etc.

He mentions on a tape or two that he knew Audrey Hepburn on a first name basis but his strongest connection was the dashing flamboyant actor, Errol Flynn. Flynn played action roles, pirate roles and parts somewhat similar to what Johnny Depp is doing now. Errol Flynn and Hubbard apparently dined together several times. I've seen this written up in books about Hubbard and also on the internet.

Richard DeMille, son of the extremely well known Hollywood producer, Cecil B. DeMille was an early aid of Hubbard's organization. In the excerpt which I list below, DeMille says that he was brought into Dianetics by the famous Sci Fi author, A.E. van Vogt. Of course it is well documented that the great Sci Fi writer, Robert A. Heinlein was a friend of Hubbard's and stayed in touch with, exchanging letters all the way up into the mid 80's when Hubbard died.
Cecil B. was probably a Fortune 500 type. That is the only such extremely rich mogul that I know of who had any kind of connection with Hubbard.

Ray Bradbury also knew him but as far as I know, Bradbury, still living and going strong, was never attracted or interested in Dianetics or Scientology.

Below is some info about Richard de Mille and the favorable book he wrote about SCN:

Home > de Mille, Richard ( L. Ron hubbard) > Introduction to Scientology

Introduction to Scientology
de Mille, Richard ( L. Ron hubbard)
Bookseller: Arroyo Seco Books, IOBA (Pasadena, CA, U.S.A.)
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Bibliographic Details

Title: Introduction to Scientology
Publication Date: 1953
Book Condition: Very Good +
Signed: Inscribed By Author
Edition: Second Edition, Revised
Description:

156 pp. An early tract by writer Richard de Mille, then a close aide to L. Ron Hubbard. De Mille was the daughter of Lorna Moon, later the adopted son (and nephew) of motion picture Director Cecil B. de Mille. Inscribed by the author to science fiction writer and Dianetics executive A. E. Van Vogt, dated December 1953; De Mille discusses meeting Van Vogt when he first attended a Dianetics meeting. Provenance available from the estate of A. E. Van Vogt, a prominent science fiction writer, who was the head of the first California Hubbard Dianetics organization and who, after its dissolution, founded a separate Dianetics organization and remained a life-long friend of LRH. Scarce. Bookseller Inventory # 020867

 

[Ted]

Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

Hubbard boasts about [...]

He boasted about anything and everything he could possibly get away with boasting about even if he had only the faintest connection to the person or thing. He was always positioning, long before positioning became a recognized marketing tactic.


Home > de Mille, Richard ( L. Ron hubbard) > Introduction to Scientology

Introduction to Scientology
de Mille, Richard ( L. Ron hubbard)
Bookseller: Arroyo Seco Books, IOBA (Pasadena, CA, U.S.A.)
Bookseller Rating:
Quantity Available: 1

Price: US$ 680.00
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Shipping: US$ 0.00
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About the Book Bookseller & Payment Information
Bibliographic Details

Title: Introduction to Scientology
Publication Date: 1953
Book Condition: Very Good +
Signed: Inscribed By Author
Edition: Second Edition, Revised
[...]

If Hubbard were alive to see this, his ruds would be way out for not getting a major piece of the action.

 

[Ted]

Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

How do I know this? ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Like Hubbard, I used the tone scale.

I also have the added benefit of observing history, the added benefit of a psychologist definition of sociopath, and the published characteristics of a narcissist.

So do I really know what Hubbard thought or would have done in any given circumstance? No. But I believe I can come close in prediction.

 

[Auditor's Toad]

Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

Hubbard boasts . <snip>

True enough.

But ,were any of these people where Hubturd claimed they were at St Hill for the SHSBC when he taught it ?

Just curious.

 

[Auditor's Toad]

Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

How do I know this? ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Like Hubbard, I used the tone scale.

I also have the added benefit of observing history, the added benefit of a psychologist definition of sociopath, and the published characteristics of a narcissist.

So do I really know what Hubbard thought or would have done in any given circumstance? No. But I believe I can come close in prediction.

Yep. But some here still have to sing praise to him. Maybe they can't help it.

 

[lkwdblds]

Re: What Does it Mean to Say That Something Works or That Something Doesn't Work?

Thanks for the reply Lakey. Nothing of what I say is presented as absolute truth. All I ever present is my opinion, but I still don't believe that people constantly and compulsively create 'mental image pictures' recording every moment of their experience. Freud did not address 'pictures' in his work, so you do him a small disservice by stating he did. Neither did Jung. Freud and Jung did address past experience though, alongside dream analysis and other methods. They chose to work that way after concluding that the subconscious/unconscious mind functioned non-verbally - a conclusion I share with them. I still don't see how the 'conscious mind' running pictures qualifies as a spiritual activity.

Of course, we are talking about and kicking around our opinions here. I suspected that Freud did not address "pictures" in his work and was looking at "incidents" but I took the liberty of equating a chronologically ordered series of pictures with an incident. Probably, since one of our key points of disagreement centers on whether or not a spirit compulsively manufactures pictures, it was not wise of me to take the liberty which I took.

I am willing to agree though, that some of Hubbard's ideas - "be three feet behind your head" etc, did attempt to address the spirit. Unfortunately, they did not produce much in the way of useful results, as is well known, and were subsequently abandoned. That 'auditing command' contains a problem. How can a thing with no location be three feet behind it's head? Is it a particle or a wave? Neither, in my opinion, but 'the measurement problem' has direct relevance to Hubbards 'time, place, form and event' as-izzy thingy.

Well... take your comment, 'That auditing command contains a problem. How can a thing with no location be three feet behind it's head?".

Theoretically, different spiritual beings will respond to that command in different ways as the question is repeated over and over. Some will analyze the command
as you have done and conclude that command does not make sense. Others, however, trying to obey the one giving the command try to figure out some way to
execute the command and won't give up doing that. Somewhere along the line the person figures that if they are a body, there is no way that they can be 3' feet their body. They could not execute that demand unless.....unless they were not a body or part of a body. At that point they "see" the back of their head, realize that they are a spirit and blow out! Hubbard claimed a 50% success rate so probably half the people saw the situation as you did and half believed that they had exteriorized from their body.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uncertainty_principle

I'd rather rely on more generally accepted terminology than Hubbard's as I don't consider him an authority on anything - including the true nature of his own work From what I understand, he had very little in the way of self-awareness. His behaviour is more typical of someone frantically fighting against self-awareness. "Work it out, or act it out", as some therapists like to say.

I'd prefer to stick with conscious mind, subconscious/unconscious mind, and collective subconscious/unconscious mind, as they are more broadly accepted and understood.

Totally cool!

I have come to the conclusion that most of the interesting stuff in us is happening outside the realm of what you would call the analytical mind. For instance, when I play, the 'analytical mind' just gets in the way, and I have to let go of it to allow the music to manifest itself. I'm sure you'll understand that. The 'analytical mind' is too slow and lacking in bandwidth, to be useful to me musically. It's refresh rate is too slow to keep up, Lol. My conclusion is that the part of us which can verbalise it's experience, is the least intelligent and least interesting part of us.

Very interesting and astute observation!! I have good reality on what you are saying and am trending to holds beliefs such as yours myself.

On a personal note, I do not actually consider myself to be a thetan - or even a soul, in the generally accepted sense. Rather, I consider myself to be a transmission. Strange as that statement may sound when

examined through the filters of Hubbard, it feels quite real to me, just as your conclusions about your own nature probably do to you.

Very cool!!! I'm totally supportive of you as regards these feelings of yours!!


Here's a quote you might like. Perhaps you know of it already. It opens the door to some interesting discussion.

"In the province of the mind what one believes to be true, either is true or becomes true within certain limits. These limits are to be found experimentally and experientially. When so found these limits turn out to be further beliefs to be transcended. In the province of the mind there are no limits. However, in the province of the body there are definite limits not to be transcended."

“In the province of connected minds, what the network believes to be true, either is true or becomes true within certain limits to be found experientially and experimentally. These limits are further beliefs to be transcended. In the network’s mind there are no limits.”

"What of the region that includes our body, other’s bodies? Here there are definite limits. "

- John C Lilly.

I'm not saying I wholeheartedly agree with Lilly's statements, but they form a good jumping-off point for conversation.

Can't say more just now, as I need to prepare for Shabbat. Will be back online after Shabbat.

Apologies for my poor English.


Thanks again for your interesting post.

Shabbat Shalom! Smila, I am not familiar with Lilly's system but the concepts which you put forth above are very real to me. They produce a "feel good" feeling in me, similar to another system I describe below.

Our biggest area of disagreement seems to be over whether or not spirits compulsively manufacture pictures of every moment of their existence. Hubbard said that they do, 24 pictures every second with each picture containing 57 perceptics. At the time I read this, I was believing everything which Hubbard said automatically without critically examining it.

In my real experience, I am not able to discern that there are 24 pictures per second of my entire spiritual existence nor can I recall 57 perceptics in any of my pictures. I can look at an incident, say attending a high school dance and being nervous about meeting girls. The incident definitely has some pictures in it - a ten minute incident may have 20 or 30 pictures but Hubbard is saying that it has14,400 picures. I may recall the 5 common perceptics plus perhaps another 5 or 10 additional perceptics. 57 perceptics from a given picture is not real to me.

I have no idea whether what Hubbard says is true as regards compulsive taking of pictures being done by spirits. If asked to state an opinion, my opinion would be that some pictures are made automatically but that Hubbard has overstated by far the number of pictures made as well as the amount of data content in each picture. I do believe that an incident is made up of chronologically ordered pictures which contain the thoughts and emotions of the spirit superimposed into the pictures. That's what it feels like to me and is just an opinion, nothing more.

When we get beyond this picture thing, there is mostly agreement between us. Furthermore, whether or not pictures are being compulsively made is not a major component in my system of belief. Therefore, I track very well with what you are saying.

A lot of people in the circles I am now involved with are breaking thought into two components, analytical thought coming from the conscious mind and heartfelt thought, which is supposed to be a higher form thought coming from one's "heart". The way these people are using "heart", heart is really a synonym for the spirit.

This is a very simple concept, perhaps too simple but it "feels" right.
Lakey

 

[CarmeloOrchards]

Carroll Shelby

[video=youtube;oc6FmZCT0Zc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oc6FmZCT0Zc[/video]


Legendary car designer, racer Shelby dies at 89


By JEFF WILSON
The Associated Press
DALLAS — Decades after a heart condition forced him to retire from racing, Carroll Shelby still loved to drive muscle cars. Well into his 80s, the legendary car designer spent hours testing his last Mustang Shelby GT500, which sets a new record for horsepower and hits a top speed of more than 200 miles per hour.

A one-time chicken farmer, Shelby had more than a half-dozen successful careers during his long life: champion race car driver, racing team owner, automotive consultant and safari tour operator. His fabled Shelby Cobra sports car became an automotive and cultural icon, and he was later credited with injecting testosterone into Ford's Mustang and Chrysler's Viper.

When Shelby died Thursday night in a Dallas hospital, he also was one of the nation's longest-living heart transplant recipients, having received a heart on June 7, 1990, from a 34-year-old man who died of an aneurysm. Shelby also received a kidney transplant in 1996 from his son, Michael.

"What made him so unusual is he developed, literally, hundreds of cars," said Craig Jackson, chairman and CEO of Barrett-Jackson Auction Company. "This guy was 89 years old and he was still developing cars."

Shelby first made his name behind the wheel of a car, winning France's grueling 24 Hours of Le Mans sports car race with teammate Ray Salvadori in 1959. He had turned to the race-car circuit in the 1950s after his chicken ranch failed. He won dozens of races in various classes throughout the 1950s and was twice named Sports Illustrated's Driver of the Year.

He already was suffering serious heart problems when he won Le Mans and ran the race "with nitroglycerin pills under his tongue," his longtime friend, Dick Messer, former executive director of Los Angeles' Petersen Automotive Museum, once noted. Soon after his win at Le Mans, he gave up racing and turned his attention to designing high-powered "muscle cars" that eventually became the Shelby Cobra and the Mustang Shelby GT500.

"He's an icon in the medical world and an icon in the automotive world," Messer said.

"His legacy is the diversity of his life," he added. "He's incredibly innovative. His life has always been the reinvention of Carroll Shelby."

The Cobra, which used Ford engines and a British sport car chassis, was the fastest production model ever made when it was displayed at the New York Auto Show in 1962.

A year later, Cobras were winning races over Corvettes, and in 1964 the Rip Chords had a Top 5 hit on the Billboard pop chart with "Hey, Little Cobra." ("Spring, little Cobra, getting ready to strike, spring, little Cobra, with all of your might. Hey, little Cobra, don't you know you're gonna shut 'em down?")

In 2007, an 800-horsepower model of the Cobra made in 1966, once Shelby's personal car, sold for $5.5 million at auction, a record for an American car.
"It's a special car. It would do just over three seconds to 60 (mph), 40 years ago," Shelby told the crowd before the sale, held in Scottsdale, Ariz.

It was Lee Iacocca, then head of Ford Motor Co., who assigned Shelby the task of designing a model of Ford's Mustang that could compete against the Corvette for young male buyers. Iacocca often joked that Shelby was so persistent he gave him the money and Ford V-8 engines to build the Cobra just to get him out of his office.

Turning a vehicle he had once dismissed as "a secretary car" into a rumbling, high-performance model was "the hardest thing I've done in my life," Shelby recalled in a 2000 interview with The Associated Press.

That car and the Shelby Cobra made his name a household word in the 1960s.
When the energy crisis of the 1970s limited the market for gas-guzzling high-performance cars, Shelby weathered the downturn by heading to Africa, where he operated a safari company for a dozen years.

By the time he returned to the United States, Iacocca was running Chrysler Motors and he hired Shelby to design the supercharged Viper sports car.

"He was a great friend and we did some really good work together," Iacocca said Friday in a statement.

Inducted into the Automotive Hall of Fame in 1992, Shelby worked in recent years as a technical adviser on the Ford GT project and designed the Shelby Series 1 two-seat muscle car, a 21st century clone of his 1965 Cobra. His 2013 Shelby GT500 has the most powerful production V-8 engine in the world — at 662 horses — and a top speed of more than 200 miles per hour. It is arriving in dealerships now. The model that Shelby test drove sold for $350,000 at a charity auction in January.

"I've always been asked, 'What is my favorite car?' and I've always said 'The next one,'" Shelby said, according to Ford's website. "I'm going to take that back tonight. This is my new favorite car."

Edsel B. Ford, a member of Ford's board of directors, said Friday in a statement that the company had lost a legend.

"Carroll Shelby is one of the most recognized names in performance car history, and he's been successful at everything he's done," Ford said. "Whether helping Ford dominate the 1960s racing scene or building some of the most famous Mustangs, his enthusiasm and passion for great automobiles over six decades has truly inspired everyone who worked with him."

He created the Carroll Shelby Foundation in 1991 to provide assistance for children and young people needing acute coronary and kidney care. According to its website, the foundation has helped numerous children get surgery, as well as provided money for research.

Shelby was born Jan. 11, 1923, in Leesburg, Texas.

During World War II, he was an Army Air Corps flight instructor who corresponded with his fiancée by dropping love letters stuck into his flying boots onto her farm.
After leaving the military in 1945, he started a dump truck business, then decided to raise chickens. The poultry business initially flourished, with Shelby earning a $5,000 profit on the first batch of broilers he delivered. He went broke, however, when his second flock died of disease.

A friend then invited him to become an amateur racer and his success led to his joining the Aston-Martin team and competing in races all over the world.
Shelby had homes in Los Angeles and his native east Texas. Doctors did not immediately release a cause of death.

He is survived by his wife, Cleo Shelby; his three children, Patrick, Michael and Sharon; his sister, Anne Shelby Ellison; six grandchildren and four great-grandchildren. Funeral services were not immediately announced.
___
Wilson reported from Los Angeles. AP Autos Writer Dee-Ann Durbin contributed to this report from Detroit.
Copyright The Associated Press

 

[lkwdblds]

Re: Carroll Shelby

[video=youtube;oc6FmZCT0Zc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oc6FmZCT0Zc[/video]


Legendary car designer, racer Shelby dies at 89


By JEFF WILSON
The Associated Press
DALLAS — Decades after a heart condition forced him to retire from racing, Carroll Shelby still loved to drive muscle cars. Well into his 80s, the legendary car designer spent hours testing his last Mustang Shelby GT500, which sets a new record for horsepower and hits a top speed of more than 200 miles per hour.

A one-time chicken farmer, Shelby had more than a half-dozen successful careers during his long life: champion race car driver, racing team owner, automotive consultant and safari tour operator. His fabled Shelby Cobra sports car became an automotive and cultural icon, and he was later credited with injecting testosterone into Ford's Mustang and Chrysler's Viper.

When Shelby died Thursday night in a Dallas hospital, he also was one of the nation's longest-living heart transplant recipients, having received a heart on June 7, 1990, from a 34-year-old man who died of an aneurysm. Shelby also received a kidney transplant in 1996 from his son, Michael.

"What made him so unusual is he developed, literally, hundreds of cars," said Craig Jackson, chairman and CEO of Barrett-Jackson Auction Company. "This guy was 89 years old and he was still developing cars."

Shelby first made his name behind the wheel of a car, winning France's grueling 24 Hours of Le Mans sports car race with teammate Ray Salvadori in 1959. He had turned to the race-car circuit in the 1950s after his chicken ranch failed. He won dozens of races in various classes throughout the 1950s and was twice named Sports Illustrated's Driver of the Year.

He already was suffering serious heart problems when he won Le Mans and ran the race "with nitroglycerin pills under his tongue," his longtime friend, Dick Messer, former executive director of Los Angeles' Petersen Automotive Museum, once noted. Soon after his win at Le Mans, he gave up racing and turned his attention to designing high-powered "muscle cars" that eventually became the Shelby Cobra and the Mustang Shelby GT500.

"He's an icon in the medical world and an icon in the automotive world," Messer said.

"His legacy is the diversity of his life," he added. "He's incredibly innovative. His life has always been the reinvention of Carroll Shelby."

The Cobra, which used Ford engines and a British sport car chassis, was the fastest production model ever made when it was displayed at the New York Auto Show in 1962.

A year later, Cobras were winning races over Corvettes, and in 1964 the Rip Chords had a Top 5 hit on the Billboard pop chart with "Hey, Little Cobra." ("Spring, little Cobra, getting ready to strike, spring, little Cobra, with all of your might. Hey, little Cobra, don't you know you're gonna shut 'em down?")

In 2007, an 800-horsepower model of the Cobra made in 1966, once Shelby's personal car, sold for $5.5 million at auction, a record for an American car.
"It's a special car. It would do just over three seconds to 60 (mph), 40 years ago," Shelby told the crowd before the sale, held in Scottsdale, Ariz.

It was Lee Iacocca, then head of Ford Motor Co., who assigned Shelby the task of designing a model of Ford's Mustang that could compete against the Corvette for young male buyers. Iacocca often joked that Shelby was so persistent he gave him the money and Ford V-8 engines to build the Cobra just to get him out of his office.

Turning a vehicle he had once dismissed as "a secretary car" into a rumbling, high-performance model was "the hardest thing I've done in my life," Shelby recalled in a 2000 interview with The Associated Press.

That car and the Shelby Cobra made his name a household word in the 1960s.
When the energy crisis of the 1970s limited the market for gas-guzzling high-performance cars, Shelby weathered the downturn by heading to Africa, where he operated a safari company for a dozen years.

By the time he returned to the United States, Iacocca was running Chrysler Motors and he hired Shelby to design the supercharged Viper sports car.

"He was a great friend and we did some really good work together," Iacocca said Friday in a statement.

Inducted into the Automotive Hall of Fame in 1992, Shelby worked in recent years as a technical adviser on the Ford GT project and designed the Shelby Series 1 two-seat muscle car, a 21st century clone of his 1965 Cobra. His 2013 Shelby GT500 has the most powerful production V-8 engine in the world — at 662 horses — and a top speed of more than 200 miles per hour. It is arriving in dealerships now. The model that Shelby test drove sold for $350,000 at a charity auction in January.

"I've always been asked, 'What is my favorite car?' and I've always said 'The next one,'" Shelby said, according to Ford's website. "I'm going to take that back tonight. This is my new favorite car."

Edsel B. Ford, a member of Ford's board of directors, said Friday in a statement that the company had lost a legend.

"Carroll Shelby is one of the most recognized names in performance car history, and he's been successful at everything he's done," Ford said. "Whether helping Ford dominate the 1960s racing scene or building some of the most famous Mustangs, his enthusiasm and passion for great automobiles over six decades has truly inspired everyone who worked with him."

He created the Carroll Shelby Foundation in 1991 to provide assistance for children and young people needing acute coronary and kidney care. According to its website, the foundation has helped numerous children get surgery, as well as provided money for research.

Shelby was born Jan. 11, 1923, in Leesburg, Texas.

During World War II, he was an Army Air Corps flight instructor who corresponded with his fiancée by dropping love letters stuck into his flying boots onto her farm.
After leaving the military in 1945, he started a dump truck business, then decided to raise chickens. The poultry business initially flourished, with Shelby earning a $5,000 profit on the first batch of broilers he delivered. He went broke, however, when his second flock died of disease.

A friend then invited him to become an amateur racer and his success led to his joining the Aston-Martin team and competing in races all over the world.
Shelby had homes in Los Angeles and his native east Texas. Doctors did not immediately release a cause of death.

He is survived by his wife, Cleo Shelby; his three children, Patrick, Michael and Sharon; his sister, Anne Shelby Ellison; six grandchildren and four great-grandchildren. Funeral services were not immediately announced.
___
Wilson reported from Los Angeles. AP Autos Writer Dee-Ann Durbin contributed to this report from Detroit.
Copyright The Associated Press

Carroll Shelby was one of the greatest and most creative men the auto business has ever had. His original Shelby Cobra is a timeless legend. I didn't know that he worked with Iacoca developing the Viper for Chrysler Corp when Chrysler was an independent company (before the Mercedes take over and now the Fiat take over). I did not know that he had a heart transplant. Its great that he was given 34 more years to work his magic!! The well never ran dry for him, just more and more innovative sports cars designed and developed right up until his last days!!

Speaking of good guys and great auto men, I am also a huge fan of Lee Iacoca's. I own both his books which he wrote in the 80's. His showdown with Henry Ford III, who fired him from Ford out of jealousy and his beating the odds in reviving Chrysler Corp in the late 70's are extremely inspiring stories. Iacoca was responsible for buying American Motors and adding the Jeep brand to the Chrysler line up. Without the Jeep franchise, it is virtually 100% certain that Chrysler would have died out by now but instead it is currently the fastest growing car company in America.

BTW, the head of Fiat is a car enthusiast in the mold of Iacoca and also in the mold of Carroll Shelby. Mainly because of this man, 2013 will see Viper return to the car market after not being produced for nearly 2 years. The new Viper will be totally revolutionary, offering competition to Ferrari and Masserati at a much lower price.
Lakey

 

[looker]

Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

I read a story in Car and Driver about Carrol Shelby. The reporter asked about the acceleration of the cobra. Carrol said I have a $20 Ill put in the sun visor on the passenger side. When I count to 3 I'm gonna floor it. If you can reach up and grab that 20, its yours.

Carrol counted to 3 hit the gas the reporters hands went up and flew in back of his head. He couldn't even get close to the $20. The reporter was aghast at the acceleration.

 

[paradox]

Re: What Does it Mean to Say That Something Works or That Something Doesn't Work?

<snip>

I am willing to agree though, that some of Hubbard's ideas - "be three feet behind your head" etc, did attempt to address the spirit. Unfortunately, they did not produce much in the way of useful results, as is well known, and were subsequently abandoned. That 'auditing command' contains a problem. How can a thing with no location be three feet behind it's head? Is it a particle or a wave? Neither, in my opinion, but 'the measurement problem' has direct relevance to Hubbards 'time, place, form and event' as-izzy thingy.
<snip>

Basically stems from the ages-old debate over whether the spiritual is distinctly separate from the material, and vice versa. Been a long, long time but I think it's in his axioms somewhere or maybe just a part of his definition for theta and thetan that a thetan has no location except by or other than by postulate and consideration.

Which also forms the basis of a thetan believing itself to be a body, vs having a body. So most wogs are found to believe that they are their body and, therefore, that they are located in their body, which in the western societies would normally be inside their skulls.

One of the goals of auditing would then be to "exteriorize" the thetan so that by their own postulates and considerations they would be then "located" an optimal 3 feet behind the head as opposed to being squarely inside the head. By whatever process (I'll leave that to your own reasoning) the thetan so positioned experiences life, relative to the body, from a position of 3 feet behind it which, also according to Hubbard, was a much "safer" location in terms of accidents or injury or other perceptics related to said bodyies etc.

I'll leave it to a techie, or someone with a far better memory than mine, to give you a better description of it if they wish.

Personally, I think it's all a matter of ego-oriented preferential beliefs and speculations giving rise to delusional perceptions of separateness, but because it is all highly, if not entirely, subjective even this statement of mine is subject to the same criticism.

 

[CarmeloOrchards]

Re: Ken Ogger, the Pilot

It's good to get some factual data about The Pilot. When I first read of Ogger being found dead in his pool, I took it for granted that C of S must have had something to do with his drowning. Adding in the facts which you have presented, Carmelo, suicide looks like a more likely alternative.
Lakey

It was suicide, but really, the Co$ contributed heavily to the making of the actuality.

The moral of the story is get away from the Co$, and get a job, pay your bills, earn an income. Don't try to save the world, until you have saved yourself. For all those in the Sea Org passing 60, get out, earn some money while you still can. Prepare for old age.

 

[CarmeloOrchards]

Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

This tired old thread could use some life somewhere near fitting the purposes of this board.

Please save this thread ! What started off as a somewhat interesting thread managed to attract a few posters with important information and history ( seems they got tired of the BS and left for better threads ) and this thing has gotten real close to a thread for recipe trading.

Smilla, please continue here with the direction you headed - it is a fresh breath from movie & opera trivia ( guess that is what attracted the academics to read here ) !

The above post^^^^ the other day stuck in my craw.

Tonight I went to my wife's school's end of the year all school play. The ESL junior high and high schoolers did "Oklahoma." The elementary school kids did "101 Dalmatians." it was a lot more charming than the touring show that I saw last night of "Million Dollar Quartet."( story about one night Elvis, Johnny Cash, Carl Perkins, and Jerry Lee Lewis got together.

This thread has discussed everything under the sun including, but not limited to: driving cattle, classical music, Tommy's hamburgers, fish frying, power processing, bagels, Denny's, rock and roll, old TV shows, comedians

[video=youtube;dyBzYCEyUlE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dyBzYCEyUlE&feature=results_video&playnext=1&list=PL630C3223041D2F4C[/video]

If I understand Auditor's Toad correctly, he'd just like to diss Scientology (and perhaps Lakey) 24/7.

[video=youtube;X6Tto1JnLXc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6Tto1JnLXc&ob=av2n[/video]


I left Scientology in 1976. I've never looked back on that decision.

For my part, I think life is for living. I can't play the victim card regarding Scientology. Nothing tortuous ever happened to me. I don't really have any crabby bitchy things to say about the Co$. My feeling is this thread is a sanctuary from the "ain't it awful" that fills the internet about Scientology.

I find fish frying a lot more interesting and relevant to my life than what Debbie Cook did or didn't do yesterday. About a thousand people a day read this thread. They, apparently, agree with me. If that is an example of a "tired thread," I'd like to see what AT finds a vibrant thread.

 

[lkwdblds]

Re: Auditor's Toad

The above post^^^^ the other day stuck in my craw.

Tonight I went to my wife's school's end of the year all school play. The ESL junior high and high schoolers did "Oklahoma." The elementary school kids did "101 Dalmatians." it was a lot more charming than the touring show that I saw last night of "Million Dollar Quartet."( story about one night Elvis, Johnny Cash, Carl Perkins, and Jerry Lee Lewis got together.

This thread has discussed everything under the sun including, but not limited to: driving cattle, classical music, Tommy's hamburgers, fish frying, power processing, bagels, Denny's, rock and roll, old TV shows, comedians

[video=youtube;dyBzYCEyUlE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dyBzYCEyUlE&feature=results_video&playnext=1&list=PL630C3223041D2F4C[/video]

If I understand Auditor's Toad correctly, he'd just like to diss Scientology (and perhaps Lakey) 24/7.

[video=youtube;X6Tto1JnLXc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6Tto1JnLXc&ob=av2n[/video]


I left Scientology in 1976. I've never looked back on that decision.

For my part, I think life is for living. I can't play the victim card regarding Scientology. Nothing tortuous ever happened to me. I don't really have any crabby bitchy things to say about the Co$. My feeling is this thread is a sanctuary from the "ain't it awful" that fills the internet about Scientology.

I find fish frying a lot more interesting and relevant to my life than what Debbie Cook did or didn't do yesterday. About a thousand people a day read this thread. They, apparently, agree with me. If that is an example of a "tired thread," I'd like to see what AT finds a vibrant thread.

I put Auditor's Toad on ignore several months ago. If someone replies to one of his posts, I then can see what he wrote.

What you copied here, Carmelo, was typical. Here you have a guy blasting this thread as being tired, old and irrelevant, YET HE READS IT EVERY DAY! That, to me, is an indicator that something is wrong, somewhere.

Why would I guy avidly read something every day which he despises and thinks is old, tired, irrelevant and worn out? The rational thing to do is to not read it, especially knowing that the OP, whom you despise has you on IGNORE!! Reading something you don't like and writing negative comments on everything is a games condition but the IGNORE BUTTON gets me out of that game.


As our thread closes in on 700,000 views, we are getting between 1,000 and 1,300 views each and every day. The average thread on ESMB ends up being read by about 1,300 to 2,600 viewers, about 2 days of viewing on this thread.

Tired and old, I don't think so! Regardless of what I think, the stats speak for themselves. Some of our poster have moved on but many new people are viewing us every day. As always, most of our viewing is done by non-members.

THANK GOD FOR THE IGNORE BUTTON!!!!! Use the ignore button if you are being dissed by someone who you deem to be a nuisance . It is really a great tool, it is very effective and puts one at a position of cause. There is one precept of Hubbard's that I always felt was very wise: "Don't communicate with anyone unless you yourself desire it." THE IGNORE BUTTON IS A VERY VALUABLE TOOL in being able to apply this precep.
Lakey

 

[RogerB]

Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

Hey, Toady's fun! . . . . . . though I can well understand you may not be partial to his poking fun at you or at your expense, Lakey, look at the lighter side of it . . . . he notices you!

Better than being ignored, no?



R

 

[CarmeloOrchards]

Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

Hey, Toady's fun! . . . . . . though I can well understand you may not be partial to his poking fun at you or at your expense, Lakey, look at the lighter side of it . . . . he notices you!

Better than being ignored, no?



R

in terms of perspective, I read and enjoy your posts Roger, but I also appreciate the humor Trouble puts on your lines. It is all a matter of perspective, and whose ox is being gored. Toady has a wicked humor. I love it. I took that one post too personally.

 

[Auditor's Toad]

Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

in terms of perspective, I read and enjoy your posts Roger, but I also appreciate the humor Trouble puts on your lines. It is all a matter of perspective, and whose ox is being gored. Toady has a wicked humor. I love it. I took that one post too personally.

CO no personal insult was meant - or intended - towards you.

I find in a certain humor in those who on one hand agree with with Hubbard " communication is the universal solvent " and on the other " don't communicate unless you yourself desire it" mixed with " disconnection " .. never mind the EP of Grade Zero.

Being put on ignore by Lakey ? Good ! One of those cases where I'm glad to be not associated with someone. Anyway, if he could confront a comm cycle, he would. His choice to not communicate - maybe next he'll disconnect from me.

I don't read ESMB every day. It is a good time filler when time to play is available.

Some people don't like humor and they are entitled to their ways. I'll continue to laugh at what strikes me as funny and gladly live with whoever that offends.

 

[RogerB]

Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

in terms of perspective, I read and enjoy your posts Roger, but I also appreciate the humor Trouble puts on your lines. It is all a matter of perspective, and whose ox is being gored. Toady has a wicked humor. I love it. I took that one post too personally.

Ummm, what one post too personally?

In any event I'm teasing my mate Lakey . . . . so, umm, what did you take too personally that wasn't directed at you by me?

R

 

[CarmeloOrchards]

Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

Ummm, what one post too personally?

In any event I'm teasing my mate Lakey . . . . so, umm, what did you take too personally that wasn't directed at you by me?

R

nothing, it was Toady's post

 

[Auditor's Toad]

Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

I've had dear friends say that when getting offended or hurt by things on a chatboard it is time to back away from the keyboard and take a little breather.

One extreme says an online chatboard is more real and serious than most anything else in real life and the extreme of the other side says it is merely words typed on a screen by a stranger.............as with most things, perhaps the truth is somewhere between the extremes.

Anybody got a good recipe they would be willing to share ?

And, again, CO I directed nothing at you on a personal level. I do get some people are not going to like my posts or me

 

[CarmeloOrchards]

Re: The old days - Aboard the Apollo - 1973

I've had dear friends say that when getting offended or hurt by things on a chatboard it is time to back away from the keyboard and take a little breather.

One extreme says an online chatboard is more real and serious than most anything else in real life and the extreme of the other side says it is merely worgs typed on a screen by a stranger.............as with most things, perhaps the truth is somewhere between the extremes.

Anybody got a good recipe they would be willing to share ?

And, again, CO I directed nothing at you on a personal level. I do get some people are not going to like my posts or me

My first Scorpion was at Don the Beachcomber's. It was as good as LSD. It still is.

Scorpion Punch


Prep Time:
10 Min Ready In:
10 Min


Original Recipe Yield 1 scorpion bowl
Ingredients

3 cups crushed ice
2 fluid ounces gin
1 fluid ounce dark rum
2 fluid ounces 151 proof rum
2 fluid ounces light rum
2 fluid ounces vodka
2 fluid ounces grenadine syrup
8 fluid ounces fresh orange juice
10 fluid ounces pineapple juice
3 fluid ounces fresh lemon juice (optional)
4 pineapple chunks
8 maraschino cherries
Directions

Place the crushed ice in a large pitcher and pour in the gin, dark rum, 151 proof rum, light rum, vodka, grenadine, orange juice, pineapple juice, and lemon juice. Stir well to mix, then pour into a large, decorative cocktail glass and garnish with pineapple, cherries, and straws.